LOST 06.17/18/18.5: "The End" (Everything Else Was Just Progress)

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Zoe said:
I think the fact that Nadia died when they were together hammered it in to him that they weren't meant to be.

Yep. The narrative obviously favors the path that the island sent the characters on. Sayid could never be with Nadia because the island gave Shannon to him. And then, the island took her away. Kind of a bi-polar asshole, that island.

Holy shit...

Bi-polar island...

Bi-polar... bear...?
 
Just finished watching :'( Emotionally, best episode of the series. I don't really understand wtf just happened, but it was good stuff. At least it wasn't fucked up like how X Files ended.

So basically, the flashsideways was limbo in the end after all? I guess that makes what Lindelcuse said about them not being dead true all along, yet not, sort of? :S I wonder why Vincent wasn't with them in the church then, seeing how pretty much everyone else was. Still a million questions left unanswered I guess & it's a slippery slope imo even if it bugs me :lol

Anyway, I don't think I've cried tears of joy, and other kinds, as much before :D After that episode, which shall not be named, I was afraid I was gonna have to throw my DVDs in the dumpster but I think it safe to say that I was wrong in the end ^_^ It's a damn shame I'm so far behind in these threads, as everyone has already been said when I catch up :(

Obviously the end of an era. I suppose it ended on a positive note huh? I don't know, it hasn't really sunk in yet to be perfectly honest...
 
gdt5016 said:
No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That whore!
Even though she definitely loved, Jack, she loved Sawyer too, they both lost their true loves, there's no reason they couldn't have been together, until death, then they finally were reunited with the true loves....
 
So how many years until we get the "Lost Spin-off" starring Hurley and Ben?

I knew they were going to keep things alive for a future spin-off of some sort, but I did not know they were going to set it up so perfectly. Usually set-ups like this are super weak, or cost the show some closure in its final episode. But Lost actually pulled it off.
 
CartridgeBlower said:
So how many years until we get the "Lost Spin-off" starring Hurley and Ben?

The real question is how many years will it take for ABC to get creatively bankrupt and "reimagine" LOST? 10? 15? And what will we think of it?
 
Solo said:
The real question is how many years will it take for ABC to get creatively bankrupt and "reimagine" LOST? 10? 15? And what will we think of it?

I'm still betting King actually makes The Hunted Ones, the LOST spin-off he made up in Under The Dome.
 
How do we know the light on the other side of the church doors is not the same light in the cave on the island?

The alternate world was a purgatory, but not one that leads to heaven, rather it leads back to the island.

Desmond and Hurley in alternate-land were rounding everyone up to bring them back to the island. This theory may explain why Faraday's mom said something like "why don't you leave them alone?", to Desmond. Why would she want him to stop trying to get them together before they head off to heaven?

It may also explain why the man in black thought he would be able to teleport off the island. He knew the cave led to the church.

I'm not attached to this theory, but it seems to make as much (or more) sense as "...and they all went to heaven". Is there anything that outright disproves it?
 
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:lol :lol i was bored
 
Solo said:
The real question is how many years will it take for ABC to get creatively bankrupt and "reimagine" LOST? 10? 15? And what will we think of it?

After the ending we got...I will hate anyone and everyone who even attempts to touch this franchise :/.
 
First off one explanation of Desmond's knowledge of sideways is that he really saw a flash forward (not unlike how he saw Charlies death) which showed him the sideways reality.

Of course sideways is a misnomer. It really is not sideways but a flash forward, a flash way forward to after everyone's death.

msdstc said:
You guys are missing the point... I completely get that, but why would they as people exist there, until they are dead? Is that just a reality for their souls, and when they die they move on from there? Seems a bit farfetched to me.
They come there (there being sideways/purgatory/whatever you want to call it) to resolve issues that they weren't able to resolve in their lives and possibly atone for their sins. Ben wasn't ready to let go because he still had to fix things with Alex. Jack was ready to let go because he was able to become the father that he never had.

Also I know people love open ended things to discuss, and I get that, but it also can be used as a device to wrap things up without disappointing people by not living up to hype. The problem with this, is that you can insert anything between Point A and Point B and say that it was always planned that way. There's no way it was meant to end this way, maybe in a basic outline, but I just don't see with all the things they started, that it was supposed to go this direction. There are too many plotholes.
I guess you have to define your definition of plot hole first. If you're saying contradictions, I don't really believe that happened, at least not in any major way. Were there gaps in the story telling? In terms of filling out the mythology, definitely. In terms of filling out the main story of the characters, a little although a lot of the character gaps were usually due to casting issues or characters getting too tall issues.

