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[captive]

Bourne Ultimatum on the way for December 11th; no specs yet other than the disc being a combo.

Artwork (grammatical error and all) is up for Twister; no finalized date yet, just a vague "early '08" comment from Warner:

Oh hell yes i love Twister, i have that movie on DVD, double dip am confirmed

 

[The Main Event]

Bourne Ultimatum on the way for December 11th; no specs yet other than the disc being a combo.

*Thumbs up*

 

[DarkJediKnight]

Looks like The 51gb discs just went official. Its official name is: HD DVD-ROM (51G)

This war is about to get interesting. Let's see if Toshiba can actually get these discs to play in Gen1 and Gen2 players properly. Someone who worked on the 51gb discs have confirmed that they will play on all HD DVD players.

 

[Raistlin]

Looks like The 51gb discs just went official. Its official name is: HD DVD-ROM (51G)

This war is about to get interesting. Let's see if Toshiba can actually get these discs to play in Gen1 and Gen2 players.

I'm a little confused by their claims.


Even in the somewhat unlikely event the optical drive can actually read the third layer consistant enough to be usable, I was under the impression the spec was to have a higher bit rate as well.

I would think the only way to do this, other than a major redesign, would be to spin the disc faster (which is obviously part of the PC drive spec). It seems pretty unlikely the standalone ROM drives were designed for this however. Did they dump that part of the proposed spec?

 

[StoOgE]

I'm a little confused by their claims.


Even in the somewhat unlikely event the optical drive can actually read the third layer consistant enough to be usable, I was under the impression the spec was to have a higher bit rate as well.

I would think the only way to do this, other than a major redesign, would be to spin the disc faster (which is obviously part of the PC drive spec). It seems pretty unlikely the standalone ROM drives were designed for this however. Did they dump that part of the proposed spec?

i believe they have... but if they get the higher bitrate too.. that could be very interesting.

 

[StoOgE]

more importantly... the twin is approved... 1 dvd layer, 2 hddvd layers. combo disc with 30gb hddvd non-flipper = sex.

 

[maharg]

I would think the only way to do this, other than a major redesign, would be to spin the disc faster (which is obviously part of the PC drive spec). It seems pretty unlikely the standalone ROM drives were designed for this however. Did they dump that part of the proposed spec?

I would guess it has a lot to do with the amount of power the firmware has available to it. Maybe the fact that most HDDVD players are by toshiba themselves has made it possible to change the spec more than they otherwise would be able to.

 

[Raistlin]

i believe they have... but if they get the higher bitrate too.. that could be very interesting.

I can't see them just saying fuck you to everyone that has current players. If they current ones have different drives, it possible (however slightly) that some are adjustable ... I just don't think its liekly they all are.


Think of it this way ... the advertised price advantage for HD DVD is due to its design being a bit closer to DVD than BD. This is reported to help both for disc replication, as well as HW production.

Based on that, it seems illogical to expect that the released players had optics designed to reliably support triple layers, let alone support faster drive speeds than the movie spec details.


The fact they openly admit the error rate is goign to be higher for the 3rd layer ... but that their error correction should compensate scares me a bit. I suppose its fine for putting the extras there ... but I wouldn't want the feature on it.

 

[Raistlin]

more importantly... the twin is approved... 1 dvd layer, 2 hddvd layers. combo disc with 30gb hddvd non-flipper = sex.

IMO ... meh.


Who wants to pay extra for a disk that contains a gimped version of the DVD?

I would guess it has a lot to do with the amount of power the firmware has available to it. Maybe the fact that most HDDVD players are by toshiba themselves has made it possible to change the spec more than they otherwise would be able to.

What does SW have to do with physical limitations of the HW? Based on the 'closeness to DVD' of the overall HW design ... it seems unlikely that the optical and drive HW were designed to be this robust.

If they can pull it off with no major sacrifices, more power to them. Just color me surprised if they can.



And if they can't ... it is a mistake IMO to do this. Segmenting the market at this time is practically suicide. Then again, it may just be market BS. While the new HW may support it, I can't see many studios jumping on it if most people can't even use it. So maybe its just a bullet item :/

 

[StoOgE]

or it could work with existing players. im sure we will get details soon.

