More_Badass
Member
Is this the issue? That people see the premise and assume it's going to be an alt-right dream show endorsing/supporting them?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
HBO orders alternate universe Civil War drama [update: interview w/ producers]
- Thread starter Cornballer
- Start date
- Status
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
Yeah I have no interest in shows based around black people as slaves or criminals on TV.
Angelus Errare
Banned
I personally think this show will be the white savior trope cranked up to 600.
We're just sick of seeing slavery shows/movies in general. Thank god Black Panther comes out in 7 months.
Well what else can it be? The people passing on it are making valid point. The confederacy is actively celebrated now, not like Germany which supressed everything related to Nazism. Hell I live in Arkansas and I see confederate flags hooked to truck beds waving in the air like every other day. I know what those people think of me and people like me. They'll it's about "Southern Pride" but everyone knows that's horseshit.
I'm actually a fan of alternate reality in movies and television, just hard to see D & D not fucking this up by trying to make the audience either sympathize with slave owners or by carving out an alt-right wet dream with a Game of Thrones sized budget.
I keep trying to read Foote. He's really good, but I start mentally getting bogged down in all the battles by volume 2.
Doctoglethorpe
Member
Yeah those racists sure love Man in the High Castle for its lovely depiction of good ol nazis.
What the hell is this argument? It's clearly supposed to be a dystopia, that is, it's gonna make the confederacy look like a living hell for everyone who isn't a white male. Why assume the opposite from the company that brings you John Oliver? Seems beyond absurd to me.
What the hell is this argument? It's clearly supposed to be a dystopia, that is, it's gonna make the confederacy look like a living hell for everyone who isn't a white male. Why assume the opposite from the company that brings you John Oliver? Seems beyond absurd to me.
I am using my Shargian to see the future.
There will be the super progressive white people
The evil white people
and a few named black characters used to show why the progressive people are progressive and why the evil people are evil.
Says a lot when mass hiring of black actors has to involve slavery.
Black Panther so lit
Possibly, but that's different and even further speculation than what you were saying. Shit could end up pretty terrible of course, but I'd be pretty surprised if HBO and those creators were going for 'righteous hard working slave owners' as their backdrop.
This is pretty much my angle on this too. I'll watch it until it sucks
More_Badass
Member
This is where I'm at. It's going to depend heavily on the writers and directors they get, in the execution
I keep bringing up Handmaid's Tale, but only because it's the most recent. The premise is everything your right wing misogynistic religious extremist would love, but the execution is about how fucked up and horrifying that would be. That's the kind of tastefulness this show would need
Sunster
Member
thing about The Handmaid's Tale is that it's about strong women being strong. ITT people are worried this show will be about black people needing to be saved.
I doubt this show is going to be aboug confederate southerners getting murdered every 15 minutes so I'll pass.
There's no chance the show wont have zero depictions of black people suffering or the negativity surrounding slavery period. I have zero tolerance for fictional shows exploring that right now. I dont care how a black character would overcome it.
ryutaro's mama
Member
There will be some of that for sure but I agree with excelsiorlef. She was spot on saying that some dubious characters will no doubt gain a cult following for being awful to Black folks on this show.
superdeluxe
Member
That's my question, I've seen several people thinking this will glorify slave ownership, but nothing in the description alludes to that.
ultratruman
Banned
It's definitely an idiosyncratic thing, but I can't watch these 'alternative history' stories. I find them tasteless and ghoulish.
TheCochese
Banned
Keep in mind that he was very much a proponent of the Lost Cause, if I remember his bio correctly.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
The reaction online to this is literally the same reaction to Secret Empire. This is not a good time for alt-history.
lightskintwin
Banned
There's plenty of other great Black programming than Black Panther coming out in 7 months. Thank god for Insecure season 2 coming out this weekend on HBO, no less.
I just don't see a plausible geopolitical explanation for how institutionalised slavery survives another 150 years in the West even if the South wins the Civil War.
And if you're going to make it that they just modified the institution to be more informal you aren't making alternative history anymore.
And if you're going to make it that they just modified the institution to be more informal you aren't making alternative history anymore.
Frozenprince
Banned
Bet Richard Spencer tweets about him.
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
Has nothing to do with thinking its glorifying slavery and everything to do with having zero interest in a show based around black people being slaves, servants, criminals, etc.
Fascists love to cherry pick from media, including anti-fascist media. It's always a risk when portraying them.
