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[FUNKNOWN iXi]

But lets go back to previous Halos with placed weapons. Is the skill it takes to know locations of power weapons, and the intent to rush toward them as the number one objective in slayer, proportional to the advantage the power weapons give you? I'd say not at all. There is much more innate skill/talent associated with direct gunplay, and therefore the reward should be from that skilled gunplay itself.

You may respond that actually strategically dominating the power weapon zone does take skill, not just the knowledge of placement. That strategy is tied to direct gunplay, so you're right there. However, that actually gives players with high gunplay associated skill exponentiated advantage, because power weapons take no skill to use but take a bunch of skill to get.

Therefore a player that is highly skilled in gunplay is much more able to obtain weapons that are much easier to kill opponents with, making it very akin to a killstreak in call of duty. However, because an aspect of an ordnance drop is random, it takes away some of that power from a skilled player, as I believe it should. A skilled player will still get more drops, however they don't know exactly what they will get and they don't know necessarily where it will drop (global ordnance). To me, that is equal to having your gunplay skill in tact, but not having knowledge and skill to exponentiate (made up word?) your advantage in obtaining a weapon that takes no or less skill to use.

Not to sound like a jerk but you just summed up the very problem Halo 3 had with the BR spread and Halo Reach had with the bloom:

Trying to balance the game by adding luck/random/chance/etc. so the good players don't dominate and the lesser-skilled players have a chance.

-EDIT-
Halo 3 Example: BR spread -> A good player might get unlucky and have a bullet miss due to spread where the possibly lesser-skilled opponent gets lucky and has more of his shots stay consistent with their aiming.
Reach Example: DMR bloom -> Pace your shots perfectly for a 5sk. A lesser-skilled player can spam 5 shots and get a lucky kill even quicker. It's the same thing, you're giving a chance to the player who isn't as skilled, or the player who didn't shoot first.. etc



So if you're going to defend it, you probably shouldn't use that as a reason ;\ - That being said, I see both sides to how Personal Ordnance and Global Ordnance may or may not be good for competitive play, but the only way we'll know for sure is if we give them a chance. Halo 1 and Halo 2 had lots of asymmetric gameplay/maps, and it worked because of the core gameplay fundamentals.

 

[Louis Wu]

Hold on, I'm confused, there's a type of ordnance (global?) that DOESN'T appear directly in front of you when you call it in?

I'm pretty sure Global Ordnance drops only at the beginning of matches. (And in fixed locations.) I could be wrong.

 

[Shake Appeal]

People seriously complaining about the BR being a 4sk, as if that is an absolute measure that can be easily compared across games and contexts, need to have their posting rights restricted. At least for a while. Like until after launch.

 

[AllIsOneIsNone]

Not to sound like a jerk but you just summed up the very problem Halo 3 had with the BR spread and Halo Reach had with the bloom:

Trying to balance the game by adding luck/random/chance/etc. so the good players don't dominate and the lesser-skilled players have a chance.

So if you're going to defend it, you probably shouldn't use that as a reason ;\ - That being said, I see both sides to how Personal Ordnance and Global Ordnance may or may not be good for competitive play, but the only way we'll know for sure is if we give them a chance. Halo 1 and Halo 2 had lots of asymmetric gameplay/maps, and it worked because of the core gameplay fundamentals.

Did you mean to quote my post? I don't see how you would gather that information from what I wrote. I'm saying most definitely give ordnance a chance, and saying that previous halos with placed power weapons only have the illusion of taking more skill.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

I'm pretty sure Global Ordnance drops only at the beginning of matches. (And in fixed locations.) I could be wrong.

In the weekly update a short while ago they teased the Mantis and said that the player playing won because that Binary Rifle dropped near him just near the end of a match. That sounds more akin to the global ordnance than a personal ordnance that he just got his hands on?

That said nothing we have seen so far has shown global ordnance working in that way right?

 

[Domino Theory]

So can we redeem the Dew XP stuff now? Alison gave a bunch of us free Doritos and Mountain Dew so I want to get a jump on it.

 

[Portugeezer]

Do UK people get double XP or we are not fat hungry enough?

 

[Genesis Knight]

I'm pretty sure Global Ordnance drops only at the beginning of matches. (And in fixed locations.) I could be wrong.

