Common: Flamewreath and Twilight Cultist (Do you hear the caaaaaall?)
Rare: Evolve and Disciple of C'thun
Epic: Same as what you listed. Shadowcaster should have been the priest legendary.
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Hearthstone |OT6| C'THUN for President! Why pick the lesser evil?
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
Common: Flamewreath and Twilight Cultist (Do you hear the caaaaaall?)
Rare: Evolve and Disciple of C'thun
Epic: Same as what you listed. Shadowcaster should have been the priest legendary.
As a mostly arena-player, not picking just the highest rated cards but those I enjoy more than justified:
Common: Aberrant Berserker, Shatter, Southsea Squidface
Rare: Corrupted Seer, Corrupted Healbot, Forlorn Stalker, Journey Below
Epic: Renounce Darkness, Forbidden Healing
Common: Aberrant Berserker, Shatter, Southsea Squidface
Rare: Corrupted Seer, Corrupted Healbot, Forlorn Stalker, Journey Below
Epic: Renounce Darkness, Forbidden Healing
The best counter to flamewreathed faceless....is to play flamewreathed faceless before they do. PogChamp.
It's my favorite card now actually, theway he says "need a light?" reminds me of Firebat from StarCraft. You can feel the pain of your opponent through the screen when you play this, it's pretty good.
It's my favorite card now actually, theway he says "need a light?" reminds me of Firebat from StarCraft. You can feel the pain of your opponent through the screen when you play this, it's pretty good.
If Rag had killed some other friendly minion and KT resurrected it the interaction would have made sense and nobody would have complained about it. The issue here was that it doesn't make much sense for KT to be a valid target for his own effect. But since he was a valid target of his own effect at the time of his release, the interaction actually made some sort of sense once you realized how the stack worked.
It's still a 6 mana creature as long as Eternal Sentinel or Lava Shock don't get played. Any hard removal like Hex, Polymorph, or SW
is fine.RecRoulette
Member
Common: Flamewreathed Faceless (sorry)
Rare: Evolve
Epic: Renounce Darkness (I really want to get this card and make a deck with it)
Rare: Evolve
Epic: Renounce Darkness (I really want to get this card and make a deck with it)
Odds are good it will get nerfed to 5 mana pretty quickly. Shamans and paladins have essentially switch roles.
Now shamans have the god curve while paladins have to run odd decks in order to be viable.
Gentle Rodriguez
Member
What? Hex, Poly, Uldaman, equality, Sap, SW Death, Execute, I'm probably forgetting some. Most classes can deal with big things early on, BGH wasn't ever the only answer to them.
Karsticles
Member
What annoys me is that playing fat creatures early is the Druid staple. Shaman has moved more and more toward sharing this feature, and it's just so uninteresting. Earth Elemental used to be the class's only early fatty, but then they added Totem Golem and now Flamewreathed Faceless.
Shaman has never been about bulkiness in WoW. It's a class about using a bunch of odd tools to achieve something amazing. Fire Elemental, Frost Shock, and Healing Totem are good examples of what the class should be.
To me, cards like Frost Elemental are great examples of what a Shaman should be doing. I don't even know why that card is neutral, but Fire and Earth Elemental aren't. More elementals that have interesting board control effects through Battlecries and passives is where the class should be going. Then the class is a hybrid between solid creature plays and control effects. That's exactly what a Shaman is in the Warcraft universe. Cards like Trogg are lazy and ruin the class identity.
That's not how it works...
Sure removals exist in the game but this comes down on turn 4 or even coined out. What are the chances you draw your removal in 3-4 turns? 4 mana + 2 overload isn't a 6 mana creature, 6 mana creature comes two turns later.. that's two less draws for you to get an answer, huge difference.
The way it would work is to keep that one removal in your hand in mulligan but then you get destroyed by their other early plays because you chose for a reactive play. That's what I mean the best counter for it is that, don't be reactive if you want to be winning in hearthstone. The player that reacts is always in a disadvantage. Keeping that Harrison for them to play doomhammer, turns out they never draw doomhammer and you have a dead card in your hand when you die... It's probably still correct to keep the Harrison but it happens. If you're playing shaman, you should not ever keep hex to react to the other guy's faceless, that's like really bad play.
Sure removals exist in the game but this comes down on turn 4 or even coined out. What are the chances you draw your removal in 3-4 turns? 4 mana + 2 overload isn't a 6 mana creature, 6 mana creature comes two turns later.. that's two less draws for you to get an answer, huge difference.
The way it would work is to keep that one removal in your hand in mulligan but then you get destroyed by their other early plays because you chose for a reactive play. That's what I mean the best counter for it is that, don't be reactive if you want to be winning in hearthstone. The player that reacts is always in a disadvantage. Keeping that Harrison for them to play doomhammer, turns out they never draw doomhammer and you have a dead card in your hand when you die... It's probably still correct to keep the Harrison but it happens. If you're playing shaman, you should not ever keep hex to react to the other guy's faceless, that's like really bad play.
what are the best counters?
so, I'm just a very pleb HS player who hasn't past the basic card set and yesterday someone with a warlock sent me Reno Jackson when he had 4-6 of health.
He did that 3 times... THREE TIMES.. it was outrageous, he even sent me a C'thun.
I still can't believe I managed to still beat him with my basic mage deck
He did that 3 times... THREE TIMES.. it was outrageous, he even sent me a C'thun.
I still can't believe I managed to still beat him with my basic mage deck
Aggro decks do well against them. So Face Shaman and Zoolock.
It's why I have a huge number of taunts in my Druid C'thun deck.
So we did some talking about N'Zoth Rogue yesterday and here are my results.
I went 10-2 with it. It felt very consistent, which is the best compliment I can give a deck.
The first game I lost was against a mid-range hunter and I held off his mid-game pressure and built my board until turn 13 or 14. If I would have drawn any 2 damage from my deck I would have one and he needed to draw 2 damage to win. I didn't draw it, but he got Kill Command. A very close game.
The second loss was against a C'thun rogue. I lost this game because of a misplay. I was going to copy Sylvanus' death rattle with a raptor and then I needed to use my SI:7 agent's damage to kill my own Sylvanus so that I could steal his minion. Well SI:7 is a combo card and I accidentally played it before the raptor, so he got to keep his minion. That minions damage + C'thun was perfect lethal for him.
I ended up going with a more tempo oriented deck. So I took out some combo pieces and focused on just being on the board and absolutely controlling it with the cheap removal.
The best part was that the deck completely destroyed every aggro list that I came up against. The cheap removal and hero power kept their board under control very easily. Shadow strike was clutch in removing key aggro minions like Faceless and Councilman.
2x Backstab
2x Sap
2x Eviscerate
2x Loot Hoarder
2x Undercity Huckster
1x Bloodmage Thalnos
2x Fan of Knives
2x SI:7 Agent
2x Unearthed Raptor
2x Shadow Strike
1x Earthen Ring Farseer
1x Edwin Van Cleef
2x Infested Tauren
2x Tomb Pillager
2x Azure Drake
1x Sylvanus
1x Cairn
1x N'Zoth
I went 10-2 with it. It felt very consistent, which is the best compliment I can give a deck.
The first game I lost was against a mid-range hunter and I held off his mid-game pressure and built my board until turn 13 or 14. If I would have drawn any 2 damage from my deck I would have one and he needed to draw 2 damage to win. I didn't draw it, but he got Kill Command. A very close game.
The second loss was against a C'thun rogue. I lost this game because of a misplay. I was going to copy Sylvanus' death rattle with a raptor and then I needed to use my SI:7 agent's damage to kill my own Sylvanus so that I could steal his minion. Well SI:7 is a combo card and I accidentally played it before the raptor, so he got to keep his minion. That minions damage + C'thun was perfect lethal for him.
I ended up going with a more tempo oriented deck. So I took out some combo pieces and focused on just being on the board and absolutely controlling it with the cheap removal.
The best part was that the deck completely destroyed every aggro list that I came up against. The cheap removal and hero power kept their board under control very easily. Shadow strike was clutch in removing key aggro minions like Faceless and Councilman.
2x Backstab
2x Sap
2x Eviscerate
2x Loot Hoarder
2x Undercity Huckster
1x Bloodmage Thalnos
2x Fan of Knives
2x SI:7 Agent
2x Unearthed Raptor
2x Shadow Strike
1x Earthen Ring Farseer
1x Edwin Van Cleef
2x Infested Tauren
2x Tomb Pillager
2x Azure Drake
1x Sylvanus
1x Cairn
1x N'Zoth
N'Zoth Paladin. Peacekeeper, Ulduman and Equality keeps their threats away until you've built a board worth resurrecting.
Only problematic match up is against Rogue.
