Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
They should rework stitches to an assassin
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Heroes of the Storm |OT| Pretty sure that Abathur is AFK
- Thread starter Nirolak
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It's happening!
Patching. I purchased him but can't play him yet either...hopefully the patching fixes that.
EDIT: Rexxar in. Hero League change in. Silencer in.
EDIT: Gat damn you version mismatch! y u do dis 2 me
EDIT: @Yoshichan, your Butcher's Beast mount you were worried about is apparently in the store now separately.
Patching. I purchased him but can't play him yet either...hopefully the patching fixes that.
EDIT: Rexxar in. Hero League change in. Silencer in.
EDIT: Gat damn you version mismatch! y u do dis 2 me
EDIT: @Yoshichan, your Butcher's Beast mount you were worried about is apparently in the store now separately.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Yeah it's widespread Dreadnaught has it too atm
jaundicejuice
Member
So what resolves this? I've exited and re-entered the client. Same error. Killed the battle.net.exe in task manager. Same error.
Edit: Killing the Agent.exe as well, seeing if that makes a difference. Nope, same error. Something they've got to resolve on their end I guess?
Edit: Killing the Agent.exe as well, seeing if that makes a difference. Nope, same error. Something they've got to resolve on their end I guess?
It means they haven't updated the current version server-side properly, this is reminiscent of the HS app getting the TGT update too early on Amazon.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Chain bomb now only applies to 3 nearest targets not already under the influence of one.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
?
During the day a lot of my posts are written in segments or while im thinking about something else it's my b, i noticed they are kind of more formal too, like i might read back and something and be like wow i really sound like i care a lot about something here when i dont, not at all
we kno u care bout us bb, u dun haev 2 lie
What else you doing? Thought we were your only ones. D:
jaundicejuice
Member
People will stop complaining about the hero in creep wave deletes but that hurts Chainbomb and his dps. I wonder if people will suddenly view Pyromaniac as being more viable.
Are the selected talent abilities like Arcane Barrier, Clairvoyance, Bolt of the Storm or Arcande Power classified as Basic Abilities? In short, does Pyromaniac's CD reduction apply to those?
The worst match I've played that I've won was an hour and a half long match in Dota 2. The other team had won by minute 50. They controlled the map, they just wouldn't push base for whatever reason despite farming the Aegis of the Immortal multiple times and having a Death Prophet. They just wouldn't push base as a team despite having a better team comp as well as level and farm advantage. They threw the match. I can't even remember why it took so long for my team to claw back. I just remember that I was playing Dazzle, hard support Dazzle and ended up farming a Desolator, Boots of Travel and Necro 3--two expensive carry items and one luxury item--so I could push their core down like some shitty Tinker.
MOBA's are simultaneously the best and worst multiplayer game out there. If you think HotS is somehow unique in this, go install League or Dota 2 and see where the solo queue takes you in those. You just gotta accept if you play solo queue your experience will be all over the map. You can't be too high over the highs and too low over the lows. Even if you play with a few other people, there's always that random element of the other one or two players.
Unless you always queue with a full stack, there's always a random element.
You can keep bitching about random players or you could do something about it. The whole "why don't these QM randoms listen to me!!!1!!!" shtick is getting old though.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Lvl 7 talent gives Rexxar insane waveclear.
Dread's Rexxar analysis was hilarious, he's gonna check them out in QM now, for us EU plebs who can't do so ourselves
http://www.twitch.tv/dreadnaught_heroes
Dread's Rexxar analysis was hilarious, he's gonna check them out in QM now, for us EU plebs who can't do so ourselves
http://www.twitch.tv/dreadnaught_heroes
Dam ofc i care about the ppl, i mean more like it's not like i go into a hots game thinking something like "the role system will surely be bad for hots in the long run and i worry about the way they constantly apply bandages instead of addressing root issues, wow there are 4 squishies on my team"
Idream updated his tierlist btw
Description for kael's lvl 4 is gotlike
Idream updated his tierlist btw
Description for kael's lvl 4 is gotlike
jaundicejuice
Member
This game mode is not available. Blizz plz.
Edit: I'm in. I love that Radiance Bear is a talent in this. Flare and Feign Death as well, awesome.
