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[zkylon]

I like this idea, but another cool thing in DotA is the way you can click on enemy champions (or friendly ones) and see their abilities just like you can see your own. Fair enough, it'll still take ages to learn how they all work, but that's something, especially in a game where you can't simply try out the champion you just lost against.

yea that's pretty cool and kill cards like they have in both games are useful, it's just that I think it's sometimes too much to digest early on, specially during a game

like I know what every champion in lol does, I'm not diamond or even a longtime moba player but I feel like I could grab dota and learn it if I spent enough time on it, it's just that these champion pools are such a huge barrier of entry that having a rough idea of what the dude that's in front of me does (what's his signature move? what's his role? what to look out for?) I think would be really helpful in a way reading his entire kit maybe wouldn't.

like, it's too much for me right now, new players are too noobish to really care about mana costs and cooldowns and crap. knowing that "BLITZ HOOK = BAD", which is kind of the advice a friend would give you seems to me like a lovely thing to have in the game if you're a total noob

 

[brian!]

What's one and two?

shamrock malphite and eagle anivia

 

[Achtius]

Might be a long shot but I think Closer is an Irish-American naturalist.

 

[Newt]

Kayle - [Q] - Reckoning
Blasts a target,dealing 60/110/160/210/260 (+)(+0.6)magic damage,slowing their Movement Speed by 35/40/45/50/55% for 3/3/3/3/3 seconds,and applying a stack of Holy Fervor.

Cost: 70/75/80/85/90 Mana

Range: 0

Cooldown: 8/8/8/8/8

Guess I'm never playing mid again.

 

[dimb]

her current scaling of +1 is pretty ridic.

 

[zkylon]

it's a great nerf to kayle, lich bane kayle is stupid she can slow you while speeding herself up and instagib you with a qe combo. if all things fail she can turn immortal and hit you again with e until you're dead.

I thought they'd put some of that damage elsewhere, tho I guess the mana buff to her ult is pretty nice. feels like they fucked her up hard tho, they should buff her passive or something

also like the renek changes

 

[Cathcart]

Smell ya later, Kayle. Her title should be changed to The No-Fun Champ.

"Ohh guys time to do my awesome ult that's super fun."
"Nope. Kayle ult."
"Fuuuuu--"

We're all taught in school that if we ever get the chance to go back in time and stop one champion from being created that we're supposed to stop Teemo, but if I get a second shot at it I'm removing no-fun stupidface boring Kayle from the game.

 

[Newt]

Guess I gotta learn how to play another mid champ. I hate mid .

 

[garath]

Guess I gotta learn how to play another mid champ. I hate mid .

Yasuo

edit: Oh cool. didn't realize I was approved for a PBE account. Creating now. Don't know if I'll ever have the time to do anything with it though.

 

[Type2]

Yasuo

edit: Oh cool. didn't realize I was approved for a PBE account. Creating now. Don't know if I'll ever have the time to do anything with it though.

Practice new junglers and runes.
Also well deserved on the kayle nerfs.

 

[Edwardo]

shamrock malphite and eagle anivia

I have shamrock malph but I can only use it on st Patrick's day.

 

[Fracas]

Any of you guys good at jungling? I've played something like 20 games in the role (I had to do it 4 times during placements ;__ and I want to get better. I'm doing fairly well with getting my jungle clear patterns set/covering lanes, but I suck at preventing the other jungler from invading. I'd like to work on my ganks as well.

I usually go with Hecarim.

Guess I gotta learn how to play another mid champ. I hate mid .

Swain for dayssss

 

[Stone Ocean]

Now thaaats a real nerf to Kassadin. Fuck Null Sphere

And Kayle will still be fucking retarded with the weaving masteries. She'll just to back to being about DPS instead of burst.

 

[Mister Wilhelm]

Kayle nerf is needed. Casting one spell and hitting one auto should not be able to melt targets like that and still be able to do sustained damage after.