The Lamonster
Member
PSA: Hearthstone works through Steam Link with an Xbox One controller, no fuss whatsoever. It's plug and play.
It's basically Hearthstone on console and it's awesome.
It's basically Hearthstone on console and it's awesome.
EnVy_CaLiBeR
Member
Been playing a lot of N'Zoth Pally and Rogue. My favorite decks to play at the moment. C'Thun Warrior is great because Shieldbearer is bae.
Bilefin, Steward of Darkshire, Renouce Darkness.
Undercity Huckster is a close second for Favorite Rare. Love that guy, so glad I pulled 2 gold ones.
Infernodash
Member
Resurrect the Light
Forbidden Shaping x2
Northshire x2
Resurrect x2
SWP x1
Doomsayer x2
Museum Curator x2
SWD x2
Infested Tauren x2
Shifting Shade x2
Excavated x1
Holy Nova x1
Darkshire x2
Cairne
Entomb x1
Emperor Thaurissan x1
Sylvanas
Chillmaw
Confessor
Soggoth
Mind Control x1
N'Zoth
The goal is to get doomsayer on the board for the early turns and then resurrect it to keep board clear, in the late game it's good for resurrecting deathrattle minions for cheap while adding more board presence. Obviously, rng screws you over sometime and resurrects the curator or northshire, which isn't so bad if you already have board presence as it facilitates card draw from heal. Lastly, resurrect first, then add minions, there is always the possibility you resurrect doomsayer in the late game. Forbidden shaping comes in handy if you absolutely must get board presence because of shitty draw, but typically you want to drop it turn 8 or turn 10 heal and then drop.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Always happy to see cthun minions as control pally.
Infernodash
Member
N'Zoth Resurrection Deck. I'm not sure if anyone else has done it, but it's something I've been running with great success against control/cthun decks.
It does which is weird. Should work like Golden Monkey (only golden cards are replaced by golden versions) but instead works like Thoughtsteal.
GenericBadGuy
Member
I finally have a large handful of decks that are nothing but crazy fun and I'm having the best time with the game I've had in a while.
Renounce Darkness Warlock (with Yogg), Astral Druid, Corrupted Randuin, Arcanite Reaper (HOOO!) Warrior, Yogg Casino Mage...
Win or lose, the game is just a load of chill fun. I get to rank 20 for the card back and stick to casual for quests.
Renounce Darkness Warlock (with Yogg), Astral Druid, Corrupted Randuin, Arcanite Reaper (HOOO!) Warrior, Yogg Casino Mage...
Win or lose, the game is just a load of chill fun. I get to rank 20 for the card back and stick to casual for quests.
Doesn't a golden Golden Monkey turn your non-golden cards into golden ones, too? I think I saw that on stream.
Overload is a mechanic used for borrowing tempo and honestly it makes more sense to borrow tempo for creatures rather than burn or removal spells. The worst designed overload card in the game is Lava Burst. It is overcosted in its overload which makes it poor removal, so it primarily gets used like a late game Kill Command. Burn to the face.
And it's not exactly like Druid. Druid has to pay an extra card to get that advantage, but Shaman pays mana later. It is a different enough mechanic.
Probably. I'm not made of dust, so can't check it out.
Golden cards have the Midas touch. Every card or minion that they generate turns golden.
Favorite cards so far --
Commons:
Darkshire Alchemist
N'zoth First Mate
Rares:
Undercity Huckster
Shifting Shade
Journey Below
Epics:
Forbidden Healing / Shaping
Twilight Summoner (best sound clip)
Embrace the Shadow
My absolute favorite cards so far have been Lightlord and N'zoth. They got me playing Paladin. I suspect I'll like Vilefin Inquisitor as well.
As for Shaman, yeah, I'm not crazy about the big fatties. I like cards more like Thing From Below (totem interaction), Healing Wave, and Unstable Elemental. I really like Thunderbluff Valiant. It's a shame it's not being played.
Commons:
Darkshire Alchemist
N'zoth First Mate
Rares:
Undercity Huckster
Shifting Shade
Journey Below
Epics:
Forbidden Healing / Shaping
Twilight Summoner (best sound clip)
Embrace the Shadow
My absolute favorite cards so far have been Lightlord and N'zoth. They got me playing Paladin. I suspect I'll like Vilefin Inquisitor as well.
