I always thought it was weird that the 11" Air had a 16:9 screen when every other MacBook had 16:10, come to think of it.
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"Hello Again" Apple holding mac-centric media event October 27th 10am PST
- Thread starter Dany
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I always thought it was weird that the 11" Air had a 16:9 screen when every other MacBook had 16:10, come to think of it.
345triangle
Member
yeah it's odd, but 1366 x 768 is kind of the standard cheap laptop resolution i guess, and makes it feel like a more casual video-focused machine. also it's 11.6-inch, so they could really have rounded it up to 12 in common parlance.
given the bezels though it just makes the overall shape more awkward than it needs to be. the new macbook is a lot easier to throw into a bag.
in terms of industrial design i love everything about the new macbook except the keyboard. it's really the perfect all-around size for me.
Michael Tsai's links round up ― New MacBook Pros and the State of the Mac ― is essential reading if you want to get a pulse on what the Mac developer community thinks of the recent Apple (and Microsoft) event
The Real Abed
Perma-Junior
Yeah, the 12" MacBook is smaller and lighter than the 11" Air while still having a nicer screen with a lot more pixel room. I don't know why you wouldn't want that.
And I bet by the time you update, the MacBook would have the better revision 2 butterfly keyboard. And hopefully be a bit faster.
It's a win-win situation here. All you lose is ports. Which I could see as a drawback if you use them and need them. So maybe we'll get lucky and the MacBook will also have a second USB-C port at least. (Really the biggest problem with it. Replacing all ports with one all-in-one port is one thing but only putting one on is just stupid.)
eyeball_kid
Member
That assumes Apple will even allow unsigned code to run on the Touch Bar, which I doubt.
The Real Abed
Perma-Junior
You can be a signed developer without having to put apps on the MAS. Which is all we need. Even Apple knows people don't use it as much as they want them to.
Apple's backed off making Mac app features locked behind the App Store because they've realized no one cares about the Mac App Store. Some features like iCloud do require code-signing with a developer account, but Apple doesn't have to approve that, you just have to pay them for it.
Zeyphersan
Banned
That'd be a great way to have absolutely no one get Touch Bar support
The keyboard is my only issue. Its size is fine, and I will probably end up choosing the next 12" iteration if the 2nd gen butterfly is as good as claimed.
The bezels aren't that different.
It's much worse because the bezel on the sides are thicker while the screen is tiny. Just makes it look extremely claustrophobic to me.
jts
...hate me...
Boring morning, was checking the different original MacBook Pro releases throughout time, and thought I’d compile them for those interested.
___________________________________________________
1st gen - still based on PowerBook G4’s design
Jan 2006
MacBook Pro 15” - $1,999
April 2006
MacBook Pro 17” - $2,799
___________________________________________________
2nd gen - aluminum unibody
October 2008
MacBook 13” (aluminum unibody - not dubbed Pro yet) - $1,299
MacBook Pro 15” - $1,999
January 2009
MacBook Pro 17” - $2,799
June 2009
MacBook Pro 13” - $1,199
___________________________________________________
3rd gen - Retina display
June 2012
MacBook Pro 15” - $2,199
October 2012
MacBook Pro 13” - $1,699
___________________________________________________
4th gen - USB-C/Touch Bar
October 2016
MacBook Pro 13” (gimped) - $1,499
MacBook Pro 13” - $1,799
MacBook Pro 15” - $2,399
___________________________________________________
So the outliers being the aluminum unibody MacBook (2008) and derivative MacBook Pro (2009), which were quite affordable from the get-go, the price jumps go as it follows:
2nd gen - no price change
3rd gen - 13” increases $400-$500; 15” increases $200
4th gen - 13” increases $100 (decreases $200 for the gimped version); 15” increases $200
___________________________________________________
1st gen - still based on PowerBook G4’s design
Jan 2006
MacBook Pro 15” - $1,999
April 2006
MacBook Pro 17” - $2,799
___________________________________________________
2nd gen - aluminum unibody
October 2008
MacBook 13” (aluminum unibody - not dubbed Pro yet) - $1,299
MacBook Pro 15” - $1,999
January 2009
MacBook Pro 17” - $2,799
June 2009
MacBook Pro 13” - $1,199
___________________________________________________
3rd gen - Retina display
June 2012
MacBook Pro 15” - $2,199
October 2012
MacBook Pro 13” - $1,699
___________________________________________________
4th gen - USB-C/Touch Bar
October 2016
MacBook Pro 13” (gimped) - $1,499
MacBook Pro 13” - $1,799
MacBook Pro 15” - $2,399
___________________________________________________
So the outliers being the aluminum unibody MacBook (2008) and derivative MacBook Pro (2009), which were quite affordable from the get-go, the price jumps go as it follows:
2nd gen - no price change
3rd gen - 13” increases $400-$500; 15” increases $200
4th gen - 13” increases $100 (decreases $200 for the gimped version); 15” increases $200
Great roundup... yeah, i'm not really feeling the update after having thought on it more. At first, I just wasn't sure. I thought the touch bar was interesting but mostly felt like a gimmicky addition. But the real crime here is in the specs... Apple has for years shown less and less interest in putting top of the line components in its pro models... but this year is among the worst offenders. A huge price hike with middling improvements in the ways that really matter: more ram, faster chips, being forward thinking on things such as VR. All things you can get in windows laptops that, amazingly, cost HALF as much or less and have improved in their external designs quite a lot in recent years.