 

[zkylon]

And Kayle will still be fucking retarded with the weaving masteries. She'll just to back to being about DPS instead of burst.

which is alright because playing dps is actually somewhat mechanically demanding. she'll have to position well and make good use of her passive and all of that.

instead of, you know, one shotting people with a targetted spell

I love this nerf, but I think she'll be pretty weak now. like 525 range is nothing. I feel like buffing her passive so it's 3 stacks of 5% armor/mr reduction instead of 5 stacks of 3% would be pretty nice at making up for the lost damage.

 

[Stone Ocean]

Back to Nashors - Liandrys then?

 

[zkylon]

Back to Nashors - Liandrys then?

maybe

at first glance it looks like she got axed pretty hard, while buffing all her support stuff, so I dunno if she'll remain competitive.

I wonder if she'll show up more in top than mid now

 

[drawkcaB]

Awesome. Renekton nerfs. Next patch is going through OP champs like a its a hit list.

 

[PROGRAM_IX]

shamrock malphite and eagle anivia

I have shamrock malph but I can only use it on st Patrick's day.

I love Shamrock Malphite. It's kind of embarrassing. But I love it.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Awesome. Renekton nerfs. Next patch is going through OP champs like a its a hit list.

sounds fun

 

[dimb]

sounds fun

it's okay.

 

[DeadNames]

Yasuo

edit: Oh cool. didn't realize I was approved for a PBE account. Creating now. Don't know if I'll ever have the time to do anything with it though.

Let me have it!

Spoiler

YES Renek changes.

 

[Scratch]

I am awakened!

 

[Mothman91]

Why remove the armor pen on his E? That was there so that in late game, he can fight with the armor stacking tanks. I think Riot was just "saying" that they would try to help his late game, but fuck it they said.

And oh yeah, don't touch Shyvana or Mundo righ rito?

 

[Hazaro]

it'd be really cool, for both doto and lol, to have very brief noob friendly champion descriptions during loading screens or whatnot.

like say for blitzcrank it could say something like: "Tanky robot that can pull enemies to him from afar. Beware of when he runs towards you or when you lose sight of him!".

Someone mentioned it already, but at least you can hover over their skills to see range + mana cost and read the description. I was kind of shocked I couldn't do this in LoL.
Have you laned vs Bane yet? That was fun as a noob.

Also it's not that up to date, but: www.dota2alttab.com/ may or may not be useful.

Personally I just file heroes under:
They can't kill me
They can get me killed
They can kill me
They can kill me from realllllllllly far away

 

[Crab Milk Mickey]

It's bad in the sense that it doesn't really teach you how to play DotA, more like how to control you champion in DotA. The first few tutorial "levels" even give a false impression that the game might be some sort of RTS or even an action RPG. It's very good in the sense that it's well put together and more entertaining to go through than LoL's tutorial.

I mean...it's a MOBA. I'm not sure how you make a proper tutorial for game type that takes upwards of 100 hours to really understand.

Well, that's disappointing. I hoped with all the foresight and resources Valve had they'd turn their tutorials into a proper educational tool... for as much as that's possible with a game that is in a constant state of flux. Tall order regardless.

Ideally that'd be one way to attract newcomers, since MOBA's (much like fighting games) lack immediate and official documentation for various intricacies and what a player may or may not be doing wrong.

it'd be really cool, for both doto and lol, to have very brief noob friendly champion descriptions during loading screens or whatnot.

like say for blitzcrank it could say something like: "Tanky robot that can pull enemies to him from afar. Beware of when he runs towards you or when you lose sight of him!".

I dislike how crude the current loading screen has been since the very beginning. There's so much you can do with it instead of it simply showcasing resized splash arts.

 

[drawkcaB]

Why remove the armor pen on his E? That was there so that in late game, he can fight with the armor stacking tanks. I think Riot was just "saying" that they would try to help his late game, but fuck it they said.

