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Halo |OT18| We're Back Baby!

Trasher

Member
This is on the front page of reddit.

http://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/1o51bl/guy_on_rhalo_asks_what_halo_multiplayer_was_like/

Gameplay mechanics aside, Halo 2 was in a different era of the internet. You are probably excited to be playing online and learning lots of things about the game that you'd never thought of from other players. When Halo 2 was new this is how everyone felt. Everyone was introducing new friends to each other constantly, we all wore mics all the time, had hours and hours of custom game lobbies where we'd just sit and talk, show each other jumps we'd found, do the same superbounce (glitch that made you jump very, very high) for a whole evening straight, stupid customs like first to 250 plasma pistol punchout on Ascension/Lockout. There were also a lot more custom games going on - if you had a full friends list or a clan you pretty much had access to a lockout or midship FFA game 24/7. You'd join games that had been going for hours where the top 10 players all had hundreds of kills and you could never hope to catch up, but it was just fun to play.

We played custom games where the rules were fully imposed by the community, and it was up to us to gang up on players who broke them (e.g. Cat and Mouse where 2 players would get in Wraiths and the rest would try to run away in Warthogs, no shooting of the Wraith and no getting out of the Warthog, Zombies where you had to switch teams when you died and had to not use the human weapons as a zombie and not use the sword as a human). Halo 2 had a clan system built in, complete with clan matchmaking games. I used to try out for clans in 1v1s against a player who was in it to prove my worth, and I can still remember winning some that at the time I thought I had no hope of doing so.

A lot of what was so magic about it was that the internet was a different place back then. I remember playing about 5 games of matchmaking with a guy, then we went into a custom lobby on Coagulation (Blood Gulch re-make) and literally just shared our whole life stories with each other over the course of a whole afternoon, and at the time this is just the sort of thing you'd happily do on the internet. We ended up playing together almost daily for 3 years. The attitude in matchmaking was different too, the social lobbies were really social, people weren't worried about KD like they are now, they'd shout more (excitedly) and get angry less. Ranked was super serious, though.

Halo 3 was pretty fun too, the forge and deeper customisation options led to some really amazing gametypes being made that you would just never be able to conceive of yourself. Doing the puzzle maps with friends, the zombie variants, playing matchmaking on custom maps etc was all completely new to me at the time. The Xbox userbase at the time hadn't gone off using mics yet, in the ranked playlists you would still expect all 8 players to be using mics the vast majority of the time.

I guess if you didn't play Halo 2 or 3 online then the idea of the ranking system is pretty new to you, but that was one of the greatest things Halo had to offer, and frankly the game is nowhere near what it was without it. The intensity of the games used to be crazy. If a game was 49-49 then the next point would secure the win and the winning team's ranks would go up while the losing team's would go down. The tension at that point was really massive, and I haven't really felt it since. You really would feel your heart sink when someone died on your team, or guilty if you was you, and inversely such intense joy when your team won and pride when it was your kill. People devised names for every location on the maps and would constantly update you as to the enemy team's location and status in order to give you even the slightest advantage. It's strange to think now because it hasn't happened in so long, but we would be endlessly saying things like "Papa John is one-shot on training with rockets", "They have a guy in shotgun with sniper watching long hall, rockets up in 20 seconds" etc. It was a whole different experience to the social gaming you experience now.
 
I know a few of you here have a 3DS, anyone getting X or Y tomorrow? Need friend codes for trading!

X and Y come out tomorrow?

Damn I don't have any money. :( I'll find a way to purchase it anyways... As soon as I find my 3DS and 3DS charger, I'll post my friend code. :) I pre-ordered X for the record. I'm totally down trading starters eggs. I'm getting Fennikin and Bulbasaur. Would love to get a Charmander and Squirtle egg from any GAFfers.
 

wwm0nkey

Member
X and Y come out tomorrow?

Damn I don't have any money. :( I'll find a way to purchase it anyways... As soon as I find my 3DS and 3DS charger, I'll post my friend code. :) I pre-ordered X for the record. I'm totally down trading starters eggs. I'm getting Fennikin and Bulbasaur. Would love to get a Charmander and Squirtle egg from any GAFfers.

Im doing a Froakie and Charmander starter combo. Also love how you can EV train your pokemon from the get go, might make the game easier but will make online MUCHHHHHH better.
 

