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[OokieSpookie]

I was somewhat, but the fact that you guys can't wrap your heads around a very simple concept is puzzling me. I mean some of you think DD will never become a reality. WOW. :lol

:lol Nobody doubts that it will become a reality.
Amazon does it, Netflix does it, Blockbuster will be doing it, Apple, Microsoft, Sony, Vongo and countless others do it.
Will it replace hard media or even become a viable competition, no it will not at least not for five-ten years.

 

[KachoMakura]

:lol Nobody doubts that it will become a reality.
Amazon does it, Netflix does it, Blockbuster will be doing it, Apple, Microsoft, Sony, Vongo and countless others do it.
Will it replace hard media or even become a viable competition, no it will not at least not for five-ten years.

Well we're on the same page then. I don't think it'll be anytime soon, but as time goes on it will get increasingly popular. I'd say about 5 years it should be mainstream and a very viable means of distribution.

 

[maynerd]

God I hate double dipping within six months.

Will this be out on HD DVD on Nov 27 too?

Fing Universal. Why wasn't this out on day one? Bah.

http://www.horror-movies.ca/horror_9156.html

Disc 1: Main Feature

* Anamorphic Widescreen Presentation
* English, French and Spanish DD5.1 EX Surround
* English SDH, French and Spanish subtitles
* Feature Commentary with Simon Pegg & Edgar Wright
* Feature Commentary with The Sandford Police Service - Simon Pegg, Nick Frost, Jim Broadbent, Rafe Spall, Kevin Eldon & Olivia Colman
* Feature Commentary with The Sandford Village People - Kenneth Cranham, Timothy Dalton, Paul Freeman & Edward Woodwar
* Feature Commentary with The Real Fuzz - Any Leafe & Nick Eckland
* Feature Commentary with Edgar Wright & Guest
* Outtakes
* Storyboards
* Fuzz-O-Meter (Trivia Track)
* Inadmissible: Deleted Scenes
* Fuzz-O-Meter
* Danny's Notebook
* Hot Funk
* Theatrical Trailer
* UK TV Spot 1
* UK TV Spot 2
* Director's Cut Trailer


Disc 2: Extra Features

* We Made Hot Fuzz
* Art Department
* Friends & Family
* Cranks, Cranes & Controlled Chaos
* Here Come the Fuzz
* Return to Sandford
* Edgar & Simon's Flip Chart
* Simon Muggs
* Sergeant Fisher's Perfect Sunday
* Plot Holes
* Special Effects: Before & After
* Video Blogs
* Poster Gallery
* Photo Gallery
* AM Blam: Making 'Dead Right'
* Dead Right (1993)
* Edgar Wright Director's Commentary on Dead Right
* Simon Pegg and Nick Frost Commentary on Dead Right


Disc 3: Extra Features

* The Extended Fuzzball Rally
* Video Blogs

Man I'm glad I didn't buy this movie. Lookin forward to this release.

 

[Aaron]

God I hate double dipping within six months.

Will this be out on HD DVD on Nov 27 too?

99% of that is already in the HD-DVD version. The only thing new I noticed was the commentary Edgar Wright + Guest. Might be a couple of new small features, but the disc was overloaded as it was.

PS - The DVD version of the movie really looks like shit when you've seen it in HD. So much of the detail is just plain fuzzed out.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

dunno if anyone has posted this, but I'm trying to find a link.

Apparently Toshiba just demoed a 51GB Triple Layer HD DVD at CEDIA.

Do you think Sony's answer will be a tri layer 75GB BD?

Clearly 75 would be far too much for movies, but great for games.

 

[YYZ]

from what we've seen of games on blu-ray made for blu-ray, the developers use up the space. I think they will find ways to use the space.

Is there any slight delay when switching between layers? I've heard possibilities of a maximum of 8 layers on BD, 4 on each side; which gives 200GB.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

from what we've seen of games on blu-ray made for blu-ray, the developers use up the space. I think they will find ways to use the space.

Is there any slight delay when switching between layers? I've heard possibilities of a maximum of 8 layers on BD, 4 on each side; which gives 200GB.

not sure. I just got told, I'm trying to find links/info

 

[Xater]

Yesterday I watched Bourne Ultimatum. The movie was fucking awesome!

