Naked Snake
Member
Is there any content difference between the normal 5-disc set of Blade Runner and the briefcase edition other than packaging?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Hi-Def Media Lovefest: The war is over and we can all go home.
- Thread starter HyperionX
- Start date
- Status
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Enderle's site lists both Microsoft and Toshiba (and Sony, for that matter) as clients, but it seems clearn which one paid for that last article. 
CoG said:Rob Enderle Suicide Watch is right. Now he's saying optical discs are doomed and digital-downloads are the way to go
http://news.digitaltrends.com/talkback224.html
The guy wants a download subscription service to replace personal movie libraries? *pukes*
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
FFObsessed said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in this early stage, ESPECIALLY with such pitiful sales compared to DVD, wouldn't ATTACH rates and SA Player sales matter more?
If you took SA AND the PS3 into account, BD players outnumber HD players by a shitload. but multiplat movie sales do not.
Even total movie sales don't top them by much considering the total player difference.
Outdoor Miner
Member
For anyone thats picked up the Harry Potter boxset, does it have extra room for movies 6 and 7 for when those are released?
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
Oni Jazar said:
But attach rates suggest that even with the added advantage of the PS3 Blu-ray isn't pushing out the number of discs it should be.
Don;t you think that would be a deterrent?
Attach rates are the reason 3rd parties wan't to put so much content on the 360. Not to mention GOOD contet as opposed to shovelware that lazy devs are putting on the Wii to cash in.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Why would standalone sales matter in a market where one of the best value/quality players is a PS3?
Why would attach rates matter at all, except when combined with player absolute numbers to determine active buying market size?
In other words, just because I have a PS3 doesn't mean the dozens of movies I've bought haven't put money in studios' pockets.
Why would attach rates matter at all, except when combined with player absolute numbers to determine active buying market size?
In other words, just because I have a PS3 doesn't mean the dozens of movies I've bought haven't put money in studios' pockets.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
Ignatz Mouse said:
I just personally doubt Warner are going to go with a format that is being pushed virtually soley by a games console, and not even being pushed very much either.
Imagine if you took the PS3 out of the equation?
All this is forgetting of course costs, HDi vs BDJ, and a standard specification which are also factors.
I Just see Warner being smarter than that, that's all.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Standalone BD player sales have not lagged far behind HD-DVD sales, especially when you consider that they're competing with the PS3 as an attractive player option. The has been propped up by the PS3, no doubt-- but the under $300 players are out now.
You're grasping. WB going Blu would be very smart for a variety of reasons.
You're grasping. WB going Blu would be very smart for a variety of reasons.
Because video game system sales will never come close to standalone Home video machines.Ignatz Mouse said:
PS2 has sold roughly 40~ million in USA. Standalone DVD player sales in USA (NOT counting video game systems, pc's..etc) is around 135 million~
You see the difference? Even the biggest video game system of all time is a mere niche compared to the home video market. Video games are a mere drop in a bucket compared to dvd.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
Ignatz Mouse said:
WB going either way would end it all anyway.
They go HD, you've got the 3 biggest on HD side, and Disney would go neutral soon after, if their voting on the 51GB TL HD DVD is surely a sign of SOMETHING.
Not to mention Stringer's recent comments can't be a good sign.
If WB go Blu-ray well it would be over for obvious reasons.
Outdoor Miner said:
What do you think? WB wants you to buy a HP 1-6 set and a HP 1-7 set after this, just as fools bought HP 1-2, HP 1-3, HP 1-4, and HP 1-5 sets already. They are printing money with this franchise and the fans who buy any and every release.
Wait for all 7 movies to come, then buy the 1-7 set.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Cheebs, except that the more affordable Blu-Ray players are here. Of course the PS3 will never sell numbers like dedicated machines. But the sales of BD movies *on* PS3 as well as the sales of dedicated Blu-ray players so far has shown the appetite for movies is there.
