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[-PXG-]

You're obviously a "natural", so anything you say is invalid when it comes to advice to beta males.

Sure, there is such a thing of having an innate ability or natural awareness of certain things. However, no one that can live off pure intellect, skill, or luck. These things are developed over time, through practice and experience.

I can work out problems because I've developed logic and ways of thinking over time. I became a better artist and better at video games by doing those activities over and over again. I've gotten better at dealing with women through my experience with them and learning from my mistakes.

Life and everything you do with yourself is iterative. Before college, I could barely talk to girls , let alone get them to want to talk to me or have anything to do with me. Now, I have no problem at all. Most of my friends are females, many of whom joke about how I'm a player and that I always have some sort of new lady friend. This didn't happen on it's own. This wasn't magic.

I worked really hard, improving myself, learning how to love myself and looking at what I did wrong and knowing how to set realistic expectations.

I'm not. I was as geeky as anyone else on this forum in high school. I put some actual effort in fixing myself and it paid off. Why? Because I don't have the sense of entitlement some of the people here have.

You are not owed a relationship, love, respect, etc, etc. You need to genuinely earn that shit and whining about the crushing unfair world definitely is NOT the way to go about earning it.

This right here.

 

[Kinitari]

You're obviously a "natural", so anything you say is invalid when it comes to advice to beta males.

That's a self-defeatist attitude.

Here's something that's crazy - women aren't all that different then men when it comes to a lot of things. They enjoy sex, they want to be wanted, they enjoy having fun and they want companionship.

Knowing these things, you should be able to understand that it isn't inherently difficult to find yourself with a girl, the problem is we create obstacles for ourselves. Why you're not good enough, why she's not good enough, emotional problems you have, communication problems you have, etc etc.

You need to remove as many obstacles as possible - but even after all that, you need to walk down the path you create for yourself. I think what I see a lot are people who are willing to remove some of their obstacles, but then expect it to be over after that. You still need to take those steps forward.

 

[-PXG-]

In other news, I've become friends with this lovely girl at my new job. Too bad she...well...works at the same place as I do. There is no way in hell I'm dipping the pen in company ink...I've seen too many fellas here make that mistake. Hell, I've always discouraged it in my posts.

Fucking sucks. She's really great too. There's definitely chemistry between us, but I ain't gonna fuck around with her. I'll just remain friends with her and leave it at that. Doesn't really matter anyway though....


Anyway, the black girl from last weekend, has been all over my dick, literally. She's fun to talk to and be around...but I don't know. We have a lot in common and I dig her...but not enough to actually want a relationship. I'm still sorting out my feelings. She keeps on telling me over and over that she wants me to be her boyfriend and what not. She's not the clingy or obsessive type though. If she was, I wouldn't want anything to do with her in the first place. She's admitted that she wants to have sex. As much as I want to, in the event I decide that I don't want to be with her, I don't want her to feel like she was used. I'm not that kind of guy and the last thing I want to do is take advantage of her.

I also have another date, with another (white) girl tomorrow night. Dinner, coffee, normal shit. Nothing fancy. She's pretty excited and has been looking forward to it all week. Feels good.

EDIT

This was all a personal update. Not really asking for advice. Just thought (some...though many of you don't, which is fine) would like to know what was going on.

But here is advice for you, which has been said many times, but cannot be said enough:

DIVERSIFY!!!

Have backups. Talk to many girls. Even if they only become friends, so what? There's nothing wrong with having friends. Just don't deal with flakes, drama or silly as head games.

You'll probably learn something about them, as well as yourself, by talking and interacting with them. And who knows, one of them might change their mind and want to date you. As long as you're not committed, and as long as you don't lie (but don't give someone more info than they asked for), you're not cheating or being a piece of shit.

Plus, having people friends and people to talk to in general will give you less time to worry, be bitter or develop anxiety. You won't have time for any of that because you're too busy enjoying yourself.

You should only be a one woman man if you're in a relationship. If not, go nuts. Don't ever think you're the only guy she's seeing. Just don't bite off more than you can chew. And don't mix up their names either

 

[~Kinggi~]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kagsXFrFPiM&feature=player_embedded#t=0s

His advice is getting better ill give him that. Not as much of the hope floats shit and more of the actual processes and things to do to progress,

 

[jaxword]

I'm not. I was as geeky as anyone else on this forum in high school. I put some actual effort in fixing myself and it paid off. Why? Because I don't have the sense of entitlement some of the people here have.

You are not owed a relationship, love, respect, etc, etc. You need to genuinely earn that shit and whining about the crushing unfair world definitely is NOT the way to go about earning it.

Yeah, exactly. Relationships require skill just like everything else. I'm seriously surprised there AREN'T more guys here, on a gaming forum, who don't think of it in those terms. Girls have standards as well; I think a lot of guys don't think girls have those, or at least don't understand how theirs differ than guys'.



Also, welcome back Shanadeus, I thought you were banned but I see you're no longer grey.

 

[soultron]

Spacebar made great points. None of us are telling you to be douchebags. We're telling you to be confident guys who have shit going on in their lives. Improving your "love life" should be a benefit that comes from improving your life as a whole. I can't stress Spacebar's point about being nice because you want to be nice (and not get anything) as being super important. Being nice and expecting a reward is a waste of your time and makes you seem like a spineless coward, in my opinion. I can expand on that if you want. Be nice because you want to genuinely help someone out.

