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Heroes of the Storm |OT| Pretty sure that Abathur is AFK

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yea if you let KT walk into your party bush and DWW your whole team then that is pretty fucking stupid.

wat. the whole idea of a party bush is that someone walks close enough for you to kill him.

With flamestrike, the Kaelthas has to both (a) aim the flamestrike and (b) the other team has 1 second to react dodge it. With chain bomb, kaelthas just clicks on two things and deals 6 living bombs worth of damage to 3 heroes.

I can't believe any of you are justifying this stupid change. ignite was far better gameplay than the shit that exists on the PTR
 

Ketch

Member
chain bomb requires you to get much closer, to a team that's clumped on minions, it's only every 12 seconds and it still doesn't do as much damage as a flamestrike with igntie and 5 stacks of GP.
 

Maledict

Member
Because currently on live if he did exactly the same thing it would hit for more damage than it does on test. And everytime a KT picks chain bomb on live we laugh at them for being idiots.

Seriously, I've played on test, and I've watched the streams. The lack of any MMR in matchmaking shows horribly. Kael is getting away with shit that is stupidly bad on live - there's a reason why flamethrower is chosen. For Kael to unleash chain bomb fun he has to be in auto attack range, and people have figured out that Kael in auto attack range is a dead Kael for several months now.

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I think people are hugely overestimating KTs power right now.
 

kirblar

Member
Because currently on live if he did exactly the same thing it would hit for more damage than it does on test. And everytime a KT picks chain bomb on live we laugh at them for being idiots.

Seriously, I've played on test, and I've watched the streams. The lack of any MMR in matchmaking shows horribly. Kael is getting away with shit that is stupidly bad on live - there's a reason why flamethrower is chosen. For Kael to unleash chain bomb fun he has to be in auto attack range, and people have figured out that Kael in auto attack range is a dead Kael for several months now.

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I think people are hugely overestimating KTs power right now.
It at least means the risk-reward is balanced correctly. High damage = up close, low, safe damage = far away.
 
chain bomb requires you to get much closer, to a team that's clumped on minions, it's only every 12 seconds and it still doesn't do as much damage as a flamestrike with igntie and 5 stacks of GP.

okay, but 5 stacks of GP is irrelevant because GP is nerfed anyway.

"having to get closer" is no excuse for one hero being able to instantly deal 6 living bombs worth of damage to heroes that are even less clumped up than they would be to dodge flamestrikes on this current patch.

the Kerrigan .gif is an extreme example obviously. And the interaction with zombie wall makes it unlikely to happen like that often, but the point here is that it is not hard to pull this stuff off whatsoever where you're getting multiple heroes hit with 3-4 living bomb explosions each

Because currently on live if he did exactly the same thing it would hit for more damage than it does on test. And everytime a KT picks chain bomb on live we laugh at them for being idiots.

Seriously, I've played on test, and I've watched the streams. The lack of any MMR in matchmaking shows horribly. Kael is getting away with shit that is stupidly bad on live - there's a reason why flamethrower is chosen. For Kael to unleash chain bomb fun he has to be in auto attack range, and people have figured out that Kael in auto attack range is a dead Kael for several months now.

I'd love to be proven wrong, but I think people are hugely overestimating KTs power right now.

umm... Tempo Storm and C9M have been scrimming each other on the PTR all week. This discussion was started because people were doubting what Zoia and Jake said about Kaelthas on THH, but Zoia made his comments after his team had scrimmed on the PTR.

The difference between chain bomb PTR and ignite on Live is that there's absolutely no counterplay to Kaelthas DWW and it requires you to be absurdly and unrealistically spread out to avoid.

