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Halo 5: Guardians |OT5| Is HaloGAF irrelevant now?

F

FyreWulff

Member
BizzyBum said:
Some good news on a new hiring by 343: Forger MultiLockOn to work on Halo 6 MP maps.
Click to expand...

isn't this the guy that made the completely baseless video about some conspiracy of the cartographers with loads of creepy personal attacks? Even though the CCs have literally never controlled matchmaking?

edit: LOL HE DELETED THE VIDEO


if this is real... I'm not gonna say any more on this right now.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
FyreWulff said:
isn't this the guy that made the completely baseless video about some conspiracy of the cartographers with loads of creepy personal attacks? Even though the CCs have literally never controlled matchmaking?


edit: LOL HE DELETED THE VIDEO
Click to expand...

He does have some sort of strange beef with the forge community... but he's got some strong design philosophies
 
VincentMatts

VincentMatts

Member
Juan said:
And Sprint. And ADS. And 1000 weapons filling the same role. And unbalanced PvP gameplay. And no-vehicular PvP combat.

Sorry but as much as I can agree with you on the good feeling Destiny and Halo share, I can't follow you on this.

Also, copy-pasting my last answer:



I would agree the shooting in Destiny feels as good as Halo, if not better, despite having to use ADS, which is clearly a loss since Bungie proved their FPS didn't need to rest on this mechanic, and as shooting is the base mechanic, everything feel really good within Destiny loop.

But for the rest, nah, sorry, (Bungie's) Halo is far ahead above Destiny.

Destiny AI may be one of the poorest I ever had the displeasure to encounter on a game, and I never felt challenged by my surroundings in Destiny, which makes the game pretty boring to me. Yesterday, I played Keyes on Halo CE, with a buddy, and it hits my hard that Destiny will never brings me as much fun as Halo on the long run.

Bungie clearly kept the good feeling formula they had with Halo when making Destiny, and the philosophy behind 30 seconds of fun, something missing from moderns Halo, I agree, and I also agree Prometheans are killing the vibe.
Click to expand...

I agree with you on the AI thing, the AI often just stand there and let themselves be shot, but in terms of "feel" this feels like im playing a new Halo. And no i wasnt talking about PvP, simply campaign. This to me is some sort of evolved Reach and ODST combined which is still more halo to me then what 343 had done so far with the campaigns. Just update the skins in D2 to brutes, flood and elites and i feel like im playing halo, only evolved. I think thats why im enjoying D2 a lot more than i have H4 or 5.
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
Slightly Live said:
Dude has a record of toxic community interactions. Wouldn't touch that guy.
Click to expand...

He makes good maps. Has valid commentary on design in general and eloquently supports his issues with design in recent halo games. He desperately wants to and is focused on making halo better.

An attitude can be repaired
 
C

Cranster

Banned
E92 M3 said:
Halo 5 is very barebones compared to the previous Halo games and you're describing the Destiny of yore.
Click to expand...
Halo 5 is not a barebones game in it's current form. If we were discussing how it was at launch I would agree. But presently Halo 5 is booming with content.
 
RSB

RSB

Banned
VincentMatts said:
I agree with you on the AI thing, the AI often just stand there and let themselves be shot, but in terms of "feel" this feels like im playing a new Halo. And no i wasnt talking about PvP, simply campaign. This to me is some sort of evolved Reach and ODST combined which is still more halo to me then what 343 had done so far with the campaigns. Just update the skins in D2 to brutes, flood and elites and i feel like im playing halo, only evolved. I think thats why im enjoying D2 a lot more than i have H4 or 5.
Click to expand...
Halo evolved? Yeah, Everytime I jump in a Halo game I'm always wondering "Why doesn't my aim go to shit?" Or when I'm moving and shooting at the same time, I think "Shit, this would be so much better if I was forced to slow down and ADS to be this acurate" Thank god Bungie realized how archaic that was and gave us Destiny, the true evolution of the Halo formula.
LOL

E92 M3 said:
I'd like Halo 6 to take place on an actual Halo with interesting scenery. No more industrial spaceships/planets.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I'm also tired of all the boring industrial designs, and 343 still can't make Forerunner levels look right (Saber Interactive did a much better job in Halo 2 Anniversary)

Sanghelios was good, but for the most part, 343 in nowhere near Bungie when it comes to the art/visual design.
 
