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League of Legends |OT6| My AP Mid Can't Be This Cute

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F

Ferga

Member
We should have a competition for a premade 5 bot game and see who gets the most kills.

It'll be a battle of balancing your time with killing bots and timing your pushes to end the game with the most kills

Winner gets a Tim tam
 
D

d[-_-]b

Banned
jbcdjzB.jpg


First time penta kill :O.
 
Z

zkylon

zkylewd
DeadNames said:
??


I just think it's a little frustrating seeing gragas twoshot your whole team when some champions not even get hovered over.
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well it's not really about damage but more about grago having pretty much everything: waveclear, burst, mobility, poke, sustain (of health AND mana), lvl 2/3 cheese, disengage, catch and great scaling all game long. he can ever take down turrets kind of fast thanks to free ad from w (tho i wouldn't really list this as a big strength of his).

ori is a bit guilty of this too but she's not really op because she's does things just right, not excessively so like grago.

but like i think the problem overall with mages is that they're kind of just too obvious. like before a teamfight you know what a brand is gonna do, same with like lux, their kits are just too straight-forward and simple imo for them to compete against assassins so the only champs that survive mid are the ones with op numbers (grago, ziggs, nidalee, lulu, ori a bit) or have kits with a bit more "room of expression" (like ori or syndra) that are more comparable to the amount of options a mobility kit like lebonk/zed gives you.

i wish rito made more syndras. like i feel they tried something like that with velkoz but i haven't played him enough to say.

/rant

tldr +.1 ap ratio and 12/11/10/9/8 cd on lux e rito pls

d[-_-]b;105671345 said:
jbcdjzB.jpg


First time penta kill :O.
Click to expand...
nice

took me over 1k games to get my first penta T_T
 
B

Blizzard

Banned
d[-_-]b;105672098 said:
Got demolished the previous game, so this one made up for it. Plus going away for my wedding this week so trying to league it up while I can lol.
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Congrats on both counts, you can end your league career on a penta as your high note. :D
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
Tizoc said:
Thanks.

OK so can someone help with how I should go about making my build for these characters please?
Xin Zhao (Focus on AD or AD+AP? Or forgo all that and build him as a tank)
Click to expand...

Xin scales off of either CDR or on-hit effect items. The AD and AP ratios are deceiving, he won't make particularly good use of either. Generally speaking, CDR heavy builds will focus on his tanking/peeling gameplay and on-hit builds will focus on his damage/assassin gameplay.
 
M

Mister Negative

Member
a lot of the time when i jungle in inhouse i do nothing and everyone on my team gets fed and im just like oh ok

also i just realized i didnt use ghost a single time that game
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
boken said:
go mess with the enemy jungler then
Click to expand...

Or just farm up in your own jungle. Unless you get fed like 3+ kills it's faster to hit 6 just clearing camps.

On a somewhat related note, I played my first Nautilus game in S4 and put some Nautilus theories of mine to the test:

i.) his cooldowns are so high that even at 40% CDR his skills will be available for two full rotations max in a fight which leads to;
ii.) his passive supplements his skill based CC enough that max CDR is not necessary for him to do his job anyways. 20-30% CDR is sufficient which leads to;
iii.) his principal means of damage are auto-attacks. Offensive items that include on-hit effects, AD, and crit chance are optimal.
iv.) his base attack speed and movement speed are garbage and so attack speed runes and % movement speed runes are sub-par compared to other junglers.
v.) best way to keep the shield up is health stacking and activating after the opponents initial burst of damage. Health+AR/MR items are optimal.

So I went with AD marks+quints, built SotEL -> Boots -> Warmogs (could have gone Randuins, but I wanted to see how this would work and at the time Vel'Koz seemed like he might become a threat) -> Merc Treads -> Sunfire Cape -> Wit's End -> Chain Vest. Had 20% CDR between my runes, masteries, and SotEL. Ended up 8/2/9, where one death was because I held off 4 opponents to let my low health Renek and Nid escape. You know what? It felt great! I didn't miss the remaining 20% CDR at all. I need to play Nautilus some more, there's a few more key items I'd like to test out (e.g. Infinity Edge, Atma's) but it looks like I'm hoping on the Bruiser Nautilus train.
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
Mothman91 said:
holy shit, pankakes ulti got negated by wind wall lol.
Click to expand...

Like, immediately. You can still hear the SFX after the wave is gone. I've watched that fight several times and I'm still surprised purple side won so convincingly.

(Did achtius have janna ult up?)

My ping was back to normal in my match tonight (~70). Hopefully it stays that way. It had been hovering around 110 ever since those DDoS attack a month or so back.
 
N

Newt

Member
drawkcaB said:
Like, immediately. You can still hear the SFX after the wave is gone. I've watched that fight several times and I'm still surprised purple side won so convincingly.

(Did achtius have janna ult up?)

My ping was back to normal in my match tonight (~70). Hopefully it stays that way. It had been hovering around 110 ever since those DDoS attack a month or so back.
Click to expand...
Same thing with me. Also, you should play some inhouse with us sometime. I think I've invited you :S.
 
