I just got threatened to be sent to collections because I can't pay for an ambulance

Status
Not open for further replies.
Your way would make insurance unless for catastrophic situations and only useful for common medical cost.

However it's kind of like insurance works - you make a gamble. If you don't think something bad will happen to you or your house - don't get an insurance. For a peace of mind - pay premium and forget about the rest. However it seems that paying for insurance in America is just the beginning cost-wise.
 
My sister passed out at a local grocery store 10 minutes away from a hospital but somebody called an ambulance, she turned out to be fine but the ambulance ride 10 minutes to the hospital cost close to 1000 dollars. Thank god my family has good insurance.

However it's kind of like insurance works - you make a gamble. If you don't think something bad will happen to you or your house - don't get an insurance. For a peace of mind - pay premium and forget about the rest. However it seems that paying for insurance in America is just the beginning cost-wise.

My dad never used to pay for insurance on things like rental cars, but he got in a small fender bender while driving a U-Haul, and it really cost him. Now he always gets the insurance.
 
Sure it makes more sense not to spread it over the two calendar years. Thx.

Last question - is co-pay kicking in only once the deductible is paid?

Co-pay is typically always there. For instance, I pretty much always have to pay at least $30 for any service. If these are normal office visits or preventative care, that's typically all I'll ever have to pay. If it's a more specialized service such as emergency care, then I have to pay 30% after I've hit my high deductible.

Co-pays can change depending on your premium or plan. The high plan my employer offers still has the $30 office visit co-pay, but it's 10% for other services after a very low deductible. On the other end, at my last job I had a high deductible plan where I had no co-pays at all.
 
Thanks a lot for the info. I knew very little about the healthcare system in the US. It may be possible I will be moving to the US next year so every bit of information like that helps.
 
I started a new job in September, which didnt provide any sort of healthcare options for the first 8 months of employment. Not a big deal, I never get sick.

As "luck" would have it, two months in, I get my first kidney stone. Pain, so... much... pain. Went to a hospital near Cincinnati that my physician recommended me to as they were known to help those without insurance.

Here was my bill breakdown with no insurance consideration.
Hospital - $4755
Physician - $667
Radiology - $253
Lab - $68

For an hour and a half at the hospital (which I was only there that long due to that they have to keep you like 45 minutes after they give you morphine or something like that). I saw the doctor three times MAYBE totaling 5 minutes.

You get so many bills, you wonder what the hell the hospital bill is even for if everything done while you are there is billed individually on top of it! Hell, at one point, I was semi-expecting a bill from Time Warner Cable for having the cable on while I was in the room.

Get kidney stone in Germany:
Go to Hospital:
10€ pls.
You give them 10€.
Done.
 
I've only been rushed to hospital in an ambulance once, and I was in Japan which has a partial NHS/patient pay system. I didn't get charged for the ambulance, and after bloodwork, tests, and an effing MRI, I owed the equivalent of ~$200 USD, which I paid in cash right then and there. I about did a backflip.

My wife got hit by a car here in the states a couple years ago. Her out-of-pocket ambulance bill alone was 3 times my entire hospital bill in Japan.

It blows my fucking mind that some people not only don't want NHS, but rage against it like it's evil incarnate. At the very least, it's a debatable subject. Conservative media does a damn find job of indoctrinating.
 
Uh...that's how insurance works. Insurance will pay 80% or something, but you pay the 20% out of pocket. Or you have a high deductible plan, and pay (for example) $2500 and once that's paid, everything else is covered by insurance for the remainder of the year. Read the damn things you sign up for.

what's the point of insurance if you still end up having to pay out of your pocket?

that sounds like a pretty amazing and disgusting racket. you pay insurance but you also pay for some of your hospital costs. what does the insurance cover then?

The idea of insurance is to help pay for high-cost, catastrophic care, not for small routine stuff. The purpose of the co-pay is to have some of your skin in the game so that you seek medical care for things that matter. If there's no cost to you, then there will be people who will abuse it for every little issue thereby raising the costs for everyone.
 