This section of Lindsay Ellis' video on satire dips into it a bit.
A little more on "Tomorrow Belongs to Me" from Cabaret: http://www.pajiba.com/web_culture/is-tomorrow-belongs-to-me-from-cabaret-a-neonazi-anthem-.php
This section of Lindsay Ellis' video on satire dips into it a bit.
A little more on "Tomorrow Belongs to Me" from Cabaret: http://www.pajiba.com/web_culture/is-tomorrow-belongs-to-me-from-cabaret-a-neonazi-anthem-.php
superdeluxe
Member
Could be strong black people saving themselves or with the help of strong black people, no one knows yet.
I mean I'd get it if you just don't want to see anything at all involving slavery, but being outraged about something that we have so details of, just seems like a waste of breath
Doctoglethorpe
Member
I don't see a plausible explanation for how ships could travel faster than light, but that doesn't stop me from watching sci-fi.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
It says slavery will be "modernized" so it's hard to say exactly what form that will take.
For Americans at least, there's a degree of detachment that comes with something like "what if Nazis" that won't be there with "what if Confederacy." It's not strange to be concerned, especially considering it's the GoT guys.
No matter how this plays out, the way it's seen by black people will undoubtedly be different from how it's seen by everyone else.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Alt-History isn't inherently bad, at any time.
Alt-Civil War history isn't a good look for a nation that has yet to truly come to terms with the far reaching results of centuries of enslaving and dehumanizing a group of people.
Think about that. IRL, we never truly dealt with that stain on our nation but we want to show a vision of what if the South didn't truly lose? WHAT?
Sunster
Member
I don't think anyone is outraged. just saying no thanks to the concept.
Boogie9IGN
Member
This is the real question. Hurry the fuck up HBO I've been waiting ages
superdeluxe
Member
Yeah I get that perspective, I was alluding to more of those that show is going to show specific things that disagree with (glorifying slavery, white saviour trope etc)
In the end the ratings will dictate how long the show lasts, if enough people vote by not watching it, then the show will die a quick death
More_Badass
Member
I wonder how much Underground Airlines influenced this. Like it's nearly the same premise, except the 2nd-3rd Civil War part (Civil War never happened, Lincoln was assassinated before his inauguration)
excelsiorlef
Member
I just don't get why.
Like why would you want to explore what the world would be like if Black folk were still slaves in America in 2017....
Like what's so interesting and appealing about that.
Like why would you want to explore what the world would be like if Black folk were still slaves in America in 2017....
Like what's so interesting and appealing about that.
superdeluxe
Member
Some are saying no thanks to what they think the show might show, instead of the general idea of slavery itself. I totally understand and hear that for those That are not interested in the topic at all
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
Watch it win some awards. Those are the ones that always do.
Sunster
Member
In a show about black slaves owned by white people written by 2 white guys with a history of writing about white saviors saving black people I am pretty comfortable assuming that there will be a few in this show.
Really though this is the question. "Hey what if this oppressed and marginalized group was still in chains and considered subhuman property? Let's explore that!"
excelsiorlef
Member
Like I said I fully expect a Walter White type character to pop up within this.
ryutaro's mama
Member
You know as well as I do, there is a large segment of the nation that would like to see this vision. It is extremely interesting and appealing to them.
Call it the Alt-Wakanda if you will. -_____-
excelsiorlef
Member
http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/07/game-of-thrones-weiss-benioff-confederate-hbo-series
I love that Vanity Fair literally used this image as their headline image for their article on this announcement:
I love that Vanity Fair literally used this image as their headline image for their article on this announcement:
Mister Wolf
Gold Member
There will be some Stephen from Django type character who will win a Emmy for his polarizing performance.
Systemwarrior
Member
All I can picture is a show where black folk are getting called the n-word and being treated like shit. We got enough of that in the actually reality.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Don't worry, there will be moments of a slow burn and eventual comeuppance but like excelsiorlef said, it will be lost on the fans of that character getting their just due.
"Fucking PISSED they killed off Jefferson Lee! He was the fucking MAN! Done with this snowflake fucking show."
superdeluxe
Member
Benioff and Weiss didn't make the white saviour issue, that was the author of the book.
That's internal vs external logic though and is a pretty lazy deflection.
Martin wrote the takeover of Slaver's Bay rather a little differently from memory.
- Status