 

[captive]

Ok im having a really weird problem between my PS3 and my receiver. Super stardust sounded like it was only coming out of the front two speakers, so i reset the audio on the PS3 and completly reset the receiver super stardust sounded like it was fixed, so i tested with MI3 bridge scene. At -5 volume on my receiver MI3 should be almost deafeningly loud, i used it as demo matarial at my dads(exact same audio setup) at the same volume and everyone but myself and my dad were covering their ears. But now you can easily hold a normal conversation during this normally loud scene. So i popped in casino royale and at the same volume its ridiculously loud.
Im stumped, the only thing that changed in my setup was my dads PS3 going to his house and my PS3 coming home.

 

[Raistlin]

or it could work with existing players. im sure we will get details soon.

In that case, then I would suspect Toshiba is being a bit loose when stating how similar the HW is to DVD.

In other words, don't expect non-Toshiba HD DVD players to drop in price at anything much beyond traditional HW price histories. Nor should one expect cheap universals for quite some time.

 

[Duderz]

Has Unforgiven been announced for either format?

 

[Doublethink]

It's already out on both formats.

 

[Duderz]

It sure is, now that I'm looking at it on Amazon.

I'd better continue lurking here rather than posting.

 

[TAJ]

I am going to buy Next (ugh) on HD DVD when it comes out. It's got a Dolby 1.5mbps and a full blown 24bit True HD track from Paramount. I'm going to do severe testing of the audio and post my findings. If I don't detect anything of significance between DD+ 1.5 and a 24bit True HD, I'll concede that DD+ is good enough. If not, I'll still be royally pissed at Paramount for not putting a 24bit True HD on Transformers like they did on a piece of shit like Next.

This comparison only works if the DD+ track is 24-bit. (like Universal's DD+ tracks)

 

[Hitman]

I don't think so... Amazon is a pretty big player. I'm not saying it's 100% in tune with the market at large, but I think it's indicative of an overall trent.

OVERALL TRENT?! I love that guy!

 

[gray_fox224]

I hate flip discs

 

[gray_fox224]

Bourne Ultimatum on the way for December 11th; no specs yet other than the disc being a combo.

QUOTE]



YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

 

[StoOgE]

This comparison only works if the DD+ track is 24-bit. (like Universal's DD+ tracks)

but who is going to put a 24bit 1.5/sec dd+ encode and truehd on one disc?

any of the wb titles?

 

[StoOgE]

I hate flip discs

hopefully the twin will kill them with fire soon.

 

[VanMardigan]

So, Onix:

-Having dvd and HD DVD on the same side is meh, and having flippers is retarded (so I guess it's a good thing/coincidence that Blu Ray doesn't offer either)

-TL51 shouldn't work on players out now, and if it does, Toshiba are liars. Plus, they segment the market, but that's ok for Blu Ray players out now that won't be able to play the special features on next year's disks. And all this based on assumptions about compatibility that haven't been verified, and on sales that represent the very small early adopter segment.

-Space is irrelevant, it's all about bitrate. On the same token, you wouldn't trust Toshiba's players capabilities to consistently play at higher bitrates (that's without even knowing if and how capable they would be in that regard, not to mention the fact that it won't affect you because you don't own a player)

Man, Toshiba's got a tough time on their hands trying to win you over. It makes sense to have some apprehension until things clear up, but wow, Fox/Disney will be convinced before you are, apparently. :lol

 

[Kolgar]

It's already out on both formats.

It's out... and it looks spectacular.

 

[Oni Jazar]

hopefully the twin will kill them with fire soon.

Won't the twin disc only allow for a single layer DVD? I think that most DVDs now are dual layer.

