Its closer than default H4, but its about 10-15% faster than CE was. Unless High Noon was down-scaled like Timberland, but I don't recall ever hearing it was.
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Halo |OT18| We're Back Baby!
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K
kittens
Unconfirmed Member
I can't watch that where I am right now, but the issue isn't just movement speed, but also inertia, jump height, and jump duration. Good movement and fast kill weapons compliment each other well and work best when balanced. Generally speaking.
Yeah, I understand your point. It wouldn't make the ideal game we're striving for, but I just felt like faster kill times would improve the game overall from what we have now and help improve on some of the major issues even if they don't completely fix them.
Looks like CEA was set to what Halo 1's speed "felt like" and not the actual speed. Wider FOV = faster apparent movement. See also: people thought Bungie made the warthog faster in ODST, and they hadn't touched it at all - it was entirely the effect going from Halo 3's 55 degree FOV to 70 FOV had. (16:9 FOV went from 70->88)
aHebrewMenagerie
Member
It's just my personal opinion, but the Halo 1 magnum could not work inside the Halo 2/3/4 type sandbox. It all revolves around team-skill more than individual skill like Halo: CE did, and i agree with your notion that it would help with sprint, but sprint still causes maps to be poorly design, which would cripple pistol battles. Also, the skill gap that it takes to optimally operate the magnum is quite wide, which works hand-in-hand with Halo: CE/Reach's health system, Halo 2-onwards health is significantly reduced, so battles would be significantly shorter, and easier, since you wouldn't need to put as many shots into the body to kill. Those clutch battles are what makes Halo fun, etc, etc.
EDIT: Actual Halo discussion in HaloGAF? Can't be.
Reach's Anniversary setting were pretty fun, I'd rather have a zero-bloom Reach pistol than the anniversary 3-shot bloomed pistol, zero bloom is fucking fun.
Yeah, that's exactly what the creator of the vid wanted to show everyone. In the tests he ran, he discovered the movement speed in each game really weren't that different from each other (like within 5% of each other), but the FoV made them feel drastically different. At least when speaking in terms of forward running speed and not strafing, jump height, etc.
Yeah, I'd have to agree that it wouldn't be ideal. I just felt like it would make for an improved game over its current state. Its just my personal opinion as I played a lot of default-settings Reach matches with the Anniversary magnum and quite enjoyed them.
90% of Halo's problems would be solved by a weapon that fills the same role as the CE magnum; a skillful, precision weapon that allows players to kill rapidly. However, just shoehorning the CE pistol into any of the later Halo games would be a disaster.
3SK in a game with good netcode and 8 players on each side = the team can field two fireteams that can instantly kill anyone they run across if they're even vaguely disciplined.
It was practically a bloodbath on Timberlands in Reach in Anniversary mode. Even more so than ZB Hemorrhage.
It was practically a bloodbath on Timberlands in Reach in Anniversary mode. Even more so than ZB Hemorrhage.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Doesn't it make sense?!
In Halo 4 you have many ways to escape a fight (sprint + AA's, so much cover, etc.), so I honestly think the game would play a lot better with the H1 Magnum. Also, let's not forget that netcode in Halo 4 is better than any game before it and the weapons are pretty much point and win with all the aim assist and hitscan in that game. They could even make it a 4sk too.
Why can't they just make a playlist and throw it in there for us to test out? What would be the harm in that? I fully expect situations like this to be a reality going forward with the next generation's online capabilities (cloud services, more efficient updating, patches, etc.).
A disaster that would probably play much better than Halo 4 without it.
4sk, but otherwise same weapon from CE. I'd like to test that.
he prefers the term "skillslut"
I don't mind sprint too much, but I agree that Flinch is a poor replacement for descope.
Personally, I'd rather see everyone have thruster packs than sprint with faster default movement speed.
User 73706
Banned
whoa now stinkles, check your privilege, we don't want to bwing up wape culcha, doc
aHebrewMenagerie
Member
Default thruster packs could be really fun, I'd rather have good ole Halo 2-style Halo, but it won't happen, and thruster packs could create some interesting dynamics in battle, and it would also encourage strafing and a higher level of play rather than going into the enemy base warrior-style.
Anniversary made me appreciate later Halo games more--I realized how a 3SK pistol really sucks online, and how weak some of Halo 1's maps were (not that I particularly blame them--it was literally an afterthought so the fact that some are some iconic says something.) I enjoy Anniversary more than default Reach but that has a lot to do with everything besides the pistol.