T

Type2

Member
Good games today. Learned a lot from our comm in the last game too. Closer did a great job applying pressure that game, bravo.
My lee sin was soooo rusty. I have a lot to work on if I ever plan on playing him again.

I used to look at the mini map every second but my map awareness isn't at it's best right now. I think I'm playing too much league for how tired I am after work. Forgot to eat today too:/.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
Type2 said:
Good games today. Learned a lot from our comm in the last game too. Closer did a great job applying pressure that game, bravo.
My lee sin was soooo rusty. I have a lot to work on if I ever plan on playing him again.

I used to look at the mini map every second but my map awareness isn't at it's best right now. I think I'm playing too much league for how tired I am after work. Forgot to eat today too:/.
Click to expand...
you seemed to have good presence from my point of view. you and your team popped up whenever we'd try to catch someone top.

there weren't any significant picks i can remember, save for the time you guys got me between red and baron.
 
M

Mister Negative

Member
I wanna play more top/mid in inhouses. I think today was actually the first time I played something other than Jung or AD and closer spanked me pretty handily in renek v darius
 
D

daxy

Member
drawkcaB said:
Or just farm up in your own jungle. Unless you get fed like 3+ kills it's faster to hit 6 just clearing camps.

On a somewhat related note, I played my first Nautilus game in S4 and put some Nautilus theories of mine to the test:

i.) his cooldowns are so high that even at 40% CDR his skills will be available for two full rotations max in a fight which leads to;
ii.) his passive supplements his skill based CC enough that max CDR is not necessary for him to do his job anyways. 20-30% CDR is sufficient which leads to;
iii.) his principal means of damage are auto-attacks. Offensive items that include on-hit effects, AD, and crit chance are optimal.
iv.) his base attack speed and movement speed are garbage and so attack speed runes and % movement speed runes are sub-par compared to other junglers.
v.) best way to keep the shield up is health stacking and activating after the opponents initial burst of damage. Health+AR/MR items are optimal.

So I went with AD marks+quints, built SotEL -> Boots -> Warmogs (could have gone Randuins, but I wanted to see how this would work and at the time Vel'Koz seemed like he might become a threat) -> Merc Treads -> Sunfire Cape -> Wit's End -> Chain Vest. Had 20% CDR between my runes, masteries, and SotEL. Ended up 8/2/9, where one death was because I held off 4 opponents to let my low health Renek and Nid escape. You know what? It felt great! I didn't miss the remaining 20% CDR at all. I need to play Nautilus some more, there's a few more key items I'd like to test out (e.g. Infinity Edge, Atma's) but it looks like I'm hoping on the Bruiser Nautilus train.
Click to expand...

If you're going for a bruiser build you're better off just getting a liandry's for a strong dot on his e and ending it at that. Nautilus is there to soak up damage and make sure nobody is going anywhere he doesn't want them to go, so sacrificing a slot for a damage item isn't that useful. Plus, all his abilities scale off of AP rather than AD, so investing in AD items isn't optimal. Attack speed runes are good if you're jungling and provides him with all the attack speed he needs. You want a bit of attack speed for team fights, but in the end your passive is capped by its internal cooldown more than your attack speed anyway. Movement speed quints are just generally useful if you want to roam quicker (even more so if you take the ms points in utility too). Your main damage is your auto while shield is up, which if it doesn't break could be on almost constantly if you get enough CDR.
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
daxy said:
If you're going for a bruiser build you're better off just getting a liandry's for a strong dot on his e and ending it at that. Nautilus is there to soak up damage and make sure nobody is going anywhere he doesn't want them to go, so sacrificing a slot for a damage item isn't that useful. Attack speed runes are good if you're jungling and provides him with all the attack speed he needs. You want a bit of attack speed for team fights, but in the end your passive is capped by its internal cooldown more than your attack speed anyway. Movement speed quints are just generally useful if you want to roam quicker (even more so if you take the ms points in utility too). Your main damage is your auto while shield is up, which if it doesn't break should be on almost constantly if you get enough CDR.
Click to expand...

Tried everything you wrote, hated all of it. I'm done with the orthodoxy of how I'm supposed to build Nautilus and it was easily the best Naut game I've played over a year.

Newt said:
Also, you should play some inhouse with us sometime. I think I've invited you :S.
Click to expand...

You have, and it's appreciated =)

Right now I'm in the concentrating on a jungle marathon to figure out my jungle picks. I had a list of about 50 champions I'd like to play and it just wasn't realistic given that I play 10 matches tops per week. So did a support marathon to figure those picks out, now jungle (which is hellish because I want it to be my main role and it had the most champs to try out, nearly done). Might move on to mid and top next, but it's hard to consistently get those roles. My ADC picks are already done. I only like a few of them.

