9/10 times it kills you because it's the most powerful and common finisher.
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Hearthstone |OT| Why tap cards when you can roll need [Naxx final wing out now]
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9/10 times it kills you because it's the most powerful and common finisher.
Yep. It's quite rare to see it played mid-game unless the player is forced to. When I see it, it's almost always about 2 seconds before my portrait explodes.
jstevenson
Sailor Stevenson
only time you ever play it not to end the game is out of desperation, or maaaaybe if you have some sort of AOE and a taunt (but even then usually whatever you're using Leeroy against will kill him)
Yea, was just hoping the match making was a bit friendlier.
This is my first ccg and I gotta say I like it.
Haunted
Member
Penny Arcade am cry
Aww I like the Leeroy art. Fits the ridiculousness of the character/meme. I bet reducing his damage by 1 point or raising his mana cost by 1 point will tone the card down sufficiently.
Kill Command is terribad, though.
Last night I drunk drafted a stupid Paladin deck in arena. I took something like 4 Consecrations. I ended up going 6-3, and I absolutely gave up 1 win due to drunken misplays. I probably could have gotten 8 wins if I'd been clear headed.
Kill Command is terribad, though.
Last night I drunk drafted a stupid Paladin deck in arena. I took something like 4 Consecrations. I ended up going 6-3, and I absolutely gave up 1 win due to drunken misplays. I probably could have gotten 8 wins if I'd been clear headed.
The whelps do nothing but discourage it from being played in the early game. He's a finisher. He's the most powerful charge minion in the game. And the idea that taunt completely shuts him down isn't true. He's so cheap somebody can play a taunt removal on the same play. Compare him to Reckless Rocketeer who does 1 less damage for 2 more mana. The whelps should make a bigger impact than they do for the difference.
shadowstar
Member
Fuck I am the worst miracle rogue player ever. I cannot win with that deck. I always make a crucial mistake that costs me the game.
Make the whelps auto attack Leroy immediately after he attacks. This would force the player to clear them first if they want the card to survive.
Would fit the "lore". He rushes in despite the danger, players would have to come to his rescue, etc...
He could still be used as a finisher, but abusing him would take a little more planning and you couldn't just throw him on to an empty board and use him twice.
Would fit the "lore". He rushes in despite the danger, players would have to come to his rescue, etc...
He could still be used as a finisher, but abusing him would take a little more planning and you couldn't just throw him on to an empty board and use him twice.
He'll end up summoning 1/1 Taunted Whelps at this rate. Poor Leeroy.
Miracle is a vulnerable deck to rush down and needs to fix it's draw desperately. If it cannot stop the rush down and/or never gets the chance to draw their deck, it's going to be a bad time for them. If you're playing a slow deck that can't pressure them before they go off, you're basically playing against your counter.
Miracle is a vulnerable deck to rush down and needs to fix it's draw desperately. If it cannot stop the rush down and/or never gets the chance to draw their deck, it's going to be a bad time for them. If you're playing a slow deck that can't pressure them before they go off, you're basically playing against your counter.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
The only mechanic fix I'd like is for Leeroy to summon 2 Whelps that are immune to damage until the opponent's turn.
The only thing that does is stop shadowstep or other such friendly removals. I think making them immediately attack a random enemy works better. There's serious suspense whenever he's dropped with a knife juggler on the board. Bringing that suspense every time he goes down would be AWESOME.
Yeah those look really cheap
daemissary
Member
Just nerf Shadowstep. Literally nothing else needs to be changed if Shadowstep costs 2 or doesn't reduce the cost of the minion being replayed.
Shadowstep costing 2 mana is stupid. Youthful Brewmaster does the same thing for 2 mana.
That would fit with the card's backstory perfectly. People don't like RNG though.
super-famicom
Member
The beginner's guide on Reddit is helpful: http://www.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/1ua5c9/hearthstone_for_beginners_guide_and_resource/
RumblingRosco
Member
Nerfing Leeroy means you'd nerf Windfury Shamans. That's not fun! Let them have their 30-damage OTK (Flametongue, Flametongue, Leeroy, Rockbiter, Rockbiter, Windfury) even if it takes 6 cards and 12-mana spread across 2 turns!
