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Justified - Season 4 - Timothy Olyphant & Walton Goggins - Tuesdays on FX

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D

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
tokkun said:
This show has a real recurring issue with law enforcement letting criminals go with no explanation. Why was Ava turned loose at the end of the episode?
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What would she have been brought in on?

Until Ellen May testifies to something, no one has any real dirt on her.
 
Vert boil

Vert boil

Member
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The last smoke.
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;(
 
P

Polari

Member
Sad to see Colt go. Eldard played a blinder this season.

Hope they kill Winona off and next season is all about Raylan unhinged and out for revenge.
 
L

Linius

Member
wow wow, dat ending. Wondering what they have planned for our beloved Winona.

Canihasaccount (something like that), you finally did a nick change :p
 
V

Ventilaator

Banned
Haven't seen the latest episode so my information is not up to date, but man I sure hope Boyd isn't left with completely empty hands by the end of this. The "Good guys" just completely ruined everything in these last few episodes. They've got Drew and if you bring guys with guns to take Drew, they're gonna bring more guys with more guns and a helicopter. Kind of feels like Boyd's side doesn't even have a chance anymore.

I don't like that.
 
T

tokkun

Member
Dan said:
What would she have been brought in on?

Until Ellen May testifies to something, no one has any real dirt on her.
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She was witness to a fatal shooting, which should be enough to bring her in as a witness on its own.
She was a known member of the same gang as the guy who was killed and was also holding a gun when Tim arrived. Tim also goes there knowing that this gang is going to try to kill or kidnap Ellen May.
She threatened both Ellen May and the preacher's sister with the gun. The sister has no reason not to mention this to the marshals, as she admits in the next scene that she still has a grudge against Boyd.
The sister also has a pretty strong reason to believe that Ava was the person Ellen May helped cover up the murder, based on the events that went down.

All of these things point to Ava being taken in for questioning at the very least, if not arrested and charged outright. Is it possible to come up with theories for why this wouldn't happen? Sure. However, because "she is brought in" is the obvious course of events, if the show is going to have something else happen, they need to explain to the viewer why the obvious thing didn't happen.
 
N

Niraj

I shot people I like more for less.
RatskyWatsky said:
Who was that guy with Winona at the end of the episode? Someone from Detroit? I was hoping that he'd cap her, but it looks like Theo Tonin has other plans for her. :p

So if properly disposing of Delroy's body is/was a surefire way of securing Boyd and Ava's future...why didn't they just do that in the first place?
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I'm pretty sure it was Picker, Detroit guy that went with Boyd to the school last episode, and was with Nicky Augustine and Boyd at Nicky Cush's hideout. They made a point of pointing him out at the start of the episode too.

Second part, could just be a giant pain in the ass to retrieve it, or maybe they're going to try to use the body to implicate somebody else somehow? Not sure.
 
B

BenjaminBirdie

Banned
xenist said:
Man, my jaw hurts from being clenched so hard. That was tense as fuck.
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SRSLY.

This season has really helped me along in my Scared Of Loud Noises Out Of Nowhere therapy, and I can now proudly and happily watch a Justified episode without fast forwarding through the whole thing first to see the exact moments when guns are fired or things explode, but even now, as a healthy adjusted grown up, I was crawled up in a ball the whole episode eeeeeeee
 
C

Cornballer

Member
RatskyWatsky said:
So if properly disposing of Delroy's body is/was a surefire way of securing Boyd and Ava's future...why didn't they just do that in the first place?
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I didn't know if that was meant to be taken literally or figuratively.
Niraj said:
I'm pretty sure it was Picker, Detroit guy that went with Boyd to the school last episode, and was with Nicky Augustine and Boyd at Nicky Cush's hideout. They made a point of pointing him out at the start of the episode too.
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Yup, that was him.
 
P

phaze

Member
Great episode today though Colt should have known better.

Dennis said:
Winona noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!
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When I saw the guys face I thought she was a goner. There is still hope left : < No amount of Nevada will be able to make up for lack of Winona : (

tokkun said:
She was witness to a fatal shooting, which should be enough to bring her in as a witness on its own.
She was a known member of the same gang as the guy who was killed and was also holding a gun when Tim arrived. Tim also goes there knowing that this gang is going to try to kill or kidnap Ellen May.
She threatened both Ellen May and the preacher's sister with the gun. The sister has no reason not to mention this to the marshals, as she admits in the next scene that she still has a grudge against Boyd.
The sister also has a pretty strong reason to believe that Ava was the person Ellen May helped cover up the murder, based on the events that went down.

All of these things point to Ava being taken in for questioning at the very least, if not arrested and charged outright. Is it possible to come up with theories for why this wouldn't happen? Sure. However, because "she is brought in" is the obvious course of events, if the show is going to have something else happen, they need to explain to the viewer why the obvious thing didn't happen.
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I agree. There have been quite a few points that don't make much sense in this season.


Also Johny is like the lousiest traitor ever. Can't stop running his mouth.
 
C

Christoff Yurievich

Member
Clevinger said:
One part I didn't like or understand:

For the past one or two episodes, Theo's man has been telling Boyd that he's on borrowed time and that if he didn't get Drew, he's dead, right? And he didn't get Drew. He failed. And there's pretty much no hope of getting Drew now, at least from Boyd's efforts.

But now we go into this episode and Theo's guy is not only bargaining with Boyd to help him to get Ellen May, but Boyd is demanding he apologize to Eva. What the fuck?! Theo's guy should be saying, "If you don't help us, we're gonna put a bullet in your head. And by the way, your wife sucked a billion dicks. Stick that apology up your ass."
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Probably because they knew that Drew wouldn't testify/make the deal until she's safe. If Detroit has Ellen May, Drew won't say 'boo' and it's a win for them. Not as good a win as having Drew, but good enough.
 
R

RatskyWatsky

Hunky Nostradamus
Niraj said:
I'm pretty sure it was Picker, Detroit guy that went with Boyd to the school last episode, and was with Nicky Augustine and Boyd at Nicky Cush's hideout. They made a point of pointing him out at the start of the episode too.
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Ah, was it? That actor didn't make any impression on me at all so I didn't recognize him.

Cornballer said:
I didn't know if that was meant to be taken literally or figuratively.
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I'm really curious to see what Boyd and Ava's plan is.
 
L

Linius

Member
Cornballer said:
Eh, he didn't really have any qualms about killing people. He just had a soft spot for Ellen May.
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Yeah, that's true. But I always had the feeling he wasn't fully behind his own behaviour. And that damn drugs addiction. He was an interesting character, sad to see him go but that he's Gutterson'd makes up for things.
 
C

Cornballer

Member
- FX Justified Blog: Q&A with “Peace of Mind” Co-Writer Leonard Chang

Highlights:
–When did it become clear to you and the writers that Ellen May was going to play such an important role in this current season?

That was such an organic and evolving discussion that I can’t actually remember. I recall early on we were discussing Ellen May’s death, but all of us were hesitant to pull that trigger, which was significant — it reflected a deeper, perhaps even unconscious, understanding of her role in Boyd and especially Ava’s lives, so we trusted our instincts. Then each writer who wrote about Ellen May kept digging deeper, and in 408 Ben Cavell and Keith Schreier revealed Shelby and Ellen May in a quiet, reflective moment that crystallized her importance. She was an innocent victim that catalyzed the characters in different ways. Taylor and I were given the privilege of closing her chapter, and we were honored.

–An episode like “Peace of Mind” highlights how the writers find ways to involve a variety of different characters. What are some of the difficulties in pulling that off?

We had an hour to thread quite a few stories that everyone had been working hard on all season, so it was definitely a challenge. This was a difficult story to break for that reason: we had to do justice to the characters and their journeys. Not only is it an intricate puzzle, but we could never forget that everyone is the hero of their own stories, so even though Ellen May was a pawn for powerful forces she had an arduous awakening that was tied into Ava’s journey as well. They all had to connect and play off each other seamlessly. Yes, it was very, very hard.

–Giving Limehouse a moment of conscience and releasing Ellen May has deepened what is already a fascinating, complex character. Is he prepared to face the ramifications of further angering Boyd and also losing out on the $300,000 that Ava offered?

Absolutely. Dave Andron and VJ Boyd did a wonderful job of reintroducing Limehouse in 410, and they set up his journey, one of a leader burdened with responsibilities that kept him up at night, and his actions grew from that, but so did his reappraisals — thus, when faced with the visceral consequences of his choices — the fate of peoples’ lives in his hands — he had to reevaluate why he was doing what he was doing, and if it was it for the greater good. He is definitely prepared for what may come in the wake if his actions. Why? Because he answered his conscience.

