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Guild Wars 2 |OT| Buy Once, Sub Never, Fun Forever

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I'm almost ready to buy it... but for people who've played it. Lets go negative for a second. Give me the bad / worry spots for this game. Is there anything that sticks out for you? Or is it all "OMG OMG 10/10"?

Mine isn't a popular opinion around here so I keep it to myself, but since you're asking for it, here's my take on this. I pre-purchased the game, and participated in a stress test, and played one Beta Weekend like mad, and a bit in the second, and lost a bit of my interest after that.
As a preface, I'm by no means saying it's going to be a bad game - far from it - and as we're getting closer to its release, I'm getting excited again and will definitely be playing it. I'm focusing on the parts here that I noticed negatively, and not on the many other positive parts of the game. Also know that many of these things are features that other players enjoy. I seem to be pretty alone in not liking some of them.

Having said that, here's what's bothering me:

  • Dynamic Level Adjustment
In PVE, Guild Wars is separated into different zones, each having an effective level determined obviously by the monsters that roam in it and the difficulty of the quests.
Here's what Dynamic Level Adjustment does: it automatically reduces the player's level to the level of the current zone you're in. So let's say you're level 23 and you run into a level 17 zone, you get reduced to that level and as long as you're in that zone, your level is effectively 17. This doesn't include your armour or your skills however.
It's probably what annoyed me the most playing in the beta. It feels like you are never your actual level. Because you aren't. Personally, it kills any sense of my character's progression, which is a huge part for me in an MMO. I like playing MMOs because I feel my character getting stronger, with each level more so. It's a nice feeling to do quests in a certain area, level up, and be able to notice how it's gradually becoming easier. Especially if you end up traveling through an area again where you had troubles before. You feel your character becoming stronger by how you ease through these passages. You feel your character progress, become better in a world that's all around you.
I really missed that in Guild Wars 2. Walk around a bit, you're level 11. Beam yourself to another area, you're level 18. Walk some more into the next area, it's level 16 again. Didn't like the feel of that.

  • Weapons
Another thing people probably won't agree with me on. Here it is anyway: I'm not entirely sold on how weapons are handled in Guild Wars 2 as opposed to other MMOs.
I don't really like that the first five skills are bound to a certain weapon type. I played a human mesmer woman with a great sword (can't remember what the weapon type is actually called like. It's a big bad-ass sword in any case.) for instance, and I really loved how she shot lazor beams with it. After 20 levels however, it started to bore me that I didn't have more customisation options. Sure there are other customisable ones, and it's nice to switch those around a bit. Why can't I do the same with the weapon skills? The illusions I could summon with the great sword were inferior to the ones I could summon with the staff, so I often had to switch to the staff. Why can't I do that with my great sword, if I like the look and feel of it more? To me, it doesn't feel so much like a cool new feature, as much more like a limitation of sorts.
Also, many of the skills are very similar to each other, no matter what weapon type you have. That's probably to make it more balanced, but it doesn't help the variety of the skills you get with each weapon type. Quite the opposite.

  • Personal Quests
I found them bland and uninteresting. They're pretty generic. The presentation wasn't particularly exciting, with the usual in game animations that look off, and the decent but not great voice acting.
Maybe there's some pretty neat stuff coming in the later stages of the game, but from what I've seen so far, I'll just skip ahead the cut scenes, rush through the game sequences and be done with it. It doesn't feel like writing my own story line. It just feels like yet another quest.

  • Difficulty
I'm not sure how many people had the same experience as I did ... sometimes, the difficulty was a little frustrating. Normal PVE and Renown Hearts are no problem, you run around, kill monster. If there are too many at once, monsters kill you. Pretty straightforward.
Then some boss comes around in your personal quest, and the experience turns frustrating. You have a really hard time killing the boss. And you feel powerless. Here's why, on the one hand: Dynamic Level Adjustment. You'd think, as you might usually do in an MMO, hey this boss is hard, let me come back in a level or two and try again, it's going to be better then. Doesn't work here.
On the other hand, there aren't a whole lot of options skill-wise. Especially in the beginning of the game were you do not have everything readily available for you. Yes, you have the ability to dodge, but this isn't Monster Hunter, this isn't the same thing, and dodging is limited. You can't say, hey I suck, let me kill a couple of other monster, brush up my skills, and then come back, either.
I'm fairly certain this won't be that much of a problem in the latter levels with the ability to customise your skills (as in skills of your profession) and traits. You will probably have nice sets by then and it will be lots of fun to try different things both skill- and trait-wise.
The first couple of hours had their annoying moments though, consisting of me running away from a boss in a big circle for 5 minutes or so, until it was finally dead. Wasn't very enjoyable.