Bah! People lie. RNG gives us those suspense plays where we hope something works, if we aren't sure if a play is greedy or not. It adds to the excitement of the game. And even if your board is totally empty, that's still an only 1/4 chance that leeroy backfires. If you play another minion its like 1/9.
daemissary
Member
Youthful doesn't make it two cheaper to recast.
The reply was to a post calling for 2 mana cost AND removal of the mana reduction.
Of course nothing else needs to be changed then because that would basically destroy the card from being viable.
More ways to deal with Auctioneer is the most likely case for weakening Miracle. It forces you to put a tech card in the deck for them (ala Harrison vs weapon metas) and it targets the actual pivotal part of the deck. The reason Miracle Rogue has such a good match-up vs a variety of decks is because it's really hard to deal with a Concealed Auctioneer for most the field. The closest we have to a Miracle tech choice right now is Tinkmaster's random-target polymorph.
It is far healthier for the long term design of the game to just "deal" with metas by having the tools available for it.
It is. Some of the changes would gut cards and destroy decks though :x Which may or may not be the point at times lol.
I don't want to remove leeroy or miracle rogues. I just don't want a legendary to be such a pervasive threat from every class and feel MANDATORY or be abused as an OTK mechanic. Leeroy should be a fun card, not a pervasive threat at all times.
daemissary
Member
OR not AND.
You would have to remove Charge for that to happen.
As long as Leeroy is a Fireball on legs, people will always use him.
(People in this thread used to think Leeroy was nothing special. How far we've come since then.)
As long as Leeroy is a Fireball on legs, people will always use him.
(People in this thread used to think Leeroy was nothing special. How far we've come since then.)
To make the card even more thematic:
Leeroy spawns two whelp 0/1 eggs.
Egg text: When enemy attacks, egg hatches and transforms into 1/1 whelp. Whelp immediately attacks random enemy character (before enemy attack resolves).
Now leeroy has a 25% chance of dying if he's played alone and whelps aren't cleared with a spell.
For added flavor: when leeroy dies, spawn a 0/2 pile of bones with taunt.
Leeroy spawns two whelp 0/1 eggs.
Egg text: When enemy attacks, egg hatches and transforms into 1/1 whelp. Whelp immediately attacks random enemy character (before enemy attack resolves).
Now leeroy has a 25% chance of dying if he's played alone and whelps aren't cleared with a spell.
For added flavor: when leeroy dies, spawn a 0/2 pile of bones with taunt.
I suck at the game and wish I could play better. With playing maybe 4-6 hours/week I haven't been able to break rank 11.
I have a fair amount of cards, but it seems like if you really want to advance you need to play a ton of games, and if you play slower control oriented decks it is just hard to get the games in.
I have a fair amount of cards, but it seems like if you really want to advance you need to play a ton of games, and if you play slower control oriented decks it is just hard to get the games in.
Ohhh yes, this. I played a lot of drunkstone last night and went from 15 to 17. Mind you, I can now have the fun of making my way back up to 15!
Professor Lich
Member
While I can understand the Leeroy hate, let's not make the card kill itself when played. Should think about limiting the use of things like Shadow Step or Cold Blood on a single minion. That way the damage is spread out multiple turns rather than one big explosion.
daemissary
Member
I just really dislike playing against Miracle Rogue. I think it's way worse than Hunter was before UTH nerf. With Hunter, you could avoid the problem by not flooding your board and making trades with their creatures that wouldn't normally be advisable to keep your creatures to a minimum.
With Miracle Rogue it is just, do you have a fast opening draw? If yes then you win, if no then you lose. And sometimes even with a fast opening draw, they can wreck your plans with a backstab or fan.
With Miracle Rogue it is just, do you have a fast opening draw? If yes then you win, if no then you lose. And sometimes even with a fast opening draw, they can wreck your plans with a backstab or fan.
Having a (maximum) 25% chance of backfire certainly makes double shadowstep a less attractive play.
