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"I need a New PC!" 2011 Edition of SSD's for everyone! |OT|
- Thread starter Hazaro
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So I'm getting some money monday and sort of want to get something for my PC. Right now I have 4 gigs of ram in my computer (two sticks) and thinking about getting another 4 gigs. Can I just buy two of the same sticks and just plug them into the motherboard? Last time I did just this my computer would BSOD all the time.
black_vegeta
Member
Coldsnap said:
Yeah, make sure they're the exact samething.
·feist· said:
It does me well but I definitely notice performance issues in newer games like JC2 or CPU dependent stuff like SC2 and Civ5. My 2011 build is also going to be just about as much as getting my woman off her Athlon 4400+/X1500 to something that she can actually play stuff with me without choking back low framerates on minimum settings. However with the house and wedding coming up it's going to be hard to justify spending on components. I'll be renting out the basement and depending on cash flow might even rent out the garage as well. I've slowly been collecting minor parts this year during killer sales. So far I've picked up 8GB of DDR3 for 58$, a TPN-650 for 30$ and a hyper 212+ for 10$. Stuff like the MB/CPU/GPU will wait until i'm ready to buy. In the meantime if I can find a good midcase with a couple of USB3 internal headers I might jump on that. I probably won't touch storage until November either. Both HDD and SSDs are only getting cheaper with time.
I'm looking at the Dell U2711 monitor and it's a 27" monitor with a resolution of 2560*1440. Now the rig I'm planning to build won't be able to run games at acceptable settings and FPS with the res that high. So what is it going to be like running games at lower resolutions scaled to full screen? And I'm guessing running in windowed mode would defeat the point of buying a huge monitor for gaming?
ElyrionX said:
Although you can take a performance hit running in windowed mode as far as image quality goes windows > scaled. When you scale an image the monitor has to decide to keep some pixels and throw away others, leaving you with a blurry mess. The closer you get the resolution to the ratio of the native resolution the less the blury shows up. For instance if you're running at half horizontal and vertical resolution each pixel turns into four pixels perfectly. Generally I always run at native resolution and lower image settings until I hit a framerate I like. Many games won't support windowed mode and those that do might not perform as well as running in full screen. Games like PvZ I play in windowed mode as their UI is more designed around that, I don't feel like panning my mouse constantly over my entire 24" screen for casual games.
black_vegeta
Member
Just ordered my ASUS monitor, 2 more items to get (Motherboard & GPU). 
TheExodu5 said:
Hmm. Not really, no. I don't need that kind of resolution. I just need a larger display than the 22" I'm having now and the Dell U2711 looks really nice.
I hadn't thought of that before though 32" would be somewhat of an overkill at the distance I am from my PC.
How do you hook it up? HDMI? Also, is this possible with a 32" that only does 1080i and not 1080p? Or do I need a Full HD 1080p screen for this?
ElyrionX said:
Yeah, I use a DVI -> HDMI connection from my GTX 570. Some GPUs have straight HDMI connections now...it results in the same thing.
And yeah, you need a 1080p screen. But like I said, they're cheap.
The only problem is finding a suitable model. The main criteria is that you want something with low input lag. Last year's LGs and Panasonic TVs were great for this...I'm not sure which are the best to get anymore. I have the Sony 32EX400, which is pretty good in terms of input lag, and produces some awesome blacks for an LCD. Sadly, it doesn't really seem to be available anymore.
How far away are you from your monitor? I've convinced 2 friends to move to a TV now, and they'd never go back. We all sit in between 2-4' from the TV. Having a TV that size at a fairly close distance is like playing on a projector. It's amazing. The benefits of having a TV over a monitor are: it's much easier to render 1080p than 1600p (takes half the power), it's cheap, you can hook up many consoles and HT devices to it and get perfect scaling. Obviously something like the Dell would produce higher IQ, but that resolution is very difficult to run...I wouldn't run something like that on less than a 6950 2GB (though preferably something closer to a GTX 580).
Oh, and I'm not sure how they compare to the professional displays like Dell in terms of color fidelity, but they are far, far better than the TN panel monitors that are everywhere.
LCD TV wise, LGs are probably still the way to go since they use IPS panels on more of their sets.
