Halo: Reach |OT4| This Thread is Not Your Grave, But You Are Welcome In It

Botolf said:
Halo 1 (on PC) was probably my most-played Halo game in terms of multiplayer, I played it pretty frequently for a few years. I think I've had my fill of it, and I definitely don't want to contemplate what the pistol would be like without having to lead every single shot by a visible margin. One benefit of poor netcode, I guess :P. But yeah, wouldn't exactly be itching to sink more time into a mode where the pistol is even more forgiving to use.
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You really need to LAN Halo CE Xbox, the pistol was balanced within the sandbox. Best 2v2 FPS ever.
 
The Real Napsta said:
You really need to LAN Halo CE Xbox, the pistol was balanced within the sandbox. Best 2v2 FPS ever.
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It's funny, because that isn't the impression I got from those years at all. Even with the terrible netcode, the pistol was a dominant force and was the favoured weapon by everyone (power weapons aside). I did well with it myself, but eventually I got bored with the monotony of the constant pistol standoffs. I don't see it as a particularly balanced weapon.
 
Your daily dose of humor from bungie.net: Part 1, Part 2.
Ken said:
At least it seemed like the guy took it well enough.
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Yeah it was a nice, quick cycle. The feigned quick denial on the first game, avalanche, oh never mind.

I was hoping the playlist update would hit today because I was at home and had a lot of free time, and am doing very long hours the rest of the week at work. Alas. Firefight Doubles can't come soon enough.
 
Botolf said:
the pistol was a dominant force and was the favoured weapon by everyone (power weapons aside).
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That means it's balanced. Power weapons are dominant in their respective range and would win over the pistol in those ranges. Anything else, the pistol is the preferred weapon. Getting bored of everyone always using the pistol doesn't factor into it at all.
 
I love hearing people arguing about Halo CE's balance then referencing Halo PC on shitty netcode. I find it silly that I should have to emphasize that Halo CE is amazing on an Xbox, and is balanced, especially in 2v2's, as previously stated, it is the greatest 2v2 shooter ever. I don't give a fuck what Halo CE is like on PC, I care about how it plays on console, Halo PC shouldn't be a serious reference for the balance or quality of its MP in respect to a Console Remake.
 
I love being a part of the HBO family.

And I can't wait to meet up with some of my HaloGAF peeps at PAX.

My 21st birthday is Aug. 25!

I know that's random. :lol But this past week has made me appreciative of everything.

You may go back to your balancing debates.
 
KidA Seven said:
That means it's balanced. Power weapons are dominant in their respective range and would win over the pistol in those ranges. Anything else, the pistol is the preferred weapon. Getting bored of everyone always using the pistol doesn't factor into it at all.
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Balanced against power weapons, perhaps. But I hardly find it balanced against the other standard weapons, where it essentially renders them irrelevant and shunned. Balance is top-to-bottom, not top-to-middle. When you have one standard weapon being toted into battle and the rest are virtually ignored or ineffectual, you've got a problem with your balance.

Booshka said:
I love hearing people arguing about Halo CE's balance then referencing Halo PC on shitty netcode. I find it silly that I should have to emphasize that Halo CE is amazing on an Xbox, and is balanced, especially in 2v2's, as previously stated, it is the greatest 2v2 shooter ever. I don't give a fuck what Halo CE is like on PC, I care about how it plays on console, Halo PC shouldn't be a serious reference for the balance or quality of its MP in respect to a Console Remake.
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Why, because you feel fit to assert it? I've mentioned the state of the netcode on several occasions.

If I was arguing in favor of the pistol's balance on the basis of the netcode, that would certainly be suspect, as the state of it increases the difficulty of usage. The weapon was an unbalancing factor, despite it.

Anyway, clarification: 2v2s were not my scene, I tended more toward the BTB end of the scale.
 
Botolf said:
Balanced against power weapons, perhaps. But I hardly find it balanced against the other standard weapons, where it essentially renders them irrelevant and shunned. Balance is top-to-bottom, not top-to-middle. When you have one standard weapon being toted into battle and the rest are virtually ignored or ineffectual, you've got a problem with your balance.
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Well, those weapons are useless and should never have been included into the multiplayer. But the plasma rifle and AR did have its moments in competitive CE mp. That changed in the following Halos of course.




PR and AR aren't useless imo, but for the sake of argument, lets label them as useless...