As for Shaman, yeah, I'm not crazy about the big fatties. I like cards more like Thing From Below (totem interaction), Healing Wave, and Unstable Elemental. I really like Thunderbluff Valiant. It's a shame it's not being played.
call_kotaku
Member
I guess you need an insane deck in arena now to do well
I managed to draft a shaman deck with two flamewreathed faceless and I'm barely beating 3 gross ass mage drafts just to get to 6 wins
I managed to draft a shaman deck with two flamewreathed faceless and I'm barely beating 3 gross ass mage drafts just to get to 6 wins
voodoopanda
Member
My favorite cards have all been Rogue this expansion:
Undercity Huckster
Journey Below
Shadowcaster
Rogue was my least played class before Old Gods hit but that's been changing.
Undercity Huckster
Journey Below
Shadowcaster
Rogue was my least played class before Old Gods hit but that's been changing.
Karsticles
Member
Can I get the list? What's your rank? I'd love viable Priest options.
It plays out the same. My point is just that it isn't particularly interesting when put into play.
Infernodash
Member
Sure, I pasted it above the reply to you. I'm a rank 17 now, mainly because I've been experimenting with Nzoth Rogue and Paladin decks as well so I'm on a bit of a tilt from not having a complete deck for them. I would appreciate any changes you think should be made and or any substitutions.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Control Pally is a bad matchup for tempo rogue, opponent smartly made me overdraw with my acolytes though and managed to mill me both equalities.
I've been very happy that Rogue is viable again. In the pre-WoG meta you had to play Malygos. Now that deck is half as powerful as it was, but there are at least 4 other playable archetypes now. It's great. N'Zoth's high mana cost hasn't been as much of a detriment as people thought. Corrupted Healbot is a sleeper, pulls out the desperation plays like Fireballs or Hex (and I love having that one Hexed).
Infernodash
Member
Definitely one of the worst matchups for Priests now are other Priests. It's a game of attrition at this point. Do you waste a SWD or Entomb now? Will he drop a forbidden shaping? I can't even account for all the shade shenanigans too. On top of that games last like 20 minutes. lol... Fun stuff though.
Karsticles
Member
Why has Rend Blackhand never been a thing in dragon decks? I see him sometimes, but never in recommended lists.
Thaurissan without any real combos.
Chillmaw, but no activator. Consider Ysera instead of Excavated Evil.
Resurrect is interesting - you use it to get more Deathrattles in the queue, but I bet you get Northshire Cleric sometimes instead and that sucks.
I've had bad experiences with Doomsayer, personally. He almost never does the job he needs to do. Maybe a 1/4 success rate unless I am placing him on curve to wipe a 1/3 minion or something small like that. Even playing Freeze Mage, my opponent seems to ALWAYS have an answer for him.
A few thoughts:
Thaurissan without any real combos.
Chillmaw, but no activator. Consider Ysera instead of Excavated Evil.
Resurrect is interesting - you use it to get more Deathrattles in the queue, but I bet you get Northshire Cleric sometimes instead and that sucks.
I've had bad experiences with Doomsayer, personally. He almost never does the job he needs to do. Maybe a 1/4 success rate unless I am placing him on curve to wipe a 1/3 minion or something small like that. Even playing Freeze Mage, my opponent seems to ALWAYS have an answer for him.
I've found that Thoughtsteal is amazing against Control Warrior. They pretty much only run legendaries, so my first try I got Sylvannas + Baron Geddon. Then I got Gromm from a Shifting Shade. It means they have to burn all 4 of their high-level removal spells on their own minions so Ysera or something else can be played safely.
Look at all the decks that are being played right now and count the number of Legendaries in them.
Shaman decks? Not a single god damn one.
Hunter decks? Maybe Huhuran but not really. Essentially no Legendaries in Hunter decks.
Druid decks? Maybe Fandral, maybe Twin Emperors, usually Bran... none of which are godlike targets for Rend. Of course there's Cthun but the match is usually over by then.
Warrior decks? Control Warrior has lots of targets but that has been less prevalent. Cthun Warrior has very few Legendaries outside of the two Cthun ones and Grim Patron has a single Legendary in it and the game is usually over when it gets played.
Warlock decks? Zoolock only carries Brann...Control Warlock is garbage right now.
Mage decks? Tempo Mage decks have very few Legendaries (usually only Antonidas but that's being played at the end when the game is being decided) and aside from Thaurisan isn't not a big deal to Rend their other Legendaries.