I'm writing this to show you a different take on the game. This is how I personally felt playing these Beta Weekends. Most felt differently. Make of it whatever you want. I can only say again that I will probably enjoy this game when it gets released, and no-one is saying that certain mechanics won't end up growing on me.
Just a different perspective for you, from what I've seen so far.
 

Item Box

Member
I'm starting to have second thought about choosing Guardian since its so popular; it's like everyone is going to play that class :\
 
And each dungeon has three paths, and there are supposed to be some kind of dynamic/randomized events that can occur within each dungeon, so each play through will (potentially) be a little different from the last.

Only to a point though, after so many runs it's going to get stale like any other content.
 

Osaka

Did not ask for this tag
Could someone explain the server system for me shortly? How does the server choice matter in the end? I'm stuck between 2 groups of friends and their chosen servers.
 
  • Dynamic Level Adjustment
In PVE, Guild Wars is separated into different zones, each having an effective level determined obviously by the monsters that roam in it and the difficulty of the quests.
Here's what Dynamic Level Adjustment does: it automatically reduces the player's level to the level of the current zone you're in. So let's say you're level 23 and you run into a level 17 zone, you get reduced to that level and as long as you're in that zone, your level is effectively 17. This doesn't include your armour or your skills however.
It's probably what annoyed me the most playing in the beta. It feels like you are never your actual level. Because you aren't. Personally, it kills any sense of my character's progression, which is a huge part for me in an MMO. I like playing MMOs because I feel my character getting stronger, with each level more so. It's a nice feeling to do quests in a certain area, level up, and be able to notice how it's gradually becoming easier. Especially if you end up traveling through an area again where you had troubles before. You feel your character becoming stronger by how you ease through these passages. You feel your character progress, become better in a world that's all around you.
I really missed that in Guild Wars 2. Walk around a bit, you're level 11. Beam yourself to another area, you're level 18. Walk some more into the next area, it's level 16 again. Didn't like the feel of that.

When I was playing most of the feeling of the progression I got was from advancing through the personal story. But the world does open up to more things to do as well as you advance more.
 

Ferrio

Banned
Could someone explain the server system for me shortly? How does the server choice matter in the end? I'm stuck between 2 groups of friends and their chosen servers.

Can't WvWvW with people on different servers, anything else I believe you can guest on their server.
 
Could someone explain the server system for me shortly? How does the server choice matter in the end? I'm stuck between 2 groups of friends and their chosen servers.

Well you're not necessarily stuck there forever. You can change servers if you like. I think they are limiting it to once a week though?
 

Jira

Member
Could someone explain the server system for me shortly? How does the server choice matter in the end? I'm stuck between 2 groups of friends and their chosen servers.

They only thing that matters is where you want to WvW at, otherwise you can do everything else from any server and can jump between servers via guesting for free.
 

inky

Member
But you can only guest if you have a friend in another server, correct? I think that was the only issue. It's not like you can jump guest from server to server.
 
D

Deleted member 10571

Unconfirmed Member
I'm starting to have second thought about choosing Guardian since its so popular; it's like everyone is going to play that class :\

a) who cares?
b) with that few classes, you will get that feeling with every class! Just play what's fun for you, not to be "unique". Also, since there's no trinity you pretty much can discard the whole "I will only be in groups when I play X" thing. Just play what you want to play.
 

Pancakes

hot, steaming, as melted butter slips into the cracks, drizzled with sticky sweet syrup OH GOD
I can only spam log-in so much D:
 
Because its a wizard? Its a pretty hard class to play due to the amount of skills they have. Also, why don't we do a "what class will you play" poll here on GAF?

