In my humble opinion, the AI is inexcusably bad.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Gran Turismo 6 |OT| Moon Rover The Castle
- Thread starter Mobius 1
- Start date
In my humble opinion, the AI is inexcusably bad.
FunnyBunny
Member
Garnett's argument was the AI isn't supposed to challenge each other; each car is merely a benchmark of the best time (first) to the worst time (last) and everything in between.
The stipulation is you are challenging the track and computer cars are merely a measuring stick of your progress. If you buy his argument, computer controlled cars shouldn't be challenging for position much at all.
Personally, I like when computer controlled cars challenge, press and look for opportunities to overtake. Has Polyphony ever said what their "intent" is with computer controlled cars on the track (i.e., should they be racing or merely driving)?
gutterboy44
Member
I've long accepted that the cars in GT races are moving obstacles. I just wish even by the lowered standard of GT AI, they were more dynamic. They don't obey the in game physics, so why not at least shake it up.
FunnyBunny
Member
Gotcha -- I didn't know if the "moving obstacle" was widely accepted among the GT fan base or not.
I think a big problem for racing games is the condensed nature of the races themselves. What happens over the course of dozens of laps in the real world must happen during 3, 4, or 5 laps in the game. I think it leads to AI that allows the gamer a chance to compete, even if they crash early during the race. It is a game, after all.
I'm excited to see where GT goes from here. I don't know if cloud-based AI is a solution, as Forza 5 appears a little crash happy, but the AI certainly is more lifelike. The debate over whether it's a good or a bad thing is a debate for a different thread.
I am very jealous of the GT fan base right now and wish I had a PS3. Oh well!
I'll try to stay on the sidelines a bit, now. I don't want to derail a thread for people who actually own the game
MrCookiepants
Member
My game just froze in a lobby. This is the second time it's happened. Had to reset the console.
Anyone else experienced this?
Anyone else experienced this?
gutterboy44
Member
Gotcha -- I didn't know if the "moving obstacle" was widely accepted among the GT fan base or not.
I think a big problem for racing games is the condensed nature of the races themselves. What happens over the course of dozens of laps in the real world must happen during 3, 4, or 5 laps in the game. I think it leads to AI that allows the gamer a chance to compete, even if they crash early during the race. It is a game, after all.
I'm excited to see where GT goes from here. I don't know if cloud-based AI is a solution, as Forza 5 appears a little crash happy, but the AI certainly is more lifelike. The debate over whether it's a good or a bad thing is a debate for a different thread.
I am very jealous of the GT fan base right now and wish I had a PS3. Oh well!
I'll try to stay on the sidelines a bit, now. I don't want to derail a thread for people who actually own the game
I wouldn't mind some races with time scaling for fuel use and tear wear. Even in a 5 lap race, having to pit at least once makes things more exciting. So strange that things like tire wear or needing to pit only appear in GT games in the endurance events which are "end game" events for most people. Every race should have tire wear.
I did yesterday. It froze on "Connecting to server..." when trying to join a lobby.
I just pressed the PS button and quit GT6, then restarted it though. I didn't have to reset the console.
Happened to me twice yesterday. Game froze while i was on track and I couldn't exit. Had to reset the console.
Wax Free Vanilla
Member
i've seen the ai dicing with each other on many occasions in my gimped races, they've been three abreast, side by side in the corners, but polyphony do need to fix this slow down crap pronto and stop the ai from braking for no reason. they should grab the fastest online laps and build the pro ai around these, with the racing line, accel/brake inputs, etc
and they should fire the ai guys and get people in who know what they're doing.
*prays* gt will some day have ai on grand prix 4's level.
I support this idea.
The "measuring stick" argument doesn't hold up because there is so much rubber banding, and the AI cars seem to group themselves according to your possible top speed (usually bunching into 2-3 distinct groups). The AI behaves relative to your current car, not to the track. So while I spend my time tuning my car to the track (which I do), the AI "tunes" itself to me. That's the best description of the AI that I can think of.
However, I think that the philosophy for the series has always been that you are racing against the track in a car tuned to that track (in a given class). And I will say that I prefer the AI in this game to that of prior entries. It's far less slavishly devoted to the racing line. For example, cars will regularly give you space to pass on the inside without slamming into you--assuming you take the inside the way you're supposed to. There are still some wonky things about it, but all in all, it is a notable improvement.
But for all the AI's improvements, it still doesn't do the one thing it should do above all: pose a challenge.
