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LEGO GAF |OT2|: Building Dreams. Demolishing Wallets
- Thread starter PhoncipleBone
- Start date
http://legocuusoo.posterous.com/results-of-the-summer-lego-review
Back to the Future made it!
Modular Western Town didn't! WHAAAAT
Zelda and EVE didn't make it
I hoped that despite the Lone Ranger theme existing that they could consider the western town project as an exclusive set, or even slap the Lone Ranger theme on it. Though the latter is probably unrealistic as their contract probably stipulates a certain number of sets, plus it'd cost extra in licensing maybe? I dunno, it's a shame.
Back to the Future made it!
Modular Western Town didn't! WHAAAAT
Zelda and EVE didn't make it
I hoped that despite the Lone Ranger theme existing that they could consider the western town project as an exclusive set, or even slap the Lone Ranger theme on it. Though the latter is probably unrealistic as their contract probably stipulates a certain number of sets, plus it'd cost extra in licensing maybe? I dunno, it's a shame.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I find their wording on the Zelda one interesting. Thought they would have blamed needing the license and called it a day.
makes sense other than Eve - lack of info there is confusing, was it rejected due to theme or price?
Zelda due to molds is perhaps expected
Modular western - if produced - would perhaps have been forced to be Lone Ranger branded, perhaps they have a 'no compete' clause to prevent generic western sets avoiding paying license fees? Just bad timing of the license. Plus that would most likely have broken the record in terms of cost for a cuusoo model
Zelda due to molds is perhaps expected
Modular western - if produced - would perhaps have been forced to be Lone Ranger branded, perhaps they have a 'no compete' clause to prevent generic western sets avoiding paying license fees? Just bad timing of the license. Plus that would most likely have broken the record in terms of cost for a cuusoo model
The Lamonster
Member
Wow that is really surprising about the Western town. I am disappointed
bucknuticus
Member
Yes! Back to the future lego, it shall be mine!!!
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
I've noticed that Toys R Us will sometimes get the big sets during the holidays.
Space Troopers - the latest project to hit 10000 votes is thus doomed since it conflicts with Galaxy Squad.
I don't really understand about the EVE ship either. I mean, it definitely doesn't have the widespread appeal of BttF, or even Minecraft, but surely 10000 votes counts for something.
Yeah, like 6 new molds plus maybe they want someone to create a playset not just the Minifigs themselves...?
To be completely honest, I don't think it counts for an awful lot more than making LEGO consider producing it. I think a lot of people who vote do so because they like the set, but do not necessarily have any intention of buying it.
The Western Town is a shame though. It's a lot better looking than the new Lone Ranger sets (which aren't too bad, but still worse).
NathanMcMahon
Banned
I did not expect the Back to the Future set to make it. Fuck that's awesome.
biggyfries
Member
Galaxy Squad is their own theme, not a license, so that shouldn't be a reason.
But Star Wars is a license, and that may be close enough to shut it down.
I called it! BttF, with western town conflicting with lone ranger. Same reason Space Troopers won't pass, so don't get your hopes up guys. It's time to let the dream fade away!
A part of me did want the LoZ theme to get approved, even with my reservations about how well it fits into the LEGO aesthetic. I wish LEGO would be a little more flexible when it comes to needing to produce new parts.
A part of me did want the LoZ theme to get approved, even with my reservations about how well it fits into the LEGO aesthetic. I wish LEGO would be a little more flexible when it comes to needing to produce new parts.
RepairmanJack
Member
Nice, I'm happy about the Back to the Future set. I will definitely be getting that.
Not too surprised about the western set. It conflicting with the Lone Ranger sets makes sense.
Not too surprised about the western set. It conflicting with the Lone Ranger sets makes sense.
Which is... actually, quite fair.
Not really. I imagine that LEGO sells with expectations to sell hundreds of thousands of sets, so 10,000 votes isn't particularly many (and that's presuming that each one of those votes translates into a sale, which is unlikely in itself).
whatsinaname
Member
Someone built a Technic Su-37 that looks gorgeous and has some nice functions too.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeroen_ottens/8281408587/in/photostream/
http://www.hispabrickmagazine.com/en/content/english-hispabrick-magazine-015
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jeroen_ottens/8281408587/in/photostream/
http://www.hispabrickmagazine.com/en/content/english-hispabrick-magazine-015
Given TLG's justification for voting down the Western Town, I'm thinking that getting any minifigure-based set that is not a niche theme approved will not be possible.
The Western Town was first entered on CUUSOO on October 14, 2011, which at that time it was still in limbo whether the Lone Ranger film was even going to be completed, as Disney had shelved the project back in August. Therefore it was near impossible to predict that a LEGO theme based on this movie would be coming out in April 2013, hence creating this conflict that TLG is now citing for their reasoning. Since the Western theme itself had not been seen since 2002, I think mb_bricks (and his supporters, including myself) believed that this proposal would be very likely.
If other themes, especially licensed ones, are going to be a deterring factor in TLG deciding to produce a CUUSOO project, then most of the common themes are not going to pass.
Pirates - the word is a 5th PotC movie is in production
Space - Star Wars is ever-present
Castle - LotR/Hobbit are going to be around for at least the next several years (even though TLG seems to not have an issue producing Castle sets during this time, which I think is a bit hypocritical)
Western - we now know this is off-limits
City/Fire/Police/etc - TLG isn't going to compete with their own theme products
With this decision, TLG has made it much more difficult for creators looking to get their ideas approved. Not only are they going to have create compelling projects that do not conflict with any current themes (especially licensed ones) but they are going to have to also play Nostrodamus and predict future conflicts that may occur in a year (or longer) out, since the approval process takes so long.
EDIT: Let me add that I think that getting a "model"- based set approved would be a much easier probability, since licensed themes would likely not be a factor. So a set like the Mars Curiosity Rover might stand a real chance of being accepted - at least I hope so.
The Western Town was first entered on CUUSOO on October 14, 2011, which at that time it was still in limbo whether the Lone Ranger film was even going to be completed, as Disney had shelved the project back in August. Therefore it was near impossible to predict that a LEGO theme based on this movie would be coming out in April 2013, hence creating this conflict that TLG is now citing for their reasoning. Since the Western theme itself had not been seen since 2002, I think mb_bricks (and his supporters, including myself) believed that this proposal would be very likely.
If other themes, especially licensed ones, are going to be a deterring factor in TLG deciding to produce a CUUSOO project, then most of the common themes are not going to pass.
Pirates - the word is a 5th PotC movie is in production
Space - Star Wars is ever-present
Castle - LotR/Hobbit are going to be around for at least the next several years (even though TLG seems to not have an issue producing Castle sets during this time, which I think is a bit hypocritical)
Western - we now know this is off-limits
City/Fire/Police/etc - TLG isn't going to compete with their own theme products
With this decision, TLG has made it much more difficult for creators looking to get their ideas approved. Not only are they going to have create compelling projects that do not conflict with any current themes (especially licensed ones) but they are going to have to also play Nostrodamus and predict future conflicts that may occur in a year (or longer) out, since the approval process takes so long.
EDIT: Let me add that I think that getting a "model"- based set approved would be a much easier probability, since licensed themes would likely not be a factor. So a set like the Mars Curiosity Rover might stand a real chance of being accepted - at least I hope so.
PalaceBrother
Member
That's fantastic. I saw MJF speak at a financial conference in October and he's a pretty moving, motivating guy. Parkinsons is terrifying.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
So what is so different about these Cuuso sets from regular released sets in the end apart from the selection process?
I am super stoked about a BTTF set though, one of my favorite IPs of the older days!! Will buy asap, though i wonder, do most of these finished sets end up looking JUST like that prototype? Or will it deviate widely ? I mean i think that Delorean looks alright, just a little low on detail (it is pretty small too) Those Doc and Marty figs look to die for though!!!
I am super stoked about a BTTF set though, one of my favorite IPs of the older days!! Will buy asap, though i wonder, do most of these finished sets end up looking JUST like that prototype? Or will it deviate widely ? I mean i think that Delorean looks alright, just a little low on detail (it is pretty small too) Those Doc and Marty figs look to die for though!!!
whatsinaname
Member
In a way, CUUSO is just free market research for Lego. They are trying to identify niche areas in which they can sell sets in a profitable manner. Of course, it makes no sense to distract from the large these/sets they have already planned for.
It is a nice initiative but I feel some of the fans are expecting too much from it.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
Yes but in the end they WILL release a set that can be bought by us correct? Will it be super limited or widely available?
Eh, I think that we're simply seeing CUUSOO fulfil what is reasonable to expect of it: smaller projects that can be slotted in and around LEGO's pre-existing contracts and internal schedule.
I imagine that part of the problem with the Western Town proposal was simply the scale of it. Unless they sold it as one build (which would probably place it in a size and price point outside of their comfort zone), it would require quite a bit of commitment among multiple sets, which again might be undesirable.
whatsinaname
Member
They will release a set (though slightly modified from the original proposal). Three have been released so far. The current ones available for sale are
http://shop.lego.com/en-US/Hayabusa-21101
http://shop.lego.com/en-US/Minecraft-21102
No idea how long they might be available though. The Minecraft set is incredibly popular and is always sold out but I do see it sticking around for a bit.
I would've been perfectly fine with them producing just one of the buildings.
Then what would be modular about it?
And then why produce a generic Western-themed set as a random one-off, either completely unrelated to every other set produced that year, or actively competing against a large licensed theme that you're also producing?
Winnie the Pimp
Member
Good to hear those Cuuso sets will release with some modifications from the prototypes, something is off with that BTTF Delorean, can't quite put my finger on it though... maybe it's just the hood that is too plain like that, missing detail etc. Ugh i hope they won't just put a huge sticker on it though...
also: generally speaking, about how long does this process from now on take and when could we be expecting the finished model on sale at the VERY earliest?
also: generally speaking, about how long does this process from now on take and when could we be expecting the finished model on sale at the VERY earliest?
ghostmind, I feel your pain. But it seems like the timing was just really unfortunate. There must be something like a non-compete clause within the Lone Ranger deal that would stop something like Modular Western Town from happening right now.
Unfortunately, Lone Ranger just isn't as big, iconic, or specially defined like, say, Star Wars for Lego to release a similar product. I mean, nobody would mistake any Lego Space set for Star Wars, right? Lego can still keep releasing other space sets because Star Wars is just such a well-known and well-defined property. (Similarly, this is why Castle products exist alongside Lord of the Rings.) But beyond the main characters, I can't think of anything particularly special and different about Lone Ranger that makes it more than a generic Western, and I can't be the only one.
Disney would be PISSED if Lego released a Western set -- especially a large, expensive one -- that had no Lone Ranger branding during their Lone Ranger deal. Disney would get no royalties from the Western Town set.
Just say Lego paid Disney for the right to make 10 Lone Ranger sets. Releasing the Western Town set would be like Lego building an 11th Lone Ranger set for "free" -- Disney could easily argue that it piggybacks off the success of their license and the success of their promotion for the movie and therefore they're entitled to some of the revenue. (And even if they can't prove that in court, you'd imagine for goodwill purposes alone it's not worth fighting Disney on this.)
Of course, that doesn't mean they could have found a way to make the Cuusoo project a Lone Ranger set, but that's a different story.
Unfortunately, Lone Ranger just isn't as big, iconic, or specially defined like, say, Star Wars for Lego to release a similar product. I mean, nobody would mistake any Lego Space set for Star Wars, right? Lego can still keep releasing other space sets because Star Wars is just such a well-known and well-defined property. (Similarly, this is why Castle products exist alongside Lord of the Rings.) But beyond the main characters, I can't think of anything particularly special and different about Lone Ranger that makes it more than a generic Western, and I can't be the only one.