...that and you're all like, gold+ players with 1000+ games and I'm an unranked scrub. I read you guys already have issues putting together balanced teams, you don't need me in that mix =D
 
D

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
Liandy's is one of the worst items in the game. :(

I don't think avoiding attack speed marks because someone has poor attack speed really makes sense...and if you pick up items like SotEL on Nautilus you'll probably just find yourself outmatched by the damage of most other junglers.
 
W

Wolf Akela

Member
Naut has terrible base and growth. I tried Wits once when I got fed because of how popular it seemed with other people but it just didn't work. Go get Abyssal if you want your AP MR item. My Naut build that leans toward offense goes something like boots, Golem, Sunfire, Abyssal, Gauntlet, Liandry.

I wouldn't rush Liandry at all. It's like... last item. Snowball item of choice is Sunfire or Abyssal.
 
D

daxy

Member
I personally don't like using Naut's E to clear because it makes him very mana hungry, so I prefer AS reds and be able to start with and max W first. With a bit of attack speed by the time it goes on cooldown you're done with your camp. Allows you to be less reliant on blue early on and get a lot out of his base tankiness. Perhaps it's just a bad season 2 jungle habit of attack speed on everyone.

^ Rushing Liandry isn't a good idea yeah, but with the 4% health tick from Naut's aoe slow it could do a good bit against health stacking opponents later on in the game.
 
D

drawkcaB

Member
dimb said:
Liandy's is one of the worst items in the game. :(
Click to expand...

Yes, yes it is. If you can't keep the procs up non-stop it's bad. Even then...

I don't think avoiding attack speed marks because someone has poor attack speed really makes sense...and if you pick up items like SotEL on Nautilus you'll probably just find yourself outmatched by the damage of most other junglers.
Click to expand...

I've tried attack speed mark clears on Naut vs. AD marks, AD works better, feels better. Even went so far as to count the number of Titan's Wrath procs I achieve in a level 4 clear. No significant difference.

As far as SotEL goes, I got the idea playing a variety of junglers recently who can build it to varying degrees of syngergy. In games where I built it ganks almost always went well. In games where I built SotAG, I had more issues when ganking. I'm of the opinion now that offensive stats help ganks more than defensive stats. Further, while tenacity is great, I question rushing an item that provides it on a jungler. 80+% of the time I'm not facing any CC. Both SotEL and SotAG have gold efficiencies of ~1350g, so the conservation passive and the true damage burn/tenacity must be worth the remaining 650g. With that in mind, the 30AD and true damage burn (which thanks to bladed armor helps me clear insanely fast) is useful all the time, SotAG's tenacity is not. With that said, it's more that I'm against a SotAG rush than I'm pro SotEL. I found myself 2 kills up by level 7 and put my theories to the test. Had things gone differently, or my team comp demanded that I go pure tank (we had a Renekton top) I'd opt for Spirit Stone -> Sunfire/Randuins -> SotAG.

As far as dueling goes, why not go heavy into AD runes like the FotM junglers? Of course the Sejuanis, the Nauts, etc. are dying at second buffs. They're running attack speed marks with move speed quints vs. champions that have +20AD or more at a point in the game where AAs are a significant chunk of damage. Unfortunately (fortunately?) the enemy Shaco never had a presence in my jungle so I couldn't see how the AD marks+quints fared against and invading jungler. But until I'm convinced otherwise I'm done being a punching bag in my own jungle - I'm hitting back.

I honestly wouldn't mind you trying this all out to get a second opinion, if only to confirm that at least I'm not gimping myself.

daxy said:
I personally don't like using Naut's E to clear because it makes him very mana hungry, so I prefer AS reds and be able to start with and max W first. With a bit of attack speed by the time it goes on cooldown you're done with your camp. Allows you to be less reliant on blue early on and get a lot out of his base tankiness. Perhaps it's just a bad season 2 jungle habit of attack speed on everyone.

^ Rushing Liandry isn't a good idea yeah, but with the 4% health tick from Naut's aoe slow it could do a good bit against health stacking opponents later on in the game.
Click to expand...

I actually find Naut is among the best tanks in the jungle as far as mana costs go. Once I pick up Spirit Stone around level 4 (with 2 points in W, 1 in E) I can W+E every camp while keeping my mana high. I think the continued use of attack speed marks on Nautilus, Sejuani, Maokai, and a few other tanks is due to S2 and early S3, personally. Once they fell largely out of competitive viability there was no push by the pro/high elo players to min/max those champions, so we're still at the status quo.
 
B

Boken

Banned
Ferrio said:
I'm not going to like watching this... I played like shit :(. I should probably just play riven from now on instead of jumping around like mad, might be able to play worth a damn then.
Click to expand...

you need to learn her animation cancels

and be overall be less cautious
pre-sure u cud kill malph when he hit 35% multiple timez
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
Ferrio said:
I'm not going to like watching this... I played like shit :(. I should probably just play riven from now on instead of jumping around like mad, might be able to play worth a damn then.
Click to expand...
do what i do; watch the other teams perspective and pretend you're zoning.
 
M

Mothman91

Member
Lulu mid is so fun, I should really play her more there. Also, she doesn't really have a hard counter so that's something good for her.
 
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