TheShadow also made a great point. You're owed nothing in life -- not girls, money, success, championship rings, great test scores, nothing. You need to go out there and get it. No amount of complaining is going to make it easier or make you look more attractive; far from it. It will only make you worse and set you further back. It's a waste of time, energy, and your good reputation. If you've tried and failed, you need to keep on trying until you hit whatever mark it is that you're trying to hit. If you've not even tried (or simply tried once and given up) and are complaining, I have zero sympathy for you.

PXG (and Eggo always emphasizes this too) make great points about just making friends if nothing comes of a girl. When some of us say move on, we mean that in the sense that you should forget them in a romantic sense. If you've got enough potential women that you're working on, you can absolutely keep them as a friend because you'll be too busy to dwell on them. Keeping them as friends will have obvious benefits for you: you can bounce ideas off them, go places with them, meet their friends, etc. It's all just practise that will make your next encounter better.

This isn't a popularity contest. I'm not quoting these guys because they're the masters of this thread. I'm quoting these guys because they constantly bring a positive attitude and have much more patience when dealing with bitterness and defeatist attitudes than I.

Anyone in here who constantly brings a positive energy makes this thread a great sub-community to be a part of. c:

Let's stop wasting our time bitching (and arguing with each other) and get back to improving each others' lives. That's what this thread is about.

 

[-PXG-]

Soultron really is NeoGAF's bro. Always depend on him to make you feel good.

 

[jaxword]

Anyone in here who constantly brings a positive energy makes this thread a great sub-community to be a part of. c:

Let's stop wasting our time bitching (and arguing with each other) and get back to improving each others' lives. That's what this thread is about.

No girl wants to be around someone negative all the time...charm and charisma come from that.

Hell, I'm probably the ugliest bastard on neogaf and I still get dates just by saying and doing the right things. Making other people feel good is the power of charisma.

 

[Shouta]

Spacebar made great points. None of us are telling you to be douchebags. We're telling you to be confident guys who have shit going on in their lives. Improving your "love life" should be a benefit that comes from improving your life as a whole.

But as much as you guys keep repeating this, there are guys out there that are doing this and more yet still not getting anywhere with anyone. As BigDug pointed out, it's not just guys that are a problem but the whole environment for dating as a whole. Self-improvement is always important, there is no doubt it. However, to ignore trends that are occurring and the attitudes of the other party to rail on folks that need to vent is rather silly. As much as guy can open the road ahead of him if the destination itself is gated off, there's nothing they can do.

TheShadow also made a great point. You're owed nothing in life -- not girls, money, success, championship rings, great test scores, nothing. You need to go out there and get it. No amount of complaining is going to make it easier or make you look more attractive; far from it. It will only make you worse and set you further back. It's a waste of time, energy, and your good reputation. If you've tried and failed, you need to keep on trying until you hit whatever mark it is that you're trying to hit. If you've not even tried (or simply tried once and given up) and are complaining, I have zero sympathy for you.

I don't think many people ever believe they are entitled to anything beyond a chance to prove themselves. That much at least is something that everyone deserves, regardless of who they are.

This "Chin up! Try again!" attitude is dandy and all but it's never as simple as that. If you're hurt or angry, venting it out is a lot better than letting it fester. If you can't let it go then it's only going to hurt you later. Not all guys can simple go from one rejection to another without feeling a thing what with all the circumstances that can arise. Let it out, learn from it, then move on is what should be said.

Everything is on a case by case basis of course but I feel like this thread often feels like it's talking from a high horse rather than simply trying to push folks to improve what they can.

 

[Eggo]

No girl wants to be around someone negative all the time...charm and charisma come from that.

Hell, I'm probably the ugliest bastard on neogaf and I still get dates just by saying and doing the right things. Making other people feel good is the power of charisma.

The bolded is what I try to do whenever I go out with a group. I forget where I originally heard this, but multiple PUA-types have discussed the idea. When you go out, make it your mission to ensure the people in your group are having fun and are engaged. Don't think about yourself or act like you're trying to get something. Just be happy, make sure everyone else is happy, and things will fall into place naturally.

For example, at my birthday party last month, a bunch of friends came out to celebrate, and I spent the evening as a host making introductions and seeing that everyone was having a good time. Treat every night like that. The most important part is having a positive attitude.

 

[Eggo]

Rant

A lot of what you say rings true, like women being different in other countries, mainstream media emasculating men, and divorce not being favorable to the guy, but the overall tone of anger and bitterness clouds your message heavily. Still, I think you raise some valid points. Do you listen to Tom Leykis? He echoes many of the same sentiments you talk about.

 

[Jamesfrom818]

I try not to let girls I'm dating influence my mood too much but I was feeling a little down when two of the girls I've been seeing said they didn't want to see me anymore for differing reasons.

Enter new girl and I'm feeling great again.

 

[soultron]

But as much as you guys keep repeating this, there are guys out there that are doing this and more yet still not getting anywhere with anyone. As BigDug pointed out, it's not just guys that are a problem but the whole environment for dating as a whole. Self-improvement is always important, there is no doubt it. However, to ignore trends that are occurring and the attitudes of the other party to rail on folks that need to vent is rather silly. As much as guy can open the road ahead of him if the destination itself is gated off, there's nothing they can do.

It's still a numbers game. Call it naivety, call it ignorance, but I think it's best to just keep on going until you find success. Everyone has down days and that's cool. If I made anyone feel they can't vent, I apologise. BigDug brings up some definite points of discussion, but I feel they'd be better as a new thread entirely. If I ever come off as riding on a high horse, it's only because I want better for people. I'm ridiculously harsh in real-life too, if it's any consolation.

I don't think many people ever believe they are entitled to anything beyond a chance to prove themselves. That much at least is something that everyone deserves, regardless of who they are.