Edit: I'm in. I love that Radiance Bear is a talent in this. Flare and Feign Death as well, awesome.
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
My experience in LoL (starting 3 weeks ago) has been 10x better so far compared to post-launch HotS. I expected it to blow ass like DOTA2 but it's actually pretty cool. People play LoL like it is LoL, and that is much better than them playing HotS like it's LoL, which is like 80% of the time for me. And I still don't understand why I get people who go "I just started" when I have nearly 1000 games played now. That's fucking absurd. So pretty much I'm content to blame Blizzard for the matching I get as well as the carebear anti-critique-no-matter-how-dumbass-the-decisions attitude among most of the player base.
DOTA2 is shit because it's just shit the whole 9 yards down to the details. If a game isn't even capable of facilitating a good time, that's different from what I'm talking about with a game having everything to be great and then being dragged down. Mind you, the reason I'm so vocal and seem surprised is because I played HotS in alpha and beta and it was a whole different world then, a truly fantastic experience. Things completely went to shit after launch when the floodgates of asshats were opened.
DOTA2 is shit because it's just shit the whole 9 yards down to the details. If a game isn't even capable of facilitating a good time, that's different from what I'm talking about with a game having everything to be great and then being dragged down. Mind you, the reason I'm so vocal and seem surprised is because I played HotS in alpha and beta and it was a whole different world then, a truly fantastic experience. Things completely went to shit after launch when the floodgates of asshats were opened.
After running Rexxar through Try mode, it really feels like he's going to synergize well with Kharazim. They're going to be amazing at chasing due to Misha's charge and Rexxar's Q slow, and Kharazim teleport punches. And in laning combat, Kharazim will be able to teleport back and forth between the two and heal whoever needs it (or if they're close enough together, heal them both in one W).
I'm very excited not to play as Rexxar, but to play alongside and against him.
I'm very excited not to play as Rexxar, but to play alongside and against him.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Dread 1v1'd a Kerrigan and solo'd a garden terror at lvl 5, Misha didn't even lose health she just outhealed it.
Misha can be hatted and UE gets you another
Misha can be hatted and UE gets you another
Yeah Alpha/early Beta were incredible.
The lack of teaching tools is a huge issue and one that is really hurting play experience- everyone knows what a Laynor is yet they don't disappear, because the Laynor thinks its LoL and hasn't been taught otherwise by the client (and they won't listen to other players.).
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
Yes, because when you try to teach them yourself to make up for that, the whole team turns on you because they don't even want friendly advice, they want to do what they want regardless of it losing forts or being completely pointless, or both in one action, such as ignoring defense to grab mercs that they send to die alone (because in LoL you just kill them for bonuses) and spending half their HP doing it so they can waste time going B and arrive just in time to watch the fort blow up and then try a 3v1 to utilize the stat bonuses they didn't get from those mercs and the item they didn't buy in the nonexistent shop.
I really probably shouldn't have started LoL because it just explained too many mysteries to me. *never mounts* *goes B at full HP to change lanes even when everyone is visible* *goes back to minion wave cover instead of finishing off low HP enemy even when not under turret*
It honestly doesn't feel any different to me compared to Alpha/Beta, but I don't touch Hero League, so I don't know if that's a factor. I rarely find my allies to be totally brain-dead, and when I find them to be 'bad', it's usually that they dive/chase too much, things like that.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
the chain bomb change for kael won't affect my playstyle that much. was useful for wave-clearing obviously, but does the change affect it too heavily?
I found people to be really helpful in Alpha.
Aw man I had soooooooooo much fun chain bombing heroes just sitting their damaging towers like a bot and then realize he ded
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
i loved timing the bombing of a tower, then having it spread to all of the minions as they ran past it
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
Indeed. Strategic chatting and teamwork in nearly every game. Analysis of the state of things, consensus on what to try and collective application, cheers when it worked and more analysis and courteous consolation when it failed. I'm okay with people being unskilled or not "getting" the game. The problem is the apathy and antisocial attitude so dominant anymore. Why even play a team game if you'll be like that?
Answer: Because in LoL you can be a self-centered asshole and still carry a team sometimes, and they haven't figured out this isn't LoL yet.
This is pretty damn awesome. We tried it out a few ago.
