If that's what you view as a movie game then what do you call telltale or heavy rain? There's entirely too much resource management and open environment to call it a movie.That isn't a lie, just a different subjective view point. There is a difference.
Never said I doubted you.....You went from one of the biggest fans of LOU and UC and seeing a leak you have now cancelled your pre-order and are now stoked for CyberPunk, which also has leaks too….I'm guessing you prefer the leaked videos of Cyberpunk....I get it...Good luck,Sorry man, I really wish I was lying.
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To me, It's really that bad. It may not bother you (I doubt it though). I'm not asking you to see the spoilers, but there is a reason for the backlash and a decent one.
This game will go down in history and not for a good reason.
Agreed, but this is what I'm saying as well.... A false narrative have formed over the years and like you know... If anything is repeated often enough no matter how false, people will start to believe it.....So a concerted effort to start a false narrative about a game being a movie game...….Yet some people will interpret that in the worse way possible, actually thinking, all there is to the games are cutscenes....It's why just alongside the movie game piece, you often see...."I'll watch Sony/ND games on YouTube"...I fully agree with you but a narrative has formed over the past few years. I am not kidding when I say TLOU on grounded is one of the most intense video game experiences I have had.
Naughty Dog is the same company that gave us U2 and LOU. It's crazy but U2 and LOU had many detractors as well.....Check all the threads over the years trying to discredit LOU's framerate and calling LOU 25fps instead of enjoying one of the best games on the PS3, yet other games people deem the holy grail run at 15fps on the N64. Then you had so many threads saying LOU is not that good and even recently, a thread was created saying if "U2 should have really won GOTY that year".....There's concerted effort allright… If people could turn back time to undo ND's reception and what made them so good and praised, they would....If they could go back and relieve ND of their various GOTY awards, they would....Hard pills to swallow
Naughty dog are not the same company that gave us great games like uncharted 2 and the First the last of Us
they have been coasting on sequels and remasters ever since...but they are not offering the same mind blowing experiences that those other games last gen gave us
they have veered from offering fun game-play experiences to long boring movie like sequences ...they look pretty as hell and are best in class for the art direction but the replay-ability is zero once you have done it once
Also..certain people on their staff need to have a chat with Cliffy B about trying to form your narrative around social justice politics as people are just sick of this political correct shit
that has infested gaming which is why its getting the backlash....people want to escape in their games and not have the same horrible gender/sexuality/political crap thats in real life forced into a game
If its a great story and fun to play the game will speak for itself
yet I've never played a game so many times with such heavy action gameplay scenarios or in LOU where I approach my enemies in different ways every time, using different strategies, and that could be said with the very first game in Drake's Fortune.
Out of all the criticism from game sites, bloggers, forums and YT/Twitter comments, I don't think I've seen one person say LoU2 is bad due to being a walking sim.2. lol who has called LoU or Uncharted a walking sim? You do know what concerted means, yes? If so, you should have ample evidence of people uniting behind this criticism. Also lol @ trying to make LoU gameplay more open ended than it is. ND games are strictly linear affairs
If that's what you view as a movie game then what do you call telltale or heavy rain? There's entirely too much resource management and open environment to call it a movie.
That's a pretty bad attempt at rewriting history, an enthusiast board should deserve better than this.I have always said this and will always say it, cinematic games are all style, no substance. Naughty dog games in particular are just stock third-person action cover-shooters that do nothing innovative or interesting.
Sure, however since games score system is based since forever on specific parameters such as gameplay, graphics, sound etc., these ain't ND type of scores.Also 7 and 8 are great ratings, the fuck are you on about. lmao
There's multiple quotes from ND developers from almost a decade ago openly saying that accepting crunch is basically required to work at ND. It's a particular approach that put the game's quality before everything else and that sure ain't for everyone. But that's why their games are what they are.Are you really sure "crunchtime is good" is the hill you want to die on?
Totally agree with you here."Female characters with sex appeal are misogynistic and they can't be good role models" is a bad take no matter how you spin it.
THIS.From what i'm reading in most threads. A lot of people don't question Naughty Dog as a whole. Everyone knows they're wizards and have brought arguably the best games of current gen. The arguments about them making walking simulators are silly and should be ignored.
The problem mainly seems to be the politics in play because of massive influences by one of their execs. The outrage is mainly pointed at him and doesn't necessarily mean ND as a whole is bad.
To be fair, there's no oversaturation with ND's brand of games.....It could never be, as long as they keep churning GOTY releases. ND's games are simply games with a solid gameplay foundation, awesome graphics and animation, likeable characters and dialogue and a good story.....The reason why they are so good is because all elements of their game are at a high level......You cant say their graphics suck, you can't say the camera sucks, you cant say the characters suck, you cant say the animation sucks, you cant say the dialogue and story sucks. Everything is at a high level of excellence...Right now gamers hate so called movie games but in a few years it will be something else. It is not a conspiracy to tear them down but every years a certain genre becomes a favorite punching bag. It has also been a battleground in the culture wars since the kiss but it exploded when the leaks came out. The story greatly enhances the experience but you can't take every cutscene and piece of dialogue out and it would still be a great game.