This "Chin up! Try again!" attitude is dandy and all but it's never as simple as that. If you're hurt or angry, venting it out is a lot better than letting it fester. If you can't let it go then it's only going to hurt you later. Not all guys can simple go from one rejection to another without feeling a thing what with all the circumstances that can arise. Let it out, learn from it, then move on is what should be said.

Everything is on a case by case basis of course but I feel like this thread often feels like it's talking from a high horse rather than simply trying to push folks to improve what they can.

I'm not disagreeing with you on the fact that people need to vent instead of letting it fester. But if you've been observing this thread long enough, you'll know that some people only post in here to vent. They don't try to update us on their attempts on self-improvement. Some people brush aside advice from various sources (of differing opinions) over and over. Nobody owes us anything, but it gets a touch frustrating when you watch people provide solid advice and people just don't take it, or bring out the worst in other posters who are already having a shit time of things.

Maybe we don't do enough to support each other. I think we do a great job on congratulating even the smallest victories in here though.

 

[Attackthebase]

Maybe we don't do enough to support each other. I think we do a great job on congratulating even the smallest victories in here though.

People must have their baby steps before they become walking machines. A minor victory to us could be a major victory for another person. We should celebrate even the smallest of achievements if it is a step towards self-improvement and happiness.

 

[Shouta]

It's still a numbers game. Call it naivety, call it ignorance, but I think it's best to just keep on going until you find success. Everyone has down days and that's cool. If I made anyone feel they can't vent, I apologise. BigDug brings up some definite points of discussion, but I feel they'd be better as a new thread entirely. If I ever come off as riding on a high horse, it's only because I want better for people. I'm ridiculously harsh in real-life too, if it's any consolation.

It's certainly a numbers game for sure. Some folks don't realize it or don't want to so it can be tough when they do get rejected, especially if it's someone they started having strong feelings.

I'm not disagreeing with you on the fact that people need to vent instead of letting it fester. But if you've been observing this thread long enough, you'll know that some people only post in here to vent. They don't try to update us on their attempts on self-improvement. Some people brush aside advice from various sources (of differing opinions) over and over. Nobody owes us anything, but it gets a touch frustrating when you watch people provide solid advice and people just don't take it, or bring out the worst in other posters who are already having a shit time of things.

I've seen it, and yeah, it's frustrating. There are some folks who just won't listen and that's unfortunate, just gotta let them be and help the folks that do want help. I've given out a lot of advice myself and the ones that don't listen, won't. Not much can be done in that area. Ignoring them is probably the best thing to do.

Maybe we don't do enough to support each other. I think we do a great job on congratulating even the smallest victories in here though.

And that's worth celebrating!

 

[Kad5]

Don't know what to do.

There is this girl who acts very flirtatious. Not just around me though. She acts flirty with almost every guy. But she seems to have developed close feelings towards me in particular. She always tells me personal shit about her life and looks to me for support.

I'm also one of the few guys she kisses on the cheek. I've only seen her do this with one other guy.

She has hooked up with two of my friends in the past. Put them in the friend zone and all that.

She's recently told me how she loves me and stuff. I don't take it seriously or anything though obviously.

Just recently we were at a bar with another girl and she got drunk and we smoked and such. Most of the night she was flirting with a guy and using him to get drinks. Meanwhile i'm just sitting around cuz the place isn't much fun to me.

My friend notices me and gets close to me occasionally to ask me if there's anyway that I could have more fun and shit. I just tell her i'm fine. Later on she starts talking to me and saying that she feels great and that she juts enjoys being around me and that I make her happy and stuff and how she loves me and shit.

The other girl is also drunk at this point. I take them both back to my room at our dorm (it's co-ed) and we watch a movie. They end up sleeping on my bed. I turn on the light and they wake up. I ask them if they want to go to sleep. They tell me yes and so I tell them good night and they head up to their rooms. They tell me good night and explain to me how i'm such a great guy and how i'm so awesome for baby sitting them.


:\

 

[jaxword]

They tell me good night and explain to me how i'm such a great guy and how i'm so awesome for baby sitting them.

Oh man...you're boned. They don't even see you as a potential partner, they see you as a nice, safe...BORING person. Not even friend, it's almost doormat level here. Your entire story makes you seem like they're just using you for rides.

Sorry, man, this one would be a losing battle for you. Unless you like a challenge, this one is a lost cause.

 

[Kad5]

Oh man...you're boned. They don't even see you as a potential partner, they see you as a nice, safe...BORING person. Not even friend, it's almost doormat level here.

Sorry, man, this one would be a losing battle for you. Unless you like a challenge.

Yeah I figured.

They love to hang out with me all the time though. It's kind of bothersome to hang around girls like that.

 

[reilo]

Don't know what to do.

There is this girl who acts very flirtatious. Not just around me though. She acts flirty with almost every guy. But she seems to have developed close feelings towards me in particular. She always tells me personal shit about her life and looks to me for support.

I'm also one of the few guys she kisses on the cheek. I've only seen her do this with one other guy.

She has hooked up with two of my friends in the past. Put them in the friend zone and all that.

She's recently told me how she loves me and stuff. I don't take it seriously or anything though obviously.

Just recently we were at a bar with another girl and she got drunk and we smoked and such. Most of the night she was flirting with a guy and using him to get drinks. Meanwhile i'm just sitting around cuz the place isn't much fun to me.

My friend notices me and gets close to me occasionally to ask me if there's anyway that I could have more fun and shit. I just tell her i'm fine. Later on she starts talking to me and saying that she feels great and that she juts enjoys being around me and that I make her happy and stuff and how she loves me and shit.