I guess it all depends on how you see the sales curves changing as Blu-ray players get cheaper than the PS3 for firt time. If you believe that BD sales are just because PS3 owners buy movies out of curiosity, then the lower-proced players won't do well. If you think (as I do) that the market for Blu-ray is there and that the PS3 has been the cutting into dedicated player sales, then you'd expect an increase in adoption.
Given that dedicated Blu-ray players occasionally exceeded HD-DVD player sales despite both the PS3 *and* the lower price of HD-DVD players, I think the market for Blu-Ray is healthy. And why wouldn't it be? It's got 70% studio support with some of the biggest blockbusters exclusive to the format.
I guess it all depends on how you see the sales curves changing as Blu-ray players get cheaper than the PS3 for firt time. If you believe that BD sales are just because PS3 owners buy movies out of curiosity, then the lower-proced players won't do well. If you think (as I do) that the market for Blu-ray is there and that the PS3 has been the cutting into dedicated player sales, then you'd expect an increase in adoption.
Given that dedicated Blu-ray players occasionally exceeded HD-DVD player sales despite both the PS3 *and* the lower price of HD-DVD players, I think the market for Blu-Ray is healthy. And why wouldn't it be? It's got 70% studio support with some of the biggest blockbusters exclusive to the format.
OokieSpookie
Banned
Cheebs said:
PS2s were never considered a "good" dvd player, and as has been said blu ray stand alone prices keep dropping and their sales numbers keep growing as much as hd backers would try to pretend otherwise.
Shpeshal Ed said:
WB going Red won't end it either way. It would relegate both formats to SACD/Laserdisc status. Time-Warner wants a sustainable format.
You think Disney will go HD-DVD soon after with Steve Jobs on their board? It's an unlikely scenario. Disney never misses a vote on the steering committee, this TL51 issue is no sudden surprise.
Fox will likely up sticks and quit. BD+ is working well for them, AFAIK there have been no reports of any BD+ discs being ripped and available. If stalemates the way its headed, then there is no point investing for them.
Going back to VHS-Beta, Sony's Akio Morita was humiliated at Konosuke Matsushita's home when he laughed at his proposal that they should join forced on Beta. Morita continued with Beta because his pride was hurt. It was a lesson the company learned the hard way. When other hardware makers see no value in your format then you will lose a format war. This is why Sony-Philips compromised on DVD. After they had bought a movie studio in preparation for future fights.
Beta went on for 20yrs. Toshiba was all but ready to concede in 2005 till Microsoft's intervention. Compared to then Toshiba is in the same exact position that Sony was in: Fighting the Matsushita coalition. They are again playing for pride. Funny thing is Toshiba was the only firm on Sonys side then.
BotoxAgent
Member
Watched HP and Order of the Pheonix last night. I think this is Warner's best looking disc they've put out. But it still doesn't compare to some of the best titles put out by Fox or Disney.
I also bought Bourne Ultimatum on HDDVD....a very solid and good-looking disc. The way it was shot made me skeptical it would look good, but i was very surprised.
I also bought Bourne Ultimatum on HDDVD....a very solid and good-looking disc. The way it was shot made me skeptical it would look good, but i was very surprised.
OokieSpookie
Banned
Also from what I have heard there is some foam at the bottom that if you take it out fits the movies perfectly.gkrykewy said:Yes, there's room at the top of the box. This set is pretty much the coolest thing ever for an HP fan, by the way
Christoff Yurievich
Member
Outdoor Miner said:
never mind. guess I should open the case before I speak.
avaya said:
I agree with this. The BDA seems very galvanized between the studio supporters and the (larger IMO) strength of the hardware manufacturers. With nearly 50% of the MPAA studio support Blu-Ray exclusive, Warner going HD-DVD exclusive would only entrench both sides deeper in the format war, and prolong it indefinitely. Plus, Blu-Ray software sales would probably continue to hold the lead, making the whole thing look completely ridiculous.
If Warner doesn't choose sides, the next thing on the horizon could be Apple beginning to include BD-ROM standard in their high end models.
