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[captive]

I don't know why you bother since he can't read what you write and actively ignores when someone quotes you. *shrugs*

Because its funny for several reasons. He argues with people who quote me in agreeance, but doesnt bother to argue with me. He somehow thinks im some horrible blu-ray shill or whatever when in fact it was his own temper that got him banned and had nothing to do with me and his tag reflects that. And he continually argues with others even desribing them in worse terms than me, but no he doesnt put them on ignore.

He's just butt hurt that he got banned because he thinks that since my dad can afford HD DVD he has no logical reason not to buy hd dvd.
And he's also a hypocrit, getting mad when spin or post fud, but then he does it himself. As ignatz pointed out there arent any blu-ray people posting blu-ray spin so he did it so he could get a laugh or whatever.
As for whoever trolled him on XBL they need to get some balls and come argue with him here, really its not that hard, its not like his arguments are airtight or anything.

 

[Jeff-DSA]

Jeff: Are you just casting about for things to smear Sony with? :lol

No, I'm just saying that the format war has brought about plenty of good as well as bad. People whine about the exclusivity factors, but they forget that the war has dramatically reduced pricing. If ONLY HD-DVD or Blu-ray existed, prices would be much higher than they are now.

I'm happy that the PS3 has a BD.

I'm not attacking Sony or anything, I'm trying to point out the folly in claiming that the format war is destructive. In the end, we'll still end up with one format, that's inevitable. However, due to the war, you can probably own both now for less than what you would have had to pay for either if it was the only format available...be it HD-DVD or Blu-ray.

 

[Wulfer]

No back in the day IBM settled the dispute over DVD so we could have 1 format. Guess what happened today? They went to microsoft to settle it, oh but wait microsoft has a vested interest in one of the formats, hmmm makes you think doesnt it?

Ohh okey, all this hate stems back to Microsoft and not Toshiba, now I gotcha. The age old we must hate Microsoft mantra. I guess you guys hate Wal-mart too now! Ohh but wait now we can't hate them they sell our PS3! (Probably to more customers than any other distribution.) :lol

 

[captive]

Ohh okey, all this hate stems back to Microsoft and not Toshiba, now I gotcha. The age old we must hate Microsoft mantra. I guess you guys hate Wal-mart too now! Ohh but wait now we can't hate them they sell our PS3! (Probably to more customers than any other distribution.) :lol

No i hate walmart because of their poor policies of promoting women, their treatment of old people who work for them, and what they represent of psuhing the little guy out. Are you happy that you can walk out of the Ruins in Mexico city and see a walmart across the street? But if you want to believe i hate them because they gave deals on electronics go right ahead.

I dont hate Microsoft, but i dont like them. I dont like that they have a monopoly on operating systems.

However none of that has to do with the FACT that the companies involved did actually go to Microsoft this time to solve the format war like they did when they went to IBM in the 90's.
But please continue to perpetuate what you believe on to me, its not the first time you've done it in this very thread.

 

[SRG01]

Sony/Philips do share in the DVD patents.

They created optical media (CD), and then later began working on a video format. At the same time Toshiba was also working on a video format with several partners. Instead of having a format war, Sony/Philips decided to join with Toshiba (though with a modification to SuperDensity disc) since they were outnumbered.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dvd


As for the current format war, regardless of the DVD Forum's 'approval', many would argue that Toshiba did the breaking away since they've always had less support. And now that they have scared away CE's due to pricing, it’s even truer.

It also left Toshiba with the lion's share of the patent profits, too.

 

[Jeff-DSA]

Ohh okey, all this hate stems back to Microsoft and not Toshiba, now I gotcha. The age old we must hate Microsoft mantra. I guess you guys hate Wal-mart too now! Ohh but wait now we can't hate them they sell our PS3! (Probably to more customers than any other distribution.) :lol

Stop irritating the masses.

To those actually sharing info and debating possibilities in a grown up manner:

Isn't BD better for using the codec that MS was pushing, anyway? (Just curious here, not to rile any feathers.)

 

[Forsete]

Got 2 movies today, Sunshine and Die Hard 4.0

Sunshine is pretty much my fav. movie for 2007, glad to finally own it on BD.

 

[Wulfer]

No i hate walmart because of their poor policies of promoting women, their treatment of old people who work for them, and what they represent of psuhing the little guy out. Are you happy that you can walk out of the Ruins in Mexico city and see a walmart across the street? But if you want to believe i hate them because they gave deals on electronics go right ahead.

I dont hate Microsoft, but i dont like them. I dont like that they have a monopoly on operating systems.