The other girl is also drunk at this point. I take them both back to my room at our dorm (it's co-ed) and we watch a movie. They end up sleeping on my bed. I turn on the light and they wake up. I ask them if they want to go to sleep. They tell me yes and so I tell them good night and they head up to their rooms. They tell me good night and explain to me how i'm such a great guy and how i'm so awesome for baby sitting them.


:\

What prevented you from making a move whenever you hung out together?

 

[Kad5]

What prevented you from making a move whenever you hung out together?

Because i'm not sure if she's even into me. She acts flirty with every guy even guys she isn't interested in. I'm just different because out of every guy her and I have the closest relationship. She tells me things she's never told any of her other friends.

She said she wants to hang out with me tomorrow so I dunno....i'm just gonna act casual and see how it goes. If she gives me some signals i'll try and make something work. But i'm not gonna act aggressive about it and try and make something happen.

 

[jaxword]

Yeah I figured.

They love to hang out with me all the time though. It's kind of bothersome to hang around girls like that.

Don't be "a nice guy." You're not a nice guy. I don't mean that as an insult, I mean that if you're being nice to someone with the hidden intent of sleeping with them, that's not particularly nice or honest. You really need to be straight up when it comes to your intentions or else women will steamroll right by you to the next guy--whether he's nice or not.

Come on, you're complaining about hanging out with them. Why are you even hanging out with them, then?

 

[Kad5]

Don't be "a nice guy." You're not a nice guy. I don't mean that as an insult, I mean that if you're being nice to someone with the hidden intent of sleeping with them, that's not particularly nice or honest. You really need to be straight up when it comes to your intentions or else women will steamroll right by you to the next guy--whether he's nice or not.

My goal wasn't even to sleep with them. I was genuinely trying to take care of them.

I don't care that I didn't get laid. I'm just trying to figure out if this girl has any feelings deep down for me. She keeps giving me mixed signals. I wish she wouldn't kiss me and stuff if she didn't genuinely like me.

 

[jaxword]

My goal wasn't even to sleep with them. I was genuinely trying to take care of them.

I don't care that I didn't get laid. I'm just trying to figure out if this girl has any feelings deep down for me. She keeps giving me mixed signals. I wish she wouldn't kiss me and stuff if she didn't genuinely like me.

Honestly, she would tell you if she was interested. I don't know your exact circumstances or your personality, but from what you've said, you really don't seem like you've made YOUR intentions clear.

It sounds more like you WANT her to have feelings for you, so you're looking for reasons to expect it. The things you've said so far could easily be a girl who is just using you.

You have to be straight up with your emotions or else you'll just be seen as a sexless tool.

 

[Shouta]

My goal wasn't even to sleep with them. I was genuinely trying to take care of them.

I don't care that I didn't get laid. I'm just trying to figure out if this girl has any feelings deep down for me. She keeps giving me mixed signals. I wish she wouldn't kiss me and stuff if she didn't genuinely like me.

Yep. just like jax says, be straight and tell them your intentions. If she isn't interested, then time to move on. It's less of a headache for you an easier to move on because you haven't really developed feelings for you,or have you?

 

[Kad5]

Honestly, she would tell you if she was interested. I don't know your exact circumstances or your personality, but from what you've said, you really don't seem like you've made YOUR intentions clear.

You have to be straight up with your emotions or else you'll just be seen as a sexless tool to be used.

She's told me she has feelings for me definitely. I just don't know if they translate intimately. Me and her are extremely close. She always tells me how i'm so great and super awesome and stuff.

Am I supposed to do something? What the hell do I even do? I already tease her and stuff occasionally in a joking manner. And hell sometimes we even argue. But then we apologize to each other. Me and her agree that we're very similar to each other.

But now i'm remembering something.

Just yesterday i was in a bed with her and she told me not to "try any funny stuff". Didn't want me to spoon her basically.

So yeah she probably isn't into me like that.

 

[Kad5]

Yep. just like jax says, be straight and tell them your intentions. If she isn't interested, then time to move on. It's less of a headache for you an easier to move on because you haven't really developed feelings for you,or have you?

I've already told her in our personal talks that I think she's really pretty and awesome and that she makes me happy whenever i'm with her. What I found funny is that she thought I was gonna say something bad about her.

But I never directly told her I like her and want a relationship with her or asked her out on a date or anything.

 

[Shouta]

I've already told her in our personal talks that I think she's really pretty and awesome and that she makes me happy whenever i'm with her. What I found funny is that she thought I was gonna say something bad about her.

But I never directly told her I like her and want a relationship with her or asked her out on a date or anything.

Then make it even clearer and tell her that. The clearer you are, the better.

She sounds like someone that would really fuck with you if you aren't clear with your intentions. That's only going to cause you more suffering and it's best not to put yourself into that situation.

 

[jaxword]

She's told me she has feelings for me definitely. I just don't know if they translate intimately. Me and her are extremely close. She always tells me how i'm so great and super awesome and stuff.

Am I supposed to do something? What the hell do I even do? I already tease her and stuff occasionally in a joking manner. And hell sometimes we even argue. But then we apologize to each other. Me and her agree that we're very similar to each other.

But now i'm remembering something.

Just yesterday i was in a bed with her and she told me not to "try any funny stuff". Didn't want me to spoon her basically.

So yeah she probably isn't into me like that.

Sorry man, you've been put into the sexless friendzone.

This sounds cliche, but I've found it to be remarkably true for me and my friends. A woman has decided whether or not you are sexy in the first meeting. Regardless of whether or not it could actually happen or she'd even want to, she's already done the mental judgment on your sexual attractiveness.

