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Is the matrix a ruined franchise now like Star Wars and Alien?
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Stop Motion Pornography
Member
I just don't want to be labeled a bigot
Hari Seldon
Member
Alien is leagues ahead of Matrix. Alien has both a top tier horror movie and an all-time great action movie. Matrix has 1 good movie and 3 duds.
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
I mean, Alien is fucking awesome, but I think The Matrix was always trying to do something different from Alien/Terminator/Star Wars. The only commonality is they're all movies and all they all loosely fit into action/adventure with largely varying degrees of horror. Alien is at the top of the scale with the Horror and Star Wars would be at the bottom, obvs. Order 66, Palpatine's Death Eater choir, and I HATE SAND being the only horror elements I can think of in Star Wars off the top of my head. Jabba's Palace was pretty creepy before Jedi Rocks was a thing.
Tschumi
Member
... i liked matrix 2. it was pretty rich and well shot, and it spawned some great side-media.... the franchise has been dead since matrix 3, specifically since the big, pointless dragon ball Z fight with smith.
edit: i've liked every alien movie, even 4, and though i found the christian crap in prometheus nauseating that girl was a twisted corpse in covenant so it's all good lol
edit: i've liked every alien movie, even 4, and though i found the christian crap in prometheus nauseating that girl was a twisted corpse in covenant so it's all good lol
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TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
Reloaded is about equal to the original for me. The Architecht was a fantastic scene with a lot to chew on, and the people who bitched about it because "conversations and big words, how pretentious!" are the same people who don't like the new one because of a lack of action. The Merovingian ranting about cause and effect, The Oracle talking about choice, The Architecht talking about probability, the Councilor talking about irony, Smith talking about destiny. It's like all these different ideological standpoints got their turn at the podium and everyone was trying to make sense out of Neo's life, to the point where at the end, he had forsaken all of it and only followed his heart. Very human tale woven through so many philosophical and Sci fi lenses. Then the action sequences. Shiiiit. The upgraded Agents fight, the Burly Brawl, everything from the Chateau fight to the semis colliding. This movie, in retrospect, had it all. The only reason Revolutions sucks so hard in comparison is because it was clearly PART of Reloaded stabbed in the gut with a TO BE CONTINUED because it exceeded the run time allowed it by the execs. No kidding, one day when you have an afternoon free and you hate yourself, just watch Reloaded+Revolutions in one go and tell me it isn't more satisfying. I'd much prefer a Peter Jackson extended edition style film combining those two. Reloaded's focus on the Matrix completely makes up for Revolutions only spending like 30 minutes inside the actual simulation. And the Zion battle makes all the Zion politics in Reloaded feel less pointless. Master class put together.
Tschumi
Member
i'll give that a go!
i didn't appreciate the cgi in the million-smiths battle and the highway car chase, even when it came out it was obvious and even at that age i thought it kinda betrayed the original movie's pulley system, but yeah all in all i dig ur points
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
The CGI has not aged well, but I personally don't hold that against a film from 20 years ago. I mean, to me, it's the same as playing a PS1 game. The FMVs suck, but if they're clear enough to establish what the scene is trying to get across, then narratively it's fine. Mechanically it might lack, but for the point of the story, you know that Neo is powerful, Smith is weaker, but there's enough weak Smiths to give one powerful Neo trouble. The biggest thing that bugs me in that scene is the pile up, when it's CG it has the distinct green Matrix filter, but when it does a close up and focuses on the actual actors, everything is bluer, and it kind of ruins my immersion instantly for a split second.
I honestly never noticed any egregious CGI in the freeway chase, besides Neo flying in at the end, and the Twins weird phasing thing.
