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[Archie]

What if it's F2P?

 

[Jenga]

if there is one thing LoL is underrated in the DOTA VS LOL VS HON shitstorm, is in its character design

there's a shitton of comics with individual LoL characters. almost nil with all the others. why? strong visual character design

 

[Neki]

yeah your friend sucks then. I managed to jungle fine with Udyr using only 11 mastery points and no runes. guess your friend needs to start blaming himself instead of the game for his incompetence, amirite?

 

[Archie]

Bro you don't have to be a jerk about it. I like and dislike the rune system, but it does put lower level players at a disadvantage, especially if they play with higher level friends.

 

[Neki]

Bro you don't have to be a jerk about it. I like and dislike the rune system, but it does put lower level players at a disadvantage, especially if they play with higher level friends.

you can't tell me your friend is a competent jungler that can't jungle because of the lack of his runes and masteries when I did it perfectly fine using a similar same set of runes and masteries. It puts lower level players at a disadvantage against higher level players, but match-making tends to match lower level players with low level players, unless you're duo queuing with a high level person. And in this case, if you are, your friend should be able to carry you in a high level game, because he's going to be facing some low levels too. if he can't, you shouldn't be complaining that you're at a disadvantage. you're more likely to lose because you have bad team mates, not because the other team has better runes and masteries.

 

[Void Insanity]

We haven't even seen it yet. For all we know it could be as much as a step away from the original as LoL was.

It's WC3 DotA on the source Engine. It's a pure copy paste. Item for Item, Hero for Hero, Skill for Skill, Stat for Stat.

 

[SouthernDragon]

like chip said, summoner spells make LoL different from DotA in a possibly good way, makes the same hero play different due to variations in runes/summoner spells. if you want to play dota, play dota. though if summoner spells were removed, people would actually have to learn map awareness, which would be good. just add denying and we got a new dota game!

No, no denying. When I played HoN denying made me rage like no other. Such a stupid mechanic. I like Summoner Spells, but I'd be "ok" if they removed them (I'd miss Teleport, though). But denying? Fuck that.

It's WC3 DotA on the source Engine. It's a pure copy paste. Item for Item, Hero for Hero, Skill for Skill, Stat for Stat.

Oh.

: /

 

[Neki]

denying makes you naturally better at last hitting, something that you could use some work on.

Spoiler

kidding.

but seriously, controlling lane flow is a huge part of the game that should be included, that's why deny plank was awesome.

 

[thestopsign]

Whoever asked about the 3v3 strat. My friends and I have come up with a pretty good cheese strategy that works against most players if they aren't smart enough. The key is grabbing a Mordekaiser and getting 3 ignites. In every fight, aim for their squishiest champion, chain ignite him and use Morde's ult on him, suddenly it's pretty much insta-4v2. We find that it works best to have two other tanky guys along with Morde that can also dish damage and CC a bit. Warwick, Xin, Blitzcrank, Nunu, Jax, Trynd, Udyr, and Nasus all work pretty well. We've also run a high mobility team before with Kassadin, Jarvin, and Tristana. The key with that team is to have lots of wards so you can ambush champions by jumping over walls. As far as people you want to ban. We normally ban Tryndamere, Singed, and Nocturne.

 

[Haly]

Regarding jungling:

Currently, the jungle meta makes obvious some of the flaws of the rune system. Some heroes NEED runes to jungle. Other heroes don't. I'm not sure how the Udyr changes affected him but he used to require a hefty rune page to get a decent jungle going (unless you want to constantly b for refills). It's hard for a new player to grasp this without following the trends of buffs/nerfs.

Might I point your friend to Stonewall008's youtube channe. Even though he always has full rune pages there's lots of stuff there that can be adapted for people without runes or masteries. If he does want to continue jungling however I would recommend Warwick, or Nunu. Both are super safe, relatively cheap and self sufficient junglers.

 

[Retro_]

you can't tell me your friend is a competent jungler that can't jungle because of the lack of his runes and masteries when I did it perfectly fine using a similar same set of runes and masteries. It puts lower level players at a disadvantage against higher level players, but match-making tends to match lower level players with low level players, unless you're duo queuing with a high level person. And in this case, if you are, your friend should be able to carry you in a high level game, because he's going to be facing some low levels too. if he can't, you shouldn't be complaining that you're at a disadvantage. you're more likely to lose because you have bad team mates, not because the other team has better runes and masteries.

udyr needs runes to efficiently jungle. Most champs do

and "I did it so he just sucks" is a shoddy argument in a game like this with so many variables between 10 players.

wouldn't the easier solution be for your brother's friend to get a on a newbie account then?

I shouldn't have to. In a better game I'd be able to take my friend into games with the account I've poured time and money into, without them being at a quantifiable disadvantage in the lack of runes/masteries and summoner spells

but nope this isn't a better game this is league of legends

 

[Neki]

Then he shouldn't be trying to jungle with Udyr at level 11 if he wants to be efficient. Yes, there is a problem with runes being required on more some heroes than other, but in no way does it make it impossible to play. You guys are really overblowing how much difference runes and masteries actually play at lower levels.

and "I did it so he just sucks" is a shoddy argument in a game like this with so many variables between 10 players.

Then he shouldn't play the "omg I can't jungle properly because I don't have runes and masteries" angle then. If I can do it without runes and 11 mastery points, so can he. That's a problem with the player, not the hero. Is it efficient? Probably not. But if he insists on jungling with Udyr at this level with no runes, it's easily done.

I shouldn't have to. In a better game I'd be able to take my friend into games with the account I've poured time and money into, without them being at a quantifiable disadvantage in the lack of runes/masteries and summoner spells

And the other side is probably at the same disadvantage as you, a high level player with some low level players, or a mix. Once again, how many times have you thought to yourself, "man, I really would have won this game if I just had some damn masteries and runes!" I understand Flash can help change games, but having an extra 12 armor penetration would have not won you the game. He's at a disadvantage, you're at an advantage, because the other side will be relatively matched up the same as you.

Buy all T1 runes (no Quints though), I used all T1 runes until I found a hero I could play regularly. They're giving you the best bang for your buck. If you want to buy heroes, then fine, but you'll suffer by not having runes. There is a reason why there is a free hero rotation.

 

[SouthernDragon]

denying makes you naturally better at last hitting, something that you could use some work on.

Spoiler

kidding.

but seriously, controlling lane flow is a huge part of the game that should be included, that's why deny plank was awesome.

I'm getting pretty good at last hitting. I usually lead in CS within the first 4 minutes unless I get horribly ganked.

Lane control is important, but doing that through denying is not the way to go. It drags a game out unnecessarily and makes the game more defensive instead of aggressive. Not to mention that it's a headache for me personally; not only do I have to pay attention to the opposing wave, the enemy champs in lane and the roaming/jungling champ, but now I have to watch my wave and hit them, too?

No thanks. Allowing me to focus on farming and harassing/juking is great.

 

[Neki]

LoL is basically a rice farmer's dream. Farm farm farm is basically what happens. Not very gank-oriented like HoN, but that's just how it works.

 

[SouthernDragon]

Well, farming and harassment usually occurs until level 9, and then it becomes more teamfight/gank oriented.

Does ganking start before the 10 minute/level 11 mark in HoN?

 

[Neki]

Well, farming and harassment usually occurs until level 9, and then it becomes more teamfight/gank oriented.

Does ganking start before the 10 minute/level 11 mark in HoN?

yes, very much so. at least the competitive meta-game, is very gank heavy. usually once the mid solo is level 6.

 

[Haly]

In Hon the ganking game starts at level 1.

Trilanes ftw.

Or whenever an invis/haste rune pops up.

 

[Void Insanity]

In Hon the ganking game starts at level 1.

In LoL it starts before anything even spawns.

 

[Retro_]

In LoL it starts before anything even spawns.

Those are team fights not ganks

and the end after everything spawns for a good 10-15 mins

 

[Haly]

In LoL it starts before anything even spawns.

That's what level 1 implies

if there is one thing LoL is underrated in the DOTA VS LOL VS HON shitstorm, is in its character design

there's a shitton of comics with individual LoL characters. almost nil with all the others. why? strong visual character design

Their respective deviantart pages:
Dota
LoL
A difference of about 500. Pretty big, but not exactly "nil".

Also this was a fanwork for dota long before LoL was released.

This as well.

This is the most recent loading screen I believe:

Shit's on anything Riot's put out, even if you include the Chinese artwork.

 

[Void Insanity]

Shit's on anything Riot's put out, even if you include the Chinese artwork.