In other words, you have to make it clear you aren't aiming to be friends from the start. Or else she'll put you in that completely sexless friend category. This allows her TO be friends with you--after all, think of it from her perspective. Why would she want to be friends with a guy she wants to sleep with? She'd make her intentions clear from the start.

That's what this generation of nerdy "nice" guys doesn't realize. You have to make it clear from the start.

 

[Kad5]

Sorry man, you've been put into the sexless friendzone.

This sounds cliche, but I've found it to be remarkably true for me and my friends. A woman has decided whether or not you are sexy in the first meeting. Regardless of whether or not it could actually happen or she'd even want to, she's already done the mental judgment on your sexual attractiveness.

In other words, you have to make it clear you aren't aiming to be friends from the start. Or else she'll put you in that completely sexless friend category. This allows her TO be friends with you--after all, think of it from her perspective. Why would she want to be friends with a guy she wants to sleep with? She'd make her intentions clear from the start.

That's what this generation of nerdy guys doesn't realize. You have to make it clear from the start.

That's honestly perfectly fine by me. The only issue I have is that she keeps kissing me and holding my arm and hand and crap. All it serves to do is tease me.

Sure she's told me she thinks i'm cute. But that doesn't mean much I don't think.

 

[lawlohwhat]

But as much as you guys keep repeating this, there are guys out there that are doing this and more yet still not getting anywhere with anyone. As BigDug pointed out, it's not just guys that are a problem but the whole environment for dating as a whole. Self-improvement is always important, there is no doubt it. However, to ignore trends that are occurring and the attitudes of the other party to rail on folks that need to vent is rather silly. As much as guy can open the road ahead of him if the destination itself is gated off, there's nothing they can do.



I don't think many people ever believe they are entitled to anything beyond a chance to prove themselves. That much at least is something that everyone deserves, regardless of who they are.

This "Chin up! Try again!" attitude is dandy and all but it's never as simple as that. If you're hurt or angry, venting it out is a lot better than letting it fester. If you can't let it go then it's only going to hurt you later. Not all guys can simple go from one rejection to another without feeling a thing what with all the circumstances that can arise. Let it out, learn from it, then move on is what should be said.

Everything is on a case by case basis of course but I feel like this thread often feels like it's talking from a high horse rather than simply trying to push folks to improve what they can.

Chin up and try again is not what is being advised here. There is no need to chin up when you are not attached to the outcome of an experience, but rather invested in the experience qua experience. The positive reinforcement comes from the experience of trying and failing or succeeding, regardless of the outcome. The life that you have is then appreciated for the fact that it is there and presenting possibilities, opportunities to decide and grow, other interesting people, and the beauty of the fact that all of it is ever changing and finite.

I'm not saying that you need to go out there and pretend that there aren't obstacles in your way, that everything is easy and carefree, and that it's just a matter of believing; that's just silly. Rather, I would hope that we could open some of the people in this thread to the dangers that are inherent in the consumption-obsessed society that we live in. When people literally believe that their worth is determined by their income and the materialistic beauty of the girl they have on their arm, it creates an obsessive and fetishist attitude that is entirely pervasive and destructive.

There is no high horse or pulpit to preach from here. We are all on a fucking video game forum. We probably all share nerdy tendencies. We probably mostly share introverted personalities. However, the opportunity for significant personal growth is only open when your beliefs are strongly challenged and you are pushed. It's not about achieving internet fame, it's about helping people by challenging them to be better to everyone they come across.

EDIT: I think soultron might be right that we don't give enough positive feedback to the successes in here, as I'm certainly guilty of that.

 

[Snakeyes]

Phew, so much negativity on the previous page. Don't let that anger simmer in you, it shows when you're talking to others, especially women.

I'll chime in on the "confident" attitude with a quote from One Piece that I think embodies the ideal state of mind when taking to women, and life in general;

'The act of not doubting.' That is strength!

And that is game, charm, swagger, etc... Don't overthink things and just have fun.

You know what's hard? Finding a decent paying job in a new city with zero work experience right after high school. I studied the few positive things on my resume and rehearsed before going to interviews. Got shot down every time. A few weeks later I decided to try again and applied at the most high profile company so far. You know what my mom told me before the interview? "Just have fun."

Maybe I had slowly gotten better at interviews without noticing. Maybe someone put in a recommendation for me. Maybe the company was desperately in need of someone. But I was completely transparent, calm and didn't try hard to show myself in a certain way. And I got hired on the spot.

I decided to adopt that attitude everywhere since then and though things haven't always been perfect, I've had much more overall success.


On virginity in online profiles: Why would you bring that up right from the start? I know jack about online dating but that's a no-no. Granted, some girls love the idea of leading a guy and showing him the ropes. A good amount of them will however think that you're either going to bolt elsewhere after getting over that hump or have unrealistic expectations of what an intimate relationship should be like.


On wingmen and douchebags: What's with the self-entitlement? We're not talking Gamestop pre-orders here. Why back off on some girl that I'm attracted to just because you told me that you're into her? If you want her so damn much then get out there and prove your worth. If there's chemistry between you two then it won't matter if I'm in the picture or not. Call me a dick all you want, but I have the same mindset towards women that are already in a relationship. Just replace "chemistry" with "a relationship worth pursuing."

In my opinion it's best to adopt a "lone wolf" strategy when meeting women. Going out with friends is a lot of fun but I don't believe in having a designated wingman. The benefits outweigh the risks and limitations.

 

[jaxword]

That's honestly perfectly fine by me. The only issue I have is that she keeps kissing me and holding my arm and hand and crap. All it serves to do is tease me.