I would have said in theory that flinch was a better option than descope, especially after Reach, but I think in hindsight it was an overcorrection to other issues that Halo 4 actually addressed pretty well.
Then again after the 110% movement speed boost, 4SK BR and floaty jump return in Halo 4 I'm not really sure why people want to dramatically boost kill times again.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
WHAT THE FUCHSDHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH STOP COMPARING THE ANNIVERSARY PISTOL TO THE HALO ! PISTOL YOU SHITS1
Consistency > chance/randomness
Pistol > BR
Steelyuhas
Member
What's RUL?
Why the hell do people thing that sprint is something that makes the pace of your game fast or slow?
I agree with this.
------------
Making direct comparisons of how the CE magnum worked to the Reach Magnum with damage changed? Gobcomeon.gif
Orochinagis
Member
Just give me the knife already.
Let's not credit it enough to call it an article, it was a shit post.
I don't even mind that people can escape from bad positions, I care that the reason they can escape is because the weapons kill so slowly and are so damn easy to land shots with.
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
I'd hate to see the CE pistol online. I'd hate to see 3 shots to kill online in any base utility weapon. Why? You're shot first and then have to react to fight back, this becomes so quick the game becomes twitch shooter based like CS or COD where it's first to see = first to kill.
The skill gap you want so much in fact vanishes at such quick kill times, when played online. Now imagine team shooting in this scenario; I get shot once by two enemies and then they both shoot a second volley of shots...BAM I'm dead before I even turned around. Even if they miss half their shots I'm dead on the 3rd team shot (6 shots divided by 2 for 50% accuracy = 3SK) and I would be lucky to get 1-2 shots off and never down an enemy in 1v1 or 1v2 engagements where you didn't see/engage them first.
A 4SK sandbox for online play provides enough latency gap (for lack of better term) that a solo 1v1 or 1v2 encounter has the chance for turnover or fighting back. This applies to USA vs. USA (east to west coast) or international vs. local host too. It also contains far more skill because of the inherit ability to fight back or outmanoeuvre your foe. Reach was far too long and required you to outplay 2-4 times in a single engagement. Sprint in Reach allowed escape too much and 4 at launch had too slow kill times. 4 as it stands now is a real sweet spot for 4SK kill times as the base weapons and just needs a buff in strafe acceleration. IMO The turbo weapon balance is the best sandbox and the strafe acceleration would allow long distance dodging. I could agree the bullet magnetism could be toned down some 5-15% online too.
So go ahead and want the return of 3SK but it's really unfair for online play and in fact creates a false perception of skill or online fairness of play. 3SK is certainly not a Halo I would play online.
The skill gap you want so much in fact vanishes at such quick kill times, when played online. Now imagine team shooting in this scenario; I get shot once by two enemies and then they both shoot a second volley of shots...BAM I'm dead before I even turned around. Even if they miss half their shots I'm dead on the 3rd team shot (6 shots divided by 2 for 50% accuracy = 3SK) and I would be lucky to get 1-2 shots off and never down an enemy in 1v1 or 1v2 engagements where you didn't see/engage them first.
A 4SK sandbox for online play provides enough latency gap (for lack of better term) that a solo 1v1 or 1v2 encounter has the chance for turnover or fighting back. This applies to USA vs. USA (east to west coast) or international vs. local host too. It also contains far more skill because of the inherit ability to fight back or outmanoeuvre your foe. Reach was far too long and required you to outplay 2-4 times in a single engagement. Sprint in Reach allowed escape too much and 4 at launch had too slow kill times. 4 as it stands now is a real sweet spot for 4SK kill times as the base weapons and just needs a buff in strafe acceleration. IMO The turbo weapon balance is the best sandbox and the strafe acceleration would allow long distance dodging. I could agree the bullet magnetism could be toned down some 5-15% online too.
So go ahead and want the return of 3SK but it's really unfair for online play and in fact creates a false perception of skill or online fairness of play. 3SK is certainly not a Halo I would play online.
CE PC required leading and nerfed range better than normal CE pistol.
And once again the every Pistol kill is a 3SK myth props its ugly head up.
There has been more out-shooting on Halo CE on XBC with its insane latency and unique lag than pretty much all other Halo's combined. Very rarely are engagements a fight to who can 3SK first, usually takes 5 or more shots to get the kill.