Tschumi
Member
the slow mo part where, i think, the agents are crouching to jump on the hood of a car and imploding that hood... that was wonky to me.. also didn't like the way neo looked in the slo-mo part of the brawl when he's about to smack a smith on the head with his pole.. and didn't like the twins too much, when they were ethereal...
like i said, these are opinions i had when i was like 14 or whatever already, so yeah for me at least i'm not dissing the cgi in hindsight, it's how i felt at the time -- anyway, it's nit picking
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
Oh yeah, that shit WAS kind of videogamey. It's a testament to the freeway sequence that I barely remember the quirky moments unless I'm reminded. It was such a well put together scene. So much story and character building through an action sequence. I could rant about that scene alone for another two walls of text.
nush
Member
Its amazing and the only other good part of the Matrix. Peoples ideas after the first recorded until the sequels just crapped on that imagination.
LostDonkey
Member
Couldn't agree more. No sequels were needed after the first. Ever.
Razvedka
Banned
My same view. I didn't understand why this movie was made, beyond some sort of business decision made by a board of executives- which, iirc, in the movie they joke about as a form of metacommentary. It wasn't smart like the original or as high octane as it's sequels.
It was just... Bland, contrived, inoffensive.
JayK47
Member
Unpopular opinion, but I liked the latest Matrix movie. I felt it was at least better than the 3rd one and had a better ending to the series. I always felt the 3rd movie left you with a shit ending to what should have been an amazing series. I enjoyed the 2nd one well enough and like most people consider the first movie to be amazing. It is in no way worse than Star Wars and if you consider the last two Alien movies, that series as well.
EverydayBeast
ChatGPT 0.1
Stop it they’re movies not some newly discovered holy scripture do they need to be one and done every movie has a sequel regardless of what people say movies will continue to get sequels.
SafeOrAlone
Banned
Is the series ruined? Sure, but I never cared about the series. I'm just glad when I pop in The Matrix or Alien, I am still treated to a kick-ass experience. Nothing changes that.
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
Everything is ruined. From games to movies, cartoons, tv shows and music. Might aswell only watch classics at this point if you don’t want to be brainwashed that is.
I mean, in some cases, certainly.
But I think some people stray too far away from being sheep that they become skittish deer.
This film has a woman in it! The feminists are going to bite me and drag me off!
This film is too similar to it's prequels. MEMBER BERRIES, SOUTH PARK, soulless reboots are prowling the forests!
This film is too different from it's prequels. Clearly it's being made for a different crowd than the fans of the original. These new "nerdy," scene kids are encroaching upon my grazing field!
This movie has a gay man as the main antagonist and he says "triggered," in the trailer. The woke ideologies are ruining my ecosystem!
Enthusiast is synonymous with Person Who is Never Pleased. Wanna know why things were better from your childhood? It's because you were too stupid back then to parse out films and media preaching a relevant to the time message, and as you got older, you started picking up on the symbolism and allegory and thought to yourself "this shit is deep!" without realizing that things were just as agenda driven as they are now, it's just that the agendas have evolved and the things from 20-30 years ago are no longer relevant. If the internet was around in the early nineties and it was easier to hive mind, I guarantee you we wouldn't have a whole niche of users who claim Rage Against the Machine is a fantastic, fearless, bombastic band. We'd have people saying "these far left idiots trying to start an insurrection with their noise," and "Tom Morello needs to learn how to play guitar,"
It's not that we're all eccentric critics who were never noticed as we sit in our leather chair puffing on a tobacco pipe, it's the fact that ideas are easier to propagate now and echo chambers can be entered and left from the comfort of our own home, instantaneously.
There's some objective shit out there. But it's notbas if there's a cut off date, and everything after you turned 25 is just fundamentally garbage.
This is more generally directed, I'm pretty sure you're taking the piss, but it incentivized me to rant, and I love doing that.
JayK47
Member
One of the problems with modern movies and games are the amount of scrutiny they get. Yes, modern movies tend to have woke elements, try to appease worldwide audiences, etc. But they also get put through a meat grinder with critics like nothing before. Siskel and Ebert were about all you had to review movies besides the local paper and they never tore shit apart like it is now. The only movie discussions were with friends after the movie. People now are trying to get clicks, so they do these over the top reviews and place a shit ton of bias into their reviews, accusing every scene of being woke or political and then their thousands or millions of fans raid the review sites and give low reviews without even seeing the movie. And if they do see the movie, they go in with bias and see stuff that isn't there. Take The Matrix Resurrection for example. I was hearing how shit and woke it was before watching it and in the end, I was expecting it to be way worse. The biggest crime the movie commits is crappy CGI action scenes everywhere, which is a common crime these days. If you were saying movies were better and more authentic before green screens, I would 100% agree. Looking at movie sets now, they look pathetic. It's a fucking empty green room.