Chiggs
Gold Member
NekoFever said:I got my 5-disc Blade Runner (HD) in the mail this morning from Movietyme. I know what I'm going to be watching tonight
But which one do I watch? Might have to go for the theatrical because I haven't seen it in years.
Could you please take a picture of the insides?
Dang!
I just got the email from Amazon that my Lost Season 3 on Blu-ray was delayed. Well, it actually worked out for the better though because I had some Reward Zone coupons and I just ordered it online with in-store pickup from Best Buy. I'll swing by on my lunch break and will fire them up right after work. The only hassle will be returning the discs to Amazon since it won't allow me to cancel at this point.
I can't wait!
I just got the email from Amazon that my Lost Season 3 on Blu-ray was delayed. Well, it actually worked out for the better though because I had some Reward Zone coupons and I just ordered it online with in-store pickup from Best Buy. I'll swing by on my lunch break and will fire them up right after work. The only hassle will be returning the discs to Amazon since it won't allow me to cancel at this point.
I can't wait!
bune duggy said:doubtful since the movies come in non-standard slipcases.
never mind. guess I should open the case before I speak.
By the way, it's worth noting that the non standard cases are less crappy than originally implied. They are not cardboard sleeves - they are plastic disc backings (similar to a regular case) inside embossed cardboard "books." I would liken the external and internal look/feel to the LOTR extended DVDs. the only weird thing is that the first two movies are CD jewel case-sized rather than full sized.
I am not using PS2 as a dvd player in the example. I am just comparing how useless the video game industry is to movie companies, compared to home video the game market is a niche market that doesn't have much of a impact in terms of the entertainment industry.OokieSpookie said:
This applies to everything not just sony, not just blu-ray. In its essence the game market has little impact on home video, its just not a big enough market nor entertainment business to do so.
DarkJediKnight
Member
There's something people need to get through their thick skulls: there are thousands of PS3 owners who chose the PS3 because there was no standalone alternative.
There is no fair comparison to HD DVD because all HD DVD players are fully complete. Not the case with Blu-ray. Until Profile 1.1 and 2.0 players are the standard, people will continue to use the PS3 for playback. It's common sense.
So, in theory, the standalone sales are apples to oranges. We don't know how many PS3 owners would have bought a standalone if they knew their players would eventually support 1.1. My guess is, at least 100k+ if not more.
There is no fair comparison to HD DVD because all HD DVD players are fully complete. Not the case with Blu-ray. Until Profile 1.1 and 2.0 players are the standard, people will continue to use the PS3 for playback. It's common sense.
So, in theory, the standalone sales are apples to oranges. We don't know how many PS3 owners would have bought a standalone if they knew their players would eventually support 1.1. My guess is, at least 100k+ if not more.
Don't most people think this is better, though? For everyone involved? No inventory for the studios, and no space taken up at the consumer's place. It's unthinkable to me to buy music in a physical form anymore. Once the infrastructure is in place (I don't want it to take more than say, 10 minutes) and so long as the downloads include special features, goodbye optical!Oni Jazar said:
[edit] Oh, you said subscription. My bad. Yeah, that would blow.
Naked Snake
Member
Those who got Lost on bluray, can someone please post a picture of the box (preferably front and spine)? Thanks.
Shipping Method: FREE Super Saver Shipping
Heroes - Season 1 [HD DVD] $39.31
Lost - The Complete Third Season [Blu-ray] $64.95
Subtotal of Items: $104.26
Shipping & Handling: $3.97
Super Saver Discount -$3.97
------
Total: $104.26
Gift Certificates/Cards: - $35.00
------
Total for this Order: $69.26
Heroes was a used copy sold by Amazon that was just missing its manufactures plastic wrapping! The $35 in gift cards were from two promotions that Amazon offers. One was a Coinstar deal where I got $10 for running $30 at Coinstar machine (counting fee waved) and got my cash in the form of a Amazon gift card (I got Close Encounters with the $30 last month-- planned on getting it anyway) and I got a $25 gift card from my Amazon Visa card reward points. Basically I got Heroes for free with purchase of LOST. SWEET!