 

[theBishop]

Ok im having a really weird problem between my PS3 and my receiver. Super stardust sounded like it was only coming out of the front two speakers, so i reset the audio on the PS3 and completly reset the receiver super stardust sounded like it was fixed, so i tested with MI3 bridge scene. At -5 volume on my receiver MI3 should be almost deafeningly loud, i used it as demo matarial at my dads(exact same audio setup) at the same volume and everyone but myself and my dad were covering their ears. But now you can easily hold a normal conversation during this normally loud scene. So i popped in casino royale and at the same volume its ridiculously loud.
Im stumped, the only thing that changed in my setup was my dads PS3 going to his house and my PS3 coming home.

Are you connected with optical? You should try disabling the 2.0 PCM audio options.

 

[Laurent]

Yay or nay? High-Def Digest doesn't have a review of it yet...

 

[VanMardigan]

I just noticed the "Don't breath" tag on Twister. :lol

Who does these? And why use that grainy ass image on the cover of a high def disc? I'm guessing cost, but wouldn't putting up a high res image (even if digitally enhanced) serve up a better impression of the advantages of hi def media?? Some of the covers really blow.

Are you connected with optical? You should try disabling the 2.0 PCM audio options.

I've had him on ignore for a while, but I think he had an hdmi reciever iirc.

 

[jjasper]

Yay or nay? High-Def Digest doesn't have a review of it yet...

I am going to get it but probably not until closer to the actual Haloween. Evil Dead 2 will be the first Anchor Bay title for me.

 

[DarkJediKnight]

So, Onix:

-Having dvd and HD DVD on the same side is meh, and having flippers is retarded (so I guess it's a good thing/coincidence that Blu Ray doesn't offer either)

I think he was refering to the 4.7gb DVD side. There is no way in hell the studios will do a separate DVD encode for 4.7gb, so in that terms, it is pretty useless. My fear is that they go 15gb/8.4gb.

 

[Christoff Yurievich]

Bourne Ultimatum on the way for December 11th; no specs yet other than the disc being a combo.

Artwork (grammatical error and all) is up for Twister; no finalized date yet, just a vague "early '08" comment from Warner:

http://imgred.com/http://www.dvdactive.com/images/news/screenshot/2007/9/twisterhdr1artworkpic1.jpg

Having never seen the poster before, that's pretty funny.

 

[StoOgE]

Won't the twin disc only allow for a single layer DVD? I think that most DVDs now are dual layer.

correct.

However, its very possible that they could omit special features and fit a normal DVD encode on the single layer... and leave all the special features on the HDDVD layers.

 

[StoOgE]

I think he was refering to the 4.7gb DVD side. There is no way in hell the studios will do a separate DVD encode for 4.7gb, so in that terms, it is pretty useless. My fear is that they go 15gb/8.4gb.

yeah, but how large is the movie itself on the DVD side.. if you got rid of all special features, extra soundtracks and just had a bear bones movie + DD5.1 soundtrack?

 

[captive]

Are you connected with optical? You should try disabling the 2.0 PCM audio options.

No im on HDMI receiver. Its so weird, I have used MI3 several times as demo material and every time anything louder than -10 was too loud, even at that volume the couch and everything shakes since the sub is 3 feet away from the couch. But even at -5 now you can hold a conversation easily and nothing shakes or anything, i have to turn it up to +10 which i have never had to do for any movie and imagine casino royale or other movies would just be deafening at that volume.

yeah, but how large is the movie itself on the DVD side.. if you got rid of all special features, extra soundtracks and just had a bear bones movie + DD5.1 soundtrack?

From my experience making backup copies of movies, most double layer discs are that way because of the quality of video, even removing all special features and all audio tracks except for a DD or DTS, the video still required anywhere from a 15% to 30% compression to fit on a single layer 4.7 gig disc.

 

[captive]

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/s...DC_to_Rock_Blu-ray_with_Live_at_Donington/963

Get your earplugs ready: AC/DC is coming to high-def with Sony BMG's October Blu-ray release of the seminal concert epic 'Live at Domington.'