And oh yeah, don't touch Shyvana or Mundo righ rito?

IIRC the armor reduction of his E was added late in season 2 before the changes to how armour penetration/reduction were calculated. Because everything armour related was changed in S3, what was a buff to help him late game became invisible and undervalued power.

(Several other champions have something similar as well, like the free armour pen on Darius's E. I expect that will be take out once his mini rework shows up.)

If Renekton players still want the armour reduction, they can weave a BC into the build instead of going straight tank. Renekton applies the stacks fairly easily.

 

[zkylon]

And oh yeah, don't touch Shyvana or Mundo righ rito?

shyvanna was nerfed on this patch, mundo will probably be nerfed anytime soon, and I hate that way of thinking about buffs and nerfs, this is meant to address problems with renek we've known for ages that are completely unrelated to mundo and shyv.

Personally I just file heroes under:
They can't kill me
They can get me killed
They can kill me
They can kill me from realllllllllly far away

lol

I seem unable to find champions in the first category

I dislike how crude the current loading screen has been since the very beginning. There's so much you can do with it instead of it simply showcasing resized splash arts.

yup, I wonder how many projects riot's dealing with at the same time that they just can't roll. I can't imagine them being pleased with the current state of many of these things

 

[Crab Milk Mickey]

Also hot damn they're finally fixing what's been bugging me about Rumble's Q (namely it being hella ugly) after all this time:

This is hilarious.

 

[Leezard]

His old flame thrower had charm though. It was like he could turn it up a notch but decided to just let it puff some smoke.

Now he will have actual fire. Rumble buff.

 

[Opiate]

When/why did armor pen runes go out of favor for ad carries?

 

[dimb]

When/why did armor pen runes go out of favor for ad carries?

Before season three at least. Flat AD is just better and synergizes with life steal quints/vamp scepter.

 

[Newt]

Swain for dayssss

Gonna trust this.

 

[DeadNames]

Sigh. Some people just can't be argued with. My friend insists khazix is the most broken thing in the game while I say there are plenty of counters to him. But no, I'm wrong because he "instakills" adcs. He says khazix is "safe" and insists gragas' laning is bad
And unsafe.

 

[Fracas]

Gonna trust this.

Throw the e, q, w, then ult

Unf. He's also basically impossible to gank. Pop the ultimate then pimp cane walk away.

 

[Stone Ocean]

When/why did armor pen runes go out of favor for ad carries?

Ever since Season 2. Because flat AD does more damage early and the late game advantage of flat pen is negligible on most carries.

 

[dimb]

Sigh. Some people just can't be argued with. My friend insists khazix is the most broken thing in the game while I say there are plenty of counters to him. But no, I'm wrong because he "instakills" adcs. He says khazix is "safe" and insists gragas' laning is bad
And unsafe.

kha6 is pretty good right now. you can drop pinks though or burst him. scary early though.

 

[zkylon]

Sigh. Some people just can't be argued with. My friend insists khazix is the most broken thing in the game while I say there are plenty of counters to him. But no, I'm wrong because he "instakills" adcs. He says khazix is "safe" and insists gragas' laning is bad
And unsafe.

kha is pretty stupid right now

so is gragas

but at least playing the fat man is less facerolly

 

[Stone Ocean]

Explosive Cask ( R ) AP ratio reduced to .6 from .9
Explosive Cask ( R ) damage lowered to 150/200/250 from 150/300/450

Holy fuck I hadn't seen this

 

[Pandaman]

Holy fuck I hadn't seen this

excellent.

 

[zkylon]

Holy fuck I hadn't seen this

they also cut the cooldown by 30 seconds yo

I think it's kind of a good nerf for gragas, maybe it's too drastic but as it is right now you don't even have to aim, just try to hit a bunch of squishies and the damage is enough for it to be alright

I kinda wish they left his ult at 350 damage and just cut 20 seconds off. someting in between. like, karthus ult at lvl 1 does 250 damage :I

 

[Mothman91]

Holy fuck I hadn't seen this

Even though I bought him, I don't mind this. Those ratios were too fucking high, and that ultimate can almost bring down any squishy target to 20% easily from 100.