AS for monitors, there's a few good TN panels that come to mind:
HP 2509b - Glossy TN.
LG 2442PA - Non-Glossy TN.
And here's a review of the U2410, which is basically the little brother of the U2711.
Glossy TN, to me, is the best of both worlds; better gaming monitor due to being a TN and glossy has more vibrant colors. IPS panels tend to ghost more.
AS for monitors, there's a few good TN panels that come to mind:
HP 2509b - Glossy TN.
LG 2442PA - Non-Glossy TN.
And here's a review of the U2410, which is basically the little brother of the U2711.
Glossy TN, to me, is the best of both worlds; better gaming monitor due to being a TN and glossy has more vibrant colors. IPS panels tend to ghost more.
ElyrionX said:
It should run you quite a bit cheaper than the Dell.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0039RRCJ8/?tag=neogaf0e-20
vs $800 for a Dell U2711.
(only problem with that LG TV above is that I believe it needs to be bought in store, as there is a panel lottery: MVA vs IPS...you want the IPS)
scy said:
It's a tradeoff. TN panels are more responsive and more suited to competitive gaming...but man the colors suck so much when compared to a nice IPS or PVA panel. Ghosting is there on the current IPS panels...but it's not terribly noticeable...especially with all the games implementing motion blur nowadays.
TheExodu5 said:
I'm not from the States and the U2711 and 32" TVs are priced roughly the same around here.
Also, I didn't know LG TVs use IPS panels and it's lottery. How do you even check what panel it is before buying? Also, from my experience with LG LCD TVs, they tend to have very poor image quality compared to Samsung and Sony. What makes their TV good for PC usage over a Samsung or Sony, then?
EDIT: Just wanted to clarify that the DUll U2711 is actually cheaper than $800 over here. I think it's about $700 and that's before the occasional deals that Dell dishes out every once in a while.
Damn, assembling this pc is taking much longer than expected. Motherboard is in the case with the cpu, fan and ram. Still have a feeling I have a bit too much thermal grease on the cpu but w/e its maybe only a tiny tad. Mainy having problems with the motherboard and case instructions. I'm just not understanding them like my last pc I built.
There's a few sizes that are guaranteed IPS panels, if I recall; it's a lottery on certain panel sizes. And I upgraded from a Sharp and Samsung panels prior to my current LG and I'd say my image quality now is just as good if not better after calibration.
Besides that, there's a check based off the model number or you can inspect the pixel shape.
Well, yeah, it's a tradeoff but, to me, a Glossy TN is the best in-between of the three options (non-glossy TN, glossy TN, IPS). We'll see how I like the colors after calibrating my HP 2509b when it arrives compared to my LG.
Besides that, there's a check based off the model number or you can inspect the pixel shape.
TheExodu5 said:
Well, yeah, it's a tradeoff but, to me, a Glossy TN is the best in-between of the three options (non-glossy TN, glossy TN, IPS). We'll see how I like the colors after calibrating my HP 2509b when it arrives compared to my LG.
ElyrionX said:
You really can't compare "image quality" as you see them in store. Samsungs are usually pretty terrible in real world usage...color accuracy is not good, input lag is horrible...they're usually just set up to 'pop' out at you at the store. Sony has some good panels and some bad panels.
The main issue with PC usage is input lag. Some Samsungs have 100-150ms of input lag...this will make your mouse feel incredibly sluggish. The low end LG TVs have very low input lag...closer to 10-30ms, and the low end Sonys have around 30-40ms input lag. The higher end 120Hz models actually get worse, usually going up to around 100ms input lag.
Low end TVs today are usually very good, as long as you get a decent panel. Where they get bad is when you start buying into the slightly more expensive 120Hz and LED backlit sets...those actually look much worse than the low end 60Hz CCFL sets.
scy said:
For the LG, I think the poorer MVA panels have a D in the serial number, while the IPS panels have a W.
I need to find a TV out there that comes with a guaranteed low input lag IPS panel to recommend to people.
TheExodu5 said:
Thanks. I need to go look this up and think about it.
Also, if I purchase another monitor with a higher res than the 1680*1050 on my current 22". Will I have any issues running both monitors at different resolutions in a dual monitor setup with a single GPU?
