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Heroes of the Storm |OT2| Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery
- Thread starter Nirolak
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khadgar tbh, needs to be in the game so I can finally kill him for what he put me through getting my ring
jaundicejuice
Member
Making all three of the mages problematic and overpowered sounds un-fun. Unless they start adding heroes that legitimately counter them with abilities like...
- Ranged mana burn nuke
- Passive mana burn tied to auto-attack that has increasing damage as mana decreases
- Magic Ward that redirects damage from spells back at caster
- Astral Imprisonment that removes units from battle for a few seconds and adds a debuff to casting for a few seconds afterwards.
Malygos would be a pretty good lore candiate...
- Ranged mana burn nuke
- Passive mana burn tied to auto-attack that has increasing damage as mana decreases
- Magic Ward that redirects damage from spells back at caster
- Astral Imprisonment that removes units from battle for a few seconds and adds a debuff to casting for a few seconds afterwards.
Malygos would be a pretty good lore candiate...
How about a support with a silence as a basic ability? Something like bone prison or hammer of justice that's like a 1.5 sec silence?
Here my wish list of things:
Hero that can move above/through terrain freely, some kind of flying or ghost like ability.
Hero with global skill shot (like tyrande but different some how)
Another stealth hero that's not a burst assassin. Or just has like 3 seconds of stealth as their w or something.
Hero that can reposition allies... Like push them forward, pull them back, or swap places.
Hero that only buffs/debuffs... Like if rehgar had other totems besides earth grasp, like spell power totem or hunters mark totem.
What do you guys want to see?
Here my wish list of things:
Hero that can move above/through terrain freely, some kind of flying or ghost like ability.
Hero with global skill shot (like tyrande but different some how)
Another stealth hero that's not a burst assassin. Or just has like 3 seconds of stealth as their w or something.
Hero that can reposition allies... Like push them forward, pull them back, or swap places.
Hero that only buffs/debuffs... Like if rehgar had other totems besides earth grasp, like spell power totem or hunters mark totem.
What do you guys want to see?
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Imagine Uther with stealth that would be a pain to play against.
Also, how about we continue looking down on those players playing at the same MMR as you, Mr. Infallible Pro Players?
Guess where you're gonna find new talent and possibly even some new strats at? On the ladder. Guess where you'll git gud? On the ladder with extra practice.
It disgusts me that the NA pros and THH people look down on non-pro players with such contempt. It's very hard for me to believe that these dudes (the ones who play HL, at any rate) don't run into two or three people a week who could be a pro in HOTS where the competitive pool is very shallow and features copious amounts of bottom to mid tier retreads. That doesn't mean that they will be due to time constraints, personality issues, or whatever, but there are people there with the skill necessary or who have the raw skill that could be molded.
I know it's mostly just their version of our "everyone on my team sucks and that Hammer picked a dumb build and stayed in siege all game and threw", but still. Seriously. Play the fucking game like EU and Korea does. Get over yourselves. You're good, but you're not great. Practice, get great. Maybe learn something and possibly find some new blood.
EDIT: And, as we've said a bunch, their experience would all be better if they'd all just commit to playing it like the other regions.
Guess where you're gonna find new talent and possibly even some new strats at? On the ladder. Guess where you'll git gud? On the ladder with extra practice.
It disgusts me that the NA pros and THH people look down on non-pro players with such contempt. It's very hard for me to believe that these dudes (the ones who play HL, at any rate) don't run into two or three people a week who could be a pro in HOTS where the competitive pool is very shallow and features copious amounts of bottom to mid tier retreads. That doesn't mean that they will be due to time constraints, personality issues, or whatever, but there are people there with the skill necessary or who have the raw skill that could be molded.
I know it's mostly just their version of our "everyone on my team sucks and that Hammer picked a dumb build and stayed in siege all game and threw", but still. Seriously. Play the fucking game like EU and Korea does. Get over yourselves. You're good, but you're not great. Practice, get great. Maybe learn something and possibly find some new blood.
EDIT: And, as we've said a bunch, their experience would all be better if they'd all just commit to playing it like the other regions.
Two things about this and i dont really have anything new to contribute but
1. Playing against bad players will deteriorate your skill and condition u poorly, i feel this argument, so i mean if this game iz your bread and butter i understand that slogging through hl to improve the hl experience in the long run might not be your bag
2. This sounds kind of contradictory but a lot of pros are too focused on playing as a team. While hl does promote bad habits it is still a good place to practice shit, like mcintyre has been doing with his role swap. At the same time, i feel like a lot of pros might have experiences where they have been burned by this, because of how bad hl is in na, and had stuff work out purely because they were playing w/ bad players, at least thats how it feels
3. In na there was a thing called sel that was a closed scrim thing that was a disaster because there werent enough good players and bad ppl kept getting vouched in. Like hl this is a thing that would take investment to get to what pro players want out of it (giving worse players practice so they could reach a point where the roster skill in sel was actually consistent and the games were good), but for some reason ppl in na are in this san francisco rush.