However none of that has to do with the FACT that the companies involved did actually go to Microsoft this time to solve the format war like they did when they went to IBM in the 90's.
But please continue to perpetuate what you believe on to me, its not the first time you've done it in this very thread.

I was trying to joke with you Captive. Your hate is so strong it's scary at times. If you ever read any of my posts they're never meant to attack but, for fun. This board gets thick sometimes!

 

[captive]

Isn't BD better for using the codec that MS was pushing, anyway? (Just curious here, not to rile any feathers.)

I bet Onix would know. I dont think it matters they can both basically use all the same codecs.

I was trying to joke with you Captive. Your hate is so strong it's scary at times. If you ever read any of my posts they're never mean to attack but, for fun. This board gets thick sometimes!

Well having seen some of your posts in here i didnt think you were capable of joking, and just attacking.

 

[Wulfer]

Well having seen some of your posts in here i didnt think you were capable of joking, and just attacking.

Na, man I read this board at work and then I go home to family life or play (Xbox Live, watch a movie etc.) Half the time I read the board I'm never logged in so, even when I get banned for a small thing I'm always reading! Posting is for fun when I have time! I never mean harm from it. (Funny note the last time I was banned I didn't know until 3 days later.)

 

[VanMardigan]

The high-octane political thriller 'The Kingdom' is headed to high-def as a feature-packed HD DVD/DVD combo release.

Starring Jamie Foxx and Jennifer Garner as members of an FBI team solving a terrorist bombing in Saudi Arabia, the film was received with mixed reviews upon its theatrical release in late September, but it'll be getting the red carpet treatment when it makes its HD DVD debut on December 26, day-and-date with the standard-def DVD.

Announced supplements are extensive, with all versions sharing an audio commentary with director Peter Berg, four featurettes ("Creating the Kingdom," "History of the Kingdom," "Constructing the Freeway Sequence," "Surveillance") and deleted scenes. Exclusive to the HD DVD will be a U-Control-enabled picture-in-picture video commentary, plus additional web-enabled content (details to be announced).

Tech specs include 1080p/VC-1 video and audio tracks in both Dolby TrueHD and Dolby Digital-Plus 5.1 surround.

I remember posting this and the Bourne Ultimatum as two HD DVD hits earlier this year and getting laughed at because both were supposedly not 2007 titles. December looks like a good month for both formats.

 

[captive]

Na, man I read this board at work and then I go home to family life or play (Xbox Live, watch a movie etc.) Half the time I read the board I'm never logged in so, even when I get banned for a small thing I'm always reading! Posting is for fun when I have time! I never mean harm from it.

Well i guess i completely misjudged. Im sorry.
I too post from work, its a really boring job when computers and printers arent breaking so i just sit here and read stuff.

 

[Wulfer]

I remember posting this and the Bourne Ultimatum as two HD DVD hits earlier this year and getting laughed at because both were supposedly not 2007 titles. December looks like a good month for both formats.

OOOO Van I want that movie it was great at the theater...

 

[B-Ri]

To Argyle and any other close-minded whiners:

If Toshiba hadn't created HD-DVD, Blu-ray would still be costing you $700+ for a standalone player and the PS3 might not have launched with it added in. Sony wouldn't have felt the need to trojan horse the PS3 like they did, they'd have no pressure to drop prices so quickly on players, and the adoption rate would be much slower.

Format wars suck, but they do make the products more affordable much faster. Can it with the fanboy banter.

and to you sir i say.

if it wasnt for blu-ray existing, you wouldnt be able to buy your $100 on sale HD-DVD player with $200 of FREE software on top of it. It works both ways bro.

 

[Jeff-DSA]

and to you sir i say.

if it wasnt for blu-ray existing, you wouldnt be able to buy your $100 on sale HD-DVD player with $200 of FREE software on top of it. It works both ways bro.

Yeah, I said that a few posts up, actually.

 

[plagiarize]

Like I said before, we Blu guys don't have somebody posting every bit of posifive Blu press here as the HD-DVDers do (mainly TME)-- but now we have Red people doing it for us, with :lol's added!

More interestingly, we have some numbers that plagierize was askign for above.

~200K HD-DVD players
~1.9M PS3s

Extrapolated from who knows where, but if it's even ballpark, it's interesting.

We also know that the low-end BluRay player sold about 100K so far. Also interesting. That's how many people want a BluRay player and *don't* want it to be a PS3.

so i was probably right on the nose with 10:1. nice.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Actually, I read the source article and followed a link, and my ~200K number is probably low. It doesn't take into account anything from April to just before the sale, and that's probably a lot.

I also don't know where the PS3 number comes from, as I haven't followd console sales since, I dunno, 4 years ago or more.