If you discard those useless weapons, would the game now be balanced top to bottom?
 
KidA Seven said:
Well, those weapons are useless and should never have been included into the multiplayer. But the plasma rifle and AR did have its moments in competitive CE mp. That changed in the following Halos of course.




PR and AR aren't useless imo, but for the sake of argument, lets label them as useless...

If you discard those useless weapons, would the game now be balanced top to bottom?
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Sure would, but you'd still have one hell of a monotony problem. One of the aspects I like about Halo is the diverse stable of weaponry, and I find it the most enjoyable when nearly all weapons are viable and no single weapon gobbles up the lion's share of the limelight. I've been far more satisfied with the state of balance in the sequels.
 
Botolf said:
Sure would, but you'd still have one hell of a monotony problem. One of the aspects I like about Halo is the diverse stable of weaponry, and I find it the most enjoyable when nearly all weapons are viable and no single weapon gobbles up the lion's share of the limelight. I've been far more satisfied with the state of balance in the sequels.
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I guess that's where I differ from you. I like Halo for its skill in positioning, teamwork, movement, control of power ups and power weapons, and lastly the skill it takes to kill a person.

We'll just agree to disagree.

;)
 
KidA Seven said:
I guess that's where I differ from you. I like Halo for its skill in positioning, teamwork, movement, control of power ups and power weapons, and lastly the skill it takes to kill a person.

We'll just agree to disagree.

;)
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I like more about the multiplayer than a lot of shiny toys, sir :P. Toys just happened to be the topic of the hour.
 
I can't argue if someone just wants to use more weapons, that isn't going to happen in Halo CE to the extent most of you want. I can handle that criticism and opinion, I disagree with it, but that's fine. I just love using the Pistol in Halo CE, I love always having a weapon that I feel comfortable in any situation; I can display my skill, and have ranged shootouts. It's just the style of game I prefer.

I always prefer ranged combat in FPS games, not sniper range or style, but the in-between, the Rifle range. The Halo CE pistol is just a Rifle without the skin, and I love it. The other weapons complement it well, for close range, and to help with using and countering Camo/Overshield. All this combining for the fight for powerups and power weapons. On Asymmetrical Arena style maps, a Console Quake essentially with a Primary Utility weapon always at your disposal.

Vehicles are fun in Halo games, but the gunplay and player movement around the maps always feels more well designed, especially in Halo CE. So big maps with vehicles are fun for a little bit or a break from the Quake style Halo I was describing. But, the lasting appeal of Halo CE for me is the intimate combat based around skilled shooting, map movement, and controlling powerups, power weapons and spawns.

tl;dr kidA Seven's post
 
For my own part, I like feeling comfortable with every weapon. Not to say that every gun in the game should have the same strengths and weaknesses and be clones of each other, but that each weapon should inspire some level of hope and not, "Okay, so he has y and I have x, I'm probably dead unless he's an idiot or a miracle happens". Power weapons exempted, of course. If you've got someone bearing down on you with a mean-looking boom tube, that should inspire a little dread and panic.

Anyway, yeah, probably a part of why I like wide viability is because versatility is how I prefer to play. Sniping, sneaking around with a shotgun or flamethrower, getting into a firefight at midrange, tearing around in a warthog, lurking in the wings with a Ghost to seize a timely splatter, rolling along in a Tank, and jumping into the fray with a bullet hose in my hands, I'm the sort of player who likes to change my play style constantly. But beyond my own tastes, wide viability can be a great focus for a multiplayer title, players generally like being able to pick and choose how they succeed on the battlefield.

OT: I'll love TF2 forever, if only for its mountains of "sidegrades" and the resultant freedom to shape a loadout and a specialized play style.
 
So yeah, the emotions have settled down.

I'm pissed we aren't getting Halo 1 multiplayer for the 360. Not even custom games. Ugh
 
Ars Technica piece with a little more info on terminals:

The game also updates the terminal system, the text-based method the game used to explore the backstory of the world. Now the terminals are much easier to find, and feature a stylized, graphical story that tells the tale of the Halo, and how Guilty Spark found himself there. It's an interesting way to flesh out the game's backstory, and the only way you'll be able to experience it is to play this new game. "This isn't just a weapon, it's my home," Guilty Spark tells the player, describing the Halo structure. The graphics in the new story-based terminal segments feel almost like a breathing comic book, and what little of the story we saw was conveyed very well. If you're a hardcore Halo fan, this is going to be a nice bonus to replaying the original campaign.
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Also, why in the crap have I only watched Halo footage from E3? 14 minute Skyrim video.
 