–Every episode’s script goes through a lot of changes before arriving at what’s ultimately filmed. Can you tell us about any alternate versions of certain scenes or sequences?

So many. The Assistant Director Robert Scott jokingly called Taylor and I the head members of the Rewriters Guild of America. We actually put out a full new second draft that had the production team scrambling. We were terribly apologetic but as I mentioned earlier, this was a hard script to write, making sure all the stories and characters were coming together. One example of a big change? Boyd and Jimmy were going to rob a bank. For various reasons we found a different way into the story.

–Is there a moment that you’re most proud of in this episode?

I guess the moments when we see into the hearts of the characters, whether it’s the big church scene or the quiet scenes with Boyd and Ava. Even the scene with Raylan in the office during the Shelby/Ellen May reunion: if you watch closely we’re glimpsing into Raylan at that moment, a sense of his being cut off from that kind of intimacy going on right next to him, and he’s burying himself in paperwork for the same reason he chose to take this assignment when he didn’t have to, when Art didn’t want him to. Raylan is grappling with quite a few demons this season, but refusing to look at them.
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S

Solo

Member
Awesome episode, with the exception of Tim inexplicably just showing up at the church (unless I completely missed something) in the nick of time. It's amazing how how S4 had been the complete inverse of S3. While that season started off really strong and got weaker and weaker, S4 started off slower and has just gotten better and better. Can't wait for the finale, but I'll have to as I'll be away on vacation next week when it airs.
 
C

Cornballer

Member
- Grantland review


Solo said:
Awesome episode, with the exception of Tim inexplicably just showing up at the church (unless I completely missed something) in the nick of time.
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I assume Raylan & Rachel called him as soon as they found out where Ellen May was hiding. No need for him to stick around Limehouse's place and maybe he was closer?
 
S

Solo

Member
Cornballer said:
I assume Raylan & Rachel called him as soon as they found out where Ellen May was hiding. No need for him to stick around Limehouse's place and maybe he was closer?
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Sure, it just seemed pretty wonky the way it played out. A 5 second exposition scene showing one of them calling him would have done the trick. Instead he just appears. Small gripe in an other pretty great episode.
 
Z

Zeliard

Member
Limehouse's appearances are always a treat. I love how this show can have a power player hovering around and always exerting influence, but only feel the need to show him relatively sparingly, and always to great effect.
 
S

Silkworm

Member
Deified Data said:
No, Winona's invincible so long as she's carrying that baby, sad but true.
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Well what if she gets roughed up and miscarries? Hate to think such a thing could happen but then that would give Raylan a lot to chew on next season and would probably let Winona's character disappear from the show (which might be for the best assuming the actress is going to be too busy to do more than spot appearances due to other acting obligations).
 
T

TheChewyWaffles

Member
I have a question for this crowd - I've tried to make my way through Season 1 but it just seems to fall a little flat. Does it get better after Season 1 like Breaking Bad does? I need more incentive to invest in this show.
 
D

Deified Data

Banned
BigNastyCurve said:
I have a question for this crowd - I've tried to make my way through Season 1 but it just seems to fall a little flat. Does it get better after Season 1 like Breaking Bad does? I need more incentive to invest in this show.
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Each season is progressively better than the last, in my opinion.

Silkworm said:
Well what if she gets roughed up and miscarries? Hate to think such a thing could happen but then that would give Raylan a lot to chew on next season and would probably let Winona's character disappear from the show (which might be for the best assuming the actress is going to be too busy to do more than spot appearances due to other acting obligations).
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I think that might be too dark for Justified, but I could be wrong. I don't think the writers want to write Raylan into the corner of "guy who's child got murdered" - it would interfere with the whole atmosphere of the show.
 
C

Cornballer

Member
BigNastyCurve said:
I have a question for this crowd - I've tried to make my way through Season 1 but it just seems to fall a little flat. Does it get better after Season 1 like Breaking Bad does? I need more incentive to invest in this show.
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How much of S1 did you watch? It picks up in the second half once they move towards a longer story arc. A few people have voiced the same complaint that you have. Also, S2 is stellar.
 
N

Net_Wrecker

Member
BigNastyCurve said:
I have a question for this crowd - I've tried to make my way through Season 1 but it just seems to fall a little flat. Does it get better after Season 1 like Breaking Bad does? I need more incentive to invest in this show.
Click to expand...

Keep watching. The jump from S1 to S2 is pretty crazy (though I've enjoyed it since the beginning), and the current season is greatness.
 
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