Exactly. It baffles me how Polyphony thinks this is a good model for a campaign. It looks like a perfect scenario to expose all the weak points of GT (forcing you to deal with bad AI while abusing no penalty for collisions). And it is such a suspension of disbelief, can you imagine a real race with similarly powered cars where one driver climbs 12 places in 2 laps?
Grid starts + qualifying would make it so much more enjoyable. Didn't GT5 have qualifying? Or was it GT4. They could replace half the races with qualifying events, maybe in a format like F1 with elimination and it would be much better for me.
Anyway, I'm still greatly enjoying the driving. Currently in IA, just got a 458. What a beast, so much fun to drive.
Do games like forza actually simulate chassis damage or interior damage? Like if you get hit on the sides do you actually see the cars interior denting? Or its just cosmetic appearance and simple dents in your car? I'm sure forza could do more if the manufactures allowed them to, i doubt they do.
The AI is crap... but I also think it becomes even more apparent when you use overpowered cars.
When the playing field is even (or fixed eg. missions) races are more exiting. Just yesterday, I finished the supergt 300 championship and it was quite good because the field was kinda even.. also double file rolling starts should be the norm.
When the playing field is even (or fixed eg. missions) races are more exiting. Just yesterday, I finished the supergt 300 championship and it was quite good because the field was kinda even.. also double file rolling starts should be the norm.
gutterboy44
Member
It was a great car in GT5 and I am loving it even more in GT6. It is so insanely well balanced. I kept thinking I accidentally turned assists on.
drugstore_cowboy
Member
I don't think any manufacturer allows the vehicle's cockpit to become compromised.
If one or two did I doubt they'd add it for the sake of consistency.
PuppetMaster
Member
I think the rubberbanding got way more agressive in GT6. In GT5 it didn't really bother me.
The 1 on 1 Miura vs Gallardo event really highlighted it for me. No matter how fast my pace, the AI was always right on my ass, often rear ending me.
Finally on one retry I put my controller down before the race started, and was just watching the minimap My car was at a standstill. I could see my Ghost car in yellow on the minimap from my best lap. And in this situation where my car was not moving, the AI cars were way way behind my Ghost car. I was shocked just how big the gap was even just in the first lap.
The 1 on 1 Miura vs Gallardo event really highlighted it for me. No matter how fast my pace, the AI was always right on my ass, often rear ending me.
Finally on one retry I put my controller down before the race started, and was just watching the minimap My car was at a standstill. I could see my Ghost car in yellow on the minimap from my best lap. And in this situation where my car was not moving, the AI cars were way way behind my Ghost car. I was shocked just how big the gap was even just in the first lap.
Double file would be better but grid starts would be ideal (personally). Well, provided the AI was better of course.
gutterboy44
Member
The rubber band AI + the exaggerated draft makes the Like the Wind races pretty hilarious. Pro-tip: keep on eye on your rear view mirror Raming speeeeed!
Speaking of rear view mirror, it bugs the shit out of me that I can't enable a virtual mirror on the hood cam view. Why is it only in the bumper cam?
Speaking of rear view mirror, it bugs the shit out of me that I can't enable a virtual mirror on the hood cam view. Why is it only in the bumper cam?
I can't stand rubber band AI, so this does not bode well for me.
Graphics Horse
Member
Do the ai attempt to get in your slipstream yet? That would have made the ovals slightly more interesting in gt5.
The AI is still too easy even with the rubberbanding.
gutterboy44
Member
It seems they now put in some effort to draft, but they are completely unaware of their significant speed increase on long straights and drive straight into you. Maybe in GT7 they will master the pop. They also seem to try to draft dodge when ahead of you, but it is more of a wild swerve back and forth several times than a subtle dodge.
chrominance
Member
That might be it, I left TC at the default value of 5. So I guess I have to go learn how to drive without TC, which should be interesting.
IISANDERII
Member
Mission Races at IA are becoming tough. In the first 2 missions the AI parks itself right on the apex of a small corner so it's nearly impossible to overtake. Only way I was able to get gold on IA2 was that I found that you can bump the AI kind of hard if you bump the side of his car with the side of yours. If you put your bumper into him though, it will disqualify you.
ADRIANF1esp
Neo Member
A new graphics and sounds comparison between Gran Turismo 6 and Gran Turismo 5. Its a lap at Indianapolis circuit with Jaguar XJ13.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWOmfpeT-n4
And photos at Ascari with new BMW M4 Coupe:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWOmfpeT-n4
And photos at Ascari with new BMW M4 Coupe:
Well people complain when the AI is just setting a pre-determined time, realistically the AI should get faster if you are faster.