Orochinagis
Member
I dont understand why every new warrior have a lane clear now, making the specialists disappear since they cant fight back or push. the warrior can just simply jump there clear the minions wave in seconds and destroy the forts by himself, pushing away the specialist in that lane
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
???
Sylvanas, Nazeebo, Murky, and Zagara are beast mode specialists who can 1v1 any Warrior. Azmodan doesn't have much fight power but has a hell of a lot of tank and a warrior won't easily clear all he can put out. Hammer isn't too good at solo offense but I don't know how anyone could solo a tower she is behind.
jaundicejuice
Member
There was a slight dip when HotS went from closed to open beta and then actual release but we must have played a different Alpha and Beta because the halcyon days of HotS look pretty much the same as present day HotS from my view point. You could have a few more slightly better games in Quick Match. Beyond that, it's more or less the same.
Are you constantly solo queuing? Are you just playing Quick Match? Are you playing Hero League? How are you getting paired with all of these awful players that don't know their own ass from a hole in the ground and are so clearly worse than you.
Also how do people not play HotS like it's HotS, I don't even understand that remark. There's no farming, there's no gold, no items, laning is different, vision is handled differently, neutrals are handled differently, there's different maps, there's shifting objectives, there's no real hard meta about laning assignments and people are still figuring out hero counters, although this is always changing with new maps being added. I think some of the terminology some people sometimes use is from League. I use Dota terms while I play HotS simply because it's ingrained after years of playing but that doesn't mean I play HotS like it's Dota.
I guarantee you the same things will happen in League that happened for you in Dota 2 an Heroes of the Storm. You can't constantly play with random people and just expect everyone to gel all the time. And I don't get how Blizzard is care bear'ing HotS's player base when the only difference between LoL, Dota 2 and HotS is the lack of in-game voice chat. Every one of thes games has a reporting system, if you act like an asshole, people will report you, each has their own set of consequences. LoL has its tribunal, Dota 2 has Low-Priority Queue and HotS, oddly enough, has Silencer.
What is your MMR on hotslogs? No troll, I just suspect you're pretty high and just aren't seeing these things any more. Teammates refusing to leave lane for objectives because they're choosing to play LOL is a real thing that people experience, but you can definitely MMR your way away from it.
All those liquid things you mention are things that many players have 0 idea about because they're not taught in-game, and playing with players who don't comprehend the macro-level strategy of the game is incredibly frustrating.
ok time to write something, it's fun to think these things out, uhhh don't read it cuz it's long
so first off, mandatory meta is a ridiculous way to put what I really meant, which is just a standard meta, and also rather than it happening "organically" I just mean more community driven rather than mother company enforced/led
first disclaimer: I play mainly qm so I don't know if lane assignments have become a thing in draft games, but working off of certain information (like reddit, casting, thread posts, yeh small sample size that might not be indicative of the larger population but I feel like it is) I'm fairly certain that lane assignments are not a fully established idea for a lot of ppl, nor is it given much value when comp building in HL, could be totally wrong tho
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anyway here are two examples of thinking that I'm working with here, there's a lot of other examples that I'm not linking: https://www.reddit.com/r/heroesofth.../tassadar_is_not_a_troll_pick_at_least_in_hl/
and then some other thread where someone talks about why tass is a good soloer for mines I think it was like carlos llama or something
in the first example you see really role specific considerations, ppl saying shit like don't pick tassadar unless you have another support, tassadar should be a specialist, whatever, and in the second example you see kit specific considerations for map-specific strategy. I like the latter as a topic better, and as a facet of the game I wished the community would focus on, but I'll get back to that
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ok yeah so I'm not going to go through a bunch of drafts that were casted, but in my experience what we usually receive is kind of reddity on the outside (that is, seemingly different than what the teams actually care about) draft considerations. things like "what role needs to be filled" or "what op hero is left open". it's not rare at all that casters miss the boat when predicting a pick.
not that I think that's a bad thing necessarily, and I find that the draft casting gets better sometimes later during the tournaments or during bo5s, but not really something you can count on in general
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but on to lane assignments...I think most of us have encountered this to a certain extent, though we havent really thought out why certain things are the way they are too deeply. like we're probably all knowledgeable about things like 4-1 on mines, sky temple, and booty bay, and maybe some of us partake in 1-1-3 on cursed hallow, or 1-4 on dshire (dread's guide here: https://tempostorm.com/heroes-of-the-storm/guides/how-to-play-dragonshire-like-the-pros), though I find this more rare. and usually we'll send someone like zagara bot in booty bay (another way role negatively affects gameplay; many ppl have taken this to mean that specialist should go bot).
I probably don't really need to get into why it's good to have 4 ppl in a lane in a 2 lane situation
uhm let me say something about lane assignments in the context of league and dota. it's about maximizing value, nothing else (and this is pretty much what all mobas are about). in league you get 1 top, 1 jungle, 1 mid, 2 bot, w/ particular archetypes in each lane, in dota it's a little more fluid but the goal is the same. this is a really general way of distributing resources to maximize value. pros in general don't follow this, this exists as a meta at large, though I would say it's easier to follow dota pro strats than it is to follow league pro strats (I will get into this when I get back to the influence of roles).
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in league this lane arrangement, like hots, is because of the map. league has an early objective that spawns around 5:00, and thus you want more ppl around there. in dota you got a short lane and a long lane, which also affects lane assignment
dread's lane assignment in the dshire guide has similar considerations: mid-bottom has an area that greatly benefits from control, the map objective is not strong at all early on, there is no reason to hold both shrines since it breaks the concentration of power you get from stacking for heroes and it's not valuable, etc. basically, lanes in hots are just as much about maximizing value towards their own specific map.
this ofc gets more complicated since hots moves fast and you can mount and shit and the maps are small. for example, in booty bay yall make the call to place a badass 1v1 hero because you are throwing 4 up top for the fast waveclear, vision control, and to put the most pressure you can on those 2 little dudes and the chest. by putting a badass 1v1er at bot you are upping your chances to win both chests. but lo and behold the other team doesnt think theyll win 4v4 up top so they send zera to gank zagara at bot and receive a free chest. so yeah there are considerations (but this also goes towards the idea that zagara as a hero is good in a standard condition, which is the next thing I want to think about).
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ok I mean yeah map specific lane assignments arent that hard to figure out, but here is where most ppl stop their brain, or at least dont really talk about this stuff out loud or on tournament casts and reddit and whatever (in fact, I don't recall that much talk about lane distribution either, but I'd probably believe it if someone told me that they do a lot, plus I kind of have conditioned myself to tune out most of the casting so I'm not really reliable here)
what is really lacking is hero kit specific considerations. like in the booty bay example I gave, if zagara goes up for the chest, she will absolutely die if zeratul shows up. this is a subpar hero choice. on the other hand, let's say you put anub or leoric down there; they are both good duelers/laners, but they allllso have a free escape, u feel me?
I don't think I've ever seen a caster describe why tempo storm put anub top in dshire or zeratul bot/laning in spiderland. whenever I see ppl on streams start all 5 at mid on some maps, all I hear is wooow so wacky, I've never seen this before; nothing about how that wave meets first and you can clear it, making a powerplay on a lane that has less ppl.
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imo, the role-centric way of thinking in this game contributes a great deal to this (other important factors: new game, small pool of heroes, mouthpieces for the game who, while doing a great job (especially for basically diy ppls), do not have access to high level experience or insight (compare a league stream to a hots stream) etc.). like besides providing an avenue of blame (doh we have no warrior and they do, this game is lost), it wraps up teambuilding in this idea of best-in-slot role fulfilling.
in league it's similar (though less so), and in dota it's even more rare.
I talked a little about standard lane assignments in league (which pro players rarely participate in these days), which is mainly about maximizing value (here it's getting the most experience and map control). there are hero archetypes for each lane too, again about maximizing value, putting gold onto ppl who need it the most, putting less gold on ppl who can do without, putting those two together, putting safer self-sustaining heroes at top which is a longer lane than mid, putting ppl who need a lot of both exp. and gold at the shorter mid lane). these lane assignments exists from the top down (excluding new players) despite ppl not really being in tune w/ why it's like this. <-----this is what I mean about meta developments through a consideration of lane assignments.
oh an important thing I forgot to mention; each hero in league is assigned a supposed lane/role upon release, it's not rare at all that what Riot plans out for the hero is completely wrong tho, and usually they end up placed in better lanes.