The Island was really a MacGuffin, we only got to know of it what the main characters found out about it to advance the plot. That being said there were hints to answers. They weren't overtly mentioned, but for those who wanted to search for answers, they could get it via the ARG, via books, via names of characters, and via the pseudo-science of Eloise and Daniel. Yeah, they aren't concrete answers. But do you really want that? Across the Sea is what results with concrete answers in play. Lost was always a "smart" show (which is a rarity on cable) that challenged viewers and thats how they ended it.

- 1 why was Walt special? What were his "powers" and why even introduce them in the first place? If it's "open ended" or it "doesn't matter" then why waste our time? It was useless, they started the arc of both him and Michael, but failed to finish his.
The simple answer is they didn't realize the actor would have grown so dramatically and so quickly when they started the series, and they also didn't have a set end date to the show. As far as I know, after the show was pitched, JJ and Lindelof got together and wrote the pilot and had the show's arc in mind, but they didn't know whether the show would be a 1 season mini-series or what. They dragged their feet in season 2 because they knew the show was going to go on for many seasons. They didn't have a specific end date though so they probably wanted to save Walt stuff for a later season. And thats when Walt's voice started to drop and started to grow tall. They had to get him off the Island by the end of the season so unfortunately they couldn't explore it.



- 2 involving Walt again, how was he showing up on the island? He would show up soaking wet, everybody knows that, he also shows up to John (taller walt) look I get he was getting older, but this aspect of the show is littered with plot holes.
He had special abilities. Again, unfortunately they weren't able to explore it as much as they originally planned.

- 3 what the hell was the cabin? And why was Jacob asking for John's help? This is absolutely irrelevant to the show.
It was MiB in the cabin (which is affirmed by Claire and Smokey as Christian Shephard hanging out in the Cabin at various points). It was the start of his long con in getting the other candidates off the Island (a plot which also involved Ben hiring Michael to blow up the freighter), and getting Locke to be killed so he could put himself in the position of being Locke and getting someone on the Island to kill Jacob.


- 4 why were the others stealing children? Once again, jump on me if you want for asking too much explanation and telling me it's "irellevant" but they started a huge sideplot about kidnapping children (Aaron, Walt, the two kids in the beginning) and claiming they were giving them "the better life"

That's just a few to start.
It was part Ben's obsession, partly because the Others were probably adopting them because they couldn't have children, and partly because they couldn't have children in the main group because they'd grow up fast (too bad they didn't anticipate that with Walt).

In the end a lot of these questions aren't really relevant to the end result. As a religious person I could start asking who is God, who is the Devil, what existed before God, why did God let the Devil exist, what existed before God, etc. However, the point of religion isn't to explore that stuff either. Whats important is how you lived your life. You may encounter things you don't understand but you can go on living without fully understanding them too.

Sorry for this big run-on post if it doesn't make sense. I'm writing it while my brother is trying to have a conversation with me and while I'm watching the Habs and Flyers game.
 
greepoman said:
So...if you guys were to die today how many of you guys would end up in the same purgatory as the losties because "the island was the most important thing in your life"??? :lol :lol :lol
Entertainment wise it is, but I'd happily/gladly be in a purgatory with KATE:D
 
PetriP-TNT said:
In the end, I didn't even WANT to know why there was electromagnetism and stuff. Seriously.
It's goina make the rewatch soo more awesome, I've never been an answer guy either, Always been the character's for me. Answers don't mean shit to me, not after that finale....
 
Blader5489 said:
Bender shot the fuck out of this episode. Give him every award imaginable.

Yes he did.

That fight scene was incredible.



Lindelcuse and their editors put together the final minutes perfectly too. Right there with the end of The Constant.
 
Alucard said:
Not a copout really.

Also, there was an interview link many pages back where it was revealed that MiB's name was Samuel. (That's how they wrote him in the script, but just decided to keep him more mysterious without stating his name explicitly)
For fuck's sake... Samuel & Jacob -- those are the names of my brother and me. :lol

Good finale too, btw.
 
MMaRsu said:
It's Widmore isn't it? And yeah that is certainly possible. So tell me exactly why was Desmond a fail safe for? If MIB would get off the Island then Des could have done something to reverse this situation? At that point when Widmore was talking about Des being a failsafe I was convinced it had something to do with the X timeline.

There is still stuff I don't understand. Didn't Widmore ask Des if he knew what he meant when he had a mission to do in Happily Ever After? Desmond said yes right away, so were they talking about uncorking the Island or about the X timeline?

These are things..

He was the 'failsafe' as in Widmore was told by Jacob that the heart of the Island is what gives everything their power, and as such, the last resort would be to unplug the island, thus rendering smokey mortal and being able to kill MIB. Obviously it might end up in destroying the island, if not everything else, but I guess the alternative of a Smoke monster MIB corrupting the world would have been the worse possible outcome. He was the last resort.

They were talking about uncorking the Island.

Desmond wasn't afraid anymore because (as his scrambled interpