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Hi-Def Media Lovefest: The war is over and we can all go home.
- Thread starter HyperionX
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Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Sunshine has real 1.1 PiP that can be turned on/off instantaneously, i didn't try using it all that much, but it works as advertised (on PS3)VanMardigan said:
Pristine_Condition
Member
Nicodimas said:
This Nicodimas guy has to be a joke poster. Nobody could be this stupid.
Nicodimus: You wrote "Taken From Engadget" like you took that from an actual news story or editorial from Engadget.
But you didn't. Because that wasn't written by Engadget.
I didn't understand why you didn't link to the quote, which is common practice here at GAF, and of couse I wondered why there were so many typos in that quote, so I went to Engadget myself to check it out. Turns out, your "Taken from Engadget" thing was just a comment from a random user/HD DVD fanboy named Chris Frost, here:
http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/01/2...tudio-and-hd-dvd-are-moving-forward/#comments
I understand you are desperate, and you are probably just taking your cue to bullshit as much as possible from guys like Jason Gilbert, but don't try to obscure the truth here, OK? Did you honestly think you could get away with that sort of thing on NeoGAF?
Yeah, technically, you weren't lying. It was posted on Engadget. But you didn't exactly tell us the whole truth now, did you?
...
Also, getting back to the point of the post, random numbers mean nothing. It's the films that make up the numbers that matter.
Saying "Who cares when Fox/Sony/Buena Vista/Disney all acount [sik] for less than 2000 movies. That's not even half of Universal's back catalog" is just a laughably absurd statement, considering that many of Warner, Fox, Disney, and Sony's films are either some of the most beloved films of all-time, and/or some of the highest-grossing films of all time. People don't go into the store looking for "Movie #426 from 1938" they go out and buy the movies they love.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
:lol
Don't let your ego get the better of you. Your fake persona on GAF shouldn't do things like compel you to sell off your HD DVD collection to match your online arguments or NOT try out features because I just pointed out your blatant hypocrisy.
Besides, I wan to know if those features actually work on Ps3, since HDDigest said the Ps3 wasn't 2.0 and wouldn't play them.
Haven't seen it yet, but I read the review on HDDigest and it definitely seems like it's the kind of stuff you find on the best HDi HD DVDs. It gets better too, trust me.
It was, that's why I said it was a waste of space. Just folks talking in a big ass window that didn't close (for at least the first half hour or so I watched). That's not how it should be done.
Didn't the early HD DVD stuff include Batman Begins? That movie's PiP content is very engaging, relevant, and informative.
Yep, that's how it should work, but another important element is the content. It has to be relevant to the stuff going on screen, and enhance the movie that way. It's intended for repeat viewings (like audio commentary) so that you get a deeper understanding of the film and how specific portions were done without watching a featurette, since it unfolds at the appropriate time in the movie. Obviously, this takes time and money for studios to implement, rather than the crap New Line pulled where they just burned random video into the film that's not relevant to what you're seeing on screen.
Insane Metal
Member
Great news! HD-DVD is saved, guys!Nicodimas said:
More than anything, pulling out that list of the number of movies each studio has the rights to distribute just highlights how little Universal and Paramount have really tried to pull their weight for HDDVD. With friends like those, it's no wonder the format floundered.
Not every catalog title would be worthy of attention but I'm sure there's plenty they could have turned into events on a new format by the packaging them up nicely a la Blade Runner or Close Encounters.
Not every catalog title would be worthy of attention but I'm sure there's plenty they could have turned into events on a new format by the packaging them up nicely a la Blade Runner or Close Encounters.
^ Smoke_less_drugs
Anyhow heres a great break down:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=896112
Blu-ray fans will keep spinning, but they still do not have Universal and Paramount.
Yeah, out of those catelog titles how many would still be relevant today? WB did a great job redoing Casablanca, a consistent top 10 film of all time for HDDVD and it sold like poo. What chance would a lesser catelog title have?
