Rand0m TAG
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Halo |OT5| Believe, Again
- Thread starter GhaleonEB
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The Henery
Member
That's because MLG test their shit properly. And they do it all with minimum of fuss. If something is obviously broken they amend it sharpish. Killa KC, one fucking man, organises this.
The changed sightlines had no effect on the spawn system.
A million years ago, Cunbelin (who now works for Bungie) linked to this article, written by Sirlin back before some of the people reading this forum were born. I remember reading it and thinking two things:
I can't control how the other team plays when I play online. I can control a few things:
Who I play with
What I play
How I react to unsportsmanlike conduct
In general (MOST of the time), playing with a full team will avoid most of the dickishness in Matchmaking. (You'll occasionally run up against another full team that's way better than you are, and if they choose to be douchebags, you'll either have to take it or quit out.)
In general (a LOT of the time), you won't even ENCOUNTER dickishness; the majority of players are actually just having fun. (I understand that almost every day there's another report of dickishness brought to this forum, and indeed probably almost EVERY gaming forum on the internet... but when I look at the corpus of the games I play, dickishness shows up in a relatively small minority. It's just that these games stick in our heads because of the injustice.)
Finally, even when I DO encounter dickishness... I've found that it's a lot less painful if I let it roll off my back and just play another game. If I let it get to me, I play worse in the next game, and SMALLER amounts of dickishness have the same ability to make me angry; the experience degrades at a faster and faster rate. If I laugh it off and move on, I can have fun in the next game, and my night doesn't get ruined. I understand that this is pretty tough for most of us. Life's better when you get good at it, though.
Bottom line: I'd love it if everyone was a good sport. I think that some basic stuff should be put in place to HELP people be good sports. (Fixing the spawn problem on Objective Zealot, for example, would help the overall experience.) I don't think that people should be FORCED to be good sports. (I'm not in favor of more draconian rules, for example, and I'm not in favor of classifying things like spawntrapping as 'cheating'.) And I'd love it if Matchmaking could do a better job of putting together evenly-matched teams (without having to pay for it with hugely-long search times). Yes, I understand that last one is a pipe dream.
I certainly do my share of losing, and for the most part, I do it gracefully. Last night's game was not a good example of this; it really felt unreasonable. I don't mind being outplayed - I mind being screwed. And that's what it felt like. (I didn't quit out because I was playing with a team of friends, and I don't do that. I probably would have quit out if it had been a team of randoms.)
Anyway, I thought the Sirlin article was relevant, and wanted to bring it up.
- He's a dick for talking down to the scrub in this article
- He's completely right
I can't control how the other team plays when I play online. I can control a few things:
Who I play with
What I play
How I react to unsportsmanlike conduct
In general (MOST of the time), playing with a full team will avoid most of the dickishness in Matchmaking. (You'll occasionally run up against another full team that's way better than you are, and if they choose to be douchebags, you'll either have to take it or quit out.)
In general (a LOT of the time), you won't even ENCOUNTER dickishness; the majority of players are actually just having fun. (I understand that almost every day there's another report of dickishness brought to this forum, and indeed probably almost EVERY gaming forum on the internet... but when I look at the corpus of the games I play, dickishness shows up in a relatively small minority. It's just that these games stick in our heads because of the injustice.)
Finally, even when I DO encounter dickishness... I've found that it's a lot less painful if I let it roll off my back and just play another game. If I let it get to me, I play worse in the next game, and SMALLER amounts of dickishness have the same ability to make me angry; the experience degrades at a faster and faster rate. If I laugh it off and move on, I can have fun in the next game, and my night doesn't get ruined. I understand that this is pretty tough for most of us. Life's better when you get good at it, though.
Bottom line: I'd love it if everyone was a good sport. I think that some basic stuff should be put in place to HELP people be good sports. (Fixing the spawn problem on Objective Zealot, for example, would help the overall experience.) I don't think that people should be FORCED to be good sports. (I'm not in favor of more draconian rules, for example, and I'm not in favor of classifying things like spawntrapping as 'cheating'.) And I'd love it if Matchmaking could do a better job of putting together evenly-matched teams (without having to pay for it with hugely-long search times). Yes, I understand that last one is a pipe dream.
I certainly do my share of losing, and for the most part, I do it gracefully. Last night's game was not a good example of this; it really felt unreasonable. I don't mind being outplayed - I mind being screwed. And that's what it felt like. (I didn't quit out because I was playing with a team of friends, and I don't do that. I probably would have quit out if it had been a team of randoms.)
Anyway, I thought the Sirlin article was relevant, and wanted to bring it up.
I think the "ethics" of video games are convoluted at best, and when you're playing in a competitive setting against strangers, they're non-existent. The only way to apply ethics is to physically prevent the players from doing whatever you don't want them to do.