Saying that Halo CE online would be like CoD is unbelievably ignorant. Also, don't marginalize the shooting skill in CS, it far exceeds any Halo game, even CE.
Halo being terrible and stupid easy for so long has really clouded people's minds.
There has been more out-shooting on Halo CE on XBC with its insane latency and unique lag than pretty much all other Halo's combined. Very rarely are engagements a fight to who can 3SK first, usually takes 5 or more shots to get the kill.
Saying that Halo CE online would be like CoD is unbelievably ignorant. Also, don't marginalize the shooting skill in CS, it far exceeds any Halo game, even CE.
Halo being terrible and stupid easy for so long has really clouded people's minds.
It will work dedicated servers with pings that aren't above ~70 ms. I've played shooters that have 3sk weapons on PC and it only becomes unfair if I'm facing guys from Saudi Arabia or something.
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
That is nice and all but if such a weapon beats a BR/DMR/LR/Carby at mid range then it's failed sandbox design IMO. If a 3SK pistol fought with AR or SAW etc at close range fine I could live with that.
If you're talking about allowing 3-4SK mid range on maps like Hang 'Em High then no thank you at all again.
I would be willing to trial things with the new dedis of Halo X1, I could agree dedis and solid regional matching could really allow for such settings. However if I have to play against international players due to populations or server resources etc then again it becomes no.
Did you even read what I wrote? I included an example where players missed 50% of their shots in a 1v2 engagement. Apparently that's assuming 3SK is it? Pffft, I think you're a little biased mate.
Steelyuhas
Member
The great thing about the CE magnum is that you can kill very quickly, but the difference between the quickest kill time possible and the average kill time is wider than in any of the successive Halo games.
I'd really recommend playing PC editon. The pistol really is very nice in it.
Same with Shadowrun, which is why they are my favorite shooters. You can get a 2 or 3 shot in less than a second, or you can have a drawn out Rifle battle that lasts several seconds.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Oh shit, we rollin' deep tonight.
m(._.)
Yup, which is why I say if you take anything from later Halo games and put them in CE's sandbox, they will be much more enjoyable than in their respective game.
For example, Halo 3's maps in H1's sandbox. Think H1 2v2 on Guardian or The Pit.
EDIT:
It makes me laugh.
m(._.)
Yup, which is why I say if you take anything from later Halo games and put them in CE's sandbox, they will be much more enjoyable than in their respective game.
For example, Halo 3's maps in H1's sandbox. Think H1 2v2 on Guardian or The Pit.
EDIT:
It makes me laugh.
It's not the shots to kill that should concern you, its how fast a weapon kills (this is different than shots to kill) and how easy it is to obtain the minimum kill time. The Halo CE pistol was actually right in the middle in terms of how fast it killed when compared to the other weapons in the game (Rockets, Sniper, Shotgun, Melee all killed more rapidly).
The game as a whole was much faster. This doesn't mean it was simply who sees who first. In fact, Halo CE, despite having the fastest kill times, was the Halo game that was least determined by who-sees-who-first. It merely forced players to think and react more quickly than other Halo games. Higher skill gaps usually mean much faster gameplay, but that doesn't equate to who-sees-who-first.
You have no chance against a teamshot situation in any Halo game except CE. Why? Because the weapons are too easy to use. The fact that the weapons kill more slowly actually gives you LESS of a chance against teamshot. And again, you seem to be solely looking at kill-speed and ignoring the skill required to obtain the minimum kill time. It doesn't vanish just because a weapon kills fast.
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
While I agree the PC version is much improved over the CE console version I'm really not talking just about the min. kill time. I'm explaining how that relates to playing online with latency and reaction times compounding each other.
There is so much more than just a 3SK e.g. awareness, team work, use of cover etc. When you look at the current sandbox do we really need the return of a 3SK pistol? No we do not. Could the weapons (bullet magnetism or aim assist) and movement (strafe acceleration) use a little more tweaking so dodging at long-extreme ranges is better along with improved dodging a strafe buff gives? Yes.
It's the online factors that make me not want a 3SK min. I also disagree about fighting against 1v2, with the other factors above you can turn the tables on multiple attackers.
Look at it like this:
4SK min.
solo = 4SK min. with average 5-7SK.