FyreWulff

Member
What kind of loser would show up to a meeting with a Halo shirt on *deadpan*

Anyone need Gold for Halo 3? First 5 quotes get a month of gold

edit: i'll send them out in a bit, not immediately
 

Omni

Member
Surprisingly enough, I'm completely burnt out on GTAV. Jumping on teh Halo 3 bandwagon a week early, it seems.

did not miss the matchmaking lag. Might just stick to campaign :lol
 

TheOddOne

Member
GTA 5 characters move like they are in mud constantly.

Who designed these flight controls. Why the hell did they go all realistic with that.

Trevor is a dick and Franklin is just outright dumb. Michael is the only interesting bro.
 

Madness

Member
What kind of loser would show up to a meeting with a Halo shirt on *deadpan*

Anyone need Gold for Halo 3? First 5 quotes get a month of gold

edit: i'll send them out in a bit, not immediately

Wouldn't mind extending it another month, would give me enough time to last until December so I can see which new console to get.
 

Omni

Member
And I make 5. Gonna need some Gold for the Destiny beta.

in 2014?
Yeah? It's going to be a while before I pick up one of the next gen consoles, and I'm certainly not spending $400+ to play a beta.

hah, okay. Just seemed odd to see someone grab free Live in preparation for a beta months away - as if 10 dollars or whatever was too much to put aside in that time.
Not trying to sound insulting :)
 
Yeah? It's going to be a while before I pick up one of the next gen consoles, and I'm certainly not spending $400+ to play a beta.

hah, okay. Just seemed odd to see someone grab free Live in preparation for a beta months away - as if 10 dollars or whatever was too much to put aside in that time.
Not trying to sound insulting :)
It's not insulting, but if Fyre's handing out a free month of live then why not. If someone else needs it more than me then they're welcome to have it.
 
I think it could also be understood that people are frustrated that a company as big and with as many resources as Microsoft has to ration manpower. People expect smaller devs to not be able to focus on multiple endeavors, but feel Microsoft should be able to do things differently than other small companies. It's known why they do it. It just feels like there could be something more there, instead of just maintaining parity.

When 343 took over, there was, I think, a very conscious effort on their part to communicate in the developer-community bonhomie style which Bungie had become cherished by so many for. The "We're just getting started <3" and "Thanks for playing our game, you're awesome" platitudes are pure Bungie echolalia and an attempt at personable warmth at a sprawling mass market. All fine when the transition was occurring and people didn't know what to expect. Now it seems as though they forward face the community with a forced smile while an MS exec presses a tazer to the back of their neck. The game has changed and I don't think 343 can pull off the matey Bungie atmosphere when it's so nakedly corporate on so many issues.

Why is updating playlists a zero-sum game? If they update Halo 3 they can't do 4? Halo 4's playlists have probably seen more updates in eleven months than Halo 3 did in three years. To be candid, Halo 4 is a rapidly sinking ship in terms of the total amount of folks remaining compared to how many purchased it; Halo 3 is going to shoot into the top ten of the xbl charts by virtue of being a free game. Now would be the time to let a single Halo 4 playlist update slide in favour of updating an admittedly old Halo game, but one which will bring fresh exposure to the franchise as a whole. It should be seen as an opportunity to secure new business for the future. You think kids won't put up with no sprint in your focus tests? Wait until they're playing Team Rockets on a map as vast as Valhalla, getting a kill every three minutes or spawning with a weapon that has an effective range of 10 feet on Last Resort. Or playing Duels. That shit should've been tidied up to have given a better representation of the Halo brand to newcomers.

A Halo 3/Reach update wouldn't have even occurred to people had Frankie not promised them, which is fine, Frankie's heart was no doubt in the right place when he said that. But it has made people consider the fact that 343 was created to serve a single franchise. A whole studio with a singular focus. It just would've been really nice if they could have done these updates despite the fact they aren't of immediate capital profit. It's those sorts of gestures that really show a community love and justify the <3's.