If one movie will get me to buy a HD DVD playe rnext year it's this movie and not Transformers.

I am seriously in love with the camera works in the third Bourne.

 

[Oni Jazar]

from what we've seen of games on blu-ray made for blu-ray, the developers use up the space. I think they will find ways to use the space.

Is there any slight delay when switching between layers? I've heard possibilities of a maximum of 8 layers on BD, 4 on each side; which gives 200GB.

There is no delay for the dual layers at least. Players now are capable enough of buffering the data so a layer change is not noticable.

 

[VanMardigan]

Black Snake Moan was a terrific looking disc, for sure. It had sun baked scenes that looked very very vibrant in HD.

 

[Rabid Wolverine]

Apparently Toshiba just demoed a 51GB Triple Layer HD DVD at CEDIA.

Are the current players along with the 360 HD-DVD going to be able to read the Triple Layer Discs?

 

[Brimstone]

The specs on the 51GB are more than an additional disc recording layer. The spindle speed is also increased, so higher bit rates are possible. If I recall correctly the disc can spin faster than Blu-Ray.


But this isn't confirmed.

 

[VanMardigan]

Are the current players along with the 360 HD-DVD going to be able to read the Triple Layer Discs?

Testing is still being done, but Amir pretty much stated that if the discs aren't compatible, they would have no use for movie playback.

 

[theBishop]

dunno if anyone has posted this, but I'm trying to find a link.

Apparently Toshiba just demoed a 51GB Triple Layer HD DVD at CEDIA.

Do you think Sony's answer will be a tri layer 75GB BD?

Clearly 75 would be far too much for movies, but great for games.

My understanding was that Blu-Ray was designed for expanding layers, up to 200GB. (according to the Blu-ray FAQ). HD-DVD's spec only calls for Dual-layer and anything beyond that risks breaking compatibility. Of course, I'm sure someone on "the other side" will have something to say about it.

 

[SRG01]

I was somewhat, but the fact that you guys can't wrap your heads around a very simple concept is puzzling me. I mean some of you think DD will never become a reality. WOW. :lol

...

Okay, Telecommunications 101!

Back in the early 90s, the US government had the great idea of wiring up the whole country to a high speed fiberoptic backbone. If you were even remotely technologically aware during this era, you would recall the various companies touting high-speed data transfer and content on demand. One of the biggest selling points was the use of interactivity by television companies; box-top sets can stream games, get movies, and so forth.

So the government basically left funding to the states and let them sort out individual contracts with the various telecom companies for the needed infrastructure. However, the companies quickly realized how hard this task would be. In short, most companies decided on the ADSL specification over twisted copper pair (ie. phone line) and billions of infrastructure money disappeared with little to show for it since ADSL was several times slower than the original high-speed spec.

To date, ADSL is now the defacto broadband standard if you are a typical residential customer and is unlikely to improve over the next few years. Why? Because the implementation of ADSL is cheap, easy, and extremely profitable for the telecom companies compared to hooking up special wiring for every household. As the years go by, you'll see companies putting more restrictions on the consumer, such as data transfer caps and tiered service levels at ridiculous prices.

Reddit used to have a link to a really good article explaining this whole fiasco, but unfortunately, reddit has a really bad search engine.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

So, where are the Nielsen numbers? I'm curious to see of HD-DVD overtook BluRay with the release of Blades of Glory.

 

[Petrarca]

So, where are the Nielsen numbers? I'm curious to see of HD-DVD overtook BluRay with the release of Blades of Glory.

HD-DVD got Heroes and Blades of Glory and Post-Paramount announcement, I'd be laughing my ass off if they don't win this round

 

[Argyle]

The specs on the 51GB are more than an additional disc recording layer. The spindle speed is also increased, so higher bit rates are possible. If I recall correctly the disc can spin faster than Blu-Ray.


But this isn't confirmed.

On the other hand, as far as backwards compatibility is concerned, the extra layer MIGHT work if they built their optical pickup to be really robust (given that one of the main selling points of HD DVD is how cheap the pickups are compared to Blu-ray, it's possible but the fact that this tech is moving so slow with really only one company to approve it makes me think this is not working on old players)...