 

[VanMardigan]

Actually, I read the source article and followed a link, and my ~200K number is probably low. It doesn't take into account anything from April to just before the sale, and that's probably a lot.

Or you could've read van's post, which stated the exact same thing.

And April -June there was a surge of HD DVD standalone sales. The Perfect Offer was implemented iirc along with a round of price cuts by Toshiba. That was followed by a drop as the Sony standalone and the other BR standalones outsold the HD DVD standalones. Then the third gen machines came out last month. Toshiba should be around the 500k mark with the weekend sale. Your Ps3 number seems low as well.

 

[Frankfurter]

Or you could've read van's post, which stated the exact same thing.

And April -June there was a surge of HD DVD standalone sales. The Perfect Offer was implemented iirc along with a round of price cuts by Toshiba. That was followed by a drop as the Sony standalone and the other BR standalones outsold the HD DVD standalones. Then the third gen machines came out last month. Toshiba should be around the 500k mark with the weekend sale. Your Ps3 number seems low as well.

If this is USA only than it's quite accurate: 1.859m till the end of September NPD.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Sorry Van, I missed that in the middle of the pointless finger-pointing. Anyway, you can see where I got that guess from, now.

I agree, that number must be far, far higher. I dunno about 500K, given that Sony outsold them at times and has only shipped 100K, though. I'd put it between 350-400K.

Also, in that post you say that the PS3 should be creating a larger disparity. I'm not sure how you can say that. Even if 20% of PS3 buyers buy discs, not all of them are going to be really into it. Some may have just picked up one or two on impulse, or to check out HD media. I think you'd have to look at it imperically, and say that the PS3 has x effect, period, and that's how it shoudl be measured. Based on some sales data a while ago, I proposed that 8 PS3 owners = one HD-DVD owner. That would mean that, once you subtract all the non-PS3 BluRay players, Sony will have to sell 8x PS3s to keep the gap the same in absolute numbers.

 

[plagiarize]

Sorry Van, I missed that in the middle of the pointless finger-pointing. Anyway, you can see where I got that guess from, now.

I agree, that number must be far, far higher. I dunno about 500K, given that Sony outsold them at times and has only shipped 100K, though. I'd put it between 350-400K.

Also, in that post you say that the PS3 should be creating a larger disparity. I'm not sure how you can say that. Even if 20% of PS3 buyers buy discs, not all of them are going to be really into it. Some may have just picked up one or two on impulse, or to check out HD media. I think you'd have to look at it imperically, and say that the PS3 has x effect, period, and that's how it shoudl be measured. Based on some sales data a while ago, I proposed that 8 PS3 owners = one HD-DVD owner. That would mean that, once you subtract all the non-PS3 BluRay players, Sony will have to sell 8x PS3s to keep the gap the same in absolute numbers.

so far, that has been happening... at least if we look at software sales. as HD penetration increases, that number will come down a bit, but i'd also expect standalones to take off.

i expect that when that happens, what takes off will be based on software sales to date, rather than stand alone sales to date, as i expect it'll be more based on number of available titles and shelf space in stores... but it's going to be interesting to see when and if the status quo of 2:1 swings drastically in one direction, and why.

 

[VanMardigan]

Sorry Van, I missed that in the middle of the pointless finger-pointing. Anyway, you can see where I got that guess from, now.

I agree, that number must be far, far higher. I dunno about 500K, given that Sony outsold them at times and has only shipped 100K, though. I'd put it between 350-400K.

No, the Sony alone didn't outsell the HD DVD standalones. ALL of the BR standalones combined outsold the HD DVD standalones.

As far as your 8-1 Ps3 to HD DVD standalone ratio, I don't know. I have no clue how to quantify it. But even at 8-1, Tosh has already sold enough standalones to counter whatever sold on the Ps3 side. Like I said earlier, it's a question of IF they can sustain their sales to the point of matching the Ps3 effect.

 

[Marty Chinn]

No, I'm just saying that the format war has brought about plenty of good as well as bad. People whine about the exclusivity factors, but they forget that the war has dramatically reduced pricing. If ONLY HD-DVD or Blu-ray existed, prices would be much higher than they are now.

I'm happy that the PS3 has a BD.

I'm not attacking Sony or anything, I'm trying to point out the folly in claiming that the format war is destructive. In the end, we'll still end up with one format, that's inevitable. However, due to the war, you can probably own both now for less than what you would have had to pay for either if it was the only format available...be it HD-DVD or Blu-ray.

I don't think that's true at all because even without HD-DVD, Blu-Ray would still have to compete with DVD. So I think prices still would have been competitive with the need to get the prices down. The mass consumers aren't going to adpot Blu-Ray if it's siginificantly more expensive to them for something that they may not see the big deal in. At least with getting the price down you increase your chances. They don't want Blu-Ray to go the way of Laser Disc. They want it to be the next format.