If you want a pro-grade laptop that looks nice, really check out the new offerings from Razer... I think they are starting to get really serious about taking over this market. And maybe they will, since Apple clear doesn't care.
http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-systems/razer-blade
http://www.razerzone.com/store/razer-blade-pro
Also, Thinkpads, and some of the nicer Dells like the XPS line.
Vivalaraza
Member
The next Macbook update is likely to be in...spring 2017?
tiredheadcrab
Member
How is the screen on this device? I am sure it's not MacBook Pro good but I do have a 2k monitor from Asus that is mostly for photo editing and creative work. So in the end it might be okay.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Can a 13" macbook pro from last year stream 4 mkvs via Plex?
From all indications, the chips included are the best they could have done given their thermal requirements and what's available from Intel. What were you expecting? Tsai includes tweets from people saying they wanted a mobile Xeon and I'm not sure if he gets it or not that the MBP doesn't cater (and has never) to people who want thick and heavy workstation laptops with little battery life. Which windows laptops cost half as much, have better specs, and are in the same category as the MBP? I want to compare.
The bezels aren't that different.
it's the bezel in relation to the total screen area. - and it's even more striking because they're not the "black glass surface" bezels but the 'old' silver aluminum bezels.
Spiral Insanity
Banned
This reads like straight up propaganda. Skewed to heck.
So since I suppose it's time for me to just bite the bullet and buy new cables -- besides Apple ones for the iPhone and MacBook specifically, are there any brands that stand out for cheaper cables?
I figure I may need to buy a few USB to USB-C cables for all the USB devices I have like Kindle Paperwhite, maybe a HDMI to USB-C?
I feel like we are going to need a cable/adapter FAQ soon.
I figure I may need to buy a few USB to USB-C cables for all the USB devices I have like Kindle Paperwhite, maybe a HDMI to USB-C?
I feel like we are going to need a cable/adapter FAQ soon.
Rocky Raccoon
Banned
Does anyone know how to check if the MacBook is stolen when buying from Craigslist?
I saw a website where you can enter serial number, but I forgot what it is.
I saw a website where you can enter serial number, but I forgot what it is.
Yeah, you don't need to resort to cherry-picking quotes when there's plenty of legitimate gripes to be had.
As for the specs thing, Apple has never catered to the hardcore ___ crowd. It's really unforgivable they can't get reasonable updates out for their Mac line, but they have never made gaming machines, they've never made full-size workstations, they've never made "desktop replacement" laptops that have stuff like mobile Xeons in them. And as to the price, it's also an area where Apple plays leapfrog with itself. Take the Mac Pro and the PowerMac—pretty much universally whenever they came out with the newest big revision, like the PCI G4, the G5, the original Intel, the tube design—the Mac was either besting the competition (the old PowerPC models) or built comparably or cheaper than the PCs (the original Mac Pro, and while direct comparisons were harder with the tube, it still held true.) But then subsequent revisions came out and Intel crushed PowerPC, or in recent years Apple has simply never upgraded the tube to be worth the same amount of money. They're self-defeating.
Skel1ingt0n
I can't *believe* these lazy developers keep making file sizes so damn large. Btw, how does technology work?