I get annoyed when I hear people say that the pistol in Halo1 was overpowered and yet everyone is a freaking marksman with the sniper rifle these days. The majority of Halo highlights are sniper rifle kills. And with each new Halo game slowly making the other precision weapons weaker and weaker, that only means the sniper rifle is becoming stronger and stronger. I guess people are cool with getting one shotted left and right with no real counter, but a good all around weapon, that promotes amazing competition and gives you a fighting chance immediately upon spawning, is too powerful. I don't get that at all.

The pistol was never too powerful. Power is relative in any game, and especially in a FPS. Because both teams have the same power. In the case of the pistol, people were either too lazy or uninterested in becoming good with it, and instead became its victim more often than not. I'm not sure why people continued playing the game at this point if they didn't like it (multiplayer at least). I really don't. Everyone that I played the game with loved it.

The pistol, simply put, had a steeper learning curve than most FPS weapons and an amazing skill/reward balance. The weapon was deeper than the Pacific ocean. What this did was promote competition to the likes of which we had never seen before on a console. MLG thrived off of it, and Halo:CE was branded on our brains (or at least mine).

The Halo:CE pistol discussion aside, the bigger problem right now is bloom. I hope we never again see a Halo game with bloom in it.
 
Deputy Moonman said:
The pistol, simply put, had a steeper learning curve than most FPS weapons and an amazing skill/reward balance.
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Priceless :lol I mean wow, really? Really? That's a pretty big leap to make. Heck, you'd need a jetpack to get you across that chasm you just made.
 
Hydranockz said:
Priceless :lol I mean wow, really? Really? That's a pretty big leap to make. Heck, you'd need a jetpack to get you across that chasm you just made.
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I always put console in there for my statements as the qualifier, but I agree with him. It really is one of the most skill based and competitively balanced weapons on a CONSOLE.
 
The pistol did have quite the learning curve. It definitely had a feel that took lots of practice to actually get down. It's not a big leap to make at all Hydra. >_>
 
Hitmonchan107 said:
My 21st birthday is Aug. 25!
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Welcome to the club!

You'll soon learn that partying hard was much more fun when it was illegal.



As for Halo CE multiplayer, I didn't expect it because I knew/hoped that 343i realized that it would be nearly impossibly to replicate what CE was online. I didn't want to see how horrifying CE's true mechanics worked in an online environment without making the 3sk automatic (which would be bad, the enormous skill gap is one of the things that makes CE so good).





Also: Happy that Avatar's are back. I literally think of people as their avatar's.

Ghaleon is a fish!
 
Steelyuhas said:
As for Halo CE multiplayer, I didn't expect it because I knew/hoped that 343i realized that it would be nearly impossibly to replicate what CE was online. I didn't want to see how horrifying CE's true mechanics worked in an online environment without making the 3sk automatic (which would be bad, the enormous skill gap is one of the things that makes CE so good).
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Ugh, why do people who've never played over XBC keep saying this? If you had a good connection (5 years ago) the game played perfectly, I'd imagine any sort of tweaks to make it an actual internet multiplayer game and not feigning a system link game would only improve the situation.


It worked fine! I'd rather have that than any other Halo MP.
 
LAUGHTREY said:
Ugh, why do people who've never played over XBC keep saying this? If you had a good connection (5 years ago) the game played perfectly, I'd imagine any sort of tweaks to make it an actual internet multiplayer game and not feigning a system link game would only improve the situation.


It worked fine! I'd rather have that than any other Halo MP.
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I have played CE over XBC. Sometimes it is pretty good, but from my experience, you can not count on that 'CE experience' every time. It is a crapshoot I think, which is not good more a mass multiplayer game online. I want to be able to expect a consistent online experience pretty much all the time.
 
Hitmonchan107 said:
I love being a part of the HBO family.

And I can't wait to meet up with some of my HaloGAF peeps at PAX.

My 21st birthday is Aug. 25!

I know that's random. :lol But this past week has made me appreciative of everything.