But the rules have changed. Frankie said that he's "Old and farty and remember how excited and optimistic folks used to be about this hobby" (http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=45592516&postcount=8852). Well, equally, Halo fans are old and farty and remember when a player didn't have an advantage over another just because they paid more money to your studio at launch. They are old and farty and remember when legacy features of the game like campaign theatre and firefight weren't just hacked off like a dead limb in favour of, respectively, nothing at all and a mode which one had to be a member of MS's premium subscription service to even access. They remember when they could customise whether they could sprint in the game or not. Most importantly, they remember when this hobby was this hobby: Halo. Not a template upon which to layer current market trending gameplay tropes in a broad swipe at an even bigger pie than the one you've already got. Don't misunderstand; I remember when Turok 64 was 70 quid in Toys R Us and offered a piffling amount of content in comparison to most games now which retail for less. I know production costs are higher now than they've ever been. In many ways, all the pre-release and pre-order DLC shit for Halo 4 was justifiable. But when it starts to affect the base game; when rocket launchers fall at your feet out of luck; when you can stare through walls; when you put our super soldier in a wheelchair because accessibility means easier, easier means more people can play it and when more people can play it, more people give you money, you sacrifice what made the game so special in the first place. Halogaf may have become more sneering and suspicious but it's a mirror reflection of an industry turned cynical staring right back at them.
 

Tawpgun

Member
I can't speak for the current sustain team, but we investigated doing a playlist consolidation for Halo 3 during my tenure on the team. There were technical concerns about taking up the task due to a variety of issues. Unfortunately I really can't be more specific than that. Additionally, and I hit on this a couple days ago, it can be a tough sell to allocate the amount of test resources you need to do a proper pass on a playlist deliverable. Even with a mere consolidation you need to do a test pass before pushing it out into the wild.

I would guess the team looked at the time available to get an update out before Halo 3 went free and after balancing that against the technical concerns (which are likely more concerning today than 2 years ago) and decided it was best for the entire Halo player population across all games to keep Halo 3 as is.

Appreciate you chiming in.

So from what I understand is something as seemingly simple as playlist management takes up a bunch of time and resources just for testing... Have there been any talks in potentially streamlining the process? It seems overly regulated and bureaucratic.

Something like removing some playlists, adding new ones in etc etc shouldn't take that long. I remember waiting weeks/months for a simple fix I could have done in 3 minutes in Forge. Or just removing a map from rotation.

Let me ask this, what is the WORST that can happen if you gave one person or a small team of people the keys to the entire playlist management system. To me it seems like the worst thing is you get playlists that aren't "optimal gameplay experience" and if so just change them on the fly.

If this is impossible for Halo 4, please try and develop some kind of back end system so you don't need to go through all this nonsense for some simple map and gametype tweaks. IMO just change what you want to change, and if the community finds some kind of bug/bad gameplay experience then adjust accordingly.




Also, you can have access to an excellent resource in time, labor, and talent if you just #HireTashi
 

Fracas

#fuckonami
New 360 holiday bundle

10200334443_72db9f2374_m.jpg


$249
 
New 360 holiday bundle

10200334443_72db9f2374_m.jpg


$249

I got to see the new 360 (and the Xbox One) at a Microsoft Store last week. Not a big fan of the design, it kinda betrays the design of the other 360's. It looks like a big DVD player, not a game console. I know it was inspired by the Xbox One, but I think they should've kept it with the Slim (which is such a god design, I love matte black), i can see why they want to squeeze out some more console sales before the XBox one comes out.

The bundle looks like a decent deal with Halo 4 and Tomb Raider.


I doubt it, this is the same company that used to give 20 microsoft points to people on their birthdays and now give this:

Fuck me. I got that in my email on my birthday, and I was so confused.

"Get a shoutout from Xbox!"

Who actually gives a fuck about shootout these days?

Give me my fucking quarter and let that be the end of it.
 

Omni

Member
Hah.

Just got confirmation. To pay for my Xbox One, I've had to take up a job as a photographer for those shitty Santa pictures they do at malls over the holidays. Probably not worth it, but you gotta do what you gotta do.
 
I think it could also be understood that people are frustrated that a company as big and with as many resources as Microsoft has to ration manpower. People expect smaller devs to not be able to focus on multiple endeavors, but feel Microsoft should be able to do things differently than other small companies. It's known why they do it. It just feels like there could be something more there, instead of just maintaining parity.

You hit the nail on the head with this one. One of the main reasons for my disappointment in Bungie and now 343 with Halo 4 is that Halo is Microsoft's flagship franchise. They throw everything behind it with quite a massive budget to help with its development, so when we see things like no feature additions since Halo 3 and Firefight/Spartan Ops still being unplayable online the fans become frustrated and confused.