In a loading screen war yes, but that is all it is. A loading screen, a fan art. The in game looks nothing like it. Everything riot shows is at least accurate to the in game representation of it. Secondly it is not "DotA" character design, it is blizzard. Nearly every single model used in DotA is unit in WC3 or based on a Warcraft lore figure with the exception being the Phantom Lancer who is based on that dude from FFX.

 

[Haly]

Why compare Dota and LoL in terms of visual design then? Jenga was talking about fanworks, so that's what I responded with.

You're not actually going to defend Riot's artwork are you? It's been shit since day one. Only recently has it gotten better with the redraws. And some of them are still terrible when scrutinized (eve and morgana's torso).

 

[joelseph]

Those are team fights not ganks

and the end after everything spawns for a good 10-15 mins

If jungle doesn't need leash mid will try and fb gank before minions.

 

[Archie]

wtfisthiscrap

Singed is hard2play

 

[Void Insanity]

Why indeed. Your the one trying to pose the argument that DotA has better character design than LoL and that is not true. It has far better design than HoN though, since HoN does not have any.

 

[EXGN]

In regards to the Summoner Spell/Runepage/Masteries thing - I think a lot of people forget these elements are there for a reason besides simply adding a meta game.

Riot doesn't want people creating smurfs and crushing new players, but the game is free to play, meaning they can start as many accounts as they want. However, by making people earn runes, characters, summoner spells, etc. they are adding incentive to stay with a main account.

If they got rid of SS/Runes/Masteries, they would need to put a new system in place to prevent that 600 Elo troll from just making a new account to mess with newbies.

 

[Archie]

In regards to the Summoner Spell/Runepage/Masteries thing - I think a lot of people forget these elements are there for a reason besides simply adding a meta game.

Riot doesn't want people creating smurfs and crushing new players, but the game is free to play, meaning they can start as many accounts as they want. However, by making people earn runes, characters, summoner spells, etc. they are adding incentive to stay with a main account.

If they got rid of SS/Runes/Masteries, they would need to put a new system in place to prevent that 600 Elo troll from just making a new account to mess with newbies.

But that happens anyway. Nearly every game with my alt has been with other smurfs and leavers/racists/trolls.

 

[Haly]

Indeed, you don't actually NEED runes/summoner spells/more characters to smurf. You can smurf with pretty much any character at even at Level 1 the queues are full of smurfs.

In fact, smurfing is easier because everyone has to play without Flash, which tends to be a crutch for newer players who haven't developed sufficient map awareness/habit of warding.

 

[Void Insanity]

In fact, smurfing is easier because everyone has to play without Flash, which tends to be a crutch for newer players who haven't developed sufficient map awareness/habit of warding.

Not 100% true. Summoner spell selection is client side and if you play for awhile you'll come across people with flash.

 

[Haly]

Not 100% true. Summoner spell selection is client side and if you play for awhile you'll come across people with flash.

Well when I think smurfs I think level 1-5. Maybe up to 10 if there aren't enough on.

 

[Void Insanity]

I am also on about players level 1-5. I have seen fresh level 1's with flash.

 

[Haly]

So you have smurfs hacking their way to get Flash?

Mind boggles.

 

[HappyPuppy]

soulstealer is too momentum based. if you get it as a first item and don't get any kills, you've basically sunk 1200 gold that could have went to a deathcap instead.

I think that is the problem right there. You don't rush snowball items as your first item.

 

[Archie]

So, Singed advise? Goo throwing and fling tips would be greatly appreciated.

 

[unifin]

Don't use fling to DPS, use it to keep people in your team's focus/in your poison trail. Place goo as a gap closer or to close off choke points.

I mean, Singed is pretty simple. ><

 

[Haly]

Singed is not a solo hero. You have to have your team nearby. His job is just to run around and generally be an annoyance.

Kind of like Rammus but a bit less direct.

 

[EXGN]

So, Singed advise? Goo throwing and fling tips would be greatly appreciated.

Specifically for goo and fling, remember that goo isn't always a set up for a fling. I see a lot of Singeds that simply goo and flip enemies back into their poison. However, if you really want to do damage, you should try to fling first, then goo so they are stuck running in your poison for even longer

Singed is a unique character in that his poison trail enables him to play differently than any other champion. Rather than chasing after an enemy, you want to be running in front of and leading them. Rather than hitting turrets, you want to be running past them to poison the next enemy minion wave to let your creeps keep fighting the turret.