TheExodu5 said:
Yeah, was pretty sure it was "W" for IPS but not sure on the others. Trying to dig up the panels that are more-or-less guaranteed IPS (42" & 47" LD550 I know is an S-IPS, though that's a bit big for this discussion) over at AVS.
I know according to LG all their xx650's are IPS and they say all their (i.e., from LG) panels are S-IPS. Some panel sizes for them aren't LG-make though which is where this lottery shenanigans comes from. Kind of ridiculous, really.
Honestly, I'd just suggest sticking with monitors (TN or IPS) vs getting a TV to use as it's just simpler to figure it out :x
Damn, it's still on sale here in UK!
And quite cheap for a 32inch S-IPS panel.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B003FMSIQ8/
What's the difference between S-IPS and IPS?
And quite cheap for a 32inch S-IPS panel.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B003FMSIQ8/
What's the difference between S-IPS and IPS?
scy said:
Again. the 32LD450 has been the recommended TV for a while now, but there is a problem: panel lottery.
With the 32LD450, you can get MVA, S-IPS, or H-IPS. The S-IPS are the best as they have the best pixel response times (lower ghosting) and better viewing angles and colors. The MVA are the worst. It's completely up to chance as to what you get, unless you buy it in store and look at the serial number on the box (there will be a W in the case of H-IPS/S-IPS, and a D in case of MVA). I believe the only way to tell the difference in between S-IPS and H-IPS is using a magnifying glass to inspect the pixel pattern. H-IPS, I believe, has three horizontal lines for RGB. S-IPS seems to use chevrons.
I'm thinking there must be a guaranteed 32" IPS panel with low input lag out there...right?
My suggestion: you could just go to a store and pick one up (easy return policy. See if you like the size, and see if the picture is to your liking. If not, return it, then order a Dell.
Two others to consider: LG xxLK450 and the Philips xxPFL5405, though it's a bit more expensive (and I think it uses an LG panel anyway). Again, this is without any real research short of making sure they have IPS panels.
As for S-IPS, it's just "Super"-IPS, which I'm fairly sure most LG panels (which != LG TVs, for the record) are.
Yes and there's little to be done about it, honestly. There's very few absolutely 100% guaranteed IPS TVs. 32" is a fairly common size so it's not always an LG Panel in it for these models. And, yes, H-IPS are the three-banded "squares" vs the S-IPS chevron shape.
Basically, this. You can pick them up in store and check to see what panel type they are (MVA vs an IPS based off the serial number if visible) and do some magnifying glass looks to the panel itself at home to determine which type of IPS it is. It's just better peace of mind, honestly.
Again, hence why I suggest to just grab a PC monitor as they're always helpfully labeled TN or IPS so then you just get to pull your hair out over everything else besides panel type.
As for S-IPS, it's just "Super"-IPS, which I'm fairly sure most LG panels (which != LG TVs, for the record) are.
The Exodu5 said:
Yes and there's little to be done about it, honestly. There's very few absolutely 100% guaranteed IPS TVs. 32" is a fairly common size so it's not always an LG Panel in it for these models. And, yes, H-IPS are the three-banded "squares" vs the S-IPS chevron shape.
Basically, this. You can pick them up in store and check to see what panel type they are (MVA vs an IPS based off the serial number if visible) and do some magnifying glass looks to the panel itself at home to determine which type of IPS it is. It's just better peace of mind, honestly.
Again, hence why I suggest to just grab a PC monitor as they're always helpfully labeled TN or IPS so then you just get to pull your hair out over everything else besides panel type.
If you're just willing to buy a GTX 560 Ti, then that's my suggestion. I'd want more power and more video memory to drive 1440p.
Well it depends on what you want. There simply are no big 1080p monitors out there, so TVs are the only choice. The big IPS monitors are nice, but they're pricey, and you need the hardware to support them.
Hmmm...you can get a cheap Samsun 27" TN panel. Not sure how good it would look though.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...01431&cm_re=samsung_27-_-24-001-431-_-Product
scy said:
Well it depends on what you want. There simply are no big 1080p monitors out there, so TVs are the only choice. The big IPS monitors are nice, but they're pricey, and you need the hardware to support them.