VincentMatts

VincentMatts

Member
RSB said:
Halo evolved? Yeah, Everytime I jump in a Halo game I'm always wondering "Why doesn't my aim go to shit?" Or when I'm moving and shooting at the same time, I think "Shit, this would be so much better if I was forced to slow down and ADS to be this acurate" Thank god Bungie realized how archaic that was and gave us Destiny, the true evolution of the Halo formula.
LOL
Click to expand...

Laugh all you want, the populations were consistently much higher (wether it was twitch or just online users) on D1 and will be on D2. Only people laughing here are Bungie, all the way to the bank.
 
RSB

RSB

Banned
VincentMatts said:
Laugh all you want, the populations were consistently much higher (wether it was twitch or just online users) on D1 and will be on D2. Only people laughing here are Bungie, all the way to the bank.
Click to expand...
I don't know what any of that has to do with what I said, but ok. Also, I'm pretty sure Destiny would be just as popular, if not more, if the game didn't have those bullshit accuracy and movement penalties for everything.

And yes, the idea of a true ADS shooter like Destiny being an evolution of Halo is laughable.
 
FUNKNOWN iXi

FUNKNOWN iXi

Member
VincentMatts said:
Laugh all you want, the populations were consistently much higher (wether it was twitch or just online users) on D1 and will be on D2. Only people laughing here are Bungie, all the way to the bank.
Click to expand...
What does this have to do with anything that's being said? lol no one's confused here, everyone laughing at the comparison is doing so because of how fundamentally different the games are. Sure, there are some similarities between Halo and Destiny, but to say Destiny is a newer, better, more evolved version of Halo is just...... Well, I don't even know. I just can't even.
 
R

Ryouji Gunblade

Member
Because it's Metroid season, I made a Fusion-inspired map.

8ly42ul.jpg
Click to expand...
 
O

op_ivy

Fallen Xbot (cannot continue gaining levels in this class)
Pro league going again this week? This season has really sucked from a viewer perspective. No hype, frequent break. And I'm usually Mr positive
 
B

belushy

Banned
op_ivy said:
Pro league going again this week? This season has really sucked from a viewer perspective. No hype, frequent break. And I'm usually Mr positive
Click to expand...

Online Pro League is boring at this point. LAN League is how to do it, with multiple open lans sprinkled in between. (Literally just take the COD circuit and reduce the prize money)
 
O

op_ivy

Fallen Xbot (cannot continue gaining levels in this class)
belushy said:
Online Pro League is boring at this point. LAN League is how to do it, with multiple open lans sprinkled in between. (Literally just take the COD circuit and reduce the prize money)
Click to expand...

I don't mind the online format, in fact I like having weekly matches. It's just that we have had the same content and game modes for ages. And pro league is so few matches that are spread out over such a long period of time with constant breaks. This is what has killed my interest
 
T

Trup1aya

Member
Online format is cool, But it should compliment a tournament based system, rather than be the main course.

After worlds 2016, Pro League itself is the reason why HCS saw a decline in viewership and participation.
Things went from, "everyone has a chance to make it" to "let's just focus on these 8 teams for a season, and let 2 AMs get a shot at the end"

The scene instantly became less enticing for Orgs, and demoralizing for players Outside the top 8, especially those on the cusp. Also, online presentation can't hold a candle to LAN tourneys.

It's no surprise that things picked up a bit when there was more emphasis put on LANs. Shame we had to lose momentum before hand.

Hopefully after this season they go back to a LAN first structure, and just use the online league to keep the action up between LAN events.
 
Ozzy Onya A2Z

Ozzy Onya A2Z

Member
Karl2177 said:
It's kinda interesting what Destiny 2 did in regard to enemy AI count and how it rarely feels overwhelming, especially when compared to Halo 5's campaign. A lot of D2 encounters will have anywhere from 5 enemies to around 30. Even in those larger ones, it's rare to have a sense that the enemy is killing the player at an extreme rate (this seems relegated to bosses and those damn dogs). Now comparing that to Halo 5, I always get the feeling that the enemy either has souped up weapons or they're perfectly accurate. I don't feel like I'm being challenged strategically as much as I'm being trained to fight through attrition.
Click to expand...