He's also a character that needs to know his limits. A good Singed will know when he can chase an enemy through the 3 turrets into the enemy base and get a kill, or when he can't. He has beastly sustained health regen with FON + Ult + Masteries, enabling him to do things other champions simply can't.

You need to defy expectations and do things that no one thought you would do. You can tell if you're a good Singed when you see entire teams of enemies - including tanks - run away when you're coming near.

 

[Shalashaska161]

So, Singed advise? Goo throwing and fling tips would be greatly appreciated.

Basically you just use goo to catch up to people and then you fling them backwards, hopefully into the rest of your team. And just ult whenever a team fight happens or when your trying to catch up to someone. He is a fairly straightforward hero really, the only tricky thing is getting your positioning down perfect for flinging.

I just like him because poo gas is hilarious.

 

[shintoki]

If I recall, Singed's gas doesn't draw argo. Maybe Fling doesn't either. Use that to freely harass in a lane.

 

[Uchip]

That the exact reason I never gave a crap about HoN and do not really care much for DotA 2.

no offense but why is your avatar so pixelated and ugly?

 

[Drkirby]

no offense but why is your avatar so pixelated and ugly?

It looks like he tried to edit it in MS Paint.

So, trying Karma a bit, is there a reason no one uses her? In 250 games, I have never seen her be picked once.

 

[y2dvd]

I wouldn't mind them trying out "can't cast flash 20s after being attacked" ala the keleseth's dagger limitation.

GP is pretty alright now. His jungle is fast and his ganks post 6 are incredibly deadly. Even before 6 a ranged red at melée levels is nothing to be scoffed at.

Douche bag blitz:
Builds tank
Never initiates

"I'm good at grabbing"
Grabs singed into carry

Honestly, they need to get rid of GP's passive. I'm fine if they leave his shot slowing down. The CD on it is hella fast anyways, but with the passive, no one is escaping.

 

[SouthernDragon]

She's an usual support. She's actually really tanky for a support, too. People say she isn't that great, but I've faced several good Karma players. She's just more complicated than Janna or Sona.

 

[Void Insanity]

no offense but why is your avatar so pixelated and ugly?

I don't know...... Wait

You calling my pony ugly?

 

[BluWacky]

It looks like he tried to edit it in MS Paint.

So, trying Karma a bit, is there a reason no one uses her? In 250 games, I have never seen her be picked once.

She's the hardest support character to use effectively. She can't heal very often because of needing to build up her karmic charge things (and being very mana hungry early game), and her crowd control is difficult to use. Plus her passive encourages you to play dangerously which is not a good thing in my opinion.

Orianna is far better at fulfilling a similar function whilst being able to stay safe, IMO.

 

[Uchip]

I don't know...... Wait

You calling my pony ugly?

yes

 

[EXGN]

So I played a ranked game and I was the one choosing bans. Someone on my team said they were gonna play Yorick. I banned him XD

Maybe I'll let you play him after the incoming buffs.

 

[Drkirby]

I personally like Karma, though I play her as mainly in the start as support, then ease her into a heavy AP character as the game goes on. Start with Boots and Mana Pots, Get Philosopher's stone, the upgrade the boots, grab a Mejai's Soulstealer, Build a Abyssal Scepter (For a bit more Magic Resist), Upgrade the Philosopher's stone Eleisa's Miracle, get a Deathcap, and finish it off with ether Will of the Ancients or Morello's Evil Tome, depending on how the Soulstealer is doing.

 

[Card Boy]

I worked out an exploit on the Tribunal system. At the moment i can do 20 cases per day instead of the 10. Because i live in Australia the daily cases reset at 6PM AEST instead of 1AM DST. So before 6PM, at 5:45PM i can do 10 cases, then after 6PM i can do another 10 cases, then the next day i can rinse and repeat i can do another 10 cases at 5:45PM and so on.

There is like an hour gap where you can do an extra 10 cases. A crapload of IP should be waiting for me.

 

[Boken]

I worked out an exploit on the Tribunal system. At the moment i can do 20 cases per day instead of the 10. Because i live in Australia the daily cases reset at 6PM AEST instead of 1AM DST. So before 6PM, at 5:45PM i can do 10 cases, then after 6PM i can do another 10 cases, then the next day i can rinse and repeat i can do another 10 cases at 5:45PM and so on.

There is like an hour gap where you can do an extra 10 cases. A crapload of IP should be waiting for me.

If youre doing tribunal for IP you're doing it wrong =p