Heroes - Season 1 [HD DVD] $39.31
Lost - The Complete Third Season [Blu-ray] $64.95
Subtotal of Items: $104.26
Shipping & Handling: $3.97
Super Saver Discount -$3.97
------
Total: $104.26
Gift Certificates/Cards: - $35.00
------
Total for this Order: $69.26
Heroes was a used copy sold by Amazon that was just missing its manufactures plastic wrapping! The $35 in gift cards were from two promotions that Amazon offers. One was a Coinstar deal where I got $10 for running $30 at Coinstar machine (counting fee waved) and got my cash in the form of a Amazon gift card (I got Close Encounters with the $30 last month-- planned on getting it anyway) and I got a $25 gift card from my Amazon Visa card reward points. Basically I got Heroes for free with purchase of LOST. SWEET!
NekoFever
Member
Sorry for the horrible quality but my phone camera sucks and I don't have a real one to hand:Chiggs said:
The booklet basically has chapter listings and content listings for all five discs, and some photos. The contents of the discs are as follows:
Disc 1 (HD DVD): The Final Cut
Disc 2 (DVD): Dangerous Days: The Making of Blade Runner doc
Disc 3 (HD DVD): US Theatrical Cut, International Theatrical Cut, Director's Cut
Disc 4 (DVD): Enhancement Archive (all other extras, basically)
Disc 5 (HD DVD): Workprint edition
Blu-ray players seem like they're involved in a straight up pricing war now. Amazon keeps dropping the price and everyone else just follows their lead.
$269 for the Samsung BD-P1400 now, which was closer to $399 only a few weeks ago.
The Sony player is supposed to hit under $300 within the next week as well.
The pricing difference between 1080p players on both sides is going to be negligible much sooner than anticipated.
$269 for the Samsung BD-P1400 now, which was closer to $399 only a few weeks ago.
The Sony player is supposed to hit under $300 within the next week as well.
The pricing difference between 1080p players on both sides is going to be negligible much sooner than anticipated.
OokieSpookie
Banned
Jim said:
I have always gone with the theory that this is how it would play out.
The PS3 had one purpose in this war and that was to counter anything that HD-dvd could throw out there so that the BDA companies could bring their prices into range at their own pace.
I picked this up.. If you want to know IMHO the most exceptional thing about this transfer, surprisingly it's the amount of grain present and how it translates on screen. Yes it's nice in movies like Casablanca to go back and clean up the film. I mean it's one of the most important films in cinema history, it should be preserved for generations to come. But in some cases, and arguably Casablanca is still an example of such a case, it would be nice to see the movie how IT WAS FIRST PRESENTED back in it's original release. We can restore these movies all the way up to Snow White, where the movie was virtually repainted from scratch for its HD transfer. And again, the preserve the movie for future generations this is a good thing. But for film buffs.. I mean I would have loved to see 20MMtE in the theater back in the 50's, but considering I never had a chance this is the closest I will ever come. When you pick up Casablanca on HD-DVD, do you think that's what it was like to sit in a movie house back in 1942 with 1000 other people and see it on the big screen? Heck no.. that print is cleaned up well beyond what any positive print was capable of back then.dallow_bg said:
So in this respect.. the HD transfer of 20MMtE is outstanding. Preserving the grain while still giving us a pretty robust picture without the use of much edge enhancement for a movie of that age.
I also have to say that the colorization process is leaps and bounds beyond what we were exposed to. And before you cry foul about original integrity, there are a number of interviews with Ray Harryhausen on the disc talking about the fact that it was shot in B&W solely for budgetary reasons. He would have shot all three of his B&W films in color had he been approved the budget for it. His words exactly, bringing these films to color IS bringing it closest to his artistic intent. And as I said, the colorization process is really outstanding. The number of scenes that turned out rough can probably be counted on one hand, and mostly involve a very subdued colorization due to the complexity of the scene (like smoke and fog, stuff like that). Overall though it does bring you into the movie more, at the expense of eliminating just a tiny bit of that camp and cheese associated with viewing old monster movies in B&W.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
OokieSpookie said:
But how does that serve the BDA CE's? They weren't selling. Panasonic sold, what, 20k standalones in over a year? How is that any different from if they were competing with Toshiba? Sony and Toshiba are the only ones selling HD playing machines, and now price wars means that these gimped 1.0 BD machines have to sell at massive price cuts as well, or are we assuming that this is new 1.0 profile inventory built at hundreds of dollars less?
