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HTC Vive Launch Thread -- Computer, activate holodeck
- Thread starter taco543
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That DRM check is not Lucky's Tale specific, it doesn't check the license or the validity/integrity of the game. It's a generic one that applies for any game launched from Oculus Home and checks if an Oculus HMD is connected. At least this is my understanding. So it's very much the same situation like with an emulator, more or less. Revive is a Rift emulator. Unless you have better inside information that indeed a Lucky's Tale specific copy protection check is cracked.
Wowfunhappy
Member
Well, that's not quite removing the protection; it's making a more accurate copy
You're essentially right though, I was just thinking about it a different way.
Guardian Monkey
Member
Breaking drm to play a game you have no rights to.. Thanks.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
...my understanding is that this actually isn't true, unfortunately.
The DMCA makes circumventing software protections illegal, period. That's why it's technically illegal to backup DVD's and BluRay's to a home media server, and why the EFF had to fight for a specific exemption to the law for jailbreaking cell phones.
Nobody follows this though. Think about it. Just about every single unofficial mod anyone makes is technically a violation of the DMCA.
Universal City Studios v. Reimerdes said in the ruling against the defendant that fair use could be used as a defense, but in that case found the primary purpose was illegal distribution.
Then MGE UPS Systems v. General Electric came and found in favor of the defendant because the primary purpose was for fair use, not illegal distribution.
It seems really clear this is a case where the primary purpose is fair use, not illegal distribution.
Guardian Monkey
Member
DRM is copy protection. There isnt anything vague there.
Have you restarted oculus service / computer?
Thanks! It's working now.
GuitarAtomik
Member
Disappointing but I can wait for it. Unless they lay off Revive, I'm not buying anything off their store that's eventually coming to Steam.
Yeah, this link is a good guide to it.
Compsiox
Banned
Why does anyone care as long as revive exists and seems to be working?
It would make it seem like exclusivity works if you give them the sale while it's exclusive
I feel the exact same way.
Definitely this.
Compsiox
Banned
It'll come out for Vive eventually
Zalusithix
Member
Eh, it is what it is. If they're going timed exclusive with Oculus, it'd make sense they'd work with them. It'd be kind of pointless if they weren't to be honest. They basically cut a substantial amount of the PCVR market out by going down the artificial exclusivity route, so they might as well get the most out of the decision.
I've had both for about a month and had been debating back and forth about whether to sell the rift or not, but I just can't bring myself to do it. I've been working long hours lately and getting home late, and when your already tired and have maybe 1-2 hours to play and just want to sit down and drive a few laps in Pcars or AC, the simplicity and comfort of the Rift really shines. I absolutely love the built in headphones. I can't stand ear buds so when using the Vive I have to use either my Beyerdynamic 880s or Mad Dogs and the setup just starts to get heavy. The Vive cord is already heavy to begin with, and with another cord hanging down it just starts to feel messy compared to the ultra thin single cord on the rift. I find the sound quality of the Rift headphones to be surprisingly good. I also find the rift to be significantly more comfortable for long play sessions.
The biggest reason I would recommend the rift as a companion to the Vive, at least to someone who is into cockpit sims, is Asynchronous Timewarp. I have put significant time into Project Cars, Assetto Corsa, Elite Dangerous, and Flyinside/Prepar3d comparing them and there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that they all run better on the Rift. On PCars using the Vive with the newest patch with Vive support, If I want to have 15 cars on the track I have to turn most settings down to medium and shadows to low or I start to get Judder. On the Rift version I can run 25 cars with most settings on Ultra or high and shadows medium and it's perfectly smooth. There is honestly no comparison. I'm sure Devs will eventually do what it takes for parity across both headsets, or perhaps Valve will come up with something that works just as well, but as of right now, for cockpit based games, Asynchronous Timewarp is superior to the deferred rendering technique the Vive is using based on my personal observation.
I guess in conclusion, if you have money to burn and you really like cockpit based games, have a wheel/pedals combo, and want something a lot more comfortable and convenient to just slip on and play, then I would say go for it. If you are only going to be using an xbox controller and aren't really into sims that much, then definitely pass. Don't expect massive visual improvement either, if any. Although the Vive has more SDE, I personally find the God Rays of the Rift to be the most annoying visual aspect of either headset. They are only a factor on black/white contrasting scenes(most menu screens), but god damn they are annoying. Thankfully I don't notice them when racing. The Vives circular lense effect doesn't really bother me at all in comparison. Anyway, they both have their place in my game room and I'll be keeping both. If I could only have one, Vive all the way, but the Rift is getting more of my time lately and the more I use it the more I appreciate the thought that went into the actual design of it.
Wowfunhappy
Member
Why the heck doesn't the Vive do asynchronous time-warp? It's just software, right?
Bboy AJ
My dog was murdered by a 3.5mm audio port and I will not rest until the standard is dead
Afaik, and I could be wrong, there's literally nothing the Rift can do that the Vive can't. However, the Vive can do lots that the Rift can't.
There's only one choice, imo. Fighting with exclusivity is so awful.
Fried Food
Banned
That doesn't really answer the guys question. I'd like to know the answer as well. Things are just smoother on oculus.
DouglasteR
Member
Bad for them, one game erased from my list.
Wowfunhappy
Member
Even as someone who's getting a Vive, I appreciate what Oculus is doing in terms of funding VR development. It's not that different from the reason I'm generally okay with platform exclusives on consoles—sure, they kind of suck, but it's unlikely that Journey, Bayonetta 2, or The Last of Us would have been made without a major hardware manufacturer bankrolling development. It's all well and good to say that the PC is different because it's always been an open platform, but the effect is the same: innovative games get the development budgets they need.
