LOST 06.17/18/18.5: "The End" (Everything Else Was Just Progress)

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VistraNorrez said:
I'm getting it, Amazon says it will be delivered tomorrow so we shall see. I'm not sure what I want to do first, rewatch the finale, watch the coda, or just start over and go through everything.
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Same here, but it hasn't even been shipped yet.
 
Catalix said:
ewww, apolgists...
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To be fair when I FIRST saw Across the Sea I'm not sure how I felt about it but a few hours later after thinking heavily on it and connecting some dots, I really started to appreciate it.
 
Drealmcc0y said:
http://lostmediamentions.blogspot.com/2010/08/matthew-fox-how-lost-really-ended-video.html

Matt Fox discusses the ending, what it meant to him and when he knew the ending
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Always love hearing this dude talk about the show and his character. He always seemed so down with the cause from beginning to end. Makes me appreciate his work more.

brandonh83 said:
To be fair when I FIRST saw Across the Sea I'm not sure how I felt about it but a few hours later after thinking heavily on it and connecting some dots, I really started to appreciate it.
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I really wish I could see it from your guys' perspective, 'cause it had the reverse effect on me. At first I thought the ep was flawed, but passable. My opinion just worsened by the fourth viewing, and hit an all time low after The End aired.

It's in "Stranger in a Strange Land" territory for me.
 
I just thought the episode was crucial setup for The End. Without it, I think the light stuff and the cave and everything related wouldn't have had nearly as much context.
 
I always loved Across the Sea. I thought it was a fantastic insight into the mythology of the show. Some scenes were forced, but I thoroughly enjoyed it. I mean, it's definitely a episode that divides the fanbase--and when you delve into heavily supernatural/mythological plots, that's to be expected.
 
threenote said:
I always loved Across the Sea. I thought it was a fantastic insight into the mythology of the show. Some scenes were forced, but I thoroughly enjoyed it. I mean, it's definitely a episode that divides the fanbase--and when you delve into heavily supernatural/mythological plots, that's to be expected.
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Allison Janney's acting wasn't that great in some parts but she did great in some scenes. That's my only real nitpick about the episode overall.
 
brandonh83 said:
I just thought the episode was crucial setup for The End. Without it, I think the light stuff and the cave and everything related wouldn't have had nearly as much context.
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Oh, no doubt. It's inclusion makes total logical sense, mythology-wise. That was never my beef, though. I mostly blame the poor execution in pretty much every technical category (acting, writing, set/costume design, etc.). A huge barrier for my enjoyment.

Also, I can't really explain it well, but everyone and everything was just portrayed so... broadly. I feel LOST's greatest strengths are in the more grounded details. I never bought Jacob, MiB, or Mother as legit characters. Just limply developed vessels for pedantic Island answerz. I didn't feel anything watching their story unfold.

Plus, it did the impossible and soured my perspective on Jacobs machinations throughout the series. I was Team Jacob all the way for most the season, but man, what an incompetent, douche bag simpleton he turned out to be. :lol His "master plan" was a joke. Gotta admit, it was a letdown.
 
Across the Sea was a baffling disappointment. You'd think, after how vocal he has been about his hatred for the Star Wars prequels, at least Damon would have known better than to emphasize so much of a crucial episode on child actors.

Outside of a couple good bits by Pellegrino and Titus, the acting was pretty bad (Allison Janney was horrible, wtf was Carlton smoking when he singled out her performance?), and even the production values seemed worse than usual.

It also annoyed me to no end that with an episode as important as AtS, Darlton continued to write as vague and cryptic as possible. On the third-to-last episode, there's no reason for that.

AtS is redeemed a bit because its revelations are contextualized by What They Died For and The End, but on its own, it is simply a bad episode.
 
Fine points that I don't even really disagree with. Still, I think it's a good episode, and was needed because of where the story was headed. Ab Aeterno had much better production values.
 
Yep I agree with Brandon.

Whether you like it or not, AtS was needed to conceptualize vital parts of the story in the final two episodes. Allison Janey was cringe-worthy in certain scenes, but I feel she did a pretty good job playing the role. Now, Titus Welliver really shined in this episode. He really made the episode for me.

Edit: Blader, what about the Production Values did you not enjoy? It seemed on par with most episodes of Lost...to me, anyway.
 
Catalix said:
Plus, it did the impossible and soured my perspective on Jacobs machinations throughout the series. I was Team Jacob all the way for most the season, but man, what an incompetent, douche bag simpleton he turned out to be. :lol His "master plan" was a joke. Gotta admit, it was a letdown.
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Thats why i loved it though, he was just a man.
 
Blader and Catalix pretty much nail it. AtS is an episode that only needs to be watched once, if ever. It murders the momentum of the final episodes.
 