Filmed at the famed Donington Castle by Grammy-winning music video helmer David Mallet, 'AC/DC: Live at Donington' has been hailed by some as the most over-the-top rock spectacle ever staged, including no less than firing cannons, a giant inflatable "hells bells" floating above the stage and a 18-strong setlist chock full of the legendary headbanger's greatest hits.
ADVERTISEMENT

Filmed in 35mm Panavision with 26 cameras, 'Live at Donington' will be presented in 1080p video (codec TBA), with audio specs and supplemental specs yet to be announced (though we can only hope that one of the high-resolution audio formats will be a given) We'll keep you posted.

This is an awesome concert, but damn why did i buy this on DVD!

 

[StoOgE]

From my experience making backup copies of movies, most double layer discs are that way because of the quality of video, even removing all special features and all audio tracks except for a DD or DTS, the video still required anywhere from a 15% to 30% compression to fit on a single layer 4.7 gig disc.

Hrm... well, I'm still hopefull they find a way to go this route, because

1) I do like having a DVD available for road trips/friends houses.
2) I hate flipper discs.
3) These look better.
4) These could potentially be user friendly enough that they could stop selling the DVD version of films and only sell the twins. Cost and yeilds are obviously still issues, but Toshiba would be smart to subsidize that.

 

[Zen]

So all these combos are going to royally mess up our precious sales data and render if impossible to properly tabulate. Crap.

 

[captive]

So all these combos are going to royally mess up our precious sales data and render if impossible to properly tabulate. Crap.

Not unless these studios start putting new releases on combos only with no regular dvd version.

 

[VanMardigan]

I have the Freedom HD DVD where both the HD DVD and dvd version are on the same side. Obviously, the film is short so it still looks stunning, but this sort of solution is really awesome if they can get it working right. No flipping, disc art, and total compatibility. I loaned it out and used it around the house and it worked like a charm on every dvd player and of course the Xbox 360 add-on.

I hope they can find a solution, because I really prefer this to having the combo discs. Plus, the people I lend it to don't care that much about PQ and if I'm watching it on a regular dvd player that means I'm not too concerned about it either so a more compressed version won't matter that much to me.

 

[StoOgE]

I hope they can find a solution, because I really prefer this to having the combo discs. Plus, the people I lend it to don't care that much about PQ and if I'm watching it on a regular dvd player that means I'm not too concerned about it either so a more compressed version won't matter that much to me.

Exactly my thoughts.

Its a SD version. If Im watching that, I dont much care if it looks good because Im probably watching it a car/on a plane. The HDDVD version is still 30GB so it looks as good as a standalone..

and J6P doesnt care if its more compressed, because he is J6P.

 

[captive]

nm

 

[The Main Event]

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/Industry_Trends/Warner/Total_HD/Warner:_HD_DVD/Blu-ray_Hybrid_Disc_On_Hold_For_Now/965

Last we heard, Warner's "Total HD" hybrid disc was due in early 2008, but now the studio says it's on hold, with no release date currently in sight.

The studio shook things up at CES this past January when it announced that it would introduce a new HD DVD/Blu-ray hybrid disc by mid 2007. A single disc capable of being played on both Blu-ray and HD DVD players seemed to offer a compelling (if inefficient) short term solution for the format war, and appeared to be the anchor of Warner's dual-format stance throughout much of the year.

Alas, it looks like Total HD is not to be -- at least not in the foreseeable future. After previously delaying its initial mid-2007 launch date until early 2008, now the studio says that the hybrid format is "on hold for now."

In comments first published by TWICE Magazine, Warner Home Video president Ron Sanders explained, "we’re concerned that as the only one publishing on it, it would be hard to make it go." He went on to say the company was still talking to retailers about rolling out the hybrid format sometime in the future.

As for the rumors that Warner is weighing lucrative offers to go format-exclusive, Sanders acknowledged discussions with both camps, but seemed to indicate that the studio would support both high-def formats through the holiday shopping season.

"We’re talking to both sides and it’s crazy right now," said Sanders. "We remain committed to both for the time being. We’ll see how the fourth quarter plays out. The consumer is still kind of divided, and we still believe that we should offer the content in both formats. Now, we will watch the marketplace very closely, and see how it plays out, but for now we are supporting both."

 

[Chemo]

Thank fuck Total HD is dead.