2 team shooters = 2SK min. with average 3-4SK
3 team shooters - 2SK min. with average 2-3SK
3SK min.
solo = 3SK with average 4-5SK
2 team shooters = 2SK min. with average 2-3SK
3 team shooters = 1SK min. with average 1-2SK
When you look at it like this you can see just how often you're going to be dealing with a 2/3SK kill time. Now add the online latency in and by the time you're shot once and attempting to flee or counter attacked you're now down two shots. All of a sudden the min kill time for who sees who first is down to 1/2SK.
This is what concerns me online. I've played through LAN CE, splitscreen LAN, 2 online, 3 online, Reach (good connection), 4's launch vs. now auto-regional matching and I can tell you 3SK min. which is even the 4/5SK average is in fact boiling down to 1/2SK with online factored in.
If dedis can bring my game below 100ms on average I could deal with 3SK but it's still not the sweet spot for online play IMO.
When you've had 10+ years of USA host and non-hitscan weapons in 2/3 you'd put up some facts about online play too mate. As always love your posts about me, if you looked around you'd see I posted about game breaking bugs and Halo 4 just today in another thread.
Orochinagis
Member
Holy damn, an actual Halo stats talk.
I don't know if any 3sk supporters disagree with you here. It seems fairly obvious, right?
Jesus Christ. Old and NEW headsets to require an adapter? Come on.
http://www.computerandvideogames.co...required-for-new-headsets-not-out-until-2014/
Sorry if this is old...
http://www.computerandvideogames.co...required-for-new-headsets-not-out-until-2014/
Sorry if this is old...
Speedy Blue Dude
Banned
Oh wow. So everyone's stuck using Microsoft's boxed in headset. Better not be as terrible and flimsy as the boxed in headset with the 360.
I'm so close to canceling my preorder. I was talking to Shacker over at Bnet about it and I don't know why, but this might be the last thing that needed to happen for me to just go the Sony route for now.
I doubt it'll happen because I like so much of what is coming game-wise like Titanfall and the Xbone controller...but come on.
I doubt it'll happen because I like so much of what is coming game-wise like Titanfall and the Xbone controller...but come on.
Speedy Blue Dude
Banned
Well, to be fair, I believe the Playstation 4 can't use any headsets either. The Pulse need to wait for a system firmware update, and I think other headsets have to wait for a update as well? Both consoles have it pretty bad in terms of using an actual gaming headset.
So, now the question is, which would you rather use at launch?
or
The answer is neither.
Titanfall wise, there is always the 360/PC version until the PS4 one since is a timed exclusive apparently
YourExWife
Member
Just played Ricochet with this lovely Australian fellow had six controllers signed in (4 on the other team) and was boosting kills. Pinnacle of humanity, this one.
Daedalius and I proceeded to make him betray enough to get booted...
Daedalius and I proceeded to make him betray enough to get booted...
Just played Ricochet with this lovely Australian fellow who had six controllers singed in (4 on the other team) and was boosting kills. Pinnacle of humanity, this one.
Daedalius and I proceeded to make him to betray enough to get booted...
And yet, I am the one that was betraying him.
I didn't even get a message!
Wow Ozzy wow. Sorry to ask this but did you even play Halo CE? It seems you just read stuff about the pistol and make assumptions.
I also think the pistol can't be brought back right now, because of sandbox, movement and more. To land the 3 shot you have to be good. It is also not always a 3 shot BR in Halo mlg you have to always hit perfectly
I also think the pistol can't be brought back right now, because of sandbox, movement and more. To land the 3 shot you have to be good. It is also not always a 3 shot BR in Halo mlg you have to always hit perfectly
Garrett 2U
Member
And people say competitive Halo is dead...Just played Ricochet with this lovely Australian fellow had six controllers signed in (4 on the other team) and was boosting kills. Pinnacle of humanity, this one.
Daedalius and I proceeded to make him betray enough to get booted...
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
My top of page post clearly discusses min and avg kill times. Yes I played CE, quite a lot actually with more split screen action but plenty of LAN with mates back in the day. We even used to do a prize pool for who paid for the beers or pizza.
I used to transport and setup weekend PC LANs just to go at Doom II or Quake etc. I'm no easy noob write off mate.
I need to read up on the PC version. It does seem pretty neat.
So, now the question is, which would you rather use at launch?
The answer is neither.
Wait. That's the PS4 headset that comes with the system? Hahaha. After reading all those posts on gaming side about how Sony is so good for including a headset, I was expecting something at least semi-decent. Probably cost them all of about 10 cents to make
at that time it was better than nothing
Im just getting a headset though since I have my consoles hooked up to my speaker-less monitor
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