See, this is what I thought. Although it also comes back throughout the match, similar to respawning weapon pickups in other Halo games?

 

[Overdoziz]

I'm pretty sure Global Ordnance drops only at the beginning of matches. (And in fixed locations.) I could be wrong.

Global Ordnance drops during matches too. They drop random weapons at preset times randomly at one of a bunch of predetermined locations. And there's as far as I know no warning before a weapon is dropped without that perk.

:/

 

[YourExWife]

On another note, anything good for around 800msp? I'm looking for an Arcade game, or something on demand if they are cheap enough.

As any arcade afficionados probably know, I'm crazy biased, but if you don't have either, get the Geometry Wars games.

I can't access Vudu, does anyone want these codes?

I'm at work and would like codes for later (in case sold out by when I get home). Gracias

I didn't see a lot of Binary Rifles dropping - for ANYONE. I saw stuff like Scattershot, Needler, etc commonly, Rockets or Incineration Cannon much less commonly. I saw a variety of powerups (which I took often) - you know exactly who's using what when these are involved, they're colored. And I saw grenades. ::shrug:: As Tashi said, players of roughly equal skill will get roughly the same number of drops - and what's available to them might not be PRECISELY equivalent, but it was usually pretty close.

This is what people have an issue with. If there is a chance (even a small one) that some better weapon is going to drop for someone for equal effort, that's not balance. This is the same reason people had a massive problem with vanilla-Reach bloom. Yeah, if we both fire the same rate (say spamming as fast as possible or even decent pacing), the location of our shot has an equal chance to go anywhere within the bloom circle. But that chance that exists where my reticule and my opponents are lined up the same, but his results in a kill and mine misses, is a problem. Hopefully I explained that right.

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

Did you mean to quote my post? I don't see how you would gather that information from what I wrote. I'm saying most definitely give ordnance a chance, and saying that previous halos with placed power weapons only have the illusion of taking more skill.

Read the edit. Just saying the reason you gave has the same intentions behind it as bloom and the H3 BR spread. Other than that, I agree to let the Drops have their moment in the spotlight.

 

[Shadders]

Yes! (What codes?)

Check yer PMs.

I bought two of the Walmart Avatar codes and they each came with $5 in Vudu credit that I can't make use of.

 

[L1NETT]

Do UK people get double XP or we are not fat hungry enough?

Oh good question. Hope so, I do love me some Doritos.

 

[scar tissue]

Guys, what's the verdict on the Halo 3 cat helmet - any of you keep it on display?

After keeping mine confined to the cellar for 5 years like some kind of ugly stepchild, I've been thinking of putting it on display beside the TV.

Yeah, it's nerdy as hell and won't get me any points with the ladies, but a) I'm not getting laid anyway and b) I don't have any other nerdy stuff on display so I guess I could get away with it?

What say you, GAF?

 

[TheOddOne]

Global Ordnance drops during matches too. They drop random weapons at preset times randomly at one of a bunch of predetermined locations. And there's as far as I know no warning before a weapon is dropped without that perk.

:/

Huh? I thought you always get a marker when new stuff is dropped. The perk only lets you see it earlier, I think.

 

[YourExWife]

Huh? I thought you always get a marker when new stuff is dropped. The perk only lets you see it earlier, I think.

Umm...that's like exactly what he said.

 

[bobs...onGaf]

Do UK people get double XP or we are not fat hungry enough?

No people in the UK dont get double exp - or access to the specializations. People in the UK are getting pretty shafted. Its not like they will notice, but the casual fans who just pick up with standard edition with no real background knowledge are going to get blasted away by people in the short term who use double exp to get Armour Abilities and so on before them. Then 30-90 days later they will have less perks than those people.

 

[TheOddOne]

Umm...that's like exactly what he said.

But you instantly know that it has been dropped right? With all the indicators? Perk to see it earlier seems useless then.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

But you instantly know that it has been dropped right? With all the indicators? Perk to see it earlier seems useless then.

Right, but you'll BEFORE it's been dropped, so you can run over there and get in position to grab it before anyone else.

 

[Genesis Knight]

But you instantly know that it has been dropped right? With all the indicators? Perk to see it earlier seems useless then.

Really? You see it's coming in maybe 30 seconds before it does, you get over there, and boom you have the Binary Rifle before anyone else even knows it's on the map.