The difference between chain bomb PTR and chain bomb Live is that the 30% increased explosion radius makes it impossible to avoid ridiculous chain bomb combos when fighting for objectives on maps. Are you supposed to just concede sky temple objectives entirely because a kaelthas is nearby? No, that's fucking stupid

I guess Ketch just thinks everyone should just stand 5 miles away from both Kaelthas and their teammates all game because it requires Kael'thas to come closer to you than lobbing Q's from his base like he did with Flamestrike. /facepalm

my point here is that Kael'Thas is EASILY just as strong as he is right now post-16, if not stronger. And he is WAY stronger 1-16. So overall, he's a far better hero who's going to get banned all the time if they don't change that chain bomb interaction because no one wants to deal with having no counterplay to shit. At least with flamestrike you can walk out of the circle.
 
I have solo'd Kael'thas up to nearly 19 and in my experience you can be cautious, try to have good positioning but there are so many heroes and abilities that completely eliminate the safety of your positioning, change your positioning or rapidly close the gap on you. Pre-20, if you catch Kael out of position, he's dead. If Bolt was chosen, he might get away, that depends on your hero and ability picks.

oh nice, new map should be fun...

Interesting would be the word I'd use if what's on the PTR is what's going live on Tuesday. Those Punishers live up to their name.
 

Ketch

Member
have you played it on PTR? because it's not as strong as you think it is.

the counter play is to kill him because he has to walk up to you to cast his shit.

is it strong? yes. Is it stronger then the flamethrower ignite? no. not at all.
 
have you played it on PTR? because it's not as strong as you think it is.

the counter play is to kill him because he has to walk up to you to cast his shit.

is it strong? yes. Is it stronger then the flamethrower ignite? no. not at all.

have you played a PTR game on Sky Temple or Cursed?

I literally played in an inhouse on cursed where the my team party bushed the other team anticipating the other team's move to check our boss and Kaelthas with a Johanna instantly DWW'd 4 heroes to 1/2 health before dying and the rest of his team arrived and cleaned up. If he was casting a flamestrike, people would have, you know, walked out of the circle.
 

Maledict

Member
Like I said, I'm happy to be proven wrong but right now I don't see it. The fact is the new KT does less damage than the old KT with chain bomb - both from the nerf to the talent and the nerf to gathering power. Right *now* he doesn't have an amazing win rate when he can stand half a screen away and nuke your team down, and yet suddenly when he's doing less damage and far closer to you he's suddenly more dangerous?

Happily eat my hat to be wrong. I think he's still good, but he isn't what he currently is at all. Plus there's Jaina who would do more damage than him, faster, and lock down or slow an entire team whilst she does it...

Edit: I thouht they said the map wasn't going love tuesday? There's no way it can go live in its current state...
 

Alur

Member
Edit: I thouht they said the map wasn't going love tuesday? There's no way it can go live in its current state...

I think that remains to be seen for the same reasons that you said Kael's impact remains to be seen - the matchmaking.

After reading around and playing on it and relaying the info to my teammates that you should counterpush and jungle while the punisher is active for the enemy, I never had another game snowball.

At lower levels this will probably be an issue regardless, but I think anyone Plat or above will figure it out eventually much like they did Tomb when it was snowballing on live early. BoE was pretty rough early on too. It's just neither of those was as noticeable because the objective didn't attack heroes.

It's definitely a bit strong either way, though.
 

Milly79

Member
seriously though. let me tell you about nova.

6CpAuJlRo16jhKd9wheIhscHGtvvIbSj_62DecARPmE.jpg
6CpAuJlRo16jhKd9wheIhscHGtvvIbSj_62DecARPmE.jpg
6CpAuJlRo16jhKd9wheIhscHGtvvIbSj_62DecARPmE.jpg
6CpAuJlRo16jhKd9wheIhscHGtvvIbSj_62DecARPmE.jpg
6CpAuJlRo16jhKd9wheIhscHGtvvIbSj_62DecARPmE.jpg
 

Alur

Member
IMO KT sucks and Jaina sucks. Johanna, Muradin and Leoric all suck. Rehgar, Uther and Malfurion are the worst heals in the game. The best specialists are Gazlowe and Marky and anyone who owns a Nexus Charger, Golden Tiger or the anything Wolf related belongs in the Silver league queue they are probably already playing in and that's just my opinion and you can't refute it because it's mine.