Yes we had one. Also I'm going by the one here and gw2guru and ele seemed fairly popular right along with warrior and guardian. I think mesmer will be least played
 

Keasar

Member
Is that Fall of Cybertron Optimus? That's particularly appropriate today, then, isn't it? :D

An Avatar (and specifically Iroh) and Transformers fan, we're going to get along just fine. :)
Yup, got him last week, waiting for a War for Cybertron Optimus Prime and Megatron, and a third-party War Axe for Optimus. Rytlock and Optimus does really nicely next to my computer at the office. Will try to get a new picture of them tomorrow morning. Sadly though, I dont know if it is the same in America, on Steam here Fall of Cybertron just got delayed two days. :(

Still playing catch up from last night, so I'm sorry for the late reply on this. You're lucky you've got something to mess with while you're waiting. Where did you pre-order it from, out of curiosity? I ordered mine from Gamestop on the first day because I thought there'd be a rush and there weren't any being sold online. I might have to give them a call and see if they know when they're expecting them in (my guess: "Guild What two? Lulz, I dunno, want Call of Dudebro 8?")

http://gw2status.com/ is your friend!
I ordered mine from a nordic chain called CDON, they were the only store that had any Collectors Editions left due to a huge rush and constant screwups from other online stores that were supposed to sell them. I did call them earlier to ensure that I would get mine on time, so maybe that helped? I am the first apparently in the school area (among the few who ordered one) to get his. Was kinda funny when I brought in the gigantic box to work and half the floor flipped out over its size. :p
 

LuuKyK

Member
Wait, is there a stress test now??

Literally just started.

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Item Box

Member
Odd, the client keeps telling me my computer doesn't meet minimum requirements. My computer is pretty dated, but I can play it just fine on medium settings.
 

Proven

Member
Only ground mounts and only if they can implement a mounted combat system.
Activity required.
What type of reward? Like how would you compensate a lvl 80 that does a new event? He wouldn't be getting any experience so does that mean he simply gets more gold/rep?

I don't really care if they add stuff for everyone but I think that lvl 80s shuold have other ways to "progress" outside of leveling. Maybe cool looking gear or something for doing certain difficult dungeons that can be done at 80, I dunno.

That's exactly what's in this game. Beyond difficult level 80 areas that require groups of people to be playing together, there are three level 80 only instanced dungeons.

I don't want make this debate and I'm not saying WOW is better, I ve bought GW2 cuz i can't play WOW anymore and I think the concepts from GW2 are great, BUT I was expecting more stuff like more dungeons... more things focused on PVE, I really don't like PVP...

The largest complaint I get about GW2 is that there's too much focus on PvE content... They even added PvE content to WvW.

This is the part I'm not entirely sold on.. All the dynamic events I've participated in thus far far too easy and require no coordination or teamwork. I'm hoping this is just because it's early content.

The first thing I do in every area is rush to the second half of the area for more difficulty. Then I went to area 2, and got my butt kicked even at the required level.

Because its a wizard? Its a pretty hard class to play due to the amount of skills they have. Also, why don't we do a "what class will you play" poll here on GAF?



I'm playing Warrior too :)
http://gafguild.com/index.php?threads/you-are-going-to-play-as-professions-poll.14/
 

Retro

Member
Retro has failed.

Only doing it every 100 posts, since 100ppp is the GAF Master Race. Of course, I missed post #600 too, but I got crap to do today!

There is plans for mounts in the future?

ArenaNet has said they may include mounts at some point, if mounted combat can be implemented. As a method of travel in the game as it exists now, there's no point. Waypoints are much faster without letting you race past / over content.

But couldn't this change at release? I mean maybe these dynamic events were toned down just for testing and such.

Don't listen to BattleMonkey, he's 100% wrong with that statement. The dynamic events are much more than "MMO quest chains", if only because they're open to all players and because they occur whether players are there or not. Any comment on them being uninteresting can be dismissed by the fact that no one has seen anything higher than level 30 (out of 80) and the dynamic events only get more and more complex as the game progresses. In an interview, Colin Johansen mentioned that the end game zones in Orr have no renown hearts at all; they're composed entirely of complex Dynamic Event "Webs".

Where can I buy this now to be able to be in the stress test without using a credit card? My amazon only has the normal edition without the beta access.

You can buy the game from ArenaNet using Paypal, if that helps.

Kinda not down with the xp requirement bottoming out at 30... Seems a little weird.

It just means that each level takes the same amount of time, rather than taking longer and longer as you go.

There also doesn't feel like there's anywhere to grow because the primary skills you are going to be using throughout your character's life are the same ones you got at the beginning of the game. Compared to WoW where you start with one or two abilities and eventually have over 50 abilities to chose from, GW2 seems very limited

I disagree, skill bloat has been one of the worst parts of most MMOs I've played (Hello, LOTRO). You're also overlooking the trait system, which does allow for a but of growth. But certainly nothing on the same level as getting a new skill ever two levels. Personally, I feel like that leaves more room for the player to grow in skill, rather than the character. By giving you a smaller, standardized toolset, the impetus is on the player to get better rather than just get higher stats or flashier versions of the same spells they started with.