I get a bit irritated hearing that "these are the best chips Apple has available to them at this time."
That is, indeed, true. Sure.
However, it's frustrating for three reasons, IMO:
1) Apple is one of the largest single laptop suppliers there is, and has been known to get their hands on the newest chips earlier than the competition on the past.
2) Kaby Lake really does sound like it'll be in laptops of this size by early next year. With most not receiving their device until December, anyway... are we going to get burned by a March refresh, or are they going to take their sweet-ass-time updating again?
3) Since they went with Skylake and without Iris Pro, these chips were ready months and months and months ago. What was the hold-up? Yes, I'm sure there's a valid reason... but for what we got, it makes one wonder "what took so long?!"
Ultimately, I think this mass disappointment would have been avoided had they either released them six months ago, or waited four months and gone with Kaby Lake.
That is, indeed, true. Sure.
However, it's frustrating for three reasons, IMO:
1) Apple is one of the largest single laptop suppliers there is, and has been known to get their hands on the newest chips earlier than the competition on the past.
2) Kaby Lake really does sound like it'll be in laptops of this size by early next year. With most not receiving their device until December, anyway... are we going to get burned by a March refresh, or are they going to take their sweet-ass-time updating again?
3) Since they went with Skylake and without Iris Pro, these chips were ready months and months and months ago. What was the hold-up? Yes, I'm sure there's a valid reason... but for what we got, it makes one wonder "what took so long?!"
Ultimately, I think this mass disappointment would have been avoided had they either released them six months ago, or waited four months and gone with Kaby Lake.
Guy LeDouche
Banned
A stolen device would require some form of police records.
You can look up the serial number on Apple's support page. Google Apple serial number lookup and it should be the first result
"Cherry-picking quotes"? Really now? I know you know how link blogs are written so if that's your best response...
ok, what legitimate gripe would you rather discuss then?
Rocky Raccoon
Banned
I realized that the $400 price hike on the Macbook Pro 15 2016, $2399, is the same amount that could've been used to upgrade storage to 512GB SSD and graphics to Radeon Pro 460.
By getting those upgrades on the MBP 15 2016, it's like paying $800 more from $1999.
It sucks being an early adopter.
By getting those upgrades on the MBP 15 2016, it's like paying $800 more from $1999.
It sucks being an early adopter.
Wait, was the original argument that it's positive or negative propaganda? I actually can't follow here. Because I thought the blog pieces linked had a lot of legimate gripes they discussed.
Zeyphersan
Banned
You can use the same one
boneyjangles
Member
There is no mass disappointment. Just a very poor signal to noise ratio. Kaby lake is not ready, 6 Months ago Skylake was probably not available in volume for those specific TDP/configs, so really you are quibbling about a few months at most, which is a perfectly normal lead time.
Yes, they will get Kaby lake at some point next year, possibly even first half of the year. No, you won't be burned by going with Skylake, because Kaby is going to be a very small upgrade. Skylake was the big update, and Kaby Lake, and whatever lake comes after won't be much different.
*Update* on the lead time - after a bit of googling as far as I can see these are some of the first, if not the first laptops to have Skylake 28watt iris 550 chips.
Great to know thank you!
Rocky Raccoon
Banned
How did you get that price? I want that discount.
My cousin works for Apple so he gets a 25% discount
.So, I've been doing my work with a 2012 MBP that I upgraded to 16GB ram a while ago. If I get the upgraded version of the touchpad MBP this year with 16GB ram is that going to really speed up a lot of what I do? How much boost can I expect with Photoshop, Premiere, and Illustrator? I often have all three open at the same time while I'm working and for the most part this machine has been pretty good with it all. Does upgrading the graphics card affect those programs much? I.E. should I try for the 460?
Also, my current MBP doesn't have a flash drive. It has a hybrid with only like 8GB flash I think. I'd be upgrading to the 1TB flash. My current one also isn't retina.
Fuck, I need to start making friends.
Also, my current MBP doesn't have a flash drive. It has a hybrid with only like 8GB flash I think. I'd be upgrading to the 1TB flash. My current one also isn't retina.
My cousin works for Apple so he gets a 25% discount
Fuck, I need to start making friends.
badcrumble
Member
a lot of this seems to be about (justifiable imo) anger that the iMac/Mac mini/Mac pro weren't updated, not about problems with the new MBP per se.