EDIT: Also Dragon Shire is a dumb map and Laynor is the greatest hero since John Cena.
 

Milly79

Member
IMO KT sucks and Jaina sucks. Johanna, Muradin and Leoric all suck. Rehgar, Uther and Malfurion are the worst heals in the game. The best specialists are Gazlowe and Marky and anyone who owns a Nexus Charger, Golden Tiger or the anything Wolf related belongs in the Silver league queue they are probably already playing in and that's just my opinion and you can't refute it because it's mine.

EDIT: Also Dragon Shire is a dumb map and Laynor is the greatest hero since John Cena.

8n2HM.gif
 

kirblar

Member
Only 30 seconds on pick/bans unlike 40 in the US. I like it.

edit: No one cares about Kael, which makes sense on ST. That first pick Uther was something else tho.

edit2: HOLY SHIT A TYRAEL/BW PICK COMP

I haven't seen this outside of my one HL comp where we....picked BW with a Tyrael into an Illidan. :p
 

Alur

Member
3rd ranked team behind Liquid and Tempo Storm. I guess this is kind of like Tempo or C9 playing Stellar Lotus.

EDIT: Yohanna lol

EDITx2: Where is Tastosis?
 

Alur

Member
Dat Tyrael BM on Illidan lol.

I like this Snake team. Anybody with a guy named Oreoman is good by me. Best cookie world.
 

kirblar

Member
They were actually winnign those fights- but they let themselves get 2-3 levels down early because they weren't soaking correctly for so much of the time early.
 
Finally tried out Abathur tonight! Soo much fun! I started off with an AI match to get accustomed to the hero, then jumped into QM and went 2-1. In the last match I had some great Stab kills. My favorite of the night: my team's Johanna used Falling Sword to catch Tassadar and Li Li and I hatted her as she landed, then hit W and then Q twice for the kills.

And I hit 10k gold tonight, so now I own Abathur.
 
Dat Tyrael BM on Illidan lol.

I like this Snake team. Anybody with a guy named Oreoman is good by me. Best cookie world.

oreoman's kerrigan is fucking otherworldly. There was a game (game 2 I think) in Snake's first series against DK from the Gold League playoffs on Spider Queen which was super back and forth and he was carrying fucking hard. Can't wait to watch him play her when the new patch rolls around
 

C.Dark.DN

Banned
Played a game after a hiatus, but people don't play the objectives in my mmr. Infuriating. I don't think I will continue playing sadly. Pugging sucks too bad. Sucks that I spent $50 on heroes. Might try out lol, but the learning curb is daunting.
 

Saprol

Member
abathur hats of the storm is cool but it also forces me to focus way more on how my team fights or what lanes/objectives they're ignoring. it felt so much better to just sit in my lane as zagara or brightwing
 

Guesong

Member
Played a game after a hiatus, but people don't play the objectives in my mmr. Infuriating. I don't think I will continue playing sadly. Pugging sucks too bad. Sucks that I spent $50 on heroes. Might try out lol, but the learning curb is daunting.

Even in Hero League?

I mean people might be bad but they generally do the objective in that mode. OFC sometimes you get the random Butcher who too busy hunting down Murky in Sky Temple to come help you, but that is generally not the case.
 
Like I said, I'm happy to be proven wrong but right now I don't see it. The fact is the new KT does less damage than the old KT with chain bomb - both from the nerf to the talent and the nerf to gathering power. Right *now* he doesn't have an amazing win rate when he can stand half a screen away and nuke your team down, and yet suddenly when he's doing less damage and far closer to you he's suddenly more dangerous?

He does the same damage basically but has that stupid instagib potential, slows your team by 50% at level 16, has super speed tornadoes at level 4 so he can go roam, and gets Pyroblast now for team fights.

from what I have seen I think it's pretty much inarguable that his changes are an overall buff
 
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