GW2 is gonna be great but far from be complete like Wow.

I'd disagree, the level of polish we've seen so far has been exceptional. I think you're also discounting just how rough WoW was at launch. Servers were down all the time, a lot of features (Battlegrounds) weren't even in the game for years, and the endgame content left a LOT to be desired. It was far from a complete package.

GW2 doesn't have endgame design

MMOs are the only genre where people rush as quickly as they can to get to the end and then whine that they've beaten it while demanding more. People need to get out of that mentality and back to the "I am playing the game because it's fun" line of thought. The whole game is "the end game" and phrasing such as yours, implying that the game is somehow incomplete, is only spreading misinformation.

And they'll leave and we won't care cause we are having too much fun, while Arena.Net got their money already. So who cares?

The game can only get better the more people support it via the gem shop. Yeah, they'll pocket the $50 it costs to buy the game, but what about expansions or steady income? They've given interviews where they've said that the level of support the game gets is directly related to how many players stick with it.

To be honest I'm pretty sure there will be level 80 content being added on, if there isn't some already.

The beauty of downleveling is that they can add entirely new zones and dungeons at any level and max-level players will still be challenged and rewarded by it.

I honestly was completely floored by the game. I think it's one of the coolest games I've ever played. WvW by itself is good enough to be a full game IMO. But then they tack on this crazy beautiful world, these awesome quests, and a full-fledged customizable singleplayer storyline? OH AND BY THE WAY it has a full PVP segment? It's too much.

You forgot Kegbrawl. I'd pay $10 easy for a Kegbrawl game.

Mine isn't a popular opinion around here so I keep it to myself, but since you're asking for it, here's my take on this.

It sounds like Guild Wars 2 is just not for you. Luckily, there are now several dozen Diku-clones, most of them failing so quickly that they are now free to play.
 

Levito

Banned
I really, truly hope after buying so many terrible MMO's that this one hooks me the way WoW did back in the day, I am quite excited.
 
What type of reward? Like how would you compensate a lvl 80 that does a new event? He wouldn't be getting any experience so does that mean he simply gets more gold/rep?

I don't really care if they add stuff for everyone but I think that lvl 80s shuold have other ways to "progress" outside of leveling. Maybe cool looking gear or something for doing certain difficult dungeons that can be done at 80, I dunno.

That's exactly what you get. All dungeons have equipment sets (armor and weapons) with unique looks (heck, the FIRST DUNGEON has weapons that turn into ghostly weapons at night!), and unless you have gotten enough tokens while leveling to get all of them (unlikely), and have played through all four hard mode configurations (unlikelier), you'll want to revisit them. That's, indeed, without taking into account that each time you "level" past 80 you get a Skill Point, which you'll need to craft crazy Legendary weapons like the rainbow-shooting bow, the mace of liquid metal that turns you metallic, and the day and night sky sword (just the few revealed yet), AND for getting the transmutation stones to graft those looks onto the gear you like the stats best.
 

Jack_AG

Banned
I'm almost ready to buy it... but for people who've played it. Lets go negative for a second. Give me the bad / worry spots for this game. Is there anything that sticks out for you? Or is it all "OMG OMG 10/10"?

For me I would say WvW - I'm not sold on the way it works being server bound. You will have tons of people flocking to the best server even if it costs, resulting in lots of overflow for people who are on that server solely for PVE since so many will be waiting to queue for WvW. The opposite is also true - the lowest rated WvW servers just might be ghost towns.

I'm not sure if that will happen - but past MMO experiences of mine have shown players will flock to the server with the "best" guilds - often leading to over-crowded servers.

Another thing I am not quite convinced of is the fact that the "holy trinity" is gone. Simply by giving classes utility - you might be forced to pick group members based on their spec - sure they can do "damage" - but what about needing a utility heavy class?

I will have to see how hard exploration mode is with 5 glass cannons. If you tell me that's not the way it is "supposed" to be played then the system is already broken - seeing as how players can no longer play the way they want - rather - adapt their class to fit the dungeon. A glass cannon should be just as viable as a utility heavy profession.

We have not seen much of the dungeons in GW2 so I'm hoping for the best.
 
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