Spot on mate. I think a lot of Halo fans have been wanting just this for as long as I can remember tackling legendary campaigns. Challenge me with tons of enemies, smart AI, encounters, environment setups etc and not just weighted enemy weapons or shields etc. The tiered aspects of enemies and their weapons/abilities is fine but the baseline is far better in D2. I feel like WZ gets close to this and we're going to see PvE with H6 too.

Good times if that happens. I much prefer PvE over PvP these days and it's far less reliant on population while increasing play times and retention rates etc. Overall having 4v4 and WZ as PvP is solid but give me 3v3/4v4 PvE content and a RAID type mode where I can get my PvE version of BTB thanks. It would serve Halo very well and I feel like WZ and WZ FF have authoritatively shown the developers are going down this roadmap as well as players and parties responding to it.

It reminds of this post very much
 
N

NippleViking

Banned
Ozzy Onya A2Z said:
Spot on mate. I think a lot of Halo fans have been wanting just this for as long as I can remember tackling legendary campaigns. Challenge me with tons of enemies, smart AI, encounters, environment setups etc and not just weighted enemy weapons or shields etc. The tiered aspects of enemies and their weapons/abilities is fine but the baseline is far better in D2. I feel like WZ gets close to this and we're going to see PvE with H6 too.

Good times if that happens. I much prefer PvE over PvP these days and it's far less reliant on population while increasing play times and retention rates etc. Overall having 4v4 and WZ as PvP is solid but give me 3v3/4v4 PvE content and a RAID type mode where I can get my PvE version of BTB thanks. It would serve Halo very well and I feel like WZ and WZ FF have authoritatively shown the developers are going down this roadmap as well as players and parties responding to it.

It reminds of this post very much
Click to expand...

Revamp PVE and encounter-design, and add tools to Forge AI, Raids, and Firefight scenarios. Done (Though in reality I'm sure this is hard af).
 
D

daedalius

Member
Ozzy Onya A2Z said:
Spot on mate. I think a lot of Halo fans have been wanting just this for as long as I can remember tackling legendary campaigns. Challenge me with tons of enemies, smart AI, encounters, environment setups etc and not just weighted enemy weapons or shields etc. The tiered aspects of enemies and their weapons/abilities is fine but the baseline is far better in D2. I feel like WZ gets close to this and we're going to see PvE with H6 too.

Good times if that happens. I much prefer PvE over PvP these days and it's far less reliant on population while increasing play times and retention rates etc. Overall having 4v4 and WZ as PvP is solid but give me 3v3/4v4 PvE content and a RAID type mode where I can get my PvE version of BTB thanks. It would serve Halo very well and I feel like WZ and WZ FF have authoritatively shown the developers are going down this roadmap as well as players and parties responding to it.

It reminds of this post very much
Click to expand...

We even already had Spartan Ops, I'd love something like that but more difficult and built for 3 or 4 players. You could even setup a loadout with your cards in H5 before the mission started.

A Halo raid? man, that'd be something else.
 
B

blue_phazon

Member
What if 343 goes really nuts with forge for the next game? I was thinking about how they could take it to the next level and it's so obvious: AI scripting.

Imagine if forgers could make PVE maps/levels! I guess Doom 2016 did this first, but it could be huge with Halo.

You would see original fanmade Halo missions, or remakes of classic missions. It would be like having endless PVE content
 
B

ButteryPie

Member
Halo 5's forge tool is insanely powerful without a doubt, but the barrier to entry was subsequently raised.

I would greatly appreciate two control modes in Halo 6; One akin to Reach, and one that's an expanded Halo 5 system. I love forging, but Halo 5's forge proved more frustrating than fun, despite the vast number of quality of life improvements.
 
Ozzy Onya A2Z

Ozzy Onya A2Z

Member
If they bring Forge that far I'd prefer the Win10 freebie version to have a balls out developer styled and polished Forge tool. Way faster and more flexible to develop with a mouse and keyboard or script etc.
 
M

m23

Member
I'm sorry but the AI in destiny 2 is absolutely terrible compared to Halo. When most of the ai walk in a straight long towards you and the stronger enemies teleport literally every couple of seconds, there is a problem.

Very few of the AI actually evade or flank in any way. The only interesting enemies to fight have been the Cabal.