I think the problem is they don't race each other. They only really adjust speed vs. what the player is doing. But in a head to head if the player is way behind the AI should get more conservative. At least the AI's race manager should be yelling at them over the radio to slow down and maintain the car for the next race
See Vetel in F1. he would build a comfortable lead and then maintain pace the rest of the race, but sometimes would go faster (against orders) to set fastest lap late in the race.
It is somewhat baffling, these systems are already there (from b-spec) but it doesn't seem like the AI actually tries to win very often.
A new graphics and sounds comparison between Gran Turismo 6 and Gran Turismo 5. Its a lap at Indianapolis circuit with Jaguar XJ13.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWOmfpeT-n4
And photos at Ascari with new BMW M4 Coupe:
Adrian, this shot u took is ridiculus
IISANDERII
Member
Looking over the trophies on the PlayStation app and it says that 'First of Many' (win your first race) has only been claimed by 80.6% of players.
That's pretty low. Can the trophy only be won if you take 1st place in the first race you enter? That can't be right.
That's pretty low. Can the trophy only be won if you take 1st place in the first race you enter? That can't be right.
Katana_Strikes
Member
How many premium cars are there in the game out of the 1200+?
phosphor112
Banned
lem0n
Member
I need some friends on my PSN list to make the leaderboards more lively! If anyone wants to add me, please feel free! For online racing, I enjoy spec racing with oddball cars, like a Fiat 500 8v with soft racing slicks! Or maybe an all wagon race! Nurburgring, I could run there all day.
PSN: RWB993
PSN: RWB993
Risk Breaker
Member
I really never thought that GT5 (dunno about 6) had terrible AI.
However, the AI, good or bad, is FRIGGING SLOW. That's the main problem. For me, at least.
However, the AI, good or bad, is FRIGGING SLOW. That's the main problem. For me, at least.
phosphor112
Banned
Hudson Hornet available this Thursday.
First look at the process of recreating a car in GT.
http://playstation.gt6firstlove.com/chapter
First look at the process of recreating a car in GT.
http://playstation.gt6firstlove.com/chapter
NICE.
I really hope they are able to keep up adding cool stuff to GT6 over the next year and not just a release push marketing wise
A new graphics and sounds comparison between Gran Turismo 6 and Gran Turismo 5. Its a lap at Indianapolis circuit with Jaguar XJ13.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWOmfpeT-n4
The shadows in the cockpit are lightyears better in GT6, but I can't get over how bad the world before you looks compared to GT5. A pixilated mess...
This SCREAMS for a PS4 version to clean up the resolution and AA problems...
See You Next Wednesday
Banned
Did we see the same video? They look better because they flat out removed 90% of the shadows inside cars in GT6.
There is a faded blotch once in a while in GT6 where there were actual shadows of the wheel & interior in the cockpit in GT5.
phosphor112
Banned
Everyone bitched about the hard shadows, now we get the crap that's in GT6. =[
Here, pick your favorite I-edited-it-for-ya Phosp.
gutterboy44
Member
Gouda Jouji
Member
Was the "live build" stream earlier this month not live then? I had assumed that PD modeled the car by hand using old photos for reference since we saw the Hornet in-game already (that ad for the First Love series from late November) but the video shows them scanning and taking photos of the car. I thought they only finished the rebuild a few weeks ago.
zephervack
Member
hahahahah.
First thing I thought when I saw that pic is that the Mic must be broken.
On second thought, the Mic probably works and PD just need better Sound engineers.
Gouda Jouji
Member
The mic works fine, as evidenced by the start up/idle car sounds in the game. The sound engineers taking a recording of a parked car sustaining it's revs and pitching it up/down to try and "simulate" acceleration/deceleration is where it goes wrong.
phosphor112
Banned
I love you <3
The live build was live. They had social feeds and everything.
Gouda Jouji
Member
Maybe all the scanning and stuff they showed in the video was just for show then. Unless they have a time machine.
I finally decided to boot this game up, but what the fuck is in that day one patch?! My PS3 is saying it'll take two hours to download, and it's slowing down, meaning I probably won't be able to download it any time soon. What do I miss out on if I just play the game 1.0?
Damn. I've never been mad about day one patches until this.
Damn. I've never been mad about day one patches until this.
IISANDERII
Member
Something else that will help the drifting events is that you can change the tires. I'm doing the one with the RX7 and it starts you off on comfort soft so I went to comfort hard on the rear tires and was able to get gold.