rubik's dude
Member
I didn't particularly care for the second or third movie. I thought the fourth one was better than both, I kind of enjoyed how it poked fun at itself. Although the first movie is the best in my opinion. I don't think the series is any more ruined than it was before, and if they do make a sequel to this, I think the idea of Smith and Neo/Trinity having an alliance against a bigger threat, as much of a trope as that is, would be fun to see in a schlocky kind of way.
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
I wasn't even that put off the CG. I still enjoy the original Matrix films. The only really "weird," examples of CG that I didn't like were in two instances:
The sleek machines that sided with the humans in the real world, particularly Sati's giant dove familiar or what the fuck. It looked too smooth and shiny, like something I'd expect to see in I, Robot or Final Fantasy XIII. I know it must be a stylistic choice, because most of the Sentinels and Harvesters looked appropriately grimey.
And the way the bomber/horde people exploded into code when injured. It's The Matrix, we know that it's a simulation, you don't need the code to remind us, especially when in the past, even in the most system-breaking circumstances (Like Smith taking over literally the entire population) there was never any visible code. The code was reserved for the eyesight of programs and Neo after his powers awakened. Very immersion breaking and seemed like something to use in lieu in blood and gore, which seems weird in the same series that had Captain Mifune cut to ribbons by Sentinels and the main fucking character blinded by electrical burns.
But I didn't notice much of the sets being fake. I mean, I'm sure there was an abundance of it, but it didn't jump out at me explicitly
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Rat Rage
Member
They are actually pretty good.
Alien, Aliens, Alien 3 (Assembly Cut), Prometheus, Alien Covenant - all good.
However, Prometheus and Covenant are 2/3 or a prequel trilogy, so they feel a bit different than the A, Als, A3. They focus on the origins of the Weyland Yutani Corp, Weyland himself, the Aliens, the Cyborgs/A.I., and Space Jockeys. I liked them a lot.
Alien 4 is more like an Alien Comic made into a movie.
ShadowNate
Member
Alien, Terminator, and probably Star Wars (although I admit, I am not a fan of SW at all) all have output at least one great video game.
Matrix has a huge potential there too, especially considering that the Unreal 5 tech demo was one the most exciting things this month. Just not make an MMO again. Start smaller, and if successful then go bigger.
Matrix has a huge potential there too, especially considering that the Unreal 5 tech demo was one the most exciting things this month. Just not make an MMO again. Start smaller, and if successful then go bigger.
Cockles & Whelks
Banned
I'd say Alien comes out best. Alien Resurrection aside (it's not bad, it's just boring). Prometheus is pretty solid if you watch the fan edit that puts back the good stuff and removes the shit. ALIENS is one of few sequels better then the original.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
That's what I'm wondering too. It felt so out of place. It's the typical Feminazi bullshit lol
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
Why would a machine value power like The Merovingian? Why would a machine choose to help Trinity and Morpheus like Seraph did? Why would a machine feel love like Sati and her parents?
Misogyny is a word. What matters is the connection. Perhaps The Analyst had preconceived notions about a woman's "inherent usefulness," in contrast to a man's. Perhaps they produce less power for the Machine cities or their generally higher IQ or better connection to their emotions made them wake up from the simulation more often than male counterparts, so he asserted males as the domineering biological gender of the species. Maybe he has a directive in his programming that gives him human flaws to make his role as The Analyst more believable to enslaved minds. A script, if you will, because according to Smith, the first utopia versions of the Matrix were too perfect and the system crashed, because people define themselves their own imperfections.
Theory crafting is so much more fun than WOKE ASS LEFTIST PROPAGANDA LANA WACHOWSKI IS TRYING TO TURN MY SON INTO MY DAUGHTER LIBERALS SJW GAMERGATE FEMINAZI WAGE GAP BLACK AMERICA NICK CANNON AND MELANIN etc etc.