Sure she's told me she thinks i'm cute. But that doesn't mean much I don't think.

Imagine it from her perspective.

She wants someone to be there for her and her emotional issues and problems.

Like an emotional sponge.

Generally speaking, a guy will do that for her...if there's the expectation that this is going to lead to something more. Like a relationship and by relationship I mean sex. The more aggressive guys will make that clear.

But in your case? You're willing to do all that basically for free.

That's the friendzone. She probably doesn't even think she's teasing you, in her mind you're sexless and thus won't respond (like another guy would).

 

[Kad5]

Imagine it from her perspective.

She wants someone to be there for her and her emotional issues and problems.

Like an emotional sponge.

Generally speaking, a guy will do that for her...if there's the expectation that this is going to lead to something more. Like a relationship and by relationship I mean sex. The more aggressive guys will make that clear.

But in your case? You're willing to do all that basically for free.

That's the friendzone. She probably doesn't even think she's teasing you, in her mind you're sexless and thus won't respond (like another guy would).

Am I supposed to be doing something here then?

 

[jaxword]

Am I supposed to be doing something here then?

Yes, move on, improve yourself as a man and find someone better to pursue. You really need to ask yourself: Why is this girl so important? Is she THAT hot? Is she THAT nice a person?

Or is she the only one who showed you any attention and thus you're hooked for life?

Let go and become your own man who attracts others instead of following.

You can do it.

There is no high horse or pulpit to preach from here. We are all on a fucking video game forum. We probably all share nerdy tendencies. We probably mostly share introverted personalities. However, the opportunity for significant personal growth is only open when your beliefs are strongly challenged and you are pushed. It's not about achieving internet fame, it's about helping people by challenging them to be better to everyone they come across.

EDIT: I think soultron might be right that we don't give enough positive feedback to the successes in here, as I'm certainly guilty of that.

Probably because a lot of people on gaf are very angry and bitter people in general who look for any opportunity to insult and demean others.

Instead of improving ourselves, we try and bring others down. It's really an asshole attitude that shouldn't be encouraged.


As for the nerdy tendancies, god yes. It was grade 11 for me that changed my life. I used to play WoW every night and never talk to girls ever. Then a friend invited me to a party and I got drunk for the first time and boom, I was hitting on everything. Of course I made a complete idiot of myself, but I didn't care, and all of a sudden I realized that rejection means nothing. Going from virgin to sleeping with as many girls as possible really changes your perspective--gave up the WoW, started working out, started having parties and all of a sudden socializing in real life became way more interesting than video games. I'm still a drunken college idiot, but it's definitely more fun.

 

[Kad5]

Yes, move on, improve yourself as a man and find someone better to pursue.

You can do it.

Probably best. Part of me just kind of wants to ditch her but seeing as how i'm important to her all of a sudden I think that would just make her depressed.

 

[Maddness]

Am I supposed to be doing something here then?

Not to be rude or a dick, but she knows you like women right? I say this because I had a friend a few years back to went through something almost to the letter similar to what you're going through now. Turns out that the girl thought he was gay. It's almost movie cliche.

Regardless, you need to get this behind you and move on in one direction or another. Whether that's knowing that you're friends and it'll not be anything more than that, or that maybe there could be something there for you. Either way, you need that knowledge so that you can make your acceptance of it and move forward. That's all up to you. Be honest, confront her, and tell her how you feel. The worst she can say is no thanks and it sounds like you're already in a position to accept that answer if it comes to that.

The best advice I can give to anyone about women is simple. Learn how to play the game and then play it better. It really isn't that hard of a game once you figure out the rules. Understand those and you'll be owning boardwalk and parks place before you know it.

 

[jaxword]

Probably best. Part of me just kind of wants to ditch her but seeing as how i'm important to her all of a sudden I think that would just make her depressed.

You just talked yourself into being her emotional doormat again.

What's really going on here? Why can't you let go of her? Why is she so important to you, this one person out of the 3 billion other women out there?

Is she literally the only woman in your life?

 

[Dina]

That's honestly perfectly fine by me. The only issue I have is that she keeps kissing me and holding my arm and hand and crap. All it serves to do is tease me.

Then tell her to stop it. If she feels at ease with you, she can handle a little push back.

 

[Kad5]

Not to be rude or a dick, but she knows you like women right? I say this because I had a friend a few years back to went through something almost to the letter similar to what you're going through now. Turns out that the girl thought he was gay. It's almost movie cliche.

Regardless, you need to get this behind you and move on in one direction or another. Whether that's knowing that you're friends and it'll not be anything more than that, or that maybe there could be something there for you. Either way, you need that knowledge so that you can make your acceptance of it and move forward. That's all up to you. Be honest, confront her, and tell her how you feel. The worst she can say is no thanks and it sounds like you're already in a position to accept that answer if it comes to that.

The best advice I can give to anyone about women is simple. Learn how to play the game and then play it better. It really isn't that hard of a game once you figure out the rules. Understand those and you'll be owning boardwalk and parks place before you know it.

Yes she knows i'm not gay. In my defense I haven't made it obvious i'm interested in her. On the contrary. If anything I convey I don't like her like that and am keeping her as a friend.

But I keep pondering and i'm just gonna assume i'm in the friend zone with her simply because she hasn't made any obvious moves on me other than kissing me on the cheek and holding onto my arms and hands and caressing my hands and stuff.

 

[Kad5]

You just talked yourself into being her emotional doormat again.

What's really going on here? Why can't you let go of her? Why is she so important to you, this one person out of the 3 billion other women out there?

Is she literally the only woman in your life?

She's not THAT important to me. It's gotten to the point where i'm more important to her than she is to me. She's told me she goes through cases of suicidal thoughts and how it scares her and crap and she cries and vents to me about this stuff.

But i'm not stupid. This isn't how a girl acts towards a guy if they are attracted to them.

She vented about how much she loves and cares for me today while she was drunk. Pretty typical for someone to do when they are drunk. And the last thing she told me was that she wanted to hang out with me when she wakes up.

I guess i'll keep her around and move on. Seems to be the only thing I can do.

 

[Maddness]

Yes she knows i'm not gay. In my defense I haven't made it obvious i'm interested in her. On the contrary. If anything I convey I don't like her like that and am keeping her as a friend.

But I keep pondering and i'm just gonna assume i'm in the friend zone with her simply because she hasn't made any obvious moves on me other than kissing me on the cheek and holding onto my arms and hands and caressing my hands and stuff.

Sounds like you're stuck in 2 roles man. On the one hand you try and play her off like she's nothing even close to being on your radar. On the other, you're finding out that you actually care for this girl in a way that you aren't showing. You're basically fucking yourself. I know these guys are telling you to move on and to tell her to stop, but realistically you're putting yourself in that position.

By playing the play off role, you're basically showing her that the most you'll ever be is friends. That gives her a sense of safety with you that nothing she does will ever change you beyond the role of a friend. That's most likely why you're getting these tips of affection and she thinks nothing of it. (Of course, she could just be a complete tease, but I'm going to use your own descriptions of the situation.) You need to stop playing both roles and figure out which one you want to be. You're putting yourself in a spot you obviously don't want to and can't handle being in.

It sounds like you have a choice to make just as much, if not more so, than the choice you think she needs to make.

 

[Kad5]

Sounds like you're stuck in 2 roles man. On the one hand you try and play her off like she's nothing even close to being on your radar. On the other, you're finding out that you actually care for this girl in a way that you aren't showing. You're basically fucking yourself. I know these guys are telling you to move on and to tell her to stop, but realistically you're putting yourself in that position.

By playing the play off role, you're basically showing her that the most you'll ever be is friends. That gives her a sense of safety with you that nothing she does will ever change you beyond the role of a friend. That's most likely why you're getting these tips of affection and she thinks nothing of it. (Of course, she could just be a complete tease, but I'm going to use your own descriptions of the situation.) You need to stop playing both roles and figure out which one you want to be. You're putting yourself in a spot you obviously don't want to and can't handle being in.

It sounds like you have a choice to make just as much, if not more so, than the choice you think she needs to make.

The best thing I can do is give her more signals when we hang out. I'll see what happens.

 

[jaxword]

She's not THAT important to me. It's gotten to the point where i'm more important to her than she is to me. She's told me she goes through cases of suicidal thoughts and how it scares her and crap and she cries and vents to me about this stuff.

But i'm not stupid. This isn't how a girl acts towards a guy if they are attracted to them.

She vented about how much she loves and cares for me today while she was drunk. Pretty typical for someone to do when they are drunk. And the last thing she told me was that she wanted to hang out with me when she wakes up.

I guess i'll keep her around and move on. Seems to be the only thing I can do.

This girl sounds like she needs serious therapy and professional help, man. You're clearly trying to be her psychiatrist, and that's not healthy for either of you.

I date crazy girls, but I don't try and be their doctor. That's a recipe for disaster when something REALLY goes wrong that neither of you can handle.

The best thing I can do is give her more signals when we hang out. I'll see what happens.

Wait, what? You just said you're gonna move on, now you're gonna give her "signals"?

I don't know, man, it sounds like you may not be sure of what you want either.

 

[Kad5]

This girl sounds like she needs serious therapy and professional help, man. You're clearly trying to be her psychiatrist, and that's not healthy for either of you.

I date crazy girls, but I don't try and be their doctor. That's a recipe for disaster when something REALLY goes wrong that neither of you can handle.

Lucky for her i'm into neuropsychology. She knows this. Probably why she does this to me.

She knows i'm not stupid. She knows i'm smart and intelligent. When she hooked up with my friend she was wondering why I seemed like I was in a distant mood around her. It made her upset. She thought I was mad at her. I didn't tell her I knew the relationship wouldn't work out.

I knew my friend wanted a relationship with her. My female friend just wanted to hook up with him. She did not like this. Then when she told me about the annoying texts she would get from him I had to explain to her he had bipolar disorder.

She's gotten close to me because of our talks. We have our talks because I can intelligently provide insight for her. This gives her comfort. I make her feel loved.

In the process I occasionally distance myself from her. This attracts her to me and this is usually where she acts affectionate towards me.

What a hilarious situation I have created for myself. I could easily destroy her entire ego if I wanted to.

 

[Kad5]

This girl sounds like she needs serious therapy and professional help, man. You're clearly trying to be her psychiatrist, and that's not healthy for either of you.

I date crazy girls, but I don't try and be their doctor. That's a recipe for disaster when something REALLY goes wrong that neither of you can handle.




Wait, what? You just said you're gonna move on, now you're gonna give her "signals"?

I don't know, man, it sounds like you may not be sure of what you want either.

What do you mean by move on. Drop her from my life? You have no idea what I have created for myself then.

 

[jaxword]

Lucky for her i'm into neuropsychology. She knows this. Probably why she does this to me.

She knows i'm not stupid. She knows i'm smart and intelligent. When she hooked up with my friend she was wondering why I seemed like I was in a distant mood around her. It made her upset. She thought I was mad at her. I didn't tell her I knew the relationship wouldn't work out.