I hate playing against handlock far more than playing against miracle rogue. Though if I were to change something about miracle rogue, I'd probably just re-work some part of auctioneer, conceal, or stealth in such a way that an auctioneer reveals himself every time his power goes off so that auctioneer -> conceal just doesn't work and the only way to actually stealth him would be a master of disguise.
paperboywriter
Member
are the hearthstone servers down?
Was about to ask the same so I guess so.
It can be mitigated though. It makes the empty board double sstep OTK riskier and that type of play is something Blizzard has repeatedly nerfed in past patches.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Hearthstone is all about RNGod.
Bah, imo it's pretty easy to hurt Miracle Rogues without completely killing Auctioneer/Shadowstep/Prep/etc.
Make Leeroy cost 5 mana instead of 4. Hell make his attack 7 while you're at it, won't change much.
If he's at 5 mana, you can't ever shadowstep him twice, unless you have coin and keep it until turn 10 or so.
Using this, with 10 mana, the biggest combo possible would be something like
Leeroy -> Shadowstep -> Leeroy -> Coldblood x2 -> Prep -> Evis -> Prep -> Evis.
That does 28 damage - it's high, but it's 8 cards, which is almost impossible to pull off. If you still have an auctioneer on board it's possible, but it's a ton of work.
Otherwise, at 10 mana/4 cards, you get 20 damage, which isn't that bad, *and* it kills using Sap to get the taunter away.
The more normal situation will be Leeroy x2, which is 12 damage, for 8 mana and 2 cards, which is a bit more respectable, and while it's still a strong finisher, it's not as crazy OP as it is right now.
The problem with Miracle Rogue right now is that there are 2 counters - rush them down faster or make sure you always 2 taunts on board at all times. Just having one taunt forces them to do their combo at 10 mana (or I guess 8 if they prep the sap) if they can't remove your taunts, which is what you need to fill your deck with, and is kinda sucky because of Blade Flurry on a big dagger which is a crazy board clear. The thing is, if you always keep 2 taunts up on every turn, they're eventually going to be screwed, because they'll spend their mana on removing your stuff and slowly delaying the inevitable (their combo just cannot get in if you have taunts all the god damn time).
The problem is that you need to build a deck specifically against that (why else would you run all taunts???) so you're screwed against a lot of other stuff.
Make Leeroy cost 5 mana instead of 4. Hell make his attack 7 while you're at it, won't change much.
If he's at 5 mana, you can't ever shadowstep him twice, unless you have coin and keep it until turn 10 or so.
Using this, with 10 mana, the biggest combo possible would be something like
Leeroy -> Shadowstep -> Leeroy -> Coldblood x2 -> Prep -> Evis -> Prep -> Evis.
That does 28 damage - it's high, but it's 8 cards, which is almost impossible to pull off. If you still have an auctioneer on board it's possible, but it's a ton of work.
Otherwise, at 10 mana/4 cards, you get 20 damage, which isn't that bad, *and* it kills using Sap to get the taunter away.
The more normal situation will be Leeroy x2, which is 12 damage, for 8 mana and 2 cards, which is a bit more respectable, and while it's still a strong finisher, it's not as crazy OP as it is right now.
The problem with Miracle Rogue right now is that there are 2 counters - rush them down faster or make sure you always 2 taunts on board at all times. Just having one taunt forces them to do their combo at 10 mana (or I guess 8 if they prep the sap) if they can't remove your taunts, which is what you need to fill your deck with, and is kinda sucky because of Blade Flurry on a big dagger which is a crazy board clear. The thing is, if you always keep 2 taunts up on every turn, they're eventually going to be screwed, because they'll spend their mana on removing your stuff and slowly delaying the inevitable (their combo just cannot get in if you have taunts all the god damn time).
The problem is that you need to build a deck specifically against that (why else would you run all taunts???) so you're screwed against a lot of other stuff.
Is the benefit to doing this just more practice?
You got me!
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I need to win 5 game with Priest. Has anyone got a link to a decent deck that only uses basic class cards? I have a load of good neutrals, I really need to stop dusting all the classes I don't play often...
Thanks!
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Just reroll the quest.
I rolled for today. I have a 2/2 priest and 5/5. Figure I may as well just get them out of the way together.
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
I wouldn't be asking if that were possible.
(tomorrow then)
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