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January Wrasslin' |OT| Big Month John

Barrage

Barrage

Member
RAW was solid last night, with a hot ending segment and Big Match Roman delivering like he does every week.

For as much as I like Rusev, he is once again involved in one of the worst angles in the company.

The argument against cancelling Network if you enjoy Smackdown, you enjoy the vault and you enjoy the Network exclusive shows but don't like RAW is asinine.
 
U

Uno Venova

Banned
UberTag said:
Look at it this way. The WWE will never get any better unless people vote with their wallets because they wholesale reject any other way that their audience provides feedback - constructive or otherwise - about their product.

Additionally, it doesn't matter WHAT content you're providing them your money for, they will interpret your $9.99/month as a ringing endorsement for the current product and that you want to see Roman Reigns look strong.

So, if you're comfortable with undermining the hopes of wrestling fans to ever see a better product so you can pay $120 a year or more on a bunch of variety shows that have very little to do with the core WWE product, that's fine. You should wear that badge with pride and not feel hostile when fans hold you accountable for it.

There's nothing futile about this, by the way. Why do you perceive the idea of fans voting with their wallets as futile? There are shareholders that have influence and want to see profits and return on their investment regardless of whether Vince is alive or not.
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Saying I should be comfortable with undermining hopes of a better product seems pretty binary actually, you really have no idea what message they will take from a large drop in subscribers. So I'm actually not accountable for anything.
 
Z

Zach

Member
Biggest-Geek-Ever said:
I hated hated HATED him getting into those tests of strength with Hogan at WM19.
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He's had multiple matches now where he's doing wrestling moves and, like, working a match like he's a wrestler. Even if he's capable for realz, he's an old, roided-up promoter. His character has been established as that, not a legit wrassler. It just kills it for me. Ugh.
 
H

HazySaiyan

Banned
I haven't watched NXT in months, it's quite honestly a drag most of the time and they recap everything at the Takeover shows anyway.
 
B

BewareTheBatsie

Member
Barrage said:
RAW was solid last night, with a hot ending segment and Big Match Roman delivering like he does every week.

For as much as I like Rusev, he is once again involved in one of the worst angles in the company.

The argument against cancelling Network if you enjoy Smackdown, you enjoy the vault and you enjoy the Network exclusive shows but don't like RAW is asinine.
Click to expand...
It's almost impressive how WWE just keep on managing to find terrible storylines to shove Rusev into.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
The only downsides of the Austin/McMahon feud were

1) Vince became convinced that the evil heel authority figure angle was solid gold, which is why we've never been able to shed it 20 years later.

2) It probably tricked Vince into thinking he could actually wrestle, especially after seeing Shane put on some decent matches.
 
A

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
UberTag said:
Look at it this way. The WWE will never get any better unless people vote with their wallets because they wholesale reject any other way that their audience provides feedback - constructive or otherwise - about their product.

Additionally, it doesn't matter WHAT content you're providing them your money for, they will interpret your $9.99/month as a ringing endorsement for the current product and that you want to see Roman Reigns look strong.

So, if you're comfortable with undermining the hopes of wrestling fans to ever see a better product so you can pay $120 a year or more on a bunch of variety shows that have very little to do with the core WWE product, that's fine. You should wear that badge with pride and not feel hostile when fans hold you accountable for it.

There's nothing futile about this, by the way. Why do you perceive the idea of fans voting with their wallets as futile? There are shareholders that have influence and want to see profits and return on their investment regardless of whether Vince is alive or not.
Click to expand...

I mean, I don't necessarily understand. The actual wrestling is as good as its ever been in WWE's history. Even Meltzer agreed with that.
 
T

TarpitCarnivore

Member
It's honestly amazing to me that WWE hasn't figured out how to make all talent workable in a single show. During the New Gen/Attitude era you would see a lot of different talent, but none of them were made to feel they were bigger than they were (mid-card specific). When DOA would come out they didn't HAVE to do a promo, they just came out and wrestled. Same with singles guys. For some reason WWE thinks every wrestler is bigger than they are so we're seeing every team/wrestler getting 5-10 minutes of "time to shine" before a match even begins.

The wrestling was bad, but we used to get so much more more in a given episode.
 
F

FeenixRising

Banned
Sephzilla said:
Smackdown is worth watching because of Styles and Miz, and because it's a shorter show. Meanwhile, Raw actually got worse because of the Brand Split. All in all I think the Brand Split as it was done was a really bad idea.

A better idea for a Brand Split would have been to have no "formal" brand split. Have certain wrestlers appear just on Raw and others just on Smackdown - that way you achieve the "each show has different talent" feel but then if you have a bigger storyline you want to tell like AJ Styles fighting Kevin Owens for the WWE Title, then you aren't handcuffed by a brand split and can have both wrestlers on both shows for the duration of that story. Make the US Title the highlight belt of Raw and make the Intercontinental Title the highlight belt of Smackdown. Keep the Womens and Tag divisions together (because the brand split was horrible for these).
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Cant agree with that at all.

SmackDown's tag division escaped from the New Day's 482 Day Reign of Terror, gave us Heath & Rhyno, a refreshed Usos, American Alpha and finally gave Bray Wyatt a belt.

Same with their women's division. Before Roadblock, RAW was just Charlotte and Sasha featuring Nia Jax and Dana Brooke. Now it's going to be Charlotte and Bayley featuring Nia Jax and Dana Brooke.
 
H

HazySaiyan

Banned
If you want to send a message about RAW but still like most of their other content, just don't watch RAW and the RAW PPVs. WWE can pretend TV ratings don't matter to them but we all know they do, especially when it comes to renegotiating their TV deal. And they might not publish them but WWE absolutely have metrics on what's getting watched on the Network. If they see Smackdown PPVs are doing better than RAW they'll notice.

Or they'll just gut the Smackdown roster because they're childish.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
FeenixRising said:
Cant agree with that at all.

SmackDown's tag division escaped from the New Day's 482 Day Reign of Terror, gave us Heath & Rhyno, a refreshed Usos, American Alpha and finally gave Bray Wyatt a belt.

Same with their women's division. Before Roadblock, RAW was just Charlotte and Sasha featuring Nia Jax and Dana Brooke. Now it's going to be Charlotte and Bayley featuring Nia Jax and Dana Brooke.
Click to expand...

All of this could have been accomplished without a brand split though.
 
ElRenoRaven

ElRenoRaven

Member
So yea. Floslam is just too tempting. I mean Evolve, Shine, House of Hardcore, etc, etc,etc. As an indie fan it's just a no brainer at 12.50 a year if paid yearly.

Hope they get the app to sort in order of events though and not when uploaded.
 
M

miserable

Member
1405650128469
 
T

TarpitCarnivore

Member
Angry Grimace said:
I mean, I don't necessarily understand. The actual wrestling is as good as its ever been in WWE's history. Even Meltzer agreed with that.
Click to expand...

Doesn't matter if the wrestling is good when you get the SAME thing every week

How many times have we seen the same two people wrestle each other?
Each "brand" has a decent roster, but we see a small percentage of who is there
Any form of story telling is atrocious
 
A

Anth0ny

Member
Angry Grimace said:
I mean, I don't necessarily understand. The actual wrestling is as good as its ever been in WWE's history. Even Meltzer agreed with that.
Click to expand...

if you watch the actual wrestling in a vacuum, then yes, it's better than ever.

but i give less fucks than ever watching the 8th 3.5 star match between reigns and owens since december 1st
 
T

The Strokes

Banned
Angry Grimace said:
I mean, I don't necessarily understand. The actual wrestling is as good as its ever been in WWE's history. Even Meltzer agreed with that.
Click to expand...

Pure wrestling skill doesn't excite the WWE main crowds tho, they want the whole package, and truth be told, in WWE, in-ring skill doesn't matter as much as it does elsewhere.

There's tens of promotions with better wrestling showcasing (probably) in the US alone, not to mention Japan, or hell, even here in Mexico. It's only worth it when the storytelling is up to par with good enough wrestlers that we see people engaged, the prime example of 2016 being the Ziggler vs Miz feud, everyone's was trashing it at first but they did such a good job at telling a story, and on top of that put up good wrestling performances, most ended up really liking it.
 
M

MG310

Member
I'd rather have a Shield vs. Wyatt match at Mania over just about anything else those 6 guys could do at the show.
 
I

imBask

Banned
Uno Venova said:
Saying I should be comfortable with undermining hopes of a better product seems pretty binary actually, you really have no idea what message they will take from a large drop in subscribers. So I'm actually not accountable for anything.
Click to expand...

You shouldn't be that defensive, it's your right to pay for the network and enjoy some content, but there's no need to pretend your money isn't being funneled on the big productions in some way and that you have ZERO influence on it
 
U

Uno Venova

Banned
imbask said:
You shouldn't be that defensive, it's your right to pay for the network and enjoy some content, but there's no need to pretend your money isn't being funneled on the big productions in some way and that you have ZERO influence on it
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You really think I'm being defensive by challenging the idea that people have a clear idea what message WWE takes from a loss in subscribers and that I'm robbing wrestling fans from a great product?
 
E

excelsiorlef

Member
Uno Venova said:
People act so weird about network subbing in this thread, so if i like the E&C show, Unfiltered, Talking Smack, NXT + The back library I'm supposed to go through the trouble of stealing them instead of subbing to stick it to Vince in some futile rebellion?
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Network is excellent for back catalog, Docs, specials. Fuck to me the live events are the bonus.
 
N

Nekofrog

Banned
It's not like smackdown is even that great of a show, it's just when you put it side by side to raw that it becomes a shining diamond. Small band of good to great performers with super simple writing and storytelling. Nothing very compelling, but good enough to make raw look like total dog shit by comparison. I can't see myself watching raw again until it's 2 hours or the general consensus is that the show has improved
 
B

Brian_FETO

Banned
Nekofrog said:
It's not like smackdown is even that great of a show, it's just when you put it side by side to raw that it becomes a shining diamond. Small band of good to great performers with super simple writing and storytelling. Nothing very compelling, but good enough to make raw look like total dog shit by comparison. I can't see myself watching raw again until it's 2 hours or the general consensus is that the show has improved
Click to expand...
Seems like every now and then Raw accidentally stumbles into having a good show (which is generally when I'm not watching)
 
I

imBask

Banned
Uno Venova said:
You really think I'm being defensive by challenging the idea that people have a clear idea what message WWE takes from a loss in subscribers and that I'm robbing wrestling fans from a great product?
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just a bit, not overly defensive, not looking to offend you otherwise I would've rolled you up long ago
 
A

Anth0ny

Member
Caderfix said:
I don't want to see Dean winning, I don't even want to see him on TV at all, BUT if he wins the IC belt, he'll stay away from the main event scene, which is a major plus for me.
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just like how the guy on raw with the secondary title is staying out of the main event scene, right?
 
F

Foggy

Member
I don't quite understand the purpose of being some kind of activist consumer. If it's not worth your time, money, or hassle then just stop watching or just cut back on it. Access to other promotions has never been better or easier.
 
O

oneofthose

Banned
miz is gonna be a complete jobber heel after the ambrose feud. ambrose is the ramen of smackdown their gonna have him kill the miz's momentum.
 
I

imBask

Banned
Foggy said:
I don't quite understand the purpose of being some kind of activist consumer. If it's not worth your time, money, or hassle then just stop watching or just cut back on it. Access to other promotions has never been better or easier.
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the feeling comes from hardcore communities like this one or reddit or whatever, who complains about the state of the company but keep shoving money down their pockets

The same applies with most things, like people buying WWE2k17 day 1 but whining and clamoring for a good wrestling game
 
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