 

[plagiarize]

I don't think that's true at all because even without HD-DVD, Blu-Ray would still have to compete with DVD. So I think prices still would have been competitive with the need to get the prices down. The mass consumers aren't going to adpot Blu-Ray if it's siginificantly more expensive to them for something that they may not see the big deal in. At least with getting the price down you increase your chances. They don't want Blu-Ray to go the way of Laser Disc. They want it to be the next format.

but then, if consumers won't pay more for Blu-Ray or HD-DVD they obviously don't want it... and there's little logic in movie studios supporting either. why move to something with lower profit margins for an improvement that the average person won't pay more for?

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

No, the Sony alone didn't outsell the HD DVD standalones. ALL of the BR standalones combined outsold the HD DVD standalones.

As far as your 8-1 Ps3 to HD DVD standalone ratio, I don't know. I have no clue how to quantify it. But even at 8-1, Tosh has already sold enough standalones to counter whatever sold on the Ps3 side. Like I said earlier, it's a question of IF they can sustain their sales to the point of matching the Ps3 effect.

Care to wager what percentage of those BluRay standalone were the low-end SOny player, and what were other models at much higher prices?

I think my point stands. I don't see the Samsung or the higher-priced Sony models selling even a quarter of the low-end Sony.

 

[Raistlin]

It also left Toshiba with the lion's share of the patent profits, too.

Yes, it did.


I personally think the argument about who started what is moot at this point. They were both released, and a format war exists.

However, for the people that feel the need to dig up the argument ... they should at least get their facts straight. If someone is to be fingered for creating the HDM format war, it really should be Toshiba.

 

[VanMardigan]

Care to wager what percentage of those BluRay standalone were the low-end SOny player, and what were other models at much higher prices?

I think my point stands. I don't see the Samsung or the higher-priced Sony models selling even a quarter of the low-end Sony.

Sony SHIPPED 100k, how many of the other standalones do you think sold during that same time frame?

So how many standalones do you think sold from July to last weekend for Toshiba? Less than 100k?

edit: nevermind, I just noticed you estimated between 350-400k. I can live with 400k, even if I think it's closer to 450-500k.

 

[Marty Chinn]

but then, if consumers won't pay more for Blu-Ray or HD-DVD they obviously don't want it... and there's little logic in movie studios supporting either. why move to something with lower profit margins for an improvement that the average person won't pay more for?

By that line of thinking, why bother supporting Uncompressed PCM, or Dolby True HD? Heck why even support Dolby Digital when most people use stereo? People may want HD, they're just not willing to pay for it when they're perfectly happy with DVD. Now if you make it low enough of an entrance point, the adoption rate grows faster, as well as word of mouth on how to take advantage of their new HDTV which many people believe automatically makes everything HD. So it's in their best interest to get the price down otherwise it'll stay only amongst enthusiasts. It needs to be the same way as DVD not Laser Disc in how it gets adopted. Had DVD stayed at high prices, we'd still be watching VHS.

 

[plagiarize]

By that line of thinking, why bother supporting Uncompressed PCM, or Dolby True HD? Heck why even support Dolby Digital when most people use stereo? People may want HD, they're just not willing to pay for it when they're perfectly happy with DVD. Now if you make it low enough of an entrance point, the adoption rate grows faster, as well as word of mouth on how to take advantage of their new HDTV which many people believe automatically makes everything HD. So it's in their best interest to get the price down otherwise it'll stay only amongst enthusiasts. It needs to be the same way as DVD not Laser Disc in how it gets adopted. Had DVD stayed at high prices, we'd still be watching VHS.

uncompressed PCM is cheaper for studios to support as it is the format most of them will have the soundtracks for the films in in the first place. less reauthoring. Dolby Tru HD doesn't cost anymore in licensing fees.

but i don't believe that people aren't prepared to pay more for Blu-Ray and HD-DVD. i believe they are, and i think we should all hope i'm right.

DVD had higher profit margins than VHS at the same price to my knowledge. the same isn't true of Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

for most things which are really successful, it got adopted first, and it's price reduced second. not the other way around.

history tells me that people are willing to spend more on DVD movies than they were on VHS movies, but it was the cost of the players, not the movies, that held most people back from adopting the format initially.

 

[Shepherd]

LTTP: Wow, 90,000 A2s sold over the weekend. That is more than I thought it would be. Does this number include the number of A3s sold for $199? That is the one I bought.

edit: I see that it does not count the A3s.

http://www.videobusiness.com/article/CA6498141.html

 

[OokieSpookie]

I think what will be interesting to see is if Toshiba hit the mainstream price of if they hurt themselves and passed mainstream and hit novelty price.
An example would be at least to me something like the George Foreman grill ( bad example but you can insert any product that is not mainstream )or some other gadget along those lines.
You see the commercials and it is neat but not something you really need.
But if I walked into Walmart and saw one that was normally like 150 at 35-40$ I would be inclined to pick it up anyway just because.
(Yes I have one lol)
Would I use it?
I would for the first few days, but after that it would really just kind of sit on the shelf just in case and I tell myself I will use it soon.
As much as the numbers of units sold look really good on paper and give HD backers visions of sugar plums and tides turning, if those people who bought that player are not movie buyers it will have no impact outside of fun and headlines.
Everyone I know has a dvd player, and I would say maybe 10% of them will actually buy a movie every couple of weeks where the rest wait for certain releases.
I will stand by my belief that this will not have any kind of tangible impact, and I personally believe they would have been better off putting the A2 at a permanent regular price of $149 and left it around for a while and instead used the rest of the money to push releases and get it into the consumer consciousness.

 

[SUPREME1]

uncompressed PCM is cheaper for studios to support as it is the format most of them will have the soundtracks for the films in in the first place. less reauthoring. Dolby Tru HD doesn't cost anymore in licensing fees.

but i don't believe that people aren't prepared to pay more for Blu-Ray and HD-DVD. i believe they are, and i think we should all hope i'm right.

DVD had higher profit margins than VHS at the same price to my knowledge. the same isn't true of Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

for most things which are really successful, it got adopted first, and it's price reduced second. not the other way around.

history tells me that people are willing to spend more on DVD movies than they were on VHS movies, but it was the cost of the players, not the movies, that held most people back from adopting the format initially.

I know I'll be spending close to a grand within the next several months on:

Pioneer Elite VSX-91TXH


Just to get DolbyTrueHD and DTS-Master out of my BD and HD DVD players.

I'll be giving my current Sony 5.1 system to my in-laws.

 

[plagiarize]

I think what will be interesting to see is if Toshiba hit the mainstream price of if they hurt themselves and passed mainstream and hit novelty price.
An example would be at least to me something like the George Foreman grill ( bad example but you can insert any product that is not mainstream )or some other gadget along those lines.
You see the commercials and it is neat but not something you really need.
But if I walked into Walmart and saw one that was normally like 150 at 35-40$ I would be inclined to pick it up anyway just because.
(Yes I have one lol)
Would I use it?
I would for the first few days, but after that it would really just kind of sit on the shelf just in case and I tell myself I will use it soon.
As much as the numbers of units sold look really good on paper and give HD backers visions of sugar plums and tides turning, if those people who bought that player are not movie buyers it will have no impact outside of fun and headlines.
Everyone I know has a dvd player, and I would say maybe 10% of them will actually buy a movie every couple of weeks where the rest wait for certain releases.
I will stand by my belief that this will not have any kind of tangible impact, and I personally believe they would have been better off putting the A2 at a permanent regular price of $149 and left it around for a while and instead used the rest of the money to push releases and get it into the consumer consciousness.

on watching an hd-dvd and seeing the quality of it, those hypothetical buyers would be just as likely to keep buying hd-dvds over dvds as ps3 owners with hdtvs who didn't buy the system for blu-ray are to keep buying blu-rays over dvds after watching their first blu-ray.

if that george foreman grill made food taste twice as good and wasn't a hassle to clean compare to regular cooking utensils/pans, you'd be a lot more inclined to keep using it.

edit: i just found this.

http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.8.24.112921.289.html

it's AWESOME. it's written six years ago by someone saying DVD isn't really that much better than VHS.

i'm 90% certain it's brilliant satire, but of what i'm not sure.

 

[Marty Chinn]

uncompressed PCM is cheaper for studios to support as it is the format most of them will have the soundtracks for the films in in the first place. less reauthoring. Dolby Tru HD doesn't cost anymore in licensing fees.

but i don't believe that people aren't prepared to pay more for Blu-Ray and HD-DVD. i believe they are, and i think we should all hope i'm right.

DVD had higher profit margins than VHS at the same price to my knowledge. the same isn't true of Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

for most things which are really successful, it got adopted first, and it's price reduced second. not the other way around.

history tells me that people are willing to spend more on DVD movies than they were on VHS movies, but it was the cost of the players, not the movies, that held most people back from adopting the format initially.