 

[TheOddOne]

Right, but you'll BEFORE it's been dropped, so you can run over there and get in position to grab it before anyone else.

Oh, ok.

Do we know the timers on how early you see it? Can't be too long.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

Umm...that's like exactly what he said.

Nah, he said "there's as far as I know no warning before a weapon is dropped without that perk."

There is a warning without the perk for all players. Those with the perk just get that earlier.

EDIT: Hmm, I was under the impression that a HUD indicator comes up a few seconds before a drop for everyone, and those with perks see it a few seconds earlier than that.

 

[YourExWife]

But you instantly know that it has been dropped right? With all the indicators? Perk to see it earlier seems useless then.

When it drops, everyone knows. People with the stupid perk know before hand and can set up and be in waiting, camping, whatever, etc., hurr durr.



EDIT: Beaten cuz work internet yet again. Also, Deadly Cyclone, the point you're arguing changes the outcome in exactly zero ways.

 

[squidhands]

But you instantly know that it has been dropped right? With all the indicators? Perk to see it earlier seems useless then.

Infinity Ordnance - During each Infinity Slayer experience, the UNSC Infinity drops ordnance at the start of the match. So, what used to be a shotgun leaning against the wall in previous Halos is now dropped from Infinity. At carefully-tuned intervals, Infinity resupplies the map with power weapons.

The distance at which you can see these weapons is tuned by map. The more lethal weapons (Rocket Launcher, Scattershot, and Sniper Rifle, for instance) are always on your screen. Mid-tier weapons and grenades are not.

After initial ordnance, the Infinity drops semi-randomized weapons within very specialized constraints, set up specifically by playlist and map settings. These drops occur every few minutes. When Infinity is ready to drop a weapon, it looks at all pre-determined, designer-scripted locations, and then selects one.

You will be able to customize Infinity ordnance in Forge.

Personal Ordnance - As you earn medals, you fill up your ordnance meter. When that meter is full, you earn a reward drop for yourself from the Infinity. The reward comes in the form of three randomized power weapons, grenades, or powerups (two of the former, one of the latter). You can then choose which one you want, and the Infinity will drop the ordnance (if you're inside, it will teleport in). You won't get the highest tier power weapons (e.g., rockets) in personal ordnance, but everything you do get is powerfully awesome. And awesomely powerful. And everything in between.

We are still fine-tuning the system but in its current iteration, each successive ordnance takes 30% more to get. On average, each player gets 1-2 ordnance per game. Solid playing may net you three; however, I've been unable to confirm. For obvious reasons.

This was from the July Bulletin (superior Wudition)

 

[Portugeezer]

No people in the UK dont get double exp - or access to the specializations. People in the UK are getting pretty shafted. Its not like they will notice, but the casual fans who just pick up with standard edition with no real background knowledge are going to get blasted away by people in the short term who use double exp to get Armour Abilities and so on before them. Then 30-90 days later they will have less perks than those people.

People in UK will most likely get matched up with other European players so that shouldn't be a huge problem, but it's annoying nonetheless.

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

Really? You see it's coming in maybe 30 seconds before it does, you get over there, and boom you have the Binary Rifle before anyone else even knows it's on the map.

Proof? I remember reading that it was going to be only a few secs before it drops, something like 3-5 or so.

Why do you need a notification a weapon is coming on the map?

We dont have them know, we all just know the time for every weapon

Heat of battle, reminder, people who don't know, etc etc

 

[broony]

No people in the UK dont get double exp - or access to the specializations. People in the UK are getting pretty shafted. Its not like they will notice, but the casual fans who just pick up with standard edition with no real background knowledge are going to get blasted away by people in the short term who use double exp to get Armour Abilities and so on before them. Then 30-90 days later they will have less perks than those people.

I thought we still got access to the specialisations through the LE in the uk. Is that not right?

I hadn't really though about the double XP though. It seems strange that after they have basically made the game more accessible in general, that they make it feel harder for anyone outside of the US.

 

[nillapuddin]

Global Ordnance drops during matches too. They drop random weapons at preset times randomly at one of a bunch of predetermined locations. And there's as far as I know no warning before a weapon is dropped without that perk.

Why do you need a notification a weapon is coming on the map?