Disney would be PISSED if Lego released a Western set -- especially a large, expensive one -- that had no Lone Ranger branding during their Lone Ranger deal. Disney would get no royalties from the Western Town set.
Just say Lego paid Disney for the right to make 10 Lone Ranger sets. Releasing the Western Town set would be like Lego building an 11th Lone Ranger set for "free" -- Disney could easily argue that it piggybacks off the success of their license and the success of their promotion for the movie and therefore they're entitled to some of the revenue. (And even if they can't prove that in court, you'd imagine for goodwill purposes alone it's not worth fighting Disney on this.)
Of course, that doesn't mean they could have found a way to make the Cuusoo project a Lone Ranger set, but that's a different story.
THe lack of a windshield and windows is killing me. I know it'd make the Doc Brown and Marty figures harder to see, but it just looks like a weird cross between a beach buggy, jeep and sports car.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
Doh, it's so obvious i didn't even see that LOL, you're right...
I would wager that all licensing agreements with LEGO contain some sort of non-compete clause, to reassure the license holder that LEGO will not release a competing product (within defined parameters) that would potentially impact the sales of the licensed product.
So I understand the business reasons for this decision.
I think my larger issue is that LEGO let it go this far, knowing full well it would not pass. The Western Town has been on CUUSOO for over a year, and achieved the 10,000 vote plateau back in May. During that time, LEGO provided encouraging feedback, with no indication that competing products might be an issue. LEGO then let it sit for over 6 months in review, again with no comment, for what must have been a very quick decision on their part. This smacks of lack of communication on LEGO's part, both externally and potentially internally. I feel that the CUUSOO concept would be far better served by improved communication by LEGO during the process, rather than the way it has been executed so far.
The support for the Western Town was largely AFOL-generated, unlike Minecraft or EVE, or even Back to the Future, which were fandom-driven. Many AFOL LEGO sites (Brickset, FBTB, etc) threw their weight behind the project, as well as many individual AFOL's (such as myself) who tried to rally support in our individual online communities. The belief that many of us shared that as this was a pure LEGO theme, and not tied to any license, it needed our support to give it the exposure it deserved, and that as a pure theme, we were much more likely to have a LEGO approval, since we didn't have licensing issues to deal with. Very few of us predicted that the Lone Ranger theme would cause us problems (even though some sites are now acting like they had thought of this, after the fact). After this result it will be very difficult to mobilize the AFOL community to back another project, but perhaps the lesson to be learned here is that CUUSOO is not for that audience.
Sour grapes on my behalf? Sure, I'll admit that. However, I do think there is some merit to my points.
I agree completely on communication.
It sucks that it took this long for them to basically say: We've approved one project!
I was really hoping the delay was because they were working on multiple projects, or because they were finalising sale details, or just building really good models. But we didn't get any of that!
PalaceBrother
Member
How do you propose they might have handled it?
They can't speak to a potential conflict if it hinges on unreleased licensing deals. I agree that not saying anything seems to implicitly imply potential compliance, but unless they outright said "This set will not be produced for undisclosed reasons" early in the process then they had no alternative.
From the LEGO Italy retail book (or whatever is called):
if anything is wrong, tell me and i'll remove the images
- CHIMA will have his cartoon
- FRIENDS will have his cartoon (was just thinking this a bunch of minute ago for my daughter)
- LEGO Friends animals
- new masterpiece sets for LEGO Technic and LEGO Architecture
- LEGO Hero Factory Brain Attack
if anything is wrong, tell me and i'll remove the images
Something along those lines would have been preferrable. Instead we got this:
It really feels like there was zero communication between the CUUSOO team and the managers who make the decisions on which sets should be made.
Winnie the Pimp
Member
I wonder when 76004 (Spiderman Spidercycle chase) will be out on EU Amazon, or are there sets that are US exclusive or something? ;(
PalaceBrother
Member
Ahh....I hadn't been reading the updates. Sounds like the interim updates serve ONLY to try and drive more people to the site & voting system. I agree completely.