But also, I think the usual caveat to wait (if you can) for the second generation of a new Mac form factor hold up here (Kaby Lake should be a good performance per watt improvement, and I expect we'll see better price points in the next revision). And in the long term it's definitely true that Cook's Apple seems okay with products that are luxury rather than premium (hence the not so stealthy rising price points on Macs and iPads).
Given what we know now, I'm going to say the hold up was probably not Intel at all - it was software support for the touch bar.
Zombie James
Banned
This is sad to read but entirely on the ball and I'm in the same camp as many of these people. Apple really fucked up here and now I'm looking for alternatives.
Rukes
The front page still gets no respect
Judging by the past average, I would assume the Kaby Lake update would be "Mid-2017" and probably be released in July.
Apple is a business. The Holiday Season is coming up. Do you really think Apple would choose to miss out on the opportunity to get more sales of a brand new laptop as holiday gifts, and just release it early 2017?
Skel1ingt0n
I can't *believe* these lazy developers keep making file sizes so damn large. Btw, how does technology work?
I don't disagree with you in the slightest. It makes total sense why they released them now rather than four months from now. Doesn't mean I can't wish they would have come out sooner. Nor does it mean I can't understand why some folks might be disappointed.
schadenfood
Member
Are the new MBPs in stores now? I know they don't ship for a couple more weeks, but I wanted to see one in person before I pulled the trigger.
13" non-touch bar is on display in some places, the touch bar models aren't anywhere that I know of.
Vaio Z had them months and months ago. It's just that very few laptops bother with the 28W chips.
Avallon
Member
According to their website, you can get the no-bar MBP today at Best Buy.
formasymphonic
Member
So early 2017 for Kaby Lake makes a spring launch for new iMacs plausible.
But does anyone know enough about Intel's Xeon roadmap (or previous releases?) to speculate when we could see new Mac Pros? My gut says they'll have an event in March/April-ish for new desktop Macs and new iPads but if anyone could share any input, please do.
But does anyone know enough about Intel's Xeon roadmap (or previous releases?) to speculate when we could see new Mac Pros? My gut says they'll have an event in March/April-ish for new desktop Macs and new iPads but if anyone could share any input, please do.
badcrumble
Member
This got posted on gaming side today:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1304147
Says that the Xeon-class processors will be releasing right around the desktop-class ones. Sounds like a recipe for a spring Mac/iPad event to me, yeah. And, I suppose, they could update the AppleTV if they feel like it (though I don't see why they would need to - nobody's doing anything demanding with it).
I'm definitely hoping that if the desktop Macs get updated all at once, we also get upgraded peripherals (a Touch Bar version of the Magic Keyboard would be nice, and an update to AirPort/Time Capsule would be swell also).
The one that really hit for me was this
For the high end customers the maximum of 16GB of RAM is a huge issue when buying a Pro as a desktop replacement. A maxed out 2012 Pro had 16GB of RAM, if someone expects to have this new Mac for 5 years it will be nearly a decade stuck with the same spec when RAM intensive tasks like 4K video and 3D are set to expand massively.
The lack of ports is a huge inconvenience that should not happen when spending multiple thousands of dollars on a laptop. Even if you can write off the USB-C ports as almost political, to force the adoption of new technology, the Pro should still have been equipped with a SDXC card reader and a HDMI port.
Smiles and Cries
Member
Out for Delivery
Regardless of all the let downs I am getting hyped for my mac
Regardless of all the let downs I am getting hyped for my mac
chronos4590
Member
I think I'm getting the 13 this week. Hopefully. My 2010 MBP barely keeps charge and slugs so much. Shame it's still a decent system. But it's time
Any recommended thunderbolt and USB type c accessories?
Any recommended thunderbolt and USB type c accessories?
formasymphonic
Member
Thanks!
The TVs are Ax based so Apple can release those on their own roadmap. They don't really care about storage for them so I don't see Apple doing anything more with them until they feel like going 4K imo.
On the Mac side though it would be good to see a strong desktop launch at once. Their pricing and desktop GPU options remain to be seen though...
Edit: I'd like to see touch bar on the desktop devices to help incentivise software adoption overall, but nothing like that will happen until we see the e-ink keyboards the rumours are talking about for 2018.
Maybe we'll even get lucky and it will ship with a magic mouse that has a taptic engine?
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