Hmmm...you can get a cheap Samsun 27" TN panel. Not sure how good it would look though.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...01431&cm_re=samsung_27-_-24-001-431-_-Product
black_vegeta
Member
Would it be best to buy a non OC'ed GPU or a pre-OC GPU?
I plan on OC'ing it just see what boost performance I can get out it.
I plan on OC'ing it just see what boost performance I can get out it.
black_vegeta said:
Usually overclocked GPUs are absolutely not worth it. The only ones I've seen that are semi worth it are the GTX 560 Ti...there are some pretty substantial overclocks (~30%) there, which you're not guaranteed to get otherwise. I wouldn't pay anything extra fo them, though.
IMO, get the GPU with the best cooler you can, and overclock yourself. You might get bad luck in terms of overclockability, but that's the luck of the draw. Most pre-overclocks are so laughably minor that it doesn't make a difference.
black_vegeta
Member
TheExodu5 said:
Thank you for the info sir.
black_vegeta
Member
TheExodu5 said:And I should mention that while overclockability with a stock cooler is usually fine, be prepared to have a very loud video card. I haven't bothered overclocking my GTX 570 because of this.
I look forward to getting a sexy Asus DirectCu II GPU for my next upgrade.
Even with a ASUS DC II or MSI TF II? Aren't they supposed to be ninja like silent?
Edit: Gotcha. Dat stealth edit.
Now, keep in mind, fan profiles can often be set differently according to manufacturer. You'll often have to manually control it or create a profile for optimal the cooling/noise ration.
When I had my TwinFrozr GTX 275, I kept it at a constant 40% (which was the noise threshold for it being detectable over the rest of the fans in my case) and just overclocked as best as I could through there. I like have a constant fan speed...which is why I hate my current stock GTX 570. They're quiet at idle, but then spin up quite a bit during gameplay.
Try controlling your fan speed and see how high it has to go before you notice it. Set it as high as you can without noticing the fan, and see what kind of speeds/temperature you get from that. Adjust from there.
When I had my TwinFrozr GTX 275, I kept it at a constant 40% (which was the noise threshold for it being detectable over the rest of the fans in my case) and just overclocked as best as I could through there. I like have a constant fan speed...which is why I hate my current stock GTX 570. They're quiet at idle, but then spin up quite a bit during gameplay.
Try controlling your fan speed and see how high it has to go before you notice it. Set it as high as you can without noticing the fan, and see what kind of speeds/temperature you get from that. Adjust from there.
black_vegeta
Member
TheExodu5 said:
Will do.
*bookmarked for future reference*
scy said:
Is this the same LG panel?
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B004ZC3LPA/
Man, 32 inch 1080p IPS panels are so cheap. My £199 on this 24inch TN Samsung panel seems like a waste compared to them now.
The colors don't "pop" as much as S-IPS, if I recall. Other than that, they're virtually identical in terms of image quality, viewing angle, and so on.
Honestly, there's bigger worries to image quality than S-IPS vs H-IPS like anti-glare coatings that muck up some better panels (Dell has this issue, if I recall).
Here's some discussion on S-IPS vs H-IPS.
You can try but I just got a whole-hearted "Meh" when I tried. Amazon has a decent return policy that you should be able to get it returned without paying for shipping back to them possibly.
Honestly, there's bigger worries to image quality than S-IPS vs H-IPS like anti-glare coatings that muck up some better panels (Dell has this issue, if I recall).
Here's some discussion on S-IPS vs H-IPS.
Kyaw said:
You can try but I just got a whole-hearted "Meh" when I tried. Amazon has a decent return policy that you should be able to get it returned without paying for shipping back to them possibly.
Damn, had to remove the grill on my PSU because it's not flush by design or else I kind of have to prevent the power supply from dropping; and if I do that, I can't pop in the back uhh filter at the rear end of the FT02.
Sorted things out (except for the messy wiring job which I'll fix when all the new parts come in), booted up and noticed the power supply fan didn't spin up. Did some googling and they mentioned that it probably won't unless temps or load are high.
Nice.
Sorted things out (except for the messy wiring job which I'll fix when all the new parts come in), booted up and noticed the power supply fan didn't spin up. Did some googling and they mentioned that it probably won't unless temps or load are high.
Nice.
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