Rogue decks? Based targets are Van Cleef and Malygos. Malygos you will never have the chance. And Van Cleef usually comes out very early in the game and far before Rend is a factor.
Priest decks? Ironically Dragon Priest is the best target for Rend Blackhand because it can snipe Chillmaw, Ysera, Nefarian or Chromaggus. Control Priest on the other hand runs very few Legendaries these days but it can snipe Ysera though so that's good I guess.
Paladin decks? Aggro versions don't run any.. and it's garbage trying to snipe Nzoth Paladin Legendaries. Snipe Sylvanas, they steal Rend. Snipe Tirion and they get a weapon that kills Rend. Snipe Cairne and it still leaves a 4/5 body that kills Rend.
This was even worse when most decks only carried Dr Boom. Snipe Boom with Rend and then get your Rend killed by a single Boom Bot... wow dat value. BGH was a better option in that case. Honestly Rend Blackhand was only somewhat relevant at killing Emperor Thaurissan at the spot and that card is less common these days.
The stats really kill Rend Blackhand, 4 HP for that expensive of a minion is really bad.
Karsticles
Member
Infernodash
Member
I definitely appreciate the feedback. I can remove the Thaurissan, Chillmaw was just to get another deathrattle taunt body. Missing Belcher right now. I'll add in the Ysera.
As for doomsayer, the goal really is to have them burn removals to clear it especially if they have twilight elder or someone they're trying to keep on board. If it happened to be the only minion youve dropped you get to resurrect it again and have them try to remove it again. I've had a warrior burn execute on it twice and was helpless in the late game. Especially after I got a Brawl from shifting shade. Give it a try and let us know if you have the same results.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Bran doubling C'thun's Battlecry is ruthless. Opponent played it very well so I'm not even mad I lost. I took my 1/4 chance in killing Bran over playing the Ragnaros, might have been wrong in retrospect.
Karsticles
Member
I plan on getting some Dragon minions in my deck. Instead of relying on Doomsayer, I'm going to try and play a bit of an early board game until I can establish control for later. I think only Rogue and Mage can even attempt running Doomsayer.
Whatever card gives me the most options I guess...I don't have all that many cards.
Doomsayer sucks for Rogue too.
Doomsayer works for Paladin for a couple of reasons:
*They can Humility/Clear boards then set up Doomsayer more effeciently.
*Doomsayer clears fuel Solemn Vigils.
*Doomsayer kills activate their weaker minions like Twilight Summoners and feed Nzoth.
Control Warlocks are starting to run Doomsayer along with other crap like that new Annoyotron and it's the saddest thing ever.
Honestly these days Doomsayer is just played turn 2 to buy a turn in non Freeze Mage decks. If they have a reasonable board Doomsayer won't do anything except gain you 7 HP (maybe).
Doomsayer works for Paladin for a couple of reasons:
*They can Humility/Clear boards then set up Doomsayer more effeciently.
*Doomsayer clears fuel Solemn Vigils.
*Doomsayer kills activate their weaker minions like Twilight Summoners and feed Nzoth.
Control Warlocks are starting to run Doomsayer along with other crap like that new Annoyotron and it's the saddest thing ever.
Honestly these days Doomsayer is just played turn 2 to buy a turn in non Freeze Mage decks. If they have a reasonable board Doomsayer won't do anything except gain you 7 HP (maybe).
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Doomsayer is just a great play turn 3 or even just turn 2. Turn 2 it's a 1 for 1 turn 3 it's at least a 1 for 1 but usually soaks up removal.
Lategame it fogs a bit of damage at worst.
Lategame it fogs a bit of damage at worst.
Karsticles
Member
If you have a small collection, then it's all about crafting multiple rares/epics to fill out a basic deck. Don't start with legendaries. I hit rank 5 two seasons in a row without a single legendary in my deck, so you really just need to figure out one deck you want to make that you can afford now.
I'm just not into delaying damage. I like solutions to problems.
I've seen Rogues use Doomsayer + Conceal effectively.
Good Paladin ideas.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
A 1:1 off doomsayer is actually just fine. More importantly, it gives you the first opportunity to establish a board after it goes off. It's a very solid card and has been for a while. But the common usage of silence and it being a weaker situational late game drop stopped a lot of decks from running it.
Late game it can still protect the rest of your board, giving you a foothold to get back into the game, sometimes.
Late game it can still protect the rest of your board, giving you a foothold to get back into the game, sometimes.