We dont have them know, we all just know the time for every weapon

edit:
didnt kevin franklin say in that video all infinity ordnance is on 2 minute timers?
youll just keep track of the 2 minutes it takes for new weapons, no different than halo ever

 

[Overdoziz]

Nah, he said "there's as far as I know no warning before a weapon is dropped without that perk."

There is a warning without the perk for all players. Those with the perk just get that earlier.

EDIT: Hmm, I was under the impression that a HUD indicator comes up a few seconds before a drop for everyone, and those with perks see it a few seconds earlier than that.

When I played it it looked like the waypoint only appeared above the weapon drop after it was on the ground. I didn't pay too much attention, though.

 

[YourExWife]

Proof? I remember reading that it was going to be only a few secs before it drops, something like 3-5 or so.

When you have to coordinate which side of the map to go to, that's more than enough.

 

[dmg04]

Why do you need a notification a weapon is coming on the map?

We dont have them know, we all just know the time for every weapon

edit:
didnt kevin franklin say in that video all infinity ordnance is on 2 minute timers?

Seriously, It was always cool picking up rockets and letting the team know 'Respawn in 3 minutes at 8:53'. Now everyone will just know without any effort!

 

[ViewtifulJC]

Why do you need a notification a weapon is coming on the map?

We dont have them know, we all just know the time for every weapon

edit:
didnt kevin franklin say in that video all infinity ordnance is on 2 minute timers?

You might know the time, but remember the weapon drops are randomly across the map. I assume the specialization would tell you the exact place and time of a drop.

 

[MaximumFlipFlop]

Warning: if anyone sees pictures of Halo 4 that look similar in quality to that of the Spartan Ops CGI, or even better, they might contain huge spoilers.
Kinda spoiler regarding where the CGI is in game and why it is important that you don't see it.

Spoiler

The games prologue and epilogue are both done with CGI that looks close to live action, these are indeed huge parts of the game and should not be mistaken for marketing material or promotions, commercials etc. I got spoiled by thinking these just marketing.

Just looking out for GAF

 

[Genesis Knight]

Proof? I remember reading that it was going to be only a few secs before it drops, something like 3-5 or so.

Heat of battle, reminder, people who don't know, etc etc

I said 'maybe', just used 30 for illustration.

 

[TheOddOne]

This was from the July Bulletin (superior Wudition)

Thanks squid, glad to hear it will be tuned on map basis.

 

[Slightly Live]

Myself and the rest of the staff at ForwardUntoDawn.com are pleased to announce Community Evolved, a project we've been working on diligently for many months now! It is with great pleasure that we reveal this to you, the Halo community. This does, after all, belong more to you than to the three of us.

And thank you, HaloGAF.

 

[Reagan's BR]

Myself and the rest of the staff at ForwardUntoDawn.com are pleased to announce Community Evolved, a project we've been working on diligently for many months now! It is with great pleasure that we reveal this to you, the Halo community. This does, after all, belong more to you than to the three of us.

And thank you, HaloGAF.

VERY cool. Going to have to scrape together $75!

 

[TheOddOne]

Really awesome project Dani.

 

[Overdoziz]

Why do you need a notification a weapon is coming on the map?

We dont have them know, we all just know the time for every weapon

edit:
didnt kevin franklin say in that video all infinity ordnance is on 2 minute timers?
youll just keep track of the 2 minutes it takes for new weapons, no different than halo ever

Seriously, It was always cool picking up rockets and letting the team know 'Respawn in 3 minutes at 8:53'. Now everyone will just know without any effort!

Why do there need to be notifications? Well, that's because the weapon drops are in random locations. That's unfair but teams can at least prepare better if they know where a weapon will spawn which will make it a bit less unfair. Without a notification a weapon will just drop right in front of some unknowing player and he is rewarded for being in the right place at the right time. Honestly, even with a warning it's still unfair because one of the teams will be in a better position to set up for the spawn. The old system is so much better. They could've added waypoints above weapons with the old system and it would've been enough.

 

[FUNKNOWN iXi]

When you have to coordinate which side of the map to go to, that's more than enough.

Uhh, agree? lol but yeah Genesis, I don't think it would be 30 secs, that's just too much time to not only know where it spawns, but allows for mind games and set ups. The advantage would be something smaller like only allowing enough time to just see where it is and immediately have to travel there to make use of that advantage.