...but the extra data rate is really, really unlikely to work on old players, unless you think that Toshiba gave everyone free 2x spin rate drives? Higher bit rates? What about all the decoder chips that thought they only had to do 30mbps video? I'm pretty sure that even if this tech sees the light of day, they will either have the same bandwidth caps as before, or you're looking at obsoleting all existing players in a manner far worse than the HD DVD "Blu-ray players are obsolete because of BD-Live/Profile 1.1" talking point (at least the old players can play the main feature!)

Honestly the bandwidth cap is a bigger limitation than the capacity, so I think the TL discs don't really address the problem.

 

[gkryhewy]

HD-DVD got Heroes and Blades of Glory and Post-Paramount announcement, I'd be laughing my ass off if they don't win this round

Yes, I know that personally I immediately ordered five copies of Terminator 3 in my excitement after the Paramount announcement. As always, you make good sense.

 

[VanMardigan]

HD-DVD got Heroes and Blades of Glory and Post-Paramount announcement, I'd be laughing my ass off if they don't win this round

Prepare to laugh. I don't think all those Ps3 units stopped working all of a sudden. It's still small scale software sales, after all.

 

[Raistlin]

:lol One only has to look at Movies On-Demand, Steam and other forms of digital distribution to know that it's the wave of the future. Look at how MP3s despite being inferior quality to CDs took off. As bandwidth increases so will digital distribution. People want convenience. Some of you are so blinded by bias that your arguments lack common sense.

1) it will likely never be a replacement for disc-based media ... for many reasons. It will only compliment it.

2) peoples' viewing habits for video versus audio are VERY different. Comparing them is kind of useless.

 

[thaivo]

HD-DVD got Heroes and Blades of Glory and Post-Paramount announcement, I'd be laughing my ass off if they don't win this round

Me, I'd rather laugh at your post, because such expectations are highly unrealistic. :lol

There is likely to be some movement in the sales ratios, but it isn't likely that HD DVD is going to be outselling BD immediately because of the Paramount / DW's announcement. I think you know this, but are just being Petrarca... :lol

 

[Raistlin]

We were using 56k just a couple of years ago... who know how it will be in the next 5 years.

And you expect the bandwidth speeds to continue to move at that rate? That increase was due to moving over to an entirely different system of data transfer ... that isn't happening again in the next 5 years.

Not to mention the fact that millions of people are still using dial-up.

 

[VanMardigan]

So bd guys are overhyping what HD DVD sales will be, while the HD DVD guys are downplaying the releases/announcements. It should be a fun sales week.

Me, I'm in the middle. I think a strong week for HD DVD, but not surpassing Blu Ray.

Something like 55/45

 

[SRG01]

And you expect the bandwidth speeds to continue to move at that rate? That increase was due to moving over to an entirely different system of data transfer ... that isn't happening again in the next 5 years.

Not to mention the fact that millions of people are still using dial-up.

Ironically, it would probably be cheaper for most people to get ADSL than dialup, since ADSL modems and ethernet cards are dime-a-dozen now compared to modems. :lol

 

[Raistlin]

On the other hand, as far as backwards compatibility is concerned, the extra layer MIGHT work if they built their optical pickup to be really robust (given that one of the main selling points of HD DVD is how cheap the pickups are compared to Blu-ray, it's possible but the fact that this tech is moving so slow with really only one company to approve it makes me think this is not working on old players)...

They're 'cheap' because of how close they are to DVD. DVD lasers weren't designed for triple layers ... so it is very unlikely the current HD DVD's are robust enough to support it.

Beyond that, the transfer rate is different for the triple layers, so it is quite unlikely there will be compatibility. To my knowledge, Tosh said it will NOT be used for movies.


IMO, too little, too late. Tosh actually had a lot of problems getting dual layered burning going (BD had it over two years ago ... even before dual layered ROMs were in sufficient yields ... well before it even launched in the west). Due to this, most people/companies wanting large, optical-based data backup have leaned towards BD.