Well by cost, I'm talking about both the players and the movies. And you know what, I'm all into the home theater stuff and I'm not willing to pay more for HD content at this point. I only own a Blu-Ray player because it was built into my PS3. I only own a HD DVD player because the add on for the 360 only cost me $50. I also only own a Toshiba A2 because it cost me only $100 with 5 free movies. As for movies themselves, the format war makes me hesitant to buy movies and would rather rent for now. Also those that I do buy, I try to pay in the range of DVD prices. $20 tends to be my upper limit. Fortunately the Amazon 10% off and free shipping takes care of most movies, but yes I'm not willing to pay for it at this point. If I'm not willing to pay for it being an enthusiast, you can bet your average consumer won't be.

 

[OokieSpookie]

on watching an hd-dvd and seeing the quality of it, those hypothetical buyers would be just as likely to keep buying hd-dvds over dvds as ps3 owners with hdtvs who didn't buy the system for blu-ray are to keep buying blu-rays over dvds after watching their first blu-ray.

if that george foreman grill made food taste twice as good and wasn't a hassle to clean compare to regular cooking utensils/pans, you'd be a lot more inclined to keep using it.

edit: i just found this.

http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.8.24.112921.289.html

it's AWESOME. it's written six years ago by someone saying DVD isn't really that much better than VHS.

i'm 90% certain it's brilliant satire, but of what i'm not sure.

I can honestly say I have no idea what you are talking about because what you are saying has absolutely nothing to do with anything I said.
Nowhere does anyone say that HD is not better than dvd nor is it even implied.

What I am talking about in wondering is how many of those 90k or whatever buyers will buy at least one movie every week or for that matter one movie every three weeks.
I believe that when you reduce the price on a product you can take it too low too fast.
At 299 and higher your mind says "wow that looks fucking great and I would love that, but will I use it enough to make it worth the investment".
If your mind answers yes then you buy it, if not no.
$199 is still a good price, the same conversation goes on in your head but you can also see it is a great value so you are even more inclined to do it.
$99 or lower reaches the zone where you say "oh well even if I never really use it ,I am not losing any money and I get free movies too."
They may be the type to buy movies every week or they may not.

Also as to "made food taste twice as good and wasn't a hassle to clean compare to regular cooking utensils/pans, you'd be a lot more inclined to keep using it"
Dvd players do not need firmware updates, ethernet connection, hdmi, slow load times so if I were one of the dvd backers I would be inclined to say that the analogy failed a little.

 

[Midas]

Quick question since there's an offer for the Xbox 360 HD-DVD add-on in Sweden. Can it out put 1080p or is it only 720p? 1080p with HDMI version of Xbox 360?

 

[StoOgE]

$99 or lower reaches the zone where you say "oh well even if I never really use it ,I am not losing any money and I get free movies too."
They may be the type to buy movies every week or they may not.

:lol Really? Its not like most people just walked in and got them, there were lines for them and most sold out as the store opened. :lol You act like these people just wandered by some wierd device and bought it because it was only 100 bucks. :lol

In any case, 90K people dont need to buy a movie every week. If they buy a movie once ever 2 months you are looking at a bump of 12K a week in sales on average, that will spike when big releases come out. Given that the biggest sellers have pushed just over 100K, a 12K a week bump off of this sale would be huge. I would also think that had Transformers released next week, it would likely have sold an extra 30K copies in the first week.

 

[StoOgE]

Quick question since there's an offer for the Xbox 360 HD-DVD add-on in Sweden. Can it out put 1080p or is it only 720p? 1080p with HDMI version of Xbox 360?

1080p over VGA or HDMI, so any 360 can do it.

 

[VanMardigan]

Quick question since there's an offer for the Xbox 360 HD-DVD add-on in Sweden. Can it out put 1080p or is it only 720p? 1080p with HDMI version of Xbox 360?

1080p if you have an HDMI equipped Xbox 360 and a 1080p capable tv. Just set your xbox 360 to 1080p and you're good to go.

edit: yeah, VGA works too if your tv/monitor can handle it

 

[OokieSpookie]

:lol Really? Its not like most people just walked in and got them, there were lines for them and most sold out as the store opened. :lol You act like these people just wandered by some wierd device and bought it because it was only 100 bucks. :lol

In any case, 90K people dont need to buy a movie every week. If they buy a movie once ever 2 months you are looking at a bump of 12K a week in sales on average, that will spike when big releases come out. Given that the biggest sellers have pushed just over 100K, a 12K a week bump off of this sale would be huge.

People stand in line to get cheap cd-r bundles or flash drives on black friday, it does not mean anything to be realistic.
It is the frenzy of "secret sale for one day only".
Not to mention the magic of Ebay/Craigslist.
We will just wait until this weeks sales numbers hit...and then we will hear the excuses that
"oh alot of them were meant as gifts so they won't be opened yet" or "bu bu Blu had big releases this week so it is not fair" and then we will wait until next week and the week after that and after that and after that just like we have for about a year now.