You may go back to your balancing debates.
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I don't know what, but I want it too. Damn. Am I allowed to be jealous?

tbh. Am I the onyl one, who would have loved to get no information about the terminals etc?
Was the question right?
In my opinion it would be awesome to play through Halo CE and you see a Terminal. You would be saying to yourself: What is that? That wasn't in my Halo CE. And now the press is posting articles about the story that the terminals will tell us. I want to find out the story by myself.
 
That CG Trailer has given me the Halo bug again. I got a nice, warm, fuzzy feeling from hearing Cortana shout "Chief!"
So seeing as none of my friends play this game online anymore, I'll be jumping into Reach's Forge tonight to investigate doing another Halo 2 map remake. I bet they have all been accurately remade by now, but I've got the itch and I need to scratch it.
 
Untracked said:
That CG Trailer has given me the Halo bug again. I got a nice, warm, fuzzy feeling from hearing Cortana shout "Chief!"
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I didn't. My mind was screaming "That's not Jen Taylor, what treachery is this!"
 
Blue Ninja said:
I didn't. My mind was screaming "That's not Jen Taylor, what treachery is this!"
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I've just watched it again and I can't really tell a difference, but the last time I heard Jen's voice she was all badass and sweary in Fear 2.

It sounds a little odd when she says "John" but I honestly wouldn't have noticed.
 
Untracked said:
I've just watched it again and I can't really tell a difference, but the last time I heard Jen's voice she was all badass and sweary in Fear 2.

It sounds a little odd when she says "John" but I honestly wouldn't have noticed.
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I still can't quite tell if it's her, I'm leaning toward not. Bad first step to not have her in the trailer, I needs her. I want to know either way though cause trying to figure it out is driving me crazy!
 
randomlyrossy said:
I still can't quite tell if it's her, I'm leaning toward not. Bad first step to not have her in the trailer, I needs her. I want to know either way though cause trying to figure it out is driving me crazy!
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Frankie confirmed it was her. =)
 
Dani said:
Frankie confirmed it was her. =)
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Sweet, I was thinking if it's not her then it's a very good imposter!

How was Halo: Cryptum?
I've been out of the loop on all things Halo since just before it was released, and I'm thinking I should catch up.
I loved the other books, apart from The Cole Protocol, I lost interest in that one for some reason.
I assume Cryptum is a decent read?
 
Untracked said:
Sweet, I was thinking if it's not her then it's a very good imposter!

How was Halo: Cryptum?
I've been out of the loop on all things Halo since just before it was released, and I'm thinking I should catch up.
I loved the other books, apart from The Cole Protocol, I lost interest in that one for some reason.
I assume Cryptum is a decent read?
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Great read, great author, great... ending. ;)
 
Botolf said:
Mancannons: Conceptually this is solved easily enough, waive fall damage for players who jump into one (Play it off as mass distortion). Turn fall damage back on after they're on the ground again.
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If you're turning on fall damage for everything else, you're limiting player mobility and what the player can do in general. Sword Base would play differently without any fall damage. It contributes to the whole grounded feeling I really, really don't like about Reach, and that's part of the reason I'm not playing multiplayer as much as I did in Halo 3. With Reach's settings, I wouldn't have nearly as much fun in Avalanche and Valhalla (the two best BTB maps ever, thank you very much). I went back to Halo 3 a couple of days ago and it felt so refreshing; I felt like I could do anything.
Scarabs: Increase the time until implosion, to allow standard-loadout players to make their way to the lower floors, or perhaps add a "no fall damage" mancannon to enable quick egress. Again, there are some conceptually easy solutions for this one, and as far as I recall Scarabs were taken out for reasons of time and space.
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Now it seems here that you're going to all this trouble to add a bunch of ways to make the encounter work in spite of the jet pack when it would just be easier to remove the jet pack and go back to no fall damage.
 
Dax01 said:
With Reach's settings, I wouldn't have nearly as much fun in Avalanche and Valhalla (the two best BTB maps ever, thank you very much)
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0073_1nbe.gif


Good maps, but no.
 
I'm sure we'll see a lot better consistency and depth in the story now that 343i is in charge. Their entire reason for being is to expand and nurture Halo into a multimedia franchise.
 
Dax, u was mad.

Guess they're saving all of the map reveals for PAX, oh well. Hopefully we'll know how significant the changes are then as well, and it'll be playable. :) I still need to book my plane tickets. I really wish someone would invent a teleport machine so I wouldn't have to get on a plane. :(
 
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