I did read the whole thread. Guy wants to spend his money on video games instead of health insurance, has no clue about his health insurance coverage like any adult should. Is depressed but is capable of holding down a job (post history).

The system sucks. It's broken because it's a mangled patchwork of mandates, free rides and/or great coverage for a select few at the expense of everyone else - and that "everyone else" is often a group that can't afford that expense. It's not the fault of the people in the system using it to their benefit. That is just what humans do. It's the fault of the people who designed the system, who fail to understand the backwardness of the systems and incentives they create.

Still, you should do what it takes to survive within the system until it changes. If you're too helpless to make very basic decisions like planning ahead for health care expenses instead of blowing any money you have on entertainment, then maybe you should be treated like a child, with that money taken away and spent for you. You can't have it both ways.

Sure you can. You can not pay the extortion. When somebody is being robbed I don't blame them for having purchased video games in the past.
 
I'm 22, about to graduate, and have no health insurance because my single mother's coverage was severed by her former employer (She had a massive stroke and is now paralyzed).

She has to pay for her truckloads of medicine out of her retirement savings and depend on the support of my grandparents. If she gets sick again she will be ruined. Hopefully she can get approved by Minnesotacare but there is no guarantee.

Heres hoping I get a job and solid insurance and dont get sick.
 
The one that took me to the hospital in October when I almost died.

Crotchety old bitch called me and demanded I pay up today or she'd send me to collections. Repeatedly refused to believe me when I told her I was on my mom's insurance on account of I have no job so I'd need to talk to them. Then she just hung up on me.

Because MURICA. Clearly nothing wrong with our healthcare system.

I was charged for my mom's ambulance up front when she went in with chest pains a few months ago. And this is in Canada.

Only $40 so I wasn't too fussed. Still, seems like there would be a place and time for that.
 
I have too many health problems to live in the US. The NHS ain't perfect, but it's got be through 29 years with a list of health problems that would cost me a bomb if I was paying insurance or worse out my pocket.
 
Dude that's asinine. That's a long time. Go to a doctor, not a hospital if you're worried.

Eh, unfortunately, I have a pretty good idea what it is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporomandibular_joint_disorder

My mom has suffered from it for decades and I figured it would catch up to me sooner or later too. One side has always had a click to it, although it doesn't hurt at all (although in the last few months, it's become a more dramatic "click"). Now the other side is acting up but it's actually painful. In fact, this morning, I can't really bite down all the way on that side. It sucks. But if I go in, it's going to cost me a 20% co-pay on

-a doctor
-some other specialist
-an x-ray
-the x-ray operator
-some other thing
-some other other thing

...and it'll wind up being half a dozen itemized bills, each for a couple hundred. I know I need to go in and get it looked at sooner or later, but I'm trying to buy a house right now. And owing all these accounts will not only cost money, but may discourage the lender. And I already had my credit blown up once when I needed my appendix out nearly a decade ago. The road to repairing that was long and hard.


Incidentally, non-USA people: this is a typical story.
 
You have to pay for an ambulance in Canada. I think it's like $60 or something. I've only ever seen two ambulance bills in my life and they were a few years ago so I don't remember exactly what they were. They were definately under $100 however.

it's now around $125 + $1.25/km. It's free for persons injured in a traffic accident, persons injured in an industrial accident, persons transported between two institutions of the health and social services network, persons age 65 and over and persons receiving Income Security.
 
TMJ is actually a special case with my insurance. Apparently it's really expensive to cover or something because they're putting in a cap starting with the next plan year.

Yeah, as I understand it, it can be kind of a pain in the ass to get covered because it sort of almost falls into dentistry... enough that a lot of providers want to push it off on the dental insurance company and the dental company wants to push it right back. Basically, both entities have just enough wiggle room to try to not cover it.

(For those who don't know, most US health insurance companies don't cover dental directly, you usually get a separate plan with a separate company for that)
 
The thing i don't understand is how on earth can you have insurance over something so vital and basic as one's health? Cars? yeah. Travel? yeah. Home? yeah.

But health? This is the root of the problem. When it comes to a person's mental or physical wellbeing, you shouldn't be under the mercy of a paying system. It should be a basic right to be treated with no strings attached.
 