Plus, I'd imagine the supposed cost advantages of HD DVD tech are going out the window in this case... so I just don't see it taking off. The more they diverge from DVD, the more expensive it is ... at least short-term.

BD was designed from the get-go to have some level of expandability. Basically, HD-DVD is now just hitting BD level in size. BD can likely expand through time ... and may be able to pull off compatibility.

...but the extra data rate is really, really unlikely to work on old players, unless you think that Toshiba gave everyone free 2x spin rate drives? Higher bit rates? What about all the decoder chips that thought they only had to do 30mbps video? I'm pretty sure that even if this tech sees the light of day, they will either have the same bandwidth caps as before, or you're looking at obsoleting all existing players in a manner far worse than the HD DVD "Blu-ray players are obsolete because of BD-Live/Profile 1.1" talking point (at least the old players can play the main feature!)

Yep ... which is why it is PC-only.

It should be noted that BD also supports a variety of data rates ... so Tosh isn't really offering much here. The data rates for both formats are upgradable for PC use. Its no different than CD and DVD. On PC's, you have 2x, 4x, etc. The dedicated spec is for movies only.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I don't really think HD DVD will take over, but the combo of a decent new HD-DVD only release and very little on the BD side means it could be a lot closer than it has been.

 

[Petrarca]

Me, I'd rather laugh at your post, because such expectations are highly unrealistic. :lol

There is likely to be some movement in the sales ratios, but it isn't likely that HD DVD is going to be outselling BD immediately because of the Paramount / DW's announcement. I think you know this, but are just being Petrarca... :lol

not only Paramount announcement, there are Heroes & Blades of Glory on HD-DVD

 

[Raistlin]

Ironically, it would probably be cheaper for most people to get ADSL than dialup, since ADSL modems and ethernet cards are dime-a-dozen now compared to modems. :lol

The companies offering it are losing out.

Everyone knows J6P doesn't research this sort of thing. The prevailing assumption is that broadband is expensive. Maybe if they advertised more ... people would be jumping.

 

[sonycowboy]

A few news bits, no weekly sales data yet.

http://www.homemediaretailing.com/

On the high-definition disc front, Blades of Glory and Heroes also posted a one-two finish on the HD DVD charts, but in reverse order — the TV show came in at No. 1. Both titles are available in high-def only on HD DVD. On the Blu-ray Disc chart, 300, from the only studio (Warner) that supports both next-generation formats, remained at No. 1.

Toshiba Reaffirms HD Market Lead

The format war in the media continues unabated as Toshiba Corp., citing July data from The NPD Group, said its line of HD DVD players held a 55% market share, compared to 42% for combined Blu-ray Disc standalone players from Sony, Pioneer, Samsung, Sharp and Panasonic, among others.

Dual-format players, according to Toshiba, hold about 3% market share.

The data does not include sales of Sony’s PlayStation 3 game system that features a Blu-ray drive.

“While the competition may claim leadership based on one month of data, Toshiba has had continued sales leadership in every month since the original HD DVD players launched 17 months ago,” said a Toshiba spokesperson.

 

[sooperkool]

And you expect the bandwidth speeds to continue to move at that rate? That increase was due to moving over to an entirely different system of data transfer ... that isn't happening again in the next 5 years.

Not to mention the fact that millions of people are still using dial-up.

as much as i realize this, it still amazes me

 

[Petrarca]

A few news bits, no weekly sales data yet.

http://www.homemediaretailing.com/

“While the competition may claim leadership based on one month of data, Toshiba has had continued sales leadership in every month since the original HD DVD players launched 17 months ago,” said a Toshiba spokesperson.

So actually Sony's claim is right, that BD dedicated players have been outselling HD-DVD players in the last few weeks

 

[Raistlin]

as much as i realize this, it still amazes me

It doesn't amaze me.


The majority of people in the US don't have cable ... and the prevailing assumption is that ADSL is expensive. Plus, many people aren't even wired for it to begin with.

Wiring up the US is a pretty difficult proposition. Just too damn big.

 

[Raistlin]

So actually Sony's claim is right, that BD dedicated players have been outselling HD-DVD players in the last few weeks

And the fact that its 55% / 45% for the year ... while NOT including PS3 ... isn't really something Tosh should be trumpetting.