In this case, it's even better, because revive exists. All of the upsides (a major source of game development funding) with very few of the downsides (needing to buy multiple game consoles which essentially duplicate each other's functionality).
In this case, it's even better, because revive exists. All of the upsides (a major source of game development funding) with very few of the downsides (needing to buy multiple game consoles which essentially duplicate each other's functionality).
I don't think there is any reason the Vive couldn't use the exact same type of asynchronous timewarp from an actual hardware perspective. I'm sure it can. I just assumed it was something that oculus had patented or owned the rights to. Hell I don't even know if that's possible. Whatever the reason, they don't use it and it's extremely noticeable. It's let's me add 10 more cars and crank everything to high and ultra. That's pretty significant for someone who maybe only plays sims, and there are some people like that.
Personally I agree with you. I like everything about the Vive better and would recommend it to anyone over the rift any day of the week. I think Oculus current direction is embarrassing and I most likely won't be buying another one of their products. Doesn't change the fact that Asynchronous timewarp works great and that I wish the Vive had it.
Yes it's just software. The Vive does it using a slightly different technique called Interleaved reprojection, which locks the game rendering to 45 if it doesn't hit 90 and then reprojects to 90.
Why Valve hasn't figured out what Oculus has to make it completely adaptive? I have no idea. Perhaps the reason is more philosophical (don't encourage devs to use ATW as a crutch for an unoptimized game) than technical.
I would hope it's not something they can enable but are holding back for that reason. I can understand wanting to prioritize optimization but the benefits gained in seated sims are huge and the drawbacks are negligible. I suspect eventually that Devs will implement their own form of "Asynchronous Timewarp" built into the games. I know the Flyinside dev has already done some type of custom Timewarp for the Vive version of his app, but it doesn't work nearly as well as the oculus method.
Valve and HTC are also investing a ton of money and resources into VR development (I believe HTC alone is giving $100 million) and Valve is certainly not mandating exclusivity
Do we know any seemingly larger-budget games that have come out of partnerships with Valve or HTC?
That would be pretty lame. The effect is really, really great, and I'd love to see it on the Vive.viveks86 said:
The only support I've officially heard of is that Valve has invited the Budget Cuts guys to Bellevue while they are developing
Seems so http://steamcommunity.com/app/300060/discussions/0/365163686036533760/
The discount is valid for a week, so got time to mull it, maybe they'll release the Vive patch before the sale is over
Even The Lab, which is developed by Valve isnt exclusive to The Vive.
Peterthumpa
Member
So, holy shit.
This is my VR killer app. One of the few times I wish I had a Vive instead of the Rift.
This is my VR killer app. One of the few times I wish I had a Vive instead of the Rift.
So my Vive is coming tomorrow. Which games should I play when I get it? Any specific stand outs?
What is your killer app?
What is your killer app?
Peterthumpa
Member
The first game to come out of HTC's 100 million budget should be shown this week.
http://venturebeat.com/2016/05/26/htc-is-making-its-first-vr-game-for-its-vive-headset/
I guess you should start with The Lab. Then Budget Cuts, Space Pirate Trainer, Audio Shield, Tilt Brush, theBlu in no particular order. I don't really remember what is free or paid though.
Edit: Wait, I guess most of those are paid. I was confused because I got some of those titles for free with the Vive. Is the Vive bundle still active..?
And in a similar context it's worth mentioning that HTC also invested 10 million in Wevr, the developers behind "theBlu".
GlamFM
Banned
No
I don't have Bluetooth too. The Vive has one.
Coolio.
Grüsse aus der schönsten Stadt am Rhein.
Just watched this video on simultaneous multi projection on pascal. VR specifics start at 15m but the whole thing is pretty interesting.
https://youtu.be/mq8T42ymiBw
If their numbers are even close to being realised it could significantly increase quality by not having to render two viewports separately, plus rendering way fewer pixels. Combined with the already big performance jump of pascal (at least compared to the minimum spec of a 970) then this could be fantastic for VR performance and image quality
https://youtu.be/mq8T42ymiBw
If their numbers are even close to being realised it could significantly increase quality by not having to render two viewports separately, plus rendering way fewer pixels. Combined with the already big performance jump of pascal (at least compared to the minimum spec of a 970) then this could be fantastic for VR performance and image quality
Juts cheat if you need to. I had the same problem. My chaperone walls still match with my real walls just fine
Thing is, devs need to support it specifically. Or maybe just the engine, I don't know, but it isn't completely free, which can hinder implementation.
Hoping it gets adopted though, and that AMD has similar function/support.
Scapegoat
Member
Keep kajiggering man... I have the same dimensions as you and it took me quite a few (like 8-10) attempts to get a space that I was happy with.
I'm hoping it will effectively be free if (when) unity and UE support it.
But even if not, I think it is a big enough step forward that devs will adopt it quickly.
If the performance advantage approx. holds up I can't even see how developers have a choice but to implement it.
Guardian Monkey
Member
.
This would be a setting from an engine right? To go as an option to choose in the settings menus of game I would imagine. At least for unity and ue4 would think this is how it would work:
Guhnmystro
Member
Ordered my vive yesterday, should I expect a long wait between ordering and it shipping?
From the posts I've seen as of late, shouldn't be more than a week between placing an order and it shipping.
Wowfunhappy
Member
That's great, but it doesn't change the fact that Oculus is ALSO helping VR game development move forward. More games getting larger budgets is an always a good thing.
(The one exception would be if Oculus, or Valve for that matter, was moneyhating titles that were already being developed in order to get exclusivity, a la Microsoft with Rise of the Tomb Raider. As far as I'm aware, however, this isn't happening)
It's still stupid that they're making them exclusive. Straight up poisoning the well.
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