The state of healthcare in America is just absolutely terrifying financially. I can't tell you how relieved I was to get some health insurance through my employer.

My father who already reached retirement age still works, talking care of my mom because of the insurance. Good thing too because the benefits lapsed for a while until he got it fixed to cover my mom again. We took her to doctors to do tests and we found out she was really sick. I can't begin to imagine what would have happened without the insurance, the hospital tests and medicine my mom needed would have destroyed us financially all the while my mother's health was at risk. It was just supposed to be simple "I'm just kinda tired" thing my mother was feeling too.

I can't believe people in this country fight tooth and nail against much needed healthcare reform; it's appalling.
 
The amazing part is that people still argue that capitalism will always provide the best system at the cheapest price. The stats prove otherwise, especially in America.
 
it's now around $125 + $1.25/km. It's free for persons injured in a traffic accident, persons injured in an industrial accident, persons transported between two institutions of the health and social services network, persons age 65 and over and persons receiving Income Security.

You sure? website says $45 if deemed medically necessary and $240 if not.

http://www.health.gov.on.ca/english/public/program/ehs/land/service_qa.html#2

Edit: Unless it's different in your province.
 
Get kidney stone in Germany:
Go to Hospital:
10€ pls.
You give them 10€.
Done.

Why do you pay 10 euros? Is it to discourage needless admissions?

I completely support the NHS. not because it has saved me money (it probably hasn't compared to an insurance system, as yet) but because it means I also don't have to worry about my grandparents and family and friends. I will always know that if they need healthcare they will get it. Just knowing a family member didn't have full insurance would make me anxious.

I think in 2000 years they will look back at the NHS as an indication of civilisation, and the american system as callous.
 
I'm still convinced the U.S. has one of the best healthcare systems in regards to treatment of diseases and performing successful surgeries, but among the very worst in accessibility to and affordability of said services.
 
I'm still convinced the U.S. has one of the best healthcare systems in regards to treatment of diseases and performing successful surgeries, but among the very worst in accessibility to and affordability of said services.

I'll give that to you if the disease is cancer or autism.
But otherwise no.
I mean insurance companies are now sending people to India for surgeries. The surgery is just as good and a fraction of price. So much so that shipping someone out there and putting them up for a few days is still cheaper for the same quality.

If the quality was so much better in the states this would not be possible due to liability.
 
Well, now I know I must be careful around here, now that I move to the US....

It's funny, even with NO INSURANCE, I payed a little over 20 dollars when I broke my wrist during Kali-Skrima practice, and no more than 10 bucks when I required a physician consultation, lab tests, and some prescription drugs when I got insurance, for which I was paying a little over 70 dollar by month, and I had my parents insured as well (FULL insurance, dental, vision, consultation and drugstore).

Oh, did I mentioned this was in México?
 
Well, now I know I must be careful around here, now that I move to the US....

It's funny, even with NO INSURANCE, I payed a little over 20 dollars when I broke my wrist during Kali-Skrima practice, and no more than 10 bucks when I required a physician consultation, lab tests, and some prescription drugs when I got insurance, for which I was paying a little over 70 dollar by month, and I had my parents insured as well (FULL insurance, dental, vision, consultation and drugstore).

Oh, did I mentioned this was in México?

Yeah try that here and you'll be ruined financially.
 
The problem with the U.S health system is simple.

In other countries everyone pays a little (Well comparatively) for the healthcare in the country.

In the USA the sick whose able to pay, pays for the healthcare in the country.

For the completely healthy the U.S is great since they don't have to pay anything. For the poor the healthcare is great since they can't pay for it but that can't be refused so they get healthcare for nothing. For the unhealthy that can pay for it, it sucks since they have to pay a lot extra to subsidize the poor.

50 billion in hospital cost goes unpaid a year. Who do you think is making for it?

At the end of the day this is why you need NHS. Capitalism does not make sense for goods and services that can not be refused.
 
Sure you can. You can not pay the extortion. When somebody is being robbed I don't blame them for having purchased video games in the past.