So, in both markets, it's the cheap standalones that sell, or in BD's case, the Ps3 and some cheap standalones. I love how folks can pretend that the BD CE environment is somehow "healthier" because they don't have to compete against Toshiba, all the while ignoring the 800lb gorilla that just so happens to be the best Blu Ray player on the market. And as far as standalones, guess who is the company dominating that sector? Sony. Their standalone was the one that pushed the monthly sales temporarily ahead of Toshiba's and it's their marked down standalone that will dominate Samsung and anybody else's entry. And with even Blu Ray fans warning folks about avoiding buying these gimped Blu Ray players and pick up a Ps3 instead, I'm amused when I hear talk of the healthy CE BD standalone market.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
It's healthy in that they are making their first gen models, and that research goes into the their next gen, etc. Meanshile, costs go down faster than the price of the PS3 will drop, so there's some margin. As opposed to the HD-DVD market, where the margin's already gone.
You're focusing too much on current inventory and not whole generations of development.
You're focusing too much on current inventory and not whole generations of development.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Ignatz Mouse said:
No, they're not selling now. They'll sell when their price dips (as it has recently). Again, how is that different from competing with Toshiba? You don't think Samsung and Panasonic would sell just as many HD DVD stanalones as they have BD standalones considering the pathetic amount they currently sell?
Prince of Space
Banned
Picked up an Ultimate copy yesterday.OokieSpookie said:
OokieSpookie
Banned
VanMardigan said:
But the difference is that most of blu's will end up all in the same range.
Sony could have very easily dropped a $100-$150 player out there to counter Toshiba but it would have screwed the other companies.
Instead all the companies are bringing theirs down at the same pace and the prices are more of a regular price instead of a huge one time drop and then trying to sell the same player for 200 more a week later.
The PS3 isn't going to race to drop prices to compete against blu ray players, sony has a stand alone hitting the 270 range very soon and as I said the stand alones will take the pace from now on.
The only main people who bitch about "gimped" blu stand alones are hd idiots looking for bullet points to point to.
The average person doesn't give a shit, and no amount of anecdotal evidence by anyone on an interweb forum will change my opinion of that.
Good companies find ways around it, much like Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix.
The content is there, only instead of a pop up pip window they have other options to see it whether it is within the movie or watching them all in a series or seperately.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
VanMardigan said:
I realize this... I don't think they expect their first generation of players to sell that much. The new sub-$400 and sub-$300 players will undoubtedly sell a lot more.
I think you miss my point altogether... now that Toshiba has lowered the bottom to about $200, it will be hard to make money. Sony has lowered the bottom to $400 - <whatever added average value the PS3's otehr abilities bring >. Which means that there's room for $300 players, significantly more margin.
And if the public gets accustomed to the deal prices, that means that the respective bottoms are more like $99 and $250 both with a ton of movies. Which one do you think will attract more CE companies?
You're playing the equivilence game again. Obviously, CE's would rather have a fat year or two of early adopters with no Toshiba blowouts and no PS3 undercutting their margins. But the two are not equivilent at all.
OokieSpookie
Banned
VanMardigan said:
Yes, they are selling now.
Whether you or other hd backers want to admit it or not doesn't matter.
Blu stand alones are moving decently without the need for clearance sales.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
OokieSpookie said:
Screwed them how? Panasonic sells 10k in a year??? You're acting as if Sony's decision to NOT provide a mass market price has somehow helped the others sell. They haven't.
- Status