Sure, they are selling a bit more ... but not by much, and the trend is showing BD increasing at a faster rate.

 

[Manmademan]

So actually Sony's claim is right, that BD dedicated players have been outselling HD-DVD players in the last few weeks

this actually is more than I expected- I thought the "outselling HDDVD standalones" would be for a week or two of data at best. not an entire month.

also- LOL at HD-DVD *still* not being able to take the #1 spot with Heroes AND BoG in a week with no significant blu ray releases at all.

can't wait for the spin on this one

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

So actually Sony's claim is right, that BD dedicated players have been outselling HD-DVD players in the last few weeks

Yup. A claim that was scoffed at a week ago in this very thread.

 

[Raistlin]

Yup. A claim that was scoffed at a week ago in this very thread.

Are you surprised?

 

[VanMardigan]

And the fact that its 55% / 45% for the year ... while NOT including PS3 ... isn't really something Tosh should be trumpetting.

Sure, they are selling a bit more ... but not by much, and the trend is showing BD increasing at a faster rate.

So 55/45 (actually 55/42 but I knew you'd ignore that) YTD is "not by much", but somehow that same margin for Blu Ray, for a very limited time period, is "a faster rate". Gotcha.

 

[Brimstone]

On the other hand, as far as backwards compatibility is concerned, the extra layer MIGHT work if they built their optical pickup to be really robust (given that one of the main selling points of HD DVD is how cheap the pickups are compared to Blu-ray, it's possible but the fact that this tech is moving so slow with really only one company to approve it makes me think this is not working on old players)...

...but the extra data rate is really, really unlikely to work on old players, unless you think that Toshiba gave everyone free 2x spin rate drives? Higher bit rates? What about all the decoder chips that thought they only had to do 30mbps video? I'm pretty sure that even if this tech sees the light of day, they will either have the same bandwidth caps as before, or you're looking at obsoleting all existing players in a manner far worse than the HD DVD "Blu-ray players are obsolete because of BD-Live/Profile 1.1" talking point (at least the old players can play the main feature!)

Honestly the bandwidth cap is a bigger limitation than the capacity, so I think the TL discs don't really address the problem.

They won't be able to make the current players meet the new spec.


At some point all the players manufactured would need to get switched over to the Triple Layer spec and its faster spindle speed.


Movies have to be encoded to take advantage of this new Triple Layer spec anyway. But all current movies will play fine on the new Triple Layer spec machines.



The idea is 3 or so years down the road, movie studios that want to take advantage of increased disc capacity and higher bit rates can do so. Of course if a movie is encoded for Triple Layer specs, the early generations of the hardware won't run it. But those machines will be a tiny fraction of the market by then, and new Triple Layer machines will be dirt cheap.

So early adopters won't have a fully compatible machine for Triple Layer, but movies encoded for that are many years away. All the movies they bought will run fine, they'll just need to get a new Triple Layer compatible player several years from now.


This is even if Toshiba goes thru with releasing Triple Layer machines.

 

[Raistlin]

So 55/45 (actually 55/42 but I knew you'd ignore that) YTD is "not by much", but somehow that same margin for Blu Ray, for a very limited time period, is "a faster rate". Gotcha.

>_<

My god.


The rate wasn't 55/42 all year ... and then suddenly shot up in the last month for Sony. The margin was much greater for HD DVD at the beginning of the year ... but has been shrinking since then.

Its no different than how the SW sales shifted. There wasn't one magic day where things flip-flopped.


Seriously ... how obtuse can you be?

 

[VanMardigan]

The rate wasn't 55/42 all year ... and then suddenly shot up in the last month for Sony. The margin was much greater for HD DVD at the beginning of the year ... but has been shrinking since then.

Its no different than how the SW sales shifted. There wasn't one magic day where things flip-flopped.

I don't think you understand the information being presented. The current YTD rate is NOT 55/42 in favor of Sony. Only the previous month is. So, within the last month, Sony has outsold Toshiba at the same rate that Toshiba outsold Sony for the rest of the year. Sony attributed the RECENT spike to their cheaper BD standalone, while Toshiba countered by pointing out that it still has the YTD lead.