The line of reasoning you are referring to seems a little like questioning poor people because they got microwaves: "Why are you buying a non-essential item, dirty poor? Clearly you should be able to send your kids to college like a responsible person, if you can afford a $50 microwave oven. You're just not budgeting like an adult."

The insidious part about not having money to pay into an extorting system, is that you may very well have some degree of disposable cash at any given point in time, but still not enough to make dealing with the extortion practical. No matter how you scrimp and save.

The problem is one of sustainability. Almost everyone I know who does not have health insurance is more than capable of "budgeting". They feed themselves, keep their car maintained, buy fuel, pay rent. Most of them also see a movie or buy a small piece of entertainment once in a while. The money that goes towards those items is not enough to make a difference when it comes to buying decent health care - or enough to deal with the expenses you often incur even when your health care kicks in.

But clearly they are just not budgeting properly.

This of course has nothing to do with choosing not to pay into an extorting system because it's wrong. Which, personally, I also find a defensible decision, but realize that a vast number of people would be blind to that and simply blame the person in question for not being "responsible" like themselves.

The problem with the U.S health system is simple.

In other countries everyone pays a little (Well comparatively) for the healthcare in the country.

In the USA the sick whose able to pay, pays for the healthcare in the country.

For the completely healthy the U.S is great since they don't have to pay anything. For the poor the healthcare is great since they can't pay for it but that can't be refused so they get healthcare for nothing. For the unhealthy that can pay for it, it sucks since they have to pay a lot extra to subsidize the poor.

50 billion in hospital cost goes unpaid a year. Who do you think is making for it?

At the end of the day this is why you need NHS. Capitalism does not make sense for goods and services that can not be refused.

Because bootstraps.

Seriously, at times it seems as simple as that: to many Americans NHS is incomprehensible because they have been conditioned to see society in the most simplistic terms possible, where every man is his own castle and kingdom. Anything society provides to other people = that person taking something from you personally that they don't deserve. Make them go earn it themselves! Lazy bums. There seems to be somewhat little holistic thought in the American consciousness. Or consideration that society serves a purpose aside from enabling personal achievement and personal wealth gathering. Everything comes down to dividing us up into winners and losers, with capitalism as the referee and score tracker.

This attitude filters down to every aspect of life, including the right to basic health and bodily well being (in order to, you know, enable people to go out and achieve something in life. Or merely be allowed to live.)

It's all perceptual, as people have generally been conditioned to accept other communal services society provides, such as infrastructure and a military force that defends their status as a sovereign entity and the right to be pricks to each other.
 
Even if you have health insurance, you have to spend some time educating yourself how it works, what the ins and outs are of your policy, what you are covered for, and how much.

If you are not pro-active about your health coverage, you're gonna get fucked at some point by the system. Educating yourself will also let you shop around for non-emergency situations.

Yes this stuff confusing for the average person, and it sucks, but its the one we have and it ain't going away any time soon.

You can sit on a message board all you want, rally a few hundred people around you, find a little sympathy, but thats not going to stop your shit from going to collections, getting your credit negatively affected, and getting harassed by bill collectors.

If you're ever in the hospital, they should send a financial counselor to talk with you and if they don't, then ask for one. You should get all messy financial details squared up and on lockdown before you walk out of the hospital, for several reasons. You're likely to forget about the bill, or ignore it 6 months down the line when someone comes calling you about it. If you have no money, tell the financial counselor or business manager so they can try to get you qualified for assistance. Be fucking pro active about it and save yourself some headache later. Ask the finance people exactly what your insurance is going to cover. Again, if you wait 6 months later when the collections start coming in, nobody is going to give a shit to help you because you couldn't be bothered to help yourself when you got better and was able to leave the hospital.
 
If you're ever in the hospital, they should send a financial counselor to talk with you and if they don't, then ask for one. You should get all messy financial details squared up and on lockdown before you walk out of the hospital, for several reasons. You're likely to forget about the bill, or ignore it 6 months down the line when someone comes calling you about it. If you have no money, tell the financial counselor or business manager so they can try to get you qualified for assistance.
I know you mean well with this, but it sounds absolutely ridiculous.