I think ppl like mcintyre who use hl for a specific reason are on the right track, but i feel like a lot of ppl are just waiting for grandmasters to draw good players to the top in na because they cant afford to spam 100 tryhard hl games.
1. Playing against bad players will deteriorate your skill and condition u poorly, i feel this argument, so i mean if this game iz your bread and butter i understand that slogging through hl to improve the hl experience in the long run might not be your bag
2. This sounds kind of contradictory but a lot of pros are too focused on playing as a team. While hl does promote bad habits it is still a good place to practice shit, like mcintyre has been doing with his role swap. At the same time, i feel like a lot of pros might have experiences where they have been burned by this, because of how bad hl is in na, and had stuff work out purely because they were playing w/ bad players, at least thats how it feels
3. In na there was a thing called sel that was a closed scrim thing that was a disaster because there werent enough good players and bad ppl kept getting vouched in. Like hl this is a thing that would take investment to get to what pro players want out of it (giving worse players practice so they could reach a point where the roster skill in sel was actually consistent and the games were good), but for some reason ppl in na are in this san francisco rush.
I think ppl like mcintyre who use hl for a specific reason are on the right track, but i feel like a lot of ppl are just waiting for grandmasters to draw good players to the top in na because they cant afford to spam 100 tryhard hl games.
There's a thing called pros playing the game as it is and meeting up with other pros, which they hardly do in NA. That's why you actually have people like Chu and Mewn who are skilled players, but have it pretty easy considering they don't face all that tough of opponents because NA is too focused on calling everyone shitty if they aren't on a pro team.
It's a shitty practice, and quite frankly it will lead to them being worse overall, which sucks. If you want to be the top team, you gotta play, plain and simple.
Whine for bans. Get bans. "NA is still shit". GG.
It's a shitty practice, and quite frankly it will lead to them being worse overall, which sucks. If you want to be the top team, you gotta play, plain and simple.
Whine for bans. Get bans. "NA is still shit". GG.
yeah I was thinking maybe ppl would tryhard for the rank but in general it doesnt seem like na is very good at this game
well at least until money comes thru
I feel you on your points, but I would argue SEL wasn't ruined because lesser skilled players were let in. It was ruined because those players simply cannot get along with each other in an environment that involves players from each team being on opposing teams. One game you face 3 from C9, the next 2 of your teammates are drafted to the enemy and you get two dudes from The Pleyz or whatever.
Basically, SEL devolved into them bitching about who got the worse player(s), even though 9 out of 10 players in the league were current pros, former pros, or pro adjacent. They expected to win every game. Not in the way you set out to win every game, they expected to be like "I'm the dope shit dawg watch me carry" and they quickly realize without their team behind them they can't do that. So...it was exactly like hero league. Sometimes you win the draft and the matchmaking, sometimes you don't. NA pros just can't stand that there is RNG/variance in matchmaking in a moba, but it's the same way in every moba to a larger or smaller degree.
I maintain that the skill gap between a lot of these players is minimal, if there is any at all for the vast majority of pros in NA who aren't on the top two or three teams. The good teams are good because three or four minimal gaps in skill (or the occasional measurable gap or two) add up. Throw in the teams with better players often having better shotcalling and confidence in their team and that leads to victory.
You keep saying NA, or the population in general isn't very good at the game and I don't buy that shit man. Of course 90% of players or so aren't even in Diamond, but that's probably the case in other MOBAs as well. Naturally, everyone will get better over time. Late adopters from other MOBAs will also theoretically up the skill pool. But having shitters in grandmaster or shitters in rank 1 or whatever isn't because the skill level is low, it's because it's a game that (like most games) can be bullrushed by taking the path of least resistance (OP heroes, exploiting group numbers, queueing at specific times, etc) for people who are willing to do that. Even those people aren't "bad", they are just worse than someone who used variety to get there and took their time to stop and learn.