Across the Sea probably would've been more enjoyable in the first half of the season. Following up The Candidate, one of my favorite episodes of the series, with that was just underwhelming as fuck.
 
Drealmcc0y said:
Thats why i loved it though, he was just a man.
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Yeah, and Man in Black was just a man too. It was very interesting since the show made you think that these two "entitites" were possibly deities and un-human in every sense. AtS made the viewer sympathize with the main antagonist of the show--and that is what makes the episode great.
 
Tim-E said:
Across the Sea probably would've been more enjoyable in the first half of the season. Following up The Candidate, one of my favorite episodes of the series, with that was just underwhelming as fuck.
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I agree but with me on repeat viewing I take it for what it is, not what it should of been, or what I hoped would be answered, or even expecting it to be epic(which it isnt) with a top 10 scene of the show(which it doesnt).

So watching it just for entertainment. I find it fun and very different from the rest of the show.
 
I think it is a pretty unique episode and I loved how shots from the scene in season 1 where they find the skeletons are edited into the natural flow of the episode near the end.

So yeah. Questionable acting. Lackluster production values. Good mythology info with a nice tie-in later, and suitable setup for the finale.

7/10, move along.
 
Also, its the most thought provoking episode of the whole show(to me) which is really good.

But thats the problem with alot of the critics, they didnt want to think, they wanted answers.
 
brandonh83 said:
I think it is a pretty unique episode and I loved how shots from the scene in season 1 where they find the skeletons are edited into the natural flow of the episode near the end.
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I thought that was done pretty sloppily too.

I don't mind the callback, but the way it was done was pretty heavy-handed.
 
I really didn't think so. I thought the editing was done very well. Oh... well. I also liked the sheen that they added to the flashback shots, gave it a more dreamlike aura which I found neat.
 
brandonh83 said:
Fine points that I don't even really disagree with. Still, I think it's a good episode, and was needed because of where the story was headed. Ab Aeterno had much better production values.
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Cheers to that. They totally delivered there :D

It succeeded in all the areas I felt that AtS stumbled. I guess Ab Aeterno was my subconscious standard for that type of extended backstory episode. Like, those scenes with Richard trying to free himself from his chains; yeah sure, it sort of went on for a while, but that dire circumstance alone was heartbreaking to watch. It grounded me and I sooo bought into his plight. The story and characters all had that great sense of care throughout the episode that I could latch onto. I was taken on a relatable journey, while given major clues and explanations along the way. A great success I thought.

Across the Sea felt hollow.

threenote said:
Yeah, and Man in Black was just a man too. It was very interesting since the show made you think that these two "entitites" were possibly deities and un-human in every sense. AtS made the viewer sympathize with the main antagonist of the show--and that is what makes the episode great.
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Don't get me wrong, I very much like the idea of Jacob and his brother being these flawed human beings. I just didn't think the family drama that fueled their motivations was all that compelling on its own.
 
What a strangely divisive episode. I kinda love it just for that alone :lol
 
I don't love or hate AtS, but it is staggeringly disappointing, especially next to all of the awesome episodes it's surrounded by.
 
gdt5016 said:
I don't love or hate AtS, but it is staggeringly disappointing, especially next to all of the awesome episodes it's surrounded by.
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There was only one staggeringly dissapointing episode to me for S6:

Recon

God damn, by far the worst Sawyer centric.
 
I didnt like WKD just as much, but my initial reaction was "OK, that was shitty, Kate's episode is out of the way and when you look back that'll be by far the weak link of the season. It pretty much held true for me(except of course for Recon).
 
Recon has some redeeming scenes like Miles and Sawyer in the FSW, when Claire attacked Kate and MiB slapped Claire :lol when MiB talks about his mother and "Im the smoke thing" but the episode just felt so wrong.
 
Recon is one of those S6 episodes that has retroactively improved for me, after learning the true nature of the sideways.

What Kate Does might fall in that same category as well, but I haven't watched it since the finale to know for sure.
 
Catalix said:
Recon is one of those S6 episodes that has retroactively improved for me, after learning the true nature of the sideways.

What Kate Does might fall in that same category as well, but I haven't watched it since the finale to know for sure.
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That scene where Sawyer is watching The little house on the prairie "You know that people are not really gone when they die, we have all the good memories to sustain us until we see them again"

Really cool in heinsight.

I havent rewatched Season 6 since the finale though.
 