"You're sick, possibly really, REALLY sick... but what you should do is speak to a business manager about finance options, payment plans and whatnot."

It's just barbaric.
 
I know you mean well with this, but it sounds absolutely ridiculous.

"You're sick, possibly really, REALLY sick... but what you should do is speak to a business manager about finance options, payment plans and whatnot."

It's just barbaric.

Just because you're sick ain't no reason to leave your boot straps at home, pal.
 
I remember a few years ago when I had a kidney stone they had me pay for it while I was all drugged up. Made me feel really weird.
 
Even if you have health insurance, you have to spend some time educating yourself how it works, what the ins and outs are of your policy, what you are covered for, and how much.

If you are not pro-active about your health coverage, you're gonna get fucked at some point by the system. Educating yourself will also let you shop around for non-emergency situations.

Yes this stuff confusing for the average person, and it sucks, but its the one we have and it ain't going away any time soon.

You can sit on a message board all you want, rally a few hundred people around you, find a little sympathy, but thats not going to stop your shit from going to collections, getting your credit negatively affected, and getting harassed by bill collectors.

If you're ever in the hospital, they should send a financial counselor to talk with you and if they don't, then ask for one. You should get all messy financial details squared up and on lockdown before you walk out of the hospital, for several reasons. You're likely to forget about the bill, or ignore it 6 months down the line when someone comes calling you about it. If you have no money, tell the financial counselor or business manager so they can try to get you qualified for assistance. Be fucking pro active about it and save yourself some headache later. Ask the finance people exactly what your insurance is going to cover. Again, if you wait 6 months later when the collections start coming in, nobody is going to give a shit to help you because you couldn't be bothered to help yourself when you got better and was able to leave the hospital.

Thanks for the pep talk, but I plan to endure our shitty system AND complain about it.
 
For an hour and a half at the hospital (which I was only there that long due to that they have to keep you like 45 minutes after they give you morphine or something like that). I saw the doctor three times MAYBE totaling 5 minutes.
This is the result of a system driven by a need for money. My dad is a doc, and everyday he is told by his superiors that he "needs to bring his numbers up". They tell him that he shouldn't spend more than 15 minutes on a patient, but he tells them that he can't do everything that is required of him, and do it right, all in 15 minutes. There have been subtle hints that they may let him go.

The other day we went to the post office, and it took us 20 minutes to sort something out. He got this really depressed look on his face, and just lamented, "They're allowed more time than me in dealing with packages. Meanwhile, I'm trying to take care of someone's health."
 
I did read the whole thread. Guy wants to spend his money on video games instead of health insurance, has no clue about his health insurance coverage like any adult should. Is depressed but is capable of holding down a job (post history).

The system sucks. It's broken because it's a mangled patchwork of mandates, free rides and/or great coverage for a select few at the expense of everyone else - and that "everyone else" is often a group that can't afford that expense. It's not the fault of the people in the system using it to their benefit. That is just what humans do. It's the fault of the people who designed the system, who fail to understand the backwardness of the systems and incentives they create.

Still, you should do what it takes to survive within the system until it changes. If you're too helpless to make very basic decisions like planning ahead for health care expenses instead of blowing any money you have on entertainment, then maybe you should be treated like a child, with that money taken away and spent for you. You can't have it both ways.

So I'm supposed to live my life under the assumption that I'm going to lose my job and go to the hospital tomorrow and never spend money on anything fun?

Fuck off.

Yeah, I should probably know more about how my insurance works. Yeah, I should probably be more of a responsible, independent adult. But it's been enough of a struggle for me to even get where I am today without killing myself or winding up in a long-term mental institution or jail or something that I can kinda forgive myself if I haven't done everything perfectly.
 
The amazing part is that people still argue that capitalism will always provide the best system at the cheapest price. The stats prove otherwise, especially in America.

Just compare medicare advantage (private plans) to medicare, and is stupidly obvious.
 
So I'm supposed to live my life under the assumption that I'm going to lose my job and go to the hospital tomorrow and never spend money on anything fun?

Fuck off.