If I say something about bad about Naughty Dog, it's because I think they've made shitty games for awhile now.
I think that poster misunderstood such a quote. ND has never gone for model type women in their games, all the women in UC and LOU had a tough, survivalist outlook and countenance about them, even Chloe. They were never posed as models that appear on the Victoria Secret show.....I think that's what some people want and no matter how small, they are very vocal.....What sense does it make to be climbing mountains all over, hanging on ledges and yet Lara still looks so good, it seems all that cold weather and the beatdowns by men and animals alike are the health vials of beauty that sustains Lara's appearance. Nice clothes, make-up still well done all up on these snowy tops....Totally agree with you here."Female characters with sex appeal are misogynistic and they can't be good role models" is a bad take no matter how you spin it.
Or Lebron......Definitely a thing....Yet you turn the tides and these players are now on the hater's team and it's all praise.....Just cue how many (ND employee is now working for my favorite company) threads we've seen, started by persons who didn't have much of a pulse for anything ND. Or the people who hated Insomniac till they played Sunset Overdrive, and suddenly an Insomniac game is the holy grail. Lot's of deflecting for sure based on who is on which team and where the studio is aligned.....One thing that keeps everything in perspective is ND's track record of Meta scores, sales and GOTY's...……..It's the hard evidence which no smear campaign can fizzle.....Just look at how people are already assuming LOU 2 will be lackluster because of a leak and whatever is in it......A guy who had a steelbook is so upset, he cancelled but names the game he prefers over it, then he blames the leak...…..This is just counter marketing at best. People are already arguing and have settled that they know LOU2's quality even if they have not played.People hate success stories, people dont like Tom Brady regardless of his politics the guy is a goat and people will claim that, same as, mayweather etc.
Imagine having your head buried this far up your own ass. No, there is no conspiracy to bring down Naughty Dog because they're too successful. People are sick of the political agendas in video games. Cut the bullshit, craft a narrative with the primary goal of telling a good story rather than spreading your politics, and much of the criticism will magically vanish. It's not hard and the victimhood tactics are getting tiresome.
Maybe ND have done this.
I'm not about to let out of context spoilers taint what I think.
Never said I doubted you.....You went from one of the biggest fans of LOU and UC and seeing a leak you have now cancelled your pre-order and are now stoked for CyberPunk, which also has leaks too….I'm guessing you prefer the leaked videos of Cyberpunk....I get it...Good luck,
Agreed, but this is what I'm saying as well.... A false narrative have formed over the years and like you know... If anything is repeated often enough no matter how false, people will start to believe it.....So a concerted effort to start a false narrative about a game being a movie game...….Yet some people will interpret that in the worse way possible, actually thinking, all there is to the games are cutscenes....It's why just alongside the movie game piece, you often see...."I'll watch Sony/ND games on YouTube"...
Naughty Dog is the same company that gave us U2 and LOU. It's crazy but U2 and LOU had many detractors as well.....Check all the threads over the years trying to discredit LOU's framerate and calling LOU 25fps instead of enjoying one of the best games on the PS3, yet other games people deem the holy grail run at 15fps on the N64. Then you had so many threads saying LOU is not that good and even recently, a thread was created saying if "U2 should have really won GOTY that year".....There's concerted effort allright… If people could turn back time to undo ND's reception and what made them so good and praised, they would....If they could go back and relieve ND of their various GOTY awards, they would....
In the end, what you deem great gameplay is all subjective. Yet if many critics and millions love what you have produced, then you are doing something right, because the main purpose of game creation is to get as many people to enjoy the content as possible. Not sitting in a corner pining that your game is the greatest and not as many people see it that way....
And to add some further credence to that. People talk about UC 3 and UC4 as if they are Life of Black Tiger and Bad Rats.....Again, the concerted effort. These are also GOTY caliber games in the year they came....UC3 and UC4 are both gems of games, UC4 evolved the gameplay to even more verticality and improved mechanics. They are 92% and 93% on Meta respectively.......Naughty has not lost it;s way in the least bit......There's no way Naughty has two big franchises from last gen and they went on to leave them in the dust and go on a full new IP in the PS4 generation......There are companies that are oversaturating their franchises, Sony is not guilty of that. They will actually re-invent their older franchises often past the third game......and there's evidence to prove that.....If anything, you can expect a new franchise from ND next gen on PS5, it's when it makes most sense. There's no way ND should have not produced UC4 and LOU 2. Also you need to be less disingenuous, making UC4, LL and LOU2 is not coasting on sequels, it's catering to two of the biggest fanbases in gaming, where millions of UC4 was sold, LOU 2 is not even out yet. People would have been pissed if they didn't get a UC4 and sequel to LOU. It's like you have a star player who won MVP last year and you bench him the following. I certainly know who's not running my franchise as for good business logic and putting output, where there's demand..