It's so damn annoying to have some of these guys just start vanishing into thin air multiple times after each shot. It's like the Promethean nights x100 when it comes to teleporting.

The campaign in Destiny 2 definitely has Halo feels, but I don't think it comes close to any of the Halo games when you compare them. Way too much of the story is you running through empty spaces (for some reason you can't get a sparrow until much later) and it's just way too easy.

Destiny 2 is a big improvement to Destiny 1 though.
 
G

Gnome Scat

Member
blue_phazon said:
What if 343 goes really nuts with forge for the next game? I was thinking about how they could take it to the next level and it's so obvious: AI scripting.

Imagine if forgers could make PVE maps/levels! I guess Doom 2016 did this first, but it could be huge with Halo.

You would see original fanmade Halo missions, or remakes of classic missions. It would be like having endless PVE content
Click to expand...
Would also be great if they brought back Firefight alongside it.
 
F

Fata1moose

Banned
Samurai G0SU said:
betcha halo 6 campaign will be like halo 4.
Click to expand...

Bad again? That's a shame.

blue_phazon said:
What if 343 goes really nuts with forge for the next game? I was thinking about how they could take it to the next level and it's so obvious: AI scripting.

Imagine if forgers could make PVE maps/levels! I guess Doom 2016 did this first, but it could be huge with Halo.

You would see original fanmade Halo missions, or remakes of classic missions. It would be like having endless PVE content
Click to expand...

It's going to be on PC, they should give us proper developer tools so people can make proper maps. Forge can still be there as a secondary tool for map editing.
 
M

Madness

Member
What indications have any of you received in 5+ years of 343 shipped games that anything is balls to the wall at launch. All we've gotten is barebones releases, delays with the patented Soon™, broken games, missing features, etc.

Why would Halo 6 be any different? Yeah they have Xbox One X power, but they also still need to code the game to have it run on Xbox One OG and S.
 
E

E92 M3

Member
Madness said:
What indications have any of you received in 5+ years of 343 shipped games that anything is balls to the wall at launch. All we've gotten is barebones releases, delays with the patented Soon™, broken games, missing features, etc.

Why would Halo 6 be any different? Yeah they have Xbox One X power, but they also still need to code the game to have it run on Xbox One OG and S.
Click to expand...

That's true, they can only ride the Halo goodwill for so long.
 
F

Fata1moose

Banned
Madness said:
What indications have any of you received in 5+ years of 343 shipped games that anything is balls to the wall at launch. All we've gotten is barebones releases, delays with the patented Soon™, broken games, missing features, etc.

Why would Halo 6 be any different? Yeah they have Xbox One X power, but they also still need to code the game to have it run on Xbox One OG and S.
Click to expand...

They also have actual power with the PC. The XOX processor is still garbage.

I mostly agree, I could see them learning their lesson and having the full package upon release. Whether or not it's a Halo game that appeals to people is another question.
 
VincentMatts

VincentMatts

Member
Madness said:
What indications have any of you received in 5+ years of 343 shipped games that anything is balls to the wall at launch. All we've gotten is barebones releases, delays with the patented Soon™, broken games, missing features, etc.

Why would Halo 6 be any different? Yeah they have Xbox One X power, but they also still need to code the game to have it run on Xbox One OG and S.
Click to expand...

Hopefully, theyve learned from their mistakes one would hope. Maybe also, dont remake the same mistakes Bungie did? A lot of it comes down to common sense and how important the legacy of the franchise is to them. But according to MCC and 4 and 5, not very so far.

MS need to take a page out of the Coalition. They hired a guy who was on Gears at Epic to run Gears4. Thats What halo needs, more people who used to be on Halo to make the key decisions about the game. Im sure the people at 343 are very talented but the fact that the people making the key decisions about halo werent around at Bungie when halo was at its peak isnt helping halo now.
 
K

Karl2177

Member
Madness said:
What indications have any of you received in 5+ years of 343 shipped games that anything is balls to the wall at launch. All we've gotten is barebones releases, delays with the patented Soon™, broken games, missing features, etc.