Newer catelog releases would have faired better, but alot of Universal and Paramounts biggest hits in the last 15-20 years are attached to Spielberg or Lucasfilm, which really hurt HDDVD I think. Had Uni been able to come out with all of their Amblin hits early on in this war, and Paramount been able to jump in with some of the newer ones with Dreamworks, those could have been potentially big releases.
Then there is the factor of movies that were big hits that just have not aged well at all in the publics eye (Independence day comes to mind).. either because the special effects dont look good any more, a laughable use of technology that now seems antiquated (the Net, that movie where Denzel Washington has to fight a computer program that comes to life) or because they tapped into a zeitgeist that is long dead.
Ultimitely though, even day and date releases didnt really decide this format war. It was bundling BRD with the PS3, BD+, region coding and giant checks that were floated about by both groups that decided it.
Newer catelog releases would have faired better, but alot of Universal and Paramounts biggest hits in the last 15-20 years are attached to Spielberg or Lucasfilm, which really hurt HDDVD I think. Had Uni been able to come out with all of their Amblin hits early on in this war, and Paramount been able to jump in with some of the newer ones with Dreamworks, those could have been potentially big releases.
Then there is the factor of movies that were big hits that just have not aged well at all in the publics eye (Independence day comes to mind).. either because the special effects dont look good any more, a laughable use of technology that now seems antiquated (the Net, that movie where Denzel Washington has to fight a computer program that comes to life) or because they tapped into a zeitgeist that is long dead.
Ultimitely though, even day and date releases didnt really decide this format war. It was bundling BRD with the PS3, BD+, region coding and giant checks that were floated about by both groups that decided it.
kaching said:
To be fair..
1) They were certainly not planning on being the only studios backing the format. They thought they would have WB and New Line for this year, and if rumors are true, they may have expected Fox on board too. Its not like you can just flip a switch and decided to release 5 movies a week.
2) Last year Universal opened up the flood gates of backlogs. And they all sold horrid, and because of the shear number they were pumping out without going back to the source to remaster, many of them looked pretty bad.
3) Why release new HDDVD movies now when you have 2 years worth of HDDVD releases you can sell again on BRD? :lol
4) Its possible they were going to try and release some of those Spielberg movies. At this point, its probably not worth the headache of fighting with him, so its possible some potential first half of the year releases are canned altogehter.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
welp, as anecdotal retail stories go, my two frequent best buys have both removed a section of the HD-DVD side and replaced it with Blu-ray. Previously both HD-DVD and BRD received one full side of an aisle. Now BRD is getting one full side plus a sectional rack, and HD-DVD is getting one full side minus two sectional racks, one for BRD and one for DVD promotions.
I would have to check the other three best buys in the area but I imagine the story is the same. Circuit City would be interesting, but in November they only had about 4 sections each for both formats anyway.
And as we all know (VHS, high-res audio, N64, Gamecube, etc) once sections start shrinking at Best Buy, it's very rare for them to stop until they are taking up the least amount of space possible.
I can't say I'm shocked by Universal's announcement that nothing is changing. I seriously suspect what some of you have said, that the switch will happen simultanously with Graffeo's stepping down. The lack of news from Paramount indicates to me that something is in the works. It probably is all coming down to the timing.
But with Blu-ray standalones now selling 13 TIMES MORE than HD-DVD standalones... not including PS3 which has seen an upswing in all of this, the writing is on the wall for HD-DVD in a big way. Even Graffeo won't be able to answer to his bosses soon on why they are exclusively supporting a format that is seeing less than 1/10th the sales of their competitor.
I would have to check the other three best buys in the area but I imagine the story is the same. Circuit City would be interesting, but in November they only had about 4 sections each for both formats anyway.
And as we all know (VHS, high-res audio, N64, Gamecube, etc) once sections start shrinking at Best Buy, it's very rare for them to stop until they are taking up the least amount of space possible.
I can't say I'm shocked by Universal's announcement that nothing is changing. I seriously suspect what some of you have said, that the switch will happen simultanously with Graffeo's stepping down. The lack of news from Paramount indicates to me that something is in the works. It probably is all coming down to the timing.