Big Baller
Al Pachinko, Konami President
Reeves killed Cyberpunk too
ZywyPL
Banned
Matrix was ruined after the first movie already, the sequel has some amazing/memorable sequences,kick-ass music, it's an amazing action movie but sadly l takes all the plot downhill. 3rd movie lost all the charm by not taking place in the Matric but in real life instead, and 4th is an abomination, just milking the franchise for money.
Animatrix was awesome tho, especially the story about how it all started, how the machines were created, the first kill, the war and how/why the Matrix was created, you watch this, then the IG movie, and that's vall you really need, everything else will only ruin the impression of the universe.
Animatrix was awesome tho, especially the story about how it all started, how the machines were created, the first kill, the war and how/why the Matrix was created, you watch this, then the IG movie, and that's vall you really need, everything else will only ruin the impression of the universe.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
Animatrix and The Matrix Reloaded are both great movies
The Matrix Resurrections was ruined by the usual man hating Feminazi politics. I was rolling my eyes at that whole scene at the end.
Insane Metal
Member
Has been since the second movie. Nothing changed.
Rat Rage
Member
"Matrix was ruined after the first movie". I don't think I could be friends with someone saying that. The first Matrix was cool, but hardly too special, because it was a just a plot of "what if everything was a dream". Descartes says hello. 2 and 3 took the story further in a magnificent way, with 3 wrapping the whole story up in a great way. I feel Matrix 1, 2, 3 build a unity that can't be seperated.
The special effects in all 3 movies are top notch, but to me the actual story and dialogs are equally top notch. That's what makes the trilogy so special.
The special effects in all 3 movies are top notch, but to me the actual story and dialogs are equally top notch. That's what makes the trilogy so special.
Whitecrow
Banned
Thank you
Javthusiast
Banned
AmuroChan
Member
I wouldn't say they are ruined forever. All it takes is someone to make a great movie with these IPs again. For a lot of people, Ghostbusters 2016 "ruined" the franchise (including myself), but Afterlife was surprisingly good. I'm back on the train for more GB movies as long as they're well made like Afterlife.
SW is the one I'm most worried about because the people in charge of that franchise just don't seem to have a plan.
SW is the one I'm most worried about because the people in charge of that franchise just don't seem to have a plan.
Javthusiast
Banned
Star Wars is getting games, shows and movies. Alien is getting a new FX show.
They are far from dead.
Matrix though can rot for another 20 years after this shit sequel.
They are far from dead.
Matrix though can rot for another 20 years after this shit sequel.
West Texas CEO
GAF's Nicest Lunch Thief and Nosiest Dildo Archeologist
Aye, I'd much rather have an Animatrix live action movie, than this current pile of sh*t.
E-Cat
Member
I love it, and still think it's all those things.
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
Original entries almost always beat out sequels. Almost always.
It's like the Big Bang. Out of nothing, an entire universe get exploded out of a singularity, the author. It's like nothing ever seen before, and there's so much energy, material, and potential. But after that explosion, there can never be an explosion as big, or as powerful, or as game changing, because every subsequent explosion has to occur inside of that space created by the first one. Sometimes the energy and material will coalesce into a star, bright and powerful and blinding, pulling other things into It's gravity of influence. Other times, it will become a black hole, sucking all of the light and energy into a string thin collapse of nothingness. The only things that can be created are in the context of the original, and long after the big bang, we can still pick up the energy signals of that first, titanic explosion. Art is us, we are the universe. Walk your dog. Don't smoke inside your house. #FreeKretos, #TrashfireOfFreeThinkers
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
I want whatever you are drinking/smoking.
TheInfamousKira
Reseterror Resettler
I think it's just all the shit that's been absorbed into my body over the years acting up because I haven't eaten today and built up hallucinogenic toxins are fat soluble or something.
mcjmetroid
Member
Ya the new movie was not good. It had some great ideas but good lord.. recasting morpheus and Smith? Shocking stuff