Why would Halo 6 be any different? Yeah they have Xbox One X power, but they also still need to code the game to have it run on Xbox One OG and S.
Click to expand...
Why would Halo 6 be any different? In comparison to Halo 4, they don't have the disadvantage of being a new studio and hiring almost all of their staff during development. In comparison to Halo 5, they don't have the disadvantage of retooling the engine to work on a new hardware architecture. Fingers crossed, but hopefully they're sticking to what works and exploring new ideas in ways that don't impact the main experience. Stuff should be established from previous iterations; Forge shouldn't need a complete overhaul, custom browser should have a good codebase, etc. I can see research being invested into making asynchronous AI better and tool development that allows game modes to be iterated faster (similar to the megalo system of old).

But then again Frank could be blowing the company's money on licensing for Cortana styled meundies.
 
S

SCHUEY F1

Unconfirmed Member
op_ivy said:
I don't mind the online format, in fact I like having weekly matches. It's just that we have had the same content and game modes for ages. And pro league is so few matches that are spread out over such a long period of time with constant breaks. This is what has killed my interest
Click to expand...

Yeah I like the weekly matches as well. Wish there was more matches and new content.

The Splyce LG strongholds game was awesome last night.
 
S

Samurai G0SU

Member
Fata1moose said:
Bad again? That's a shame.
Click to expand...


remembering some quotes they made about what they 'learned' when making halo 5, it seems they will focus more on the Chief and most likely to resolve the Cortana rampant issue. I also imagine they introduce a GREATER threat, but nothing is better than a greater threat right? lol ...

So basing on their history, halo 4 story telling was better than 5 and they will go that route. I almost said halo 3 but they dont have that talent there.

I want to also bet that at the ending of 6 will have hints of the FLOOD coming back with the gravemind. lol ALL OUT WAR YALLLLLLLLLLLL
 
F

Fata1moose

Banned
I don't think they'll do the flood in mainline, seems like that's a Halo Wars 2 beat. I kind of expect the precursors at the end of Halo 6. I didn't like Halo 4 or 5's story at all, but I'm more concerned with the game design, I want it to feel more like CE and 3. The levels they should be trying emulate? Silent Cartographer, Assault on the Control Room, Two Betrayals, The Maw, The Ark, The Covenant and Halo. They have not captured the feeling of those levels with 4 and 5. There needs to be better vehicular sections, 3 way fights, large sandboxes, etc. There needs to be an emphasis on run and gun gameplay that Halo 4 and 5 didn't have, one of the problems there was ammo scarcity and the Promethean's lethality/resistances. The story just needs to be enjoyable and competant, simple is fine it can be complicated too as long as it's good.
 
O

op_ivy

Fallen Xbot (cannot continue gaining levels in this class)
Madness said:
What indications have any of you received in 5+ years of 343 shipped games that anything is balls to the wall at launch. All we've gotten is barebones releases, delays with the patented Soon™, broken games, missing features, etc.

Why would Halo 6 be any different? Yeah they have Xbox One X power, but they also still need to code the game to have it run on Xbox One OG and S.
Click to expand...

Potentially extending development by a year?

Not wasting resources on early e3 demos?

Learning from already shipping 2 mainline halo titles?

Just general optimism.
 
S

Samurai G0SU

Member
Fata1moose said:
I don't think they'll do the flood in mainline, seems like that's a Halo Wars 2 beat. I kind of expect the precursors at the end of Halo 6. I didn't like Halo 4 or 5's story at all, but I'm more concerned with the game design, I want it to feel more like CE and 3. The levels they should be trying emulate? Silent Cartographer, Assault on the Control Room, Two Betrayals, The Maw, The Ark, The Covenant and Halo. They have not captured the feeling of those levels with 4 and 5. There needs to be better vehicular sections, 3 way fights, large sandboxes, etc. There needs to be an emphasis on run and gun gameplay that Halo 4 and 5 didn't have, one of the problems there was ammo scarcity and the Promethean's lethality/resistances. The story just needs to be enjoyable and competant, simple is fine it can be complicated too as long as it's good.
Click to expand...

My expectations have lowered a bit unfortunately. bringing back the flood seems like something they will do, since they brought back cortana. all i know is the story told via mainline so if they bring back the didact somehow then i wouldn't be surprised.

good news that i remember is that split screen is back lol
 
M

Mau5

Member
Maybe it's just me but I'm getting awful FPS. Tried clearing the local Xbox 360 storage and it still feels pretty bad. Atleast in MCC I got 60FPS. Only tried H3 so far.
 
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