But with Blu-ray standalones now selling 13 TIMES MORE than HD-DVD standalones... not including PS3 which has seen an upswing in all of this, the writing is on the wall for HD-DVD in a big way. Even Graffeo won't be able to answer to his bosses soon on why they are exclusively supporting a format that is seeing less than 1/10th the sales of their competitor.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
borghe said:
His bosses know EXACTLY why they are supporting HD DVD. They cashed the check, not Ken. I know why folks here don't like him since he's the face of HD DVD, but to call for his job is absurd. Universal, like Paramount, took money/incentives to be HD DVD exclusive. Then they put Ken to head up the PRG. He's doing his damn job. Of course, once there is no more PRG, he'll need to be reassigned, but I don't see why they'd fire him like any of this is his fault.
I trust what Penton-man said about Graffeo. He's just tugging the corporate line. The Betanews interview is total trash.
Penton-Man said it's just a matter of time, in private discussions both studio's have shown their intentions. Graffeo was singled out, he's working on something else on the side...
Penton-Man said it's just a matter of time, in private discussions both studio's have shown their intentions. Graffeo was singled out, he's working on something else on the side...
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
I don't dislike Ken for doing his job, I dislike him because he's been the mouthpiece for a ton of bald-faced spin.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Ignatz Mouse said:
That's what mouthpieces do. I know you're not naive enough that you've never read the Sony spin on NPD's month after month or read the FUD from Blu Ray studios (specifically Fox and Disney) in regards to the format war being over at '07 CES.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
VanMardigan said:
Month after month spin? Nope. One comment that's been latched onto by fanboys like crazy ever since it was said? Yeah, I remember that. Not exactly BDG's finest hour, either.
But Graffeo has been the one going out of his way to not just over-proclaim and make arrogant statements, but to distort. Things like coutning the PS3 for attach ratios and discoutnign it for players sold, in the same paragraph.
I know it's his job, but that doesn't mean I have to like it, or him.
Edit: Oh, I see you mean PS3 sales spin. I don;t actively follow that, but no, I don't like it either. DOesn't bother *as much* if only because it's not standing in the way of a sane movie format with all the studios.
To be fair, I'm not calling for Ken's job. I'm simply stating that for Universal to turn face in all of this there might have to be a sacrifice. I have no animosity towards him and realize he is just towing the corporate line. But there is no way Universal is going to be able to make the switch as hard as they have been plugging HD-DVD IMHO without saying "It was all [insert_name]'s idea to do this."
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
I'm not calling for his job, either, and I wouldn't expect him to lose it.
I just know that he's willing to distort to a pretty heavy degree. Some execs (or more accurately, their PR staff that prepares them) seem more willing to admit facts, if even in couched terms.
I just know that he's willing to distort to a pretty heavy degree. Some execs (or more accurately, their PR staff that prepares them) seem more willing to admit facts, if even in couched terms.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
borghe said:
Warner fired no one when they went from HD DVD exclusive to format neutral, then fired on one again when they deserted their place in the HD DVD PRG, the HD DVD patent pool, the fact that EVERY new HD DVD player ships with one of their movies, and that they STILL have HD DVD exclusive movies and HD DVD exclusive content on multi-format releases.
They just called it the proper business move in their press release and moved on. Universal just needs to do the same, and reassign Ken. I definitely wouldn't want Ken on the BDA PRG, but I don't think Universal needs to sacrifice anyone to make the move everyone knows they should make.
Ignatz Mouse said:
It just really depends on what your general preference is. E.g., I don't follow the BD-HDDVD stuff nearly as much, but on the gaming side the MS and Sony PR mouthpieces are all completely full of shit. Of course, the PS3 fans freak out about MS spin and vice versa and everyone thinks that one side's spin is being blatantly unfair or unethical when in reality everyone is. The only party spared this is Nintendo--because they don't have to be, they can just point to the numbers and laugh (but that certainly wasn't the case with, e.g., the GC of course). I'm guessing that's what's starting to happen here.