Now, that being the case, how is Toshiba's YTD lead "not much" while Sony's recent surge is "a faster rate"?

And did you even see the chart Sony themselves used? There was no gradual trend towards BR outselling HD, just the spikes you dismissed. Sony has outsold Toshiba in previous weeks, even, just not overall. So you falsely assumed there was a gradual increase that eventually led to last month's lead.

And if you're going to respond by calling me names again, don't bother.

 

[KZObsessed]

The highlight of Pioneer's Blu-ray showcase was their Blu-ray theater showroom where they were showing clips of new and upcoming Blu-ray movies including Cars, Wild Hogs, Sin City and Batman Begins. The Cars footage showed off the "Car Finder" interactive BD-Java feature allowing users to search for the more than 200 different cars featured in the movie, and even "race the clock" to find a specific car in a frozen frame of film. The Sin City and Batman Begins footage is hopefully a sign that these movies are being prepared for release and will make an appearance on Blu-ray soon.

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=487

 

[Argyle]

They won't be able to make the current players meet the new spec.


At some point all the players manufactured would need to get switched over to the Triple Layer spec and its faster spindle speed.


Movies have to be encoded to take advantage of this new Triple Layer spec anyway. But all current movies will play fine on the new Triple Layer spec machines.



The idea is 3 or so years down the road, movie studios that want to take advantage of increased disc capacity and higher bit rates can do so. Of course if a movie is encoded for Triple Layer specs, the early generations of the hardware won't run it. But those machines will be a tiny fraction of the market by then, and new Triple Layer machines will be dirt cheap.

So early adopters won't have a fully compatible machine for Triple Layer, but movies encoded for that are many years away. All the movies they bought will run fine, they'll just need to get a new Triple Layer compatible player several years from now.


This is even if Toshiba goes thru with releasing Triple Layer machines.

Yup - this is why the TL spec is really unlikely to ever see the light of day - it's basically a new format! If I were an HD DVD early adopter screwed in such a fashion, I had might as well buy a Blu-ray player (since the TL spec basically brings it up to par with Blu-ray - the one extra GB is pretty insignificant)!

 

[Chemo]

And if you're going to respond by calling me names again, don't bother.

Obtuse is an adjective.

 

[ManaByte]

 

[Oni Jazar]

^^^^ Damn them all to hell.

I don't really care that much (I'm a renter not a buyer) but that's just beyond dumb.

 

[ManaByte]

 

[Crayon Shinchan]

Seriously ... how obtuse can you be?

You're speaking with Van Mardigan. He can be as obtuse as necessary. Just look at his tag.

 

[Xisiqomelir]

Wiring up the US is a pretty difficult proposition. Just too damn big.

The telcos were already paid to do it.

 

[Raistlin]

I don't think you understand the information being presented. The current YTD rate is NOT 55/42 in favor of Sony. Only the previous month is. So, within the last month, Sony has outsold Toshiba at the same rate that Toshiba outsold Sony for the rest of the year.

What are you talking about? I know it isn't in favor of Sony for the year. Where did I say that?

Sony attributed the RECENT spike to their cheaper BD standalone, while Toshiba countered by pointing out that it still has the YTD lead.

Now, that being the case, how is Toshiba's YTD lead "not much" while Sony's recent surge is "a faster rate"?

You don't seem to understand the concept of a growth trend. At the start of the year, stand alone players where selling heavely in favor of HD DVD. As the year progressed, the sales ratio began getting closer and closer.

That means one of two things ... either BD is seeing a higher growth rate than HD DVD is ... or HD DVD is actually in a declining trend (in the event total sales of both units are the same or less than at the start of the year ... though I don't believe that is the case.).

And did you even see the chart Sony themselves used? There was no gradual trend, just the spikes you dismissed.

Please post it ... I'm at the airport and have a shit connection. The only pic I recall is the SW sales one.

And if you're going to respond by calling me names again, don't bother.

You honestly consider someone stating you are being obtuse is calling you a name? Even discounting the fact its an adjective, do you really consider it as some sort of personal attack? If that is the case, I don't know how you survive on the internet. You must cry yourself to sleep every night.