BreezyLimbo
Banned
And what's going to happen is that the next 10 champions in line who are considered 'strong' will simply take the place of the banned ones
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League of Legends |OT12| No more Lyte, just darkness.
- Thread starter zkylon
- Start date
And what's going to happen is that the next 10 champions in line who are considered 'strong' will simply take the place of the banned ones
cool, maybe rito will finally take the time to balance something other than their handful of favorites
nah let's just put another useless nerf on nidalee and rework ryze again :^)
SenorArdilla
Member
I hope Ryze's next rework dumps him into the jungle.
LostMyNarbles
Member
Isn't that kind of an issue in all games though? There's always going to be a select list of champions that are better than everybody else. It's like in shooters where a weapon is always going to be better than another weapon, or WoW where a select set of classes *cough mage* are always going to be better than the rest.
I got Star Guardian Jinx from a chest, but spent all my essence on another dinky skin. ;_;
I got Star Guardian Jinx from a chest, but spent all my essence on another dinky skin. ;_;
PhillipCostigan
Member
hey dude, not entirely sure and even if I was I couldn't really say since they're doing some secret shit afaik but I would imagine it would be theatre in the round like at MSG, with screens on all sides
not 100% tho
Peanut Butter
Member
i don't think i had noticed before captain mf how huge mf's boobs are
it's very distracting, she can barely walk carrying those things
this skin is also way more lame than its splash, i'm really bummed out... it looks sooo bad in comparison -__-
i think i'll go back to mad max mf
the best one now that they made her anime
you can't fix champ variety in competitive by just removing the top tier
it might help a bit since now ppl aren't like throwing everything for freaking nidalee but still, game needs to allow for new strategies and win conditions, and make those balanced before champion variety works
the game is too damn solvable, that's its main issue, and it might be impossible to fix without doing some hardcore changes worthy of a full lol 2 title, but in the meantime i wish they introduced new options in a greater scale than just new stuff that individual champions can do.
i mean, do both, but definitely throw a couple wrenches in the meta so that it's not so easy to figure out
it's very distracting, she can barely walk carrying those things
this skin is also way more lame than its splash, i'm really bummed out... it looks sooo bad in comparison -__-
i think i'll go back to mad max mf
the best one now that they made her anime
yeah i think this is gonna be an issue regardless
you can't fix champ variety in competitive by just removing the top tier
it might help a bit since now ppl aren't like throwing everything for freaking nidalee but still, game needs to allow for new strategies and win conditions, and make those balanced before champion variety works
the game is too damn solvable, that's its main issue, and it might be impossible to fix without doing some hardcore changes worthy of a full lol 2 title, but in the meantime i wish they introduced new options in a greater scale than just new stuff that individual champions can do.
i mean, do both, but definitely throw a couple wrenches in the meta so that it's not so easy to figure out
Sigismundo
Member
And that's why staggering bans works instead of frontloading them.
It's not as if Riot has to copy Dota's picking phase 100%. They can find out what works best for them as long as staggering bans is a part of it.
i really don't think staggered bans would do that much for league
there's very little you're conveying to the enemy team if you pick a champion so they can play around it
it's not a bad system in itself but league is not doto and i really wonder if it'd make much of a difference
even when there was like blind pick in lck teams still picked pretty much the same as they did in draft games, rushed for the ops and that's it
there's very little you're conveying to the enemy team if you pick a champion so they can play around it
it's not a bad system in itself but league is not doto and i really wonder if it'd make much of a difference
even when there was like blind pick in lck teams still picked pretty much the same as they did in draft games, rushed for the ops and that's it
I think staggered bans could be helpful for competitive league since they have more of a purpose for their team comps and will likely identify what the enemy team is trying to do.
Solo queue comps are still gonna be solo queue comps though and staggered bans won't matter.
Sigismundo
Member
I think it also works better in Dota because of the more narrow hero design. Dota heroes tend to do one thing uniquely well (with some exceptions of course) and League champions - while becoming more unique - are more broadly good at things, and are therefore more interchangeable.
I don't see this changing too much to be honest.
I don't see this changing too much to be honest.
Yeah, that too. Staggered bans won't be the end all to fix champion diversity.
killatopak
Member
captain mf splash is great tho.
It's my log in screen background.
It's my log in screen background.
this is the crux of it, each game requires its own solution that's tailor made for their champion design and their overall gameplay design
to think there's no need to "reinvent the wheel" is silly, while they probably shouldn't go crazy with it, they should try at least to find the proper wheel that fits league's overarching design
try and remember the latest competitive games, imagine how they'd play out with staggered bans. do you think they'd be very different? do you think variety would increase or do you think they'd just rush at picking the most op like usual?
the problem with pick variety in league is that unlike doto most of league's champions overlap with each other, and most of league's systems and classes can be quantified in ways that are relatively easy to pick out a "strongest pick" and that's about it.