 

[Midas]

Thanks,

Anything else I should know? It works perfectly fine? No setbacks?

 

[plagiarize]

I can honestly say I have no idea what you are talking about because what you are saying has absolutely nothing to do with anything I said.
Nowhere does anyone say that HD is not better than dvd nor is it even implied.

What I am talking about in wondering is how many of those 90k or whatever buyers will buy at least one movie every week or for that matter one movie every three weeks.
I believe that when you reduce the price on a product you can take it too low too fast.
At 299 and higher your mind says "wow that looks fucking great and I would love that, but will I use it enough to make it worth the investment".
If your mind answers yes then you buy it, if not no.
$199 is still a good price, the same conversation goes on in your head but you can also see it is a great value so you are even more inclined to do it.
$99 or lower reaches the zone where you say "oh well even if I never really use it ,I am not losing any money and I get free movies too."
They may be the type to buy movies every week or they may not.

Also as to "made food taste twice as good and wasn't a hassle to clean compare to regular cooking utensils/pans, you'd be a lot more inclined to keep using it"
Dvd players do not need firmware updates, ethernet connection, hdmi, slow load times so if I were one of the dvd backers I would be inclined to say that the analogy failed a little.

i think your confusion was that you thought i was disagreeing with everything you said when i wasn't.

you were wondering how many hd-dvds those people that bought it on a whim might likely buy. i said 'probably as many as the average HDTV owning PS3 owner that has watched a blu-ray on their set'.

in other words, less than your average standalone user at this moment in time.

the fact is, we can only speculate on the percentage of people that A: bought it on a whim, B: bought it as a replacement or upgrade for an existing HD-DVD player or C: wanted an HD format but hadn't bought one yet due to cost of player.

how those percentages break down will play a big part of whether or not this has an impact, and we'll know if it had an impact soon enough. the higher percentage of C's the more likely an impact, but we have nothing right now to say what that break down is, and any guesses are just that... guesses.

People stand in line to get cheap cd-r bundles or flash drives on black friday, it does not mean anything to be realistic.
It is the frenzy of "secret sale for one day only".
Not to mention the magic of Ebay/Craigslist.
We will just wait until this weeks sales numbers hit...and then we will hear the excuses that
"oh alot of them were meant as gifts so they won't be opened yet" or "bu bu Blu had big releases this week so it is not fair" and then we will wait until next week and the week after that and after that and after that just like we have for about a year now.

why hasn't the software sales ratio changed from 2:1 all year now?

you've made your prediction that this achieves nothing... and you may get to come back here in a couple of weeks and feed people crow, or be served your own plate of crow.

your predictions are baseless at this point. making baseless predictions and turning out to be right has everything to do with luck.

 

[OokieSpookie]

i think your confusion was that you thought i was disagreeing with everything you said when i wasn't.

you were wondering how many hd-dvds those people that bought it on a whim might likely buy. i said 'probably as many as the average HDTV owning PS3 owner that has watched a blu-ray on their set'.

in other words, less than your average standalone user at this moment in time.

the fact is, we can only speculate on the percentage of people that A: bought it on a whim, B: bought it as a replacement or upgrade for an existing HD-DVD player or C: wanted an HD format but hadn't bought one yet due to cost of player.

how those percentages break down will play a big part of whether or not this has an impact, and we'll know if it had an impact soon enough. the higher percentage of C's the more likely an impact.

I see

 

[StoOgE]

Thanks,

Anything else I should know? It works perfectly fine? No setbacks?

Its a very good player and starts really fast. No hi def audio though. Just DD5.1

 

[OokieSpookie]

why hasn't the software sales ratio changed from 2:1 all year now?

you've made your prediction that this achieves nothing... and you may get to come back here in a couple of weeks and feed people crow, or be served your own plate of crow.

your predictions are baseless at this point. making baseless predictions and turning out to be right has everything to do with luck.

I believe that what has kept it even remotely close comes down to a few key events, the Paramount deal, the heroes deal, and this $99 thing.
Otherwise things would be far past the 70/30 margin that has been hit.
But the first two have been survived and put behind us.
The thing is, after this $99 thing what is left?