Rand0m TAG
Member
A quick 3-0 for us
@Wu-tang: I liked his yomi articles more. advanced RPS!
Yeah, but when you're making a blockbuster game, you have to consider the "ethics" and subjective desires of a wide variety of players.
I understand where the stinkman is coming from.
Yeah, but when you're making a blockbuster game, you have to consider the "ethics" and subjective desires of a wide variety of players.
I understand where the stinkman is coming from.
That's correct, also, I think a 5 man team objective on Zealot doesnt help either.
Game2Death
Banned
I was hoping/thinking there was a classic mode with no load outs? Would never touch the new modes if we had competitive Halo to play instead.
too much eslim
Member
don't think the spawns were bad in Halo 2. So i have no idea what they did to mess it up in Halo 3.
A quick 3-0 for us
*2-0
What the fuck are you talking about? I was referring to your post about spawntrapping the specific situations it presents. Spawn killing, spawn trapping and spawn predictions have always been and will continue to be a large part of Halo. It just happens naturally as you get better at the game. It's just easier on some maps than it is on others.
You are so right. Hopefully one day I can be as pro and play thousands of games on MLG.
I forgot about"One of Seven" competition/contest Bungie is having. They will get something on Bungie day (July 7th). I wonder what it is, maybe the chance to play destiny?
Heads up Killa KC doesn't do testing for MLG anymore, he got a promotion. Going to be interesting for testing when it comes to Halo 4.
Stealth check out THC rules post.
A quick 3-0 for us
Is there a link to the rosters, gametypes, etc for tonight?
ehhhh I love Halo 2 but I was spawn trapped quite a few times on there too.
Rand0m TAG
Member
Couldn't have worded it better myself. Onslaught is the best example. You literally take turns spawn trapping
Its not really something you can punish someone for, I feel like its just something some people are either ok with, or aren't. I think it stifles competition when you spawn trap/camp.
that doesn't mean the spawns were bad IMO
too much eslim
Member
well it is easier to do on small maps, but i never felt i couldn't do anything. Only time there could be an issue was during objective.
Rand0m TAG
Member
1 bomb on boneyard, heavies on cragmire, ar only hemorrhage
I feel like having the ability to trap people and prevent them from escaping or fighting back is a hallmark of bad spawns. Just one man's opinion though.
Oh man, Halo 2's spawn system.
There was a spot you could stand on in the other team's sniper spawn on Sanctuary and they'd spawn top middle into your sniper rifle's reticule over and over again.
The spawn system has gotten SO much better since the old days, I just wish they'd stop holding it back with maps from previous games.
Spawns in general Halo were never Bungie, or Halo's, strong suit. They just seemed far worse than normal in 3 and Reach for some reason, whether it is forge spawns or something else. The terrible spawning in Narrows, High Ground, Uncaged, you name it. It's borderline hilarious at times.
Poker Face
Member
i never got a chance at this because i never got a bag o swag. they changed the page to purchase at so I was F5ing the wrong page
sigh.
In some maps they were, I mean in Lockout you could actually know where their next spawn was going to be when you learned where their last spawn was.
Still not as bad as Reach's or MW3's system though.
Some people here are forgetting that normal spawn-trapping and the spawn-trapping on Zealot is not the same. Normal spawntrapping means you're under fire a few moments after you've spawned. On Zealot you're standing right behind the spawnpoints smacking them in the back right as they spawn. There's a big difference. The former requires a lot of skill and coordination (especially in something like the MLG playlist) to do consistently while the latter is much easier to set up.
ElzarTheBam
Member
Shut up Suddoth.
Is almost impossible without a popper ranking system or more strict matchmaking search, In MLG reach you are never sure if You are playing against a Game Battle team or a team of casuals.
this. It's not so easy to spawntrap somebody on most of the maps without skill so I don't think the spawns were that bad back then.
It's just that some maps make it easier and some are totally stupid like Zealot Objective in this case
Shut up chubby lady.
I say we should all start talking about lore, Multiplayer talk for a game we all hate sucks
No way this is much more interesting. Just because you hate it doesn't me we all do. A lot of us still play it.
Narrows Swat.. lol. That was fun.
Wasn't being serious, the lore talk will come on the 12th.
What's the 12th?
SDCC panel.
Hypertrooper
Member
I do not hate Reach. It is the worst Halo game. At the end I still have a lot more fun with Reach than CoDMW2 or BF. That's the reason I am putting the game in the tray sometimes.
neoism
Member
lol 2012... lol
Hydranockz
Member
So, what's the counter to the Zealot spawn trap? Killing the flag carrier and returning the flag (somehow)?
Quit out because the gametype is broken would be my counter
Halo 4 should be 60 fps!
Armor Lock.
StalkerUKCG
Banned
Just to clarify I do not condone what players like this do. I was simply offering a reason behind their cheating.
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