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FunkMiller
Member
I think you can sustain one film with a Joker without a Batman. I'm not sure you can sustain two. Can see the steam running out of this right around the time there's no-one to counteract Arthur's chaos. The third act will be the weakest part of this movie.
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clarky
Gold Member
Im not sure there is/was a narrative that their can't be another joker other than Heath. Yes he was awesome but so was Jack Nicholas and Mark Hamill. Now we have a very different but still awesome Joker.
Leto was shite because he was shite.
FunkMiller
Member
Also, not sure it's such a good idea to hide the fact that this film is a musical.
The Cockatrice
Member
Pass.
diffusionx
Gold Member
clarky
Gold Member
Maybe Robin will tip up to foil his crazy plans.
I think you can sustain one film with a Joker without a Batman. I'm not sure you can sustain two. Can see the steam running out of this right around the time there's no-one to counteract Arthur's chaos. The third act will be the weakest part of this movie.
I jest of course.
I don't think The Joker needed a sequel, but you never know. At the very least they are trying something different.
Trilobit
Member
Loved the first one. Hope they succeed with this one too. I'm glad that they didn't just make a straight up ordinary sequel. I'm a sucker for good musicals like La La Land, Singin' In the Rain and Sound of Music so I don't mind them dipping their toes in this genre. But I really hope that they don't go the route where Harley is yet another figment of his imagination. If she's to be a lead actress she needs to be at least somewhat real for me to care. It would be cool to get a third movie though that is hard realism and brutal.
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Hudo
Member
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clarky
Gold Member
Better than showing the entire movie in 3 minutes like the Alien trailer last week.
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clarky
Gold Member
First was pretty brutal at times.
If it’s anything like the first film it’s a character study of someone suffering from delusional psychosis. The whole film will play out through he’s lens and/or possibly Harleen. The music and dances are part of he’s character, he’s a performance artist, but some scenes are obviously part of he's delusion. Whenever you see him dancing it’s symbolic and an indication or elevation in he’s psychological state. This will be a masterpiece of a film, I hope.
Looks like it'll premiere at the Venice Film Festival in September.
Festival Chief Alberto Barbera:
"
DEADLINE: You said this morning that you thought Joker 2 was going to surprise people. I gather the sequel is just as dark, if not more dark, than the first one…
ALBERTO BARBERA: It is. It’s a continuation of the story but the film is completely different from the first film. If you’re expecting the same in terms of violence or other things, you’ll be surprised. When I saw the film in LA at the beginning of February there were four or five of us in the screening room, including writer Scott Silver, and we were astonished, our mouths were open at the end of the screening. It is a darker film.
BARBERA: It’s a dystopian musical, or a musical of sorts. I think it’s one of the most daring, brave, and creative films in recent American cinema. And I think it really confirms Todd Phillips as one of the most creative directors working at the moment.
DEADLINE: The trailer today was really intriguing. Do you think the Academy will respond to the film?
BARBERA: I would be surprised if not…
"
deadline.com
Festival Chief Alberto Barbera:
"
DEADLINE: You said this morning that you thought Joker 2 was going to surprise people. I gather the sequel is just as dark, if not more dark, than the first one…
ALBERTO BARBERA: It is. It’s a continuation of the story but the film is completely different from the first film. If you’re expecting the same in terms of violence or other things, you’ll be surprised. When I saw the film in LA at the beginning of February there were four or five of us in the screening room, including writer Scott Silver, and we were astonished, our mouths were open at the end of the screening. It is a darker film.
BARBERA: It’s a dystopian musical, or a musical of sorts. I think it’s one of the most daring, brave, and creative films in recent American cinema. And I think it really confirms Todd Phillips as one of the most creative directors working at the moment.
DEADLINE: The trailer today was really intriguing. Do you think the Academy will respond to the film?