there are no hard counterpicks in league (thankfully) but look at what happens when there are, actually, with karma being #1 support and then teams finding zyra as a counter and then mf as a counter to zyra. that's really interesting from both champ variety and pick and ban strategy, cos mf also requiers ashe to work properly to pull off the double ult combo, and now maybe teams will just pick alistar or something against mf, idk
but this feels more like a happy accident than a real product of league's design, and it's still just a tier list being run down that's mostly fun because mf support is so freaking silly
imo league champ variety will never be fixed without a bigger systems overhaul, big changes to itemization, map design and summoner spells. the thing about the strategies we know like poke+disengage, deathball, pick-off and teamfighting comps, is that often enough teams do like 3 of these at once
idk if that can't be fixed without limiting champion kits to something more similar to doto, and i don't think that's something any of us wants, so league should try and carve its own path and figure out where the extra layers of depth are gonna come from
the splash is gorgeous, it's just the in-game skin that looks really outdated i guess
i really wish league client had a 3d model viewer, i feel like i wouldn't have bought it if i knew it wasn't gonna be so great
don't they have the thingy on the website with the 3d model when they announce new skins? i'm sure they could also make it rotate.
I think the discussion comes down to this for me personally: 10 bans or staggers bans and picks. Personally I think the latter is way more interesting as it dramatically changes how people approaches picks and bans. Whereas with 10 bans it just feels like putting on a bigger list and that's it. More qualitative than quantitative.
Stone Ocean
Member
Well it is MF
Thanks for the leaked information! I'm sure it'll be good on all sides then
SenorArdilla
Member
Getting that sweet karma.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Thats a problem with champ designs then, innit.
When a champ like Viktor or Ekko is so dominant at what they do, then of course staggered bans wouldnt work. Because there is a homogenous design in Ritos early works that kinda ruined it. Their philosophy used to be(still is?) that if they created a character, then a player shouldnt be forced to earn a certain champion to counter that character. This is emblematic of the "champions arent available to everyone" and it was a real issue a couple of years ago when they released the majority of champions. Thats why ADCs used to be so homogenous, thats why champions tend to not be built around a nice. Its why you have aberrations like Ekko who can do almost everything perfectly, with little to no drawback. Its why Viktor is one of the strongest mages, because for a mage he does almost everything too well-AoE, single target damage, huge cc, and he can do it safely.
Now theyre trying to create niche champions, like Ivern, but the damage is already done. Theres too many "well-rounded" champions due to their previous philosophies, that niche champions end up being weaker because they are niche.
Peanut Butter
Member
All Zky wants is a three-part romance novel about Zed and Syndra.
I don't necessarily disagree with the sentiment, but picking Ivern as an example isn't a good idea. It's not like using Ivern into his actual niche makes him strong. Ivern is weak because he's undertuned.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Even if Ivern had the right numbers, he would still be a weak niche pick compared to Reksai or Lee. The only way I see Ivern being viable is overtuning his numbers and possibly lowering the timer on how long it takes to tame a jungle camp.
PhillipCostigan
Member
yeah Clubs is back up in OCE and NA, rolling out to other regions
Nah, that's all fine now. He can get to level 4 faster than Nidalee and he's even faster in the S7 jungle on the PBE (all the changes favor him more than other junglers because he never used the jungle buffs to clear in the first place) and his health and mana cost buff on his passive went a long way to helping him out. Experienced Ivern players are starting to pick up his pattern of grove the camp->go do something->return and collect, the time to grove a camp is becoming a non-factor.
If Riot buffs his early game damage (most likely place to buff) then he'll be a strong pick. You get a champion with 85% (random un-quantifiable number, whatever) of the early game but with significantly better mid and late game in a competitive environment. Once Riot buffs him and pro and high elo players start putting lots of time into him he'll become a jungle mainstay.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Ill bet you a mystery gift that, unless Ivern gets buffed, he wont be a mainstay pick competitively next year.
Hey, so, was the Riot Kayle promotion only for 5v5 games made during the period? I remember playing a match of ARAM on my craptop during the week so I could get it, but now that I have a computer that doesn't burn me alive when I run league I've noticed I don't have the skin.
PhillipCostigan
Member
that thread is one of those "ban waiting to happen threads" that are never worth venturing into except to see the size of the account graveyard
I really wanna go into it but every time I go into one of those threads I get banned for shit posting. Unlucky.
I feel like even some normal and rational posts were getting people banned in that thread.
Well anyways, not gonna discuss moderation, but yeah stay away from there lol.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Unless youre really invested into the subject matter
Yeah its best to ignore those type of threads. Well that, and if youre gonna bait like Newt does lol
RIP
Just add me (Euler) to your friend list, I'll add you tomorrow.
ARAM games worked, even coop games. Maybe you played after the period? If not, contact Riot support. I did and they responded thoroughly
EUW GAF is dead. The one time a conversation happened before clubs died it was about Vore...
Dobkeratops
OT Hard Carry
Done. Might want to be careful when it comes to clicking Talents' chat links, keep that in mind.
QED:
But it's alright, I won't judge.
I've been playing on NA recently so that explains the lack of activity. No Dobe no life.
Alright, thanks
PhillipCostigan
Member
well I'm staying in LA for another week so no EUW gold for me
maybe can do it on NA...
maybe can do it on NA...