yeah I'm just echoing hearsay stuff I dunno why it actually goes down, things I hear range from poor games to nepotism to admins being too thirsty w/ power, but the main recurring thing is that the games were bad and not better than hl
i dont mean bad disparagingly just like relatively not good at the game. I havent really thought about ways to game yourself up ranks, like that thought hadnt occurred to me until just now, but that doesnt seem too exploitable atm, esp. after they took away grouped hl. but yeah I mean outside of a couple of teams I don't think na is very good at this game, but it's all based on anecdotal things like being considered a "master" when I suk, pros repeating it over and over, and so on, maybe there is some hot yung contingent within hl that needs to be revealed somehow I dunno
i dont mean bad disparagingly just like relatively not good at the game. I havent really thought about ways to game yourself up ranks, like that thought hadnt occurred to me until just now, but that doesnt seem too exploitable atm, esp. after they took away grouped hl. but yeah I mean outside of a couple of teams I don't think na is very good at this game, but it's all based on anecdotal things like being considered a "master" when I suk, pros repeating it over and over, and so on, maybe there is some hot yung contingent within hl that needs to be revealed somehow I dunno
NA pros in general just wanna win and make money and be all-stars. It's been that way since we started following the first tiny flame of the scene in 2014. That's why we've always had like 1/3rd of the pro teams of EU for qualifiers. It's gotta be straight to the top or nothing here
The games are shit because they expect Regionals/Globals style team coordination from a bunch of randoms which isn't going to happen, even in SEL where most randoms were pros and they were all on comms. Basically, they've forgotten what it was like to be a regular player, and are unwilling to be one again even to their own detriment.
I don't think playing lower MMR/worse players is bad practice for them, either. The story coming out of Korea was how those dudes would sit in AI and try mode just practicing combos and auto attacks to work on mechanics. If random NA pro can't learn the same thing from facing a 3700 pleb on the ladder that seems like more of an issue for the pro than the pleb to me. As pros, they should be able to recognize themselves falling into bad habits and prevent them...it is supposed to be practice, after all.
The games are shit because they expect Regionals/Globals style team coordination from a bunch of randoms which isn't going to happen, even in SEL where most randoms were pros and they were all on comms. Basically, they've forgotten what it was like to be a regular player, and are unwilling to be one again even to their own detriment.
I don't think playing lower MMR/worse players is bad practice for them, either. The story coming out of Korea was how those dudes would sit in AI and try mode just practicing combos and auto attacks to work on mechanics. If random NA pro can't learn the same thing from facing a 3700 pleb on the ladder that seems like more of an issue for the pro than the pleb to me. As pros, they should be able to recognize themselves falling into bad habits and prevent them...it is supposed to be practice, after all.
I think stuff like mac trying to get back into the groove and using hl to do that is pretty good
but I def think the games are shit because they are shit
agree w/ there being like a whole slew of things to get better at in these type of environments
I don't really think there is a good excuse for them not to use what's in front of them unless they noticed themselves getting worse and not playing cauterizes this somehow
but I def think the games are shit because they are shit
agree w/ there being like a whole slew of things to get better at in these type of environments
I don't really think there is a good excuse for them not to use what's in front of them unless they noticed themselves getting worse and not playing cauterizes this somehow
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
What happened to this thread, always getting heated.
stop being so edgy smhi disagree that im disagreeing
I don't know if anything will help NA beat korea in Esports. But if they actually played HL then the quality of matches would go up. You already see it when fan/mac/glau/bige/cattle/other pros get matched against each other.
The problem is not enough of them que to get good games conistently... mostly because there's not that many to begin with but whateves.
Happens in Dota aswell, pros play match making, get matched with other pros and a few random shit lords. and then they just flame the shit lords, feed intentionally and BM in all chat.
Dota really is the worst.
gust or bust vs c9: https://www.twitch.tv/jhow4444
gust or bust up 1-0 in a bo3 and they have illidan against c9 solo support tassadar
dang HotS team is over 150 people now, last I heard it was around 100 no?
https://twitter.com/DustinBrowder/status/720409049829810176
https://twitter.com/DustinBrowder/status/720409049829810176
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
lol both C9 and NVT down a game.
Seeing pros actually dodge Li Ming's shit feels good.
Seeing pros actually dodge Li Ming's shit feels good.
I imagine they see pretty big growth potential for this game. The team may also downsize again at some point once they have everything smooth sailing. For now they reallllly need to get the new HL ranking and season 1 out. It's almost embarrassing how long it is taking it to come out at this point.
And they're still hiring. Game is making bank.
Holy shit a Dehaka/BW gank comp.
Don't tell Alur.
there was this bad ass flank right before the 2nd shrine phase. where thrall sunders from like behind nvt's mid wall and they poly wipe falstad instantly
it was pretty sick.
also. invernum/bababooey > jake/anybody
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