 

[dimb]

but at least playing the fat man is less facerolly

kha6 needs to time openings at least and factor in cc. gragas is kind of just like...throw your stuff and blow dudes up.

 

[zkylon]

yeah the more I think about it, a 200 damage nerf is brutal, that's crazy

kha6 needs to time openings at least and factor in cc. gragas is kind of just like...throw your stuff and blow dudes up.

true, but grago has only one spell to throw besides his ult, it's not like ziggs or syndra or ori. his q is not hard to land, but if you do miss it's very punishing. maybe I'm wrong but I feel like kha's difficulty is pretty much the same as playing akali or katarina or any other reset champion since his kit is pretty much jump at someone then press all the buttons for death!

 

[brian!]

yeah gragas is like 10 times easier
but those numbers holy clow

the best would be if they gave gragas really really low dmg on his ult, but two ults, wuld be most played champ

 

[Wolf Akela]

That's really damn harsh. I might consider slightly tanky AP with lich on Graggy. :/

And wot at Kayle nerf. Are they turning her into a support?

 

[KiwiLannister]

I'm saving my ip for Swain right now. I figure by the time I learn him he'll be really strong since Riot will have nerfed another 50 perfectly fine champions.

Kayle nerfs are deserved just because she's so unfun to play against. But these Renekton nerfs... I mean they basically just buffed Shyvana and Mundo. Just completely stupid, it's as though they didn't consider the effect of nerfing Renekton on the current top lane meta.

Something really needs to be done about top lane in general. Such a boring lane now.

 

[DeadNames]

kha is pretty stupid right now

so is gragas

but at least playing the fat man is less facerolly

Not really, the aoe on gragas' spells make them incredibly easy to hit, and his w is just dumb if the champ youre playing isn't good early game.

 

[Stone Ocean]

true, but grago has only one spell to throw besides his ult, it's not like ziggs or syndra or ori. his q is not hard to land, but if you do miss it's very punishing. maybe I'm wrong but I feel like kha's difficulty is pretty much the same as playing akali or katarina or any other reset champion since his kit is pretty much jump at someone then press all the buttons for death!

But as the level of play goes up, it gets a loooooot harder to just jump and faceroll. Gotta be opportunistic and pick of targets properly, otherwise you'll just die trying.

Gragas you can just throw shit from a distance and they have pretty much no answer aside from all-inning you before you can ult, and even then you can just Fatwalk out of trouble most of the time. Plus the AoE's are as fat as his gut and the cast times are almost non-existant.

Really, the only hard things about Gragas are using his ult for the displacement - which he rarely does in the current state of the game - and doing proper EQ shenanigans - which you'll not use very often.

 

[zkylon]

like I said gragas is pretty dumb too, it's just that khazix isn't specially hard to play compared to other assassins

with ahri you gotta land a non-pass through skillshot and you have no resets, with zed you gotta do your combo properly, akali and kassadin have shit early games, etc.

I don't think there's anything special about khazix as far as player skill is concerned

But as the level of play goes up, it gets a loooooot harder to just jump and faceroll. Gotta be opportunistic and pick of targets properly, otherwise you'll just die trying.

Gragas you can just throw shit from a distance and they have pretty much no answer aside from all-inning you before you can ult, and even then you can just Fatwalk out of trouble most of the time. Plus the AoE's are as fat as his gut and the cast times are almost non-existant.

Really, the only hard things about Gragas are using his ult for the displacement - which he rarely does in the current state of the game - and doing proper EQ shenanigans - which you'll not use very often.

this is why I think the direction of the nerf is really good

I just dunno if lowering his damage by that amount won't make him stupidly weak

250 (+0.6) is less damage than syndra q