SJW fanatics and anti-SJW freedom fighters are similar cults/warring factions intent more in fighting each other than fighting for something.It's possible, but when it comes to cults (which I consider feminism to be), I've found that future behaviour can be reliably extrapolated from past behaviour.
LoU2's June launch is literally 5 months away (assuming Nov PS5 launch) from being a game that didn't even launch during PS4's 7 year span before PS5 arrives.Wasn't saying ND dont make a good games....the games are fun to play but you dont get the same awe factor you once did and the time they could of been spending making a completely new mind blowing game...they spent it doing paid remasters of TLOU and the Uncharted collection to ps4
and we got 1 new uncharted game on ps4 and the follow up for TLOU2 which has been delayed about 3 times and doesn't even include the cool MP mode from the first game....this isnt the same company that pushed the envelope in the ps3 days
i honestly think they have fallen into the Gears of War sequel phase and while those games review well are also loved they dont really tread new ground
For whatever reason key people have left ND to go to other studios and the PR narrative has changed from enjoy our cool new game to ...we are going to delay this game a few times and here....have some Social justice politics to tide you over
its not really a conspiracy...people are just simply tired of this sort of shit
He's read them and knows why, but playing coy about it and defending.TLW you said you haven't watched or read any of the leaks, the leaks are the main reason why people are turning against ND. This thread is a bit pointless when you dont even know why the backlash is happening in the first place.
I dont think anyone is trying to say ND are not a good studio who make good games (although i still think Uncharted 2 amd 3 are way better than 4, and the leaks to me show that TLAU will be way better than the sequel).
SJW fanatics and anti-SJW freedom fighters are similar cults/warring factions intent more in fighting each other than fighting for something.
Games are trailing TV's and movies where when you first started to introduce any non laughing stock/token lesbian,queer, etc... character it was met with a "you are shoving politics down my throat" no matter how it was done (and in games we are at this stage still: put traditional religion under a bad light, mostly in the U.S. as in E.U. there is less reverence for organised religions as the scars it left are deeper, and add a gay main character where their sexuality is explored more than skin deep and you get that reaction).
Netflix is now at the next step, the over reaction, where women will note the sudden increase not only in heavy handed female centric shows and characters, but, and I quote, "It seems like every teenage girl is a lesbian or them discovering themselves lesbian is the plot twist of the show". Games are kind of going this trajectory too.
I'm looking at several instances of people trying to diminish their work.
1. Naughty Dog is overrated. Yet the millions who play their games including the majority of critics absolutely love their games, should we pander to the minority who do not love their games and give their games 7 and 8's to appease such a crowd.
2. Naughty Dog Games are walking simulators, yet I've never played a game so many times with such heavy action gameplay scenarios or in LOU where I approach my enemies in different ways every time, using different strategies, and that could be said with the very first game in Drake's Fortune.
3. Naughty is overworking Staff. Yet no one was forced to work OT and if you did, there was appropriate compensation relative to time and half, doubletime pay and further bonuses if the game is successful, which most ND games have been. Of course no employer would say they do not want the best and hardest working people, sometimes people have to understand that the best movies, games and art pieces you see takes lots of work, being earnest, lots of blood and tears....Having the best products are not usually cakewalks and people work hard and lose sleep behind the scenes. Having the best games is not putting It in a "best games generator simulator".....
4. Naughty and their directors are trying to push this SJW way of thinking on me: No they are not, you are not forced to buy, you are not forced to let your kids play their games if you think they will turn lesbian or gay after a playthrough. As if such people don't exist right in front of their faces everyday. Yet we have no issues with our boys allowing the main characters in GTA to plow through fields of prostitutes, working for gangs and gunning down innocents at random, at least the people you mow down in LOU and UC are bad guys trying to kill you.... So lets stop the hypocrisy. Games are fantasy, they tell stories, you love them or hate them, you buy them or not.....I have no problem with GTA or UC games.....Let the artists do their thing, the number of people who love their games will be the ultimate decider, yet people hate even when the games they don't love do well, because the game they love is only liked by 5 people including themselves, so they sit back and concoct this smear campaign. Why are millions playing these ND games? We really need to stop the witch hunts over a dev's vision, and why he made the story the way he did. It's his game and he's telling it, if you are so pressed, go do yours if you think it will take the world by storm and is such a superior piece......That way your game can go against ND's and be compared on all levels......It's also why I never understood all the Vitriol sent David Cage's way, some people absolutely love his games and it's not a template of everything else that's available. People call games garbage when they don't do well, with told ya's, but they still hate when a game is quality and super successful, there's no middle ground it seems....