Also, it sounds like when they choose a side, it's going to be based on software sales. At least, that's the impression that piece gives.

Which can't sound good to any of you HD DVD supporters.

 

[VanMardigan]

"We’re talking to both sides and it’s crazy right now,"

I bet its crazy when people are shoving fistful of dollars and incentives that far outweigh any paltry revenue you could generate by declining and selling on both formats. Sure, it's the honorable thing to do (let consumers decide), but no other studio is doing it, so just screw it and pick a side. :lol

 

[nubbe]

I'm sure the war will end when Warner decides to join either side.

 

[StoOgE]

Thank fuck Total HD is dead.

Also, it sounds like when they choose a side, it's going to be based on software sales. At least, that's the impression that piece gives.

Which can't sound good to any of you HD DVD supporters.

yes, im sure your interpretation of that quote is the basis of their decision and not giant bags of money.

totalhd is dead bc there is no one left to sell it to. :lol

 

[Chemo]

yes, im sure your interpretation of that quote is the basis of their decision and not giant bags of money.

totalhd is dead bc there is no one left to sell it to. :lol

"We'll see how the fourth quarter plays out." suggests that they might actually take the high road and choose a format based on sales rather than money hats... there might actually be a company out there that wants HD media to succeed rather languish in a huge split market clusterfuck. Just because it sounds like they might take the market into account rather than payoffs, though, doesn't mean that they actually will... but that's what that sentence suggests, and I think if you can read and comprehend the English language you can pretty easily interpret how I came to that conclusion. But I guess you'd rather make snide replies to a totally valid interpretation of that statement, huh?

 

[rc213]

I'm sure the war will end when Warner decides to join either side.

Doubt it, Even if Warner chose a side the finish line would be far far far into the distance.

 

[StoOgE]

"We'll see how the fourth quarter plays out." suggests that they might actually take the high road and choose a format based on sales rather than money hats... there might actually be a company out there that wants HD media to succeed rather languish in a huge split market clusterfuck. Just because it sounds like they might take the market into account rather than payoffs, though, doesn't mean that they actually will... but that's what that sentence suggests, and I think if you can read and comprehend the English language you can pretty easily interpret how I came to that conclusion. But I guess you'd rather make snide replies to a totally valid interpretation of that statement, huh?

see how the fourth quarter plays out = when the auction ends

 

[Chemo]

see how the fourth quarter plays out = when the auction ends

Oh, my mistake, I guess there's not even a slight chance that Warner actually cares about making one format stick in anticipation for future sales paydays and will totally ignore current software numbers in an attempt to get that one big check now.

 

[Kolgar]

Also, it sounds like when they choose a side, it's going to be based on software sales. At least, that's the impression that piece gives.

Which can't sound good to any of you HD DVD supporters.

It will be really pivotal what Toshiba does this fourth quarter in hardware. If they sell through everything they ship, and it’s a big number at the price points that are coming out, then I think [HD DVD] will be around for a long time. If they don’t, then it could go Blu-ray’s way. But Toshiba is getting very, very aggressive on pricing, which is putting pressure on Blu-ray player manufacturers to bring prices down. As a content company we just want more hardware in the homes. So what ever drives more hardware is good to see. Right now it looks like there is price pressure on both sides because there are two formats — more pressure than there would be if there was only one format. So, for our interests, more razors means we’ll sell more razor blades down the road.

Also, what's with his comment about Blu-ray 2.0 coming this fall?

I think with Blu-ray 2.0 coming this fall, we are going to see a lot more Web-enabled content coming from everyone. Consumers want it. We’ve had quite a number of downloads of ringtones on our “300” connected DVD and HD DVD. We don’t know where it’s going to go. We are kind of in the nascent stage of what is possible, but I think it’s going to be great. I think there is going to be a pent-up demand that is going to be very interesting to watch once [Web-enabled Blu-ray] products launch into the market.

I thought that was way off yet. Is Warner setting themselves up for an easy out in January if the new profiles fail to materialize?

Quotes from TWICE: http://www.twice.com/article/CA6477849.html