Why do there need to be notifications? Well, that's because the weapon drops are in random locations. That's unfair but teams can at least prepare better if they know where a weapon will spawn which will make it a bit less unfair. Without a notification a weapon will just drop right in front of some unknowing player and he is rewarded for being in the right place at the right time. Honestly, even with a warning it's still unfair because one of the teams will be in a better position to set up for the spawn. The old system is so much better. They could've added waypoints above weapons with the old system and it would've been enough.

This.

 

[ElzarTheBam]

Myself and the rest of the staff at ForwardUntoDawn.com are pleased to announce Community Evolved, a project we've been working on diligently for many months now! It is with great pleasure that we reveal this to you, the Halo community. This does, after all, belong more to you than to the three of us.

And thank you, HaloGAF.

http://communityevolved.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/banner.jpg[IMG][/URL][/QUOTE]

A great venture!

 

[Shake Appeal]

$1,210 pledged of $1,100 goal.

Well that didn't take long!

 

[Reagan's BR]

A great venture!

Premium quality.

 

[nillapuddin]

Why do there need to be notifications? Well, that's because the weapon drops are in random locations.

This is what I dont understand, looking at the Ragnarok gameplay, it seems pretty specific where the weapons will spawn, pelican, top mid, wall, and on each base's flank.

That's unfair but teams can at least prepare better if they know where a weapon will spawn which will make it a bit less unfair. Without a notification a weapon will just drop right in front of some unknowing player and he is rewarded for being in the right place at the right time.

This can happen in Halo now?

Honestly, even with a warning it's still unfair because one of the teams will be in a better position to set up for the spawn. The old system is so much better. They could've added waypoints above weapons with the old system and it would've been enough.

They pretty much did?

I dont see how its that different, unless there is a serious misunderstanding with my first counter-point, the system is basically the same thing except for shuffled weapons.


just fyi, Im not like arguing at you, I think one of us is misunderstanding how it works

Spoiler

it might be me

edit:
Im going to relisten to kevin franklin vs bravo, ill try and figure out exactly whats going on to the best of my ability

 

[Slightly Live]

$1,210 pledged of $1,100 goal.

Well that didn't take long!

Yeah, kinda insane. Before I even posted here or on the FUD main site, Twitter or anything.

Thankfully we've designed the Kickstarter campaign to scale upwards in case this happened. The support has floored us - and we've literally just shown it off for the first hour.

 

[Hydranockz]

Myself and the rest of the staff at ForwardUntoDawn.com are pleased to announce Community Evolved, a project we've been working on diligently for many months now! It is with great pleasure that we reveal this to you, the Halo community. This does, after all, belong more to you than to the three of us.

And thank you, HaloGAF.

So that Wu avatar with the blue border has been a teaser all along? I saw it on the one of yourself too, ya sneaky bastard

I'll see what I can drum up. Would love to get in on this.

 

[MaximumFlipFlop]

Myself and the rest of the staff at ForwardUntoDawn.com are pleased to announce Community Evolved, a project we've been working on diligently for many months now! It is with great pleasure that we reveal this to you, the Halo community. This does, after all, belong more to you than to the three of us.

And thank you, HaloGAF.

Oh this is really incredible. Great idea and can't wait to see the finished product. <3 Halo Community

 

[Tawpgun]

Well tell me about the Infinity Slayer games you played and what made them unbalanced and comparable to Fiesta.

I totally get where your coming from with Infinity Slayer being more fun, especially for the spectator.

But its just not competitively viable. Now, if there was some way to make the personal ordnance static, that would be PERFECT. But right now its not really fair if one player gets a sniper and the other gets a SAW or something. If they could do something like,

FIRST ORDNANCE: Rockets, nades, OS.
SECOND ORDNANCE: Sniper, nades, Speed.
THIRD ORDNANCE: Blain Beam, nades, Damage boost.

I would LOVE that.

If that's not possible, just do static, predictable weapon spawns.

 

[kittens]

Looks awesome, Dani. I'll definitely chip in a few bucks.

 

[Ramirez]

Myself and the rest of the staff at ForwardUntoDawn.com are pleased to announce Community Evolved, a project we've been working on diligently for many months now! It is with great pleasure that we reveal this to you, the Halo community. This does, after all, belong more to you than to the three of us.

And thank you, HaloGAF.

Hey, I just got my student loan left overs, think I'll drop 75 on this.