 

[plagiarize]

I believe that what has kept it even remotely close comes down to a few key events, the Paramount deal, the heroes deal, and this $99 thing.
Otherwise things would be far past the 70/30 margin that has been hit.
But the first two have been survived and put behind us.
The thing is, after this $99 thing what is left?

am i wrong to say sales of both have been growing?

obviously this $99 thing didn't sell through to everyone who wanted a player at that price, so price drops for the players will continue, just as they have for Blu-Ray players. Blu-Ray has been offering competing deals has it not?

the effect of the paramount deal hasn't ended by any means. hardly anyone ran out and bought a whole bunch of paramount hd-dvds just because they stopped supporting blu-ray. transformers helped hd-dvd for the same reason that spider-man will help blu-ray. it was a marque exclusive. the paramount deal will ensure that hd-dvd will have more of those than it would have had otherwise (though less than blu-ray has).

hd-dvd has a lot to do. they have to turn around the software sales again... and they have to build up enough of an advantage, so that when the price difference becomes moot, that they can at the very least survive in the face of blu-ray. i don't see a future without blu-ray as being very likely personally, but i think there's plenty of fight left in the hd-dvd camp.

 

[YagizY]

I do a lot of sitting back and watching in this thread and I am currently in the HD-DVD camp (even though my roommate has a PS3 so I might buy a couple of Blu-ray's if I could find them for cheap). I have a love for HD media, especially sports and movies but with that being said, this thread is hilarious. It's less discussing movies and releases for both formats and their PQ and AQ and it's more "Blu-ray IS TEH LARGEST MARKETSHARES" and "HD-DVD PWNS BLU-RAY CUZ IT5 AWESOME."

I know this isn't going to change anything in this thread but to put it in context, you are fighting over discs with data on them. None of you are Sony or Toshiba reps, none of you are making money off how successful either format is.

Who cares about numbers, didn't you buy the movies you own and the players you own FOR THE MOVIES?!

 

[plagiarize]

I do a lot of sitting back and watching in this thread and I am currently in the HD-DVD camp (even though my roommate has a PS3 so I might buy a couple of Blu-ray's if I could find them for cheap). I have a love for HD media, especially sports and movies but with that being said, this thread is hilarious. It's less discussing movies and releases for both formats and their PQ and AQ and it's more "Blu-ray IS TEH LARGEST MARKETSHARES" and "HD-DVD PWNS BLU-RAY CUZ IT5 AWESOME."

I know this isn't going to change anything in this thread but to put it in context, you are fighting over discs with data on them. None of you are Sony or Toshiba reps, none of you are making money off how successful either format is.

Who cares about numbers, didn't you buy the movies you own and the players you own FOR THE MOVIES?!

i know i did... i also judge how good a movie looks or sounds by watching it on my tv and listening to it on my speakers, rather than getting hung up on peak bitrates and god knows what else.

my hd-dvds and my blu-rays look amazing. i'm no more going to lose sleep over less peak bitrate than i am region encoding and tighter copywrite protection.

which ever wins, i'm happy.

this isn't the same for me as the VHS vs Betamax fight, because where i could tell the difference there, i can't here. whichever wins, if anyone ever 'wins', i'll continue to enjoy HD movies.

 

[OokieSpookie]

I do a lot of sitting back and watching in this thread and I am currently in the HD-DVD camp (even though my roommate has a PS3 so I might buy a couple of Blu-ray's if I could find them for cheap). I have a love for HD media, especially sports and movies but with that being said, this thread is hilarious. It's less discussing movies and releases for both formats and their PQ and AQ and it's more "Blu-ray IS TEH LARGEST MARKETSHARES" and "HD-DVD PWNS BLU-RAY CUZ IT5 AWESOME."

I know this isn't going to change anything in this thread but to put it in context, you are fighting over discs with data on them. None of you are Sony or Toshiba reps, none of you are making money off how successful either format is.

Who cares about numbers, didn't you buy the movies you own and the players you own FOR THE MOVIES?!

I think I am just going to save this response as a macro since the question comes up every few pages or so.
Yes this is about movie, but more so it was more for the dueling formats.
The whole just sit back and enjoy the movies thing is great, it really is but unfortunately I can not really be happy with that and others can not either.
If one of the two formats does not put the other one out soon, then both are going the way of the laser disk.
Now I know it is cool and trendy to say that someone is part of the laser disk thing and has a laser disk player but I prefer something that has at least a medium term future.

I also have to say and this could just be coincidence but doesn't it always seem like it is HD backers who go with the "dual format is great it should be about the movies" all of the sudden. ( nothing against the person I am replying to just seems to be the higher percentage in my view from looking at this thread and highdefdigest.

Once there is ONE format, no matter which side it is then we can put all of this crap behind us and talk about the movies as it rightly should be about.

 

[B-Ri]

Once there is ONE format, no matter which side it is then we can put all of this crap behind us and talk about the movies as it rightly should be about.

and thats what dissapoints me, is we were close to a clear advantageous winner, and then i hear people going NEUTRAL. they are extending the format war.