I'd love to see them all gone and replaced more with people who just disclosed numbers, responded to community complaints/issues, etc. But like I said, as long as they keep getting quoted no matter how asinine their comments are, all of these companies will continue to see them as valuable.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
AstroLad said:
Apparently ignatz has never experienced moutpieces and what they do before. Ken is the first example he's seen of a person who must always put a positive spin on even bad news, and he's outraged at Ken's lack of honesty in regards to Blu Ray's domination.
It's hilarious in its hypocrisy, coming from someone who owns a console that requires constant spin whenever its execs and their pr staff discuss sales. It's as if ignatz is blissfully unaware of that even while attacking Ken for doing the same on the HD DVD side.
Ken's BS isn't standing in the way of Blu Ray anymore than MS and Sony's spin is standing in the way of Wii domination. Ken's words are nothing more than that, and will not prevent his bosses from negotiating the terms of their Blu Ray deal.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
AstroLab, I don't follow games like I used to, so I haven't seen the MS Spin. What little I have seen of the Sony spin is terrible (and almost exactly the same tactics Ninteno used when the Cube was lagging in sales).
I guess the winners don't do as much annoying spin because they don't have to. I still have a reaction to the people who make the statements, though. I don't like being lied to, and in the case of HD stuff, those lies were used to perpetuate a condiction that affects me directly (the abilty to have everything available) if only at a superficial consumer level.
I guess the winners don't do as much annoying spin because they don't have to. I still have a reaction to the people who make the statements, though. I don't like being lied to, and in the case of HD stuff, those lies were used to perpetuate a condiction that affects me directly (the abilty to have everything available) if only at a superficial consumer level.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
Hey Van, I already said I don't like it when Sony does it with the PS3 (and that it's terrible) so fuck right off.
Are you telling me you're full of love for those same Sony execs the way you have a hard on for Graffeo?
Are you telling me you're full of love for those same Sony execs the way you have a hard on for Graffeo?
What bothers me the most about PR spin, especially from tech companies, is that it's just insulting to consumers. It shows us just how little they think of our intelligence and ability to see their statements for the complete BS they usually are. Maybe they're right. I really put a lot of the blame on the media organizations though--the mouthpieces for the mouthpieces.
Anyway, total digression here.
Anyway, total digression here.
bune duggy said:
I got the coupon in the mail, and if you fight for it I don't see how they can deny you a discount on the PS3. It is a blu ray player, and on the back of the coupon it specifically excludes the HD DVD 360 add on. But it does not say anything about the PS3. I'm sure they'll still try to not give you the discount on it, that is why I mentioned you might have to push for the discount.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Ignatz Mouse said:
I was initially responding to a quote that seemed to be calling for his head, like I've read on here before. I don't think he should get fired, so if that qualifies as having a hard on for him, then whatever. Go curse all you want, you hypocrite, but it doesn't change the fact that the man is guilty of the exact same thing folks in every side of this format war are guilty of: towing the company line and quoting whatever convenient numbers fit their agenda.
OokieSpookie
Banned
Crisco said:
Enjoy the fast trip out.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
VanMardigan said:
Yeah, well, I wasn't calling for his head, or anything like that, just expressing my dislike. I don't see how disliking being lied to qualifies as hypocrisy.
As I said, winners don't need to spin, and I'm fully aware that whoever was losing would be lying, just as Sony is on the gaming side, with sales expressed in ambiguous percentage gains and the like. *Yesterday* I pointed out that there is no moral high ground, remember?
And I tend to curse when words are put in my mouth or opinions attributed to me I don't have. You're so far into the console war mentality that it's the only way you seem to be able to interpret other's posts, and it's led you repeatedly to wrong claims of hypocrisy.
Ignatz Mouse
Banned
I assume we'll never hear from him again....
I received my 3:10 to Yuma Blu-ray today and American Discs are horrible with all their security stickers all over the package. 3 of those horrible stickers that keep the case closed and 2 security scan thingies on the inside. And when you want to take all of those of of couse the glue remeins on the package.
If I buy any DVD/BD etc. over here there is NOTHING on it.
If I buy any DVD/BD etc. over here there is NOTHING on it.
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