Even after witnessing the visual wonders of Disney's previous Lost releases, I was taken aback by The Complete Sixth and Final Season's gorgeous 1080p/AVC-encoded presentation. John Bartley and Stephen St. John's photography -- their sun-streaked beaches, sand-swept ruins, inviting alternate reality interiors, lush jungle canopies, stormy oceanside precipices, and murky underwater expanses -- is presented with the utmost care. Not only has the image's graininess been meticulously preserved, skintones are beautifully saturated, primaries are organic and lifelike, and blacks are rich and inky. (A few nighttime sequences struggle with middling black levels, but it's always a product of the original photography, not Disney's efforts.) And detail? Note the clarity of the closeups; the wonderfully refined edges and exceedingly well-resolved fine textures that grace Jack's every grimace and the Man in Black's every sneer. The polish of the series' backdrops; the weathered stonework of an ancient temple, the dilapidated bowels of a centuries-old ship, the rusty hull of a Dharma submarine, and the seemingly endless expanse of the island's jungles. The way Bartley and St. John's shadows wash over the castaways without stamping out precious detail or hindering the integrity of the image. From episode to episode, it's absolutely breathtaking. Yes, some softness and noise sneak into the proceedings, but never as a result of the studio's exceptional transfer. Significant artifacting, banding, smearing, crush, ringing and other unsightly nuisances are held at bay, and the presentation, spread across five roomy discs, has been given all the space it needs. Suffice to say, fans will be thrilled with the sixth season's extremely faithful presentation.
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:O
 
Drealmcc0y said:
That scene where Sawyer is watching The little house on the prairie "You know that people are not really gone when they die, we have all the good memories to sustain us until we see them again"

Really cool in heinsight.

I havent rewatched Season 6 since the finale though.
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That's exactly the scene that came to mind. Gave me chills on rewatch.
 
Catalix said:
Don't get me wrong, I very much like the idea of Jacob and his brother being these flawed human beings. I just didn't think the family drama that fueled their motivations was all that compelling on its own.
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That's understandable. Honestly, I wish we knew a little more about Allison Janey's character, but I think the viewer can draw up their own conclusions on her origins.
All of this talk is reminding me of the AtS thread--it was huuuge :lol .
 
Another quote:

Finales are divisive by their very nature. Fans, be they comic geeks, film aficionados or television junkies, invest so much of themselves, so much anticipation and expectation into a sprawling tale that pleasing everyone becomes an impossible proposition. But Lost? For some, creator Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse's labyrinthine drama had an even steeper uphill battle to fight. It didn't matter how compelling the characters were or how arresting the storylines became. It didn't matter how shocking the series' twists and turns proved to be, or how brilliantly its mysteries unraveled. Some viewers had drafted a gluttonous checklist; a point-by-point, do-or-die ransom note that listed all the questions they needed answered and all the mysteries they wanted wrapped up and hand delivered in a neat, tidy little bow. Not me. I chained myself to Lost long ago, and swore I'd follow no matter where Lindelof and Cuse led. When their sixth season returned the series' focus to their characters, I was overjoyed. When the answers that came were both organic and refreshingly simple, I cheered. Their endgame could have been a densely plotted monstrosity; an unwieldy beast of exposition and explanation everyone would have despised. Instead, it struck with emotional precision and thematic intensity, offering welcome catharsis over tiresome analysis, touching character arcs over rote connect-the-dot minutia, and heartfelt resonance over lengthy mumbo jumbo. Like every season of Lost, Lindelof and Cuse's final season wasn't at all what I expected. And for that, I walked away satisfied and grateful.
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threenote said:
That's understandable. Honestly, I wish we knew a little more about Allison Janey's character, but I think the viewer can draw up their own conclusions on her origins.
All of this talk is reminding me of the AtS thread--it was huuuge :lol .
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Oh man. Lines were drawn, alliances shattered. What a turning point that week was :lol

I just look back and smile.
 
AtS was awesome. Apologist is an unfair title, because it assumes there is anything to apologize for.

Catalix said:
Oh man. Lines were drawn, alliances shattered. What a turning point that week was :lol

I just look back and smile.
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One of the most interesting weeks for discussion.
 
I Do and Whatever Happened, Happened are Kate's standouts. And yeah, her awesomeness was kicked up a shitload of notches in the last few episodes.

Three particular moments of Kate awesomeness:

Jack...we have to kill him.



Tell, me I'm going to see you again!




I missed you sooo much.



My eyes are kinda wet right now, no joke.
 
I'm sure this was discussed, but asking again real quick before I make an impulse-decision: Is The New Man In Charge and all that extra footage only available in the Complete Collection Blu Ray, or is it also in Season 6 only?
 
John Harker said:
I'm sure this was discussed, but asking again real quick before I make an impulse-decision: Is The New Man In Charge and all that extra footage only available in the Complete Collection Blu Ray, or is it also in Season 6 only?
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The epilogue is included on both sets.
 
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