BARBERA: I would be surprised if not…
"
Venice Lineup Interview: Festival Chief Alberto Barbera Says ‘Joker 2’ Is “One Of The Most Daring Films In Recent American Cinema” & Daniel Craig Gives “The Performance Of His Career” In ‘Queer’
The Venice lineup promises a host of riches including new films from Pedro Almodovar, Pablo Larrain, Luca Guadagnino and the Joker sequel.
deadline.com
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
She had one of the better sex changes.
After this can we not have Harley Quinn in anything for 5 minutes?
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Rat Rage
Member
The first one is a character study about becoming / being a sociopath, rather than a psychopath, steadily being pushed one step further, while, at the same time, highlighting the importance and liability of the surroundings in this process. The most fascinating thing about the first movie, is, how, at times, the joker is the only character who's showing true, intrinsic compassion, while his environment, plagued by modern society ailments like capitalism, indifference, greed and cravings for recognition is not able to.
So the question remains: who's actually crazy, the joker or his surroundings? The first one is a really good movie and a pretty cool and smart Joker origin story.
The way I choose to understand it is that everything we see in the film is Arthur’s introspection, he is the narrator. Which means that it’s an unreliable firsthand account since he is suffering from delusional psychosis. A fair few scenes in the film give this away. But the moment I realised how this helps move the plot was on a second viewing, during the interview with the talk show host, the way the film lands its subversion is absolutely INSANE. You’re inclined to feel a lot of empathy for Arthur, as Robert De Niro’s character becomes a villain in that one moment. Arthur makes you understand he’s madness. It’s genius levels of story telling.
Audiophile
Member
I love movies, I love music, I absolutely hate musicals.
I also thought that while the first movies was good it was way overhyped.
Will probably skip on this one.
I also thought that while the first movies was good it was way overhyped.
Will probably skip on this one.
DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
I don't think it's a full on musical... I think it has musical elements, tho. Maybe some singing and dancing in the more delusional parts. But not something like Hamilton or Chicago or The Greatest Showman.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
It’s rumored to have at least 15 songs in it.
That’s 15 more musical numbers than any film needs lol
Audiophile
Member
The one exception I make is Magnolia (1999) with Aimee Mann's Wise Up.
Absolute cinema!
Absolute cinema!
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analog_future
Resident Crybaby
I think too many people are hung up on the "musical" angle of this film.
This movie isn't going to be a musical like Chicago or Les Miserables are musicals. My anticipation is that there's going to be some surreal, heightened scenes where Arthur, being the distracted, theatrical, performance-minded individual that he is, daydreams about himself and others in music sequences. Not too different to how he'd daydream about being on the late night talk show in the first film.
From Todd Phillips:
This movie isn't going to be a musical like Chicago or Les Miserables are musicals. My anticipation is that there's going to be some surreal, heightened scenes where Arthur, being the distracted, theatrical, performance-minded individual that he is, daydreams about himself and others in music sequences. Not too different to how he'd daydream about being on the late night talk show in the first film.
From Todd Phillips:
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BlackCoffee
Neo Member
Agreed.
menmustmow
Banned
it's Joker in name only, really. we need the Clown Prince of Crime finally on screen.
Hamil's version is the only one to do him justice.
Hamil's version is the only one to do him justice.
Dirk Benedict
Gold Member
True, but her tits look bomb.
Tokio Blues
Gold Member
IGN gave it a 5/10.
https://www.ign.com/articles/joker-folie-deux-review-joaquin-phoenix-lady-gaga-todd-phillips
https://www.ign.com/articles/joker-folie-deux-review-joaquin-phoenix-lady-gaga-todd-phillips
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DeafTourette
Perpetually Offended
So they wanted a Harley movie instead of a Joker movie ... LMBO
Likewise. I don't care about the reviews, I'll make my own judgement. Still very much hyped to watch it.
Hugare
Member
Been looking around for reviews, and what I saw aint pretty, I'll tell you that
The most worrisome one was the Screenrant one that mentioned: Joker: Folie à Deux Review – An Improved Sequel Engineered To Antagonize Joker Fans
Engineered to Antagonize Joker Fans
I think I'll wait for impressions with this movie. Despite loving the first one.