I knew my friend wanted a relationship with her. My female friend just wanted to hook up with him. She did not like this. Then when she told me about the annoying texts she would get from him I had to explain to her he had bipolar disorder.

She's gotten close to me because of our talks. We have our talks because I can intelligently provide insight for her. This gives her comfort. I make her feel loved.

In the process I occasionally distance myself from her. This attracts her to me and this is usually where she acts affectionate towards me.

What a hilarious situation I have created for myself. I could easily destroy her entire ego if I wanted to.

Dude...

This entire situation is sounding worse and worse. Now it sounds like you're picturing yourself as this puppeteer holding her strings or something.

As for "moving on", it was something you said, man...

 

[Kad5]

Dude...

This entire situation is sounding worse and worse. Now it sounds like you're picturing yourself as this puppeteer holding her strings or something.

As for "moving on", it was something you said, man...

Not on purpose. That's just how she is. She craves a guy like me. Someone who will love and care for her. That's why she hangs out with lots of guys. That is why she is so flirtatious with almost every guy she meets.

She's developed a bond with me in such a way where she genuinely cares about me. If I decided to avoid her it would make her upset. I know this because I actually did it before when she was hooking up with my friend. She thought I was mad at her so when I saw her she confronted me about it and asked me if I was mad at her. I told her I wasn't naturally and I wasn't. I just didn't wanna deal with her while the situation was going on.

She's told me lots of times how she doesn't want me to be angry with her and how she loves and cares about me.

 

[daviyoung]

snip

Ok, let's get a something sorted out first. How old are you?

There is no universal truth to women, as there is no universal truth for men but in my experience women are exactly like men with different parts. That's it. Our brains are practically identical and in the case of dating that's all that matters.

The fact that society, here your biggest problem, has somehow conditioned women isn't as strong as you think. For every one problem you have with yourself, your female equivalent has 10 things she thinks wrong with her. Except she doesn't wear this on her sleeve like men do, she hides it and buries it. You have to understand that men have always had it easy, and they will carry on having it easy. The 'feminist revolution' means very little in terms of dating because the standard human traditions are far more deeply entrenched. Women still want men to be men, just as men still want women to be women. Everything in between is up to an individual's taste.

The idea that women are somehow automatically attracted to bullies is bunk. Women are attracted to confidence. Easily influenced women are attracted to obviously confident men i.e over-compensating, easily-influenced men. This, as is proven time and time again, is a relationship recipe for disaster yet people never learn. This scale shifts per person, but in general we are all looking for our equivalent. It's just that on the extremes of this spectrum, attraction can be psychologically suicidal.

You mention stereotypical jock scenarios, where they somehow date models. This speaks more of your social conditioning than theirs. Why are you attracted to these women? Have you not considered how incompatible, on a mental level, you may be with women who are attracted to these men?

You need to remember that as a man, you've never had it so good. You hold the power, you have the power to make women hate you for ignoring them (accidentally or otherwise), and make them love you for doing something they didn't expect (accidentally or otherwise). I can guarantee that there are women attracted to you, you just need to work on your own psyche before you find out for yourself.

 

[U n i o n 0015]

Ok, let's get a something sorted out first. How old are you?

There is no universal truth to women, as there is no universal truth for men but in my experience women are exactly like men with different parts. That's it. Our brains are practically identical and in the case of dating that's all that matters.

You have to understand that men have always had it easy, and they will carry on having it easy. The 'feminist revolution' means very little in terms of dating because the standard human traditions are far more deeply entrenched. Women still want men to be men, just as men still want women to be women. Everything in between is up to an individual's taste.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, just plain wrong.

There are HUGE socio-economic shifts happening between men and women, and anyone who thinks it doesn't affect them is being foolish or is too young to realize that what happens to overall society affects even you at the micro level.

The gender that lost three-fourths of the jobs in this Great Recession was men. Women were relatively unaffected, and in urban markets they enjoy a better job market as well as better pay than their equivalent male peers.

What you end up with is a generation of women on the rise while a generation of men are going down. You don't think this affects dating at all? Of course it does, because you still have the expectations upon that same generation that men should at least be equal providers in terms of money and support.

You're ending up with a situation in which many women are having to "date down,", simply because men aren't in the position they previously were. This is unheard in the entire history of the U.S.

Start learning.

 

[daviyoung]

Wrong, wrong, wrong, just plain wrong.

There are HUGE socio-economic shifts happening between men and women, and anyone who thinks it doesn't affect them is being foolish or is too young to realize that what happens to overall society affects even you at the micro level.

The gender that lost three-fourths of the jobs in this Great Recession was men. Women were relatively unaffected, and in urban markets they enjoy a better job market as well as better pay than their equivalent male peers.

What you end up with is a generation of women on the rise while a generation of men are going down. You don't think this affects dating at all? Of course it does, because you still have the expectations upon that same generation that men should at least be equal providers in terms of money and support.

You're ending up with a situation in which many women are having to "date down,", simply because men aren't in the position they previously were. This is unheard in the entire history of the U.S.

Start learning.

The Great Recession? Huge socio-economic shifts? What the hell is this rubbish you're buying by the bucketload?

I'm not from the US, and neither is the poster I responded to, so I have no idea if people are building houses out of dollar bills over there, or if people are still buying nice things with their pay packets.

The job market means little, because if you're dating on the assumption that you can 'date up' since you're making more money than your prospective girlfriend then you're in for a real treat if you ever want a loving and trusting relationship with someone. So you can't impress a girl with your salary any more? Oh well, nevermind. I don't get how that emasculates you.