I never understood how games with a tiny budget and much less resources can pull off more than Halo. Drives me crazy.

When 343 took over, there was, I think, a very conscious effort on their part to communicate in the developer-community bonhomie style which Bungie had become cherished by so many for. The "We're just getting started <3" and "Thanks for playing our game, you're awesome" platitudes are pure Bungie echolalia and an attempt at personable warmth at a sprawling mass market. All fine when the transition was occurring and people didn't know what to expect. Now it seems as though they forward face the community with a forced smile while an MS exec presses a tazer to the back of their neck. The game has changed and I don't think 343 can pull off the matey Bungie atmosphere when it's so nakedly corporate on so many issues.

Why is updating playlists a zero-sum game? If they update Halo 3 they can't do 4? Halo 4's playlists have probably seen more updates in eleven months than Halo 3 did in three years. To be candid, Halo 4 is a rapidly sinking ship in terms of the total amount of folks remaining compared to how many purchased it; Halo 3 is going to shoot into the top ten of the xbl charts by virtue of being a free game. Now would be the time to let a single Halo 4 playlist update slide in favour of updating an admittedly old Halo game, but one which will bring fresh exposure to the franchise as a whole. It should be seen as an opportunity to secure new business for the future. You think kids won't put up with no sprint in your focus tests? Wait until they're playing Team Rockets on a map as vast as Valhalla, getting a kill every three minutes or spawning with a weapon that has an effective range of 10 feet on Last Resort. Or playing Duels. That shit should've been tidied up to have given a better representation of the Halo brand to newcomers.

A Halo 3/Reach update wouldn't have even occurred to people had Frankie not promised them, which is fine, Frankie's heart was no doubt in the right place when he said that. But it has made people consider the fact that 343 was created to serve a single franchise. A whole studio with a singular focus. It just would've been really nice if they could have done these updates despite the fact they aren't of immediate capital profit. It's those sorts of gestures that really show a community love and justify the <3's.

But the rules have changed. Frankie said that he's "Old and farty and remember how excited and optimistic folks used to be about this hobby" (http://neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=45592516&postcount=8852). Well, equally, Halo fans are old and farty and remember when a player didn't have an advantage over another just because they paid more money to your studio at launch. They are old and farty and remember when legacy features of the game like campaign theatre and firefight weren't just hacked off like a dead limb in favour of, respectively, nothing at all and a mode which one had to be a member of MS's premium subscription service to even access. They remember when they could customise whether they could sprint in the game or not. Most importantly, they remember when this hobby was this hobby: Halo. Not a template upon which to layer current market trending gameplay tropes in a broad swipe at an even bigger pie than the one you've already got. Don't misunderstand; I remember when Turok 64 was 70 quid in Toys R Us and offered a piffling amount of content in comparison to most games now which retail for less. I know production costs are higher now than they've ever been. In many ways, all the pre-release and pre-order DLC shit for Halo 4 was justifiable. But when it starts to affect the base game; when rocket launchers fall at your feet out of luck; when you can stare through walls; when you put our super soldier in a wheelchair because accessibility means easier, easier means more people can play it and when more people can play it, more people give you money, you sacrifice what made the game so special in the first place. Halogaf may have become more sneering and suspicious but it's a mirror reflection of an industry turned cynical staring right back at them.


This post just convinced me. Welcome to the Prophets of Halo. The team includes myself, BigShow, Duji, FyreWulff, sometimes BaBooshka and now you.

I'll be expecting a vial of your blood in the mail within 48 hours. Welcome to the clubhouse and that last paragraph was beautiful.
RIP grizzled Halo fans and Turok games on the 64.
 

Tawpgun

Member
The funny thing is, if there's extensive playtesting for every little playlist decision why we still got bad map/gametype combos?
 

Fuchsdh

Member
Turok is the game I always use when people complain about paying for a $60 game today. You're getting infinitely more and better content with basically any average game or better than you were in those days for often cheaper.
 

Tawpgun

Member
Turok is the game I always use when people complain about paying for a $60 game today. You're getting infinitely more and better content with basically any average game or better than you were in those days for often cheaper.

Wasn't one of the 343 devs part of the Turok team?

Kappa
 
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