in dota it's more free, icefrog just throws you some shit and is like why dont you figure it out yourselves you idiots
in hots however, laning is pretty much like whatever, ideas behind lane assignments are loosely understood, and ppl focus almost completely on teamfight comps. this isn't a bad thing and is appropriate to the game to a certain extent but it's a little contradictory. because maps are small and mobility is given to everyone, it makes sense to think about teamfight a lot (and here you get requisite yo lets get a warrior a healer and some other shit, which is the best way to throw two teams into each other repeatedly). but at the same time the race to power spikes in this game is even more important because of this (and not coincidentally, a lot of these spikes occur during objective spawning), so you it's not rare at all to see teams so into fulfilling teamfighting roles that they just get run over early game and never make it to how they imagined their fights would go. and of course, yeah you don't have to run your team into the other team.
there exists good ways to play the game, but what I usually see (mebbe it's just the more vocal, i dunno) are complaints that are molded by the way the game suggests things; because special map objectives are shiny and ppl announce it all mysteriously ppl are drawn to them like moths, because roles are a standardized thing (with hero development being more about how can we make this hero fit this role rather than how can we make an interesting hero), because merc camps make a ding when you capture them, like the list goes on.
I think having lane assignments and explanations in the public by casters or more guides like dread's dshire guide would help the community a lot, especially since ideas are often taken wholesale from explanations on stream or tier lists or guides. when you have someone thinking about how tassadar is unique in his ability to hold a single lane on mines, or how sylvanas completely shifts the opportunities a team can take, vs. like man tassadar is really not a great healer guys plus his winslow, you just get a more thoughtful game, and like it's all there already the game is pretty good
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9BNoNFKCBI
Pyros_Eien
Member
Pretty sure he means Leoric and to an extent Johanna just riding into a wave, using one skill(two for johanna) and killing everything then riding off. You can't really punish them cause you're doing chip dmg and they can heal/shield it up, and they don't even have to stay in the lane either and demolish your push near instantly, for a very low mana cost.
It does make the role kinda redundant when so many non specialists can push easily. I guess the advantage is on the amount of damage you can apply to buildings and the ability to tank tower shots while doing so, but it's a bit weird design to give such good wave clear for such small costs to non specialists, I guess.
most specialists have pretty booty waveclear or have to talent into it tho
waveclear isn't role-specific, but the reason ppl point it out on leoric and johanna is because they have a lot of things packed into their kit already and waveclear is kind of overkill
etc. used to have pretty decent waveclear but not on the level of those two, and idream's anub build talents into it as well
waveclear isn't role-specific, but the reason ppl point it out on leoric and johanna is because they have a lot of things packed into their kit already and waveclear is kind of overkill
etc. used to have pretty decent waveclear but not on the level of those two, and idream's anub build talents into it as well
Orochinagis
Member
Feels like a specialist for me,like warrior version of Kaelthas with the positioning to land CCs and destroy key elements yet pretty risky since Misha's W is his only way to escape and he is slow to run away on his own.
You can make him run faster at the cost of making Misha more vulnerable
Yeah, sorry If I didnt explain like that, thats my main concern with the recent warriors. their lane clearing and mercs pretty fast with zero risk and at all with just one skill for that designed for wave clearing.
Or Leorics healings by killing minions and his Q skill
So, it might be not sleeping for ages speaking but to sum up my experience with Rexxar -
I've never played a less fun Hero in the game. It's by far and away the most disappointing, weird, awkward hero I've ever played. Zero fun for me on a personal level .Possibility it could be strong power wise, but the fun factor is practically non-existent for me.
Maybe I'll feel differently after sleep.
I've never played a less fun Hero in the game. It's by far and away the most disappointing, weird, awkward hero I've ever played. Zero fun for me on a personal level .Possibility it could be strong power wise, but the fun factor is practically non-existent for me.
Maybe I'll feel differently after sleep.
chu is playing it here if you want to check it out: http://www.twitch.tv/chu8
No kidding. I got pumped when I saw there was a radiance talent for the bear, but without the ability to move it around manually it's kind of underwhelming. I hope they just patch this stupid stance mechanic out and make the D button control the Bear WE or Ultralisk style.
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