I hate Gaga's acting and musicals arent my thing
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Heimdall_Xtreme
Jim Ryan Fanclub's #1 Member
They must understand that many people hate musical movies.
Dirk Benedict
Gold Member
You know why they are doing it...
ricardo_sousa11
Member
Well, Todd couldnt copy Scorsese twice.
The first one was a hit mostly because of Phoenix, but rewatching it shows how dated it really is, theres very little chances this 2nd one is great, in fact, Todd never made a decent sequel to anything.
The biggest crisis is creativity.
The first one was a hit mostly because of Phoenix, but rewatching it shows how dated it really is, theres very little chances this 2nd one is great, in fact, Todd never made a decent sequel to anything.
The biggest crisis is creativity.
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Ulysses 31
Member
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
This is basically what neil did with TLOU2 when he realized that Joel was someone the audience empathized with. Todd likely looked at how the men and some incels took to Arthur's plight and decided to fuck them over.
It sucks that these men have such disdain for other men. I dont get it. Men dont hate other men, its a very woman phenomenon. We dont spite other men. I have no idea whats going with modern men. There is nothing wrong with a man committing murder to protect his adopted daughter from being murdered in her sleep after watching his real daughter get brutally murdered. There is nothing wrong with having sympathy for a mentally ill loner who couldnt afford pills and is abused by the society around him. There are dozens of studies on how men, especially young men are being left behind. They do worse in colleges, they make less money, they own fewer homes than their female counterparts. The easiest thing to do is offer them sympathy and make a movie that sympathizes with their plight but no, hollywood cant stand to make a movie that might appeal to men who dont have it all figured out.
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Lunarorbit
Member
I really have zero desire to see this. Just looks uncomfortable like the 1st one.
RAÏSanÏa
Member
Thanks for pointing out the Screenrant review. Decided to take a look to see what it said regarding that provocative title, and how it squares with assumptions regarding personal concerns made about it before reading. It's referring to the old line about it being a musical and fan culture.
Joker: Folie à Deux Review – An Improved Sequel Engineered To Antagonize Joker Fans [Venice]
Fan culture makes a much better thematic interest.
screenrant.com
Ahead of this premiere, the movie was rumored to be a musical, leading many to wonder why it would be made that way. That could hardly be what the supposed target audience would want from this sequel. I can now say it most certainly is a musical (despite the filmmakers' amusing claims to the contrary), and I think how annoyed a stereotypical Joker fan might be about that played a big part in the decision.
The jabs only continue from there. A returning Zazie Beetz testifies that the TV movie caused people to harass her, "blaming me" for what happened to Arthur. Joker diehards are increasingly associated with psychopaths as the film emphasizes Arthur's lack of identification with them. The ending triples down on this. Philips might as well be putting Joker on trial in Folie à Deux, hammering home that a lot of people got his first movie wrong. Arthur isn't really a Taxi Driver guy anymore; this time, he'd rather sing his troubles away.
Singing approached this way interests me. After reading about Comenius wanting to develop a language where falsehoods were incommunicable. But can wait for streaming.
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poodaddy
Member
Goddamn. Well said man.
Trilobit
Member
Me looking at all the uncultured users scoffing at musicals:
Edit: What I've read so far about its reception is a big letdown. I hate when creators feel the need to mix in audience reactions they didn't like into the sequels instead of just focusing on the story they want to tell. One reviewer also called it a Seinfeld finale kind of movie where they just rehashed stuff from the first movie.
This could have been an amazing sequel to watch on the big screen, but I think I'll wait for streaming instead.
Edit: What I've read so far about its reception is a big letdown. I hate when creators feel the need to mix in audience reactions they didn't like into the sequels instead of just focusing on the story they want to tell. One reviewer also called it a Seinfeld finale kind of movie where they just rehashed stuff from the first movie.
This could have been an amazing sequel to watch on the big screen, but I think I'll wait for streaming instead.
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IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
If you guys want a laugh spoil yourselves on the ending:
He never actually was The Joker. The real one kills him in the final scene.