Yeah, I should probably know more about how my insurance works. Yeah, I should probably be more of a responsible, independent adult. But it's been enough of a struggle for me to even get where I am today without killing myself or winding up in a long-term mental institution or jail or something that I can kinda forgive myself if I haven't done everything perfectly.
Maybe you should grow the fuck up. You're an unemployed adult living at home, who used a non-essential government service and didn't expect to have to pay for it. Maybe if you had your own insurance you would realize that ambulance services aren't free, although you should know that anyways because it's basic knowledge. Surprise, when you don't pay your bills they get sent to collection agencies. Don't get pissy when people call you out on your bullshit when you make a bullshit thread.
 
Maybe you should grow the fuck up. You're an unemployed adult living at home, who used a non-essential government service and didn't expect to have to pay for it. Maybe if you had your own insurance you would realize that ambulance services aren't free, although you should know that anyways because it's basic knowledge. Surprise, when you don't pay your bills they get sent to collection agencies. Don't get pissy when people call you out on your bullshit when you make a bullshit thread.

Personally, I dont think people should be judgmental turds without knowing the entire situation. And no one here knows his entire situation

And ambulance rides are usually covered by your insurance so long as you are 'in-network'. Which, to me, is insanely stupid. No mr ambulance, im unconcious and bleeding from my brain, but I dont want you to pick me up cause youre out of network and would be hella expensive. What a stupid system
 
So I'm supposed to live my life under the assumption that I'm going to lose my job and go to the hospital tomorrow and never spend money on anything fun?

Fuck off.

Yeah, I should probably know more about how my insurance works. Yeah, I should probably be more of a responsible, independent adult. But it's been enough of a struggle for me to even get where I am today without killing myself or winding up in a long-term mental institution or jail or something that I can kinda forgive myself if I haven't done everything perfectly.

I would hope that you learn from this experience. It's not about never spending money on anything fun; it's about being prepared. You bought a new game system and a few games when you were unemployed and had no savings. That part will rub people the wrong way. It's a wrong priority of what you should be doing. You can spend here and there for fun, but you should also be saving for unexpected events like this. Have a bit a savings before you start making large purchases.
 
Maybe you should grow the fuck up. You're an unemployed adult living at home, who used a non-essential government service and didn't expect to have to pay for it. Maybe if you had your own insurance you would realize that ambulance services aren't free, although you should know that anyways because it's basic knowledge. Surprise, when you don't pay your bills they get sent to collection agencies. Don't get pissy when people call you out on your bullshit when you make a bullshit thread.
Lol

You know thread whining is banned.

Also, when are ambulances a non essential service.
no wonder we can't have progress with some people heads so far up their asses.
 
My GF went to the doctors office and got an ultrasound for some stomach pain she was having. She had to pay $400 for that. Monday she got about bill in the mail for $600 in other fees. All with great health insurance.

We were there maybe 4 hours and saw someone for 10-15 minutes.

America, fuck no
 
I have dental and medical insurance, but they won't cover my jaw problems I'm experiencing. So out of pocket I have to pay $2800 for a 6 month splint therapy treatment, as well as $900 for physical therapy. TMJ treatments are treated about the same as chiropractors.

Just thought this was a good place to vent about that. :(

oh yeah... and they did an MRI for planning my treatment, the insurance covered $300, but I still had to pay about $700.
 
My GF went to the doctors office and got an ultrasound for some stomach pain she was having. She had to pay $400 for that. Monday she got about bill in the mail for $600 in other fees. All with great health insurance.

We were there maybe 4 hours and saw someone for 10-15 minutes.

America, fuck no

I think that would be $35 in Australia.
 
My GF went to the doctors office and got an ultrasound for some stomach pain she was having. She had to pay $400 for that. Monday she got about bill in the mail for $600 in other fees. All with great health insurance.

We were there maybe 4 hours and saw someone for 10-15 minutes.

America, fuck no

Yeah, really fuckin pisses me off when I go to the doctor for just a couple hours, actually see someone for a total of ten minutes, and get a bill for hundreds of dollars AFTER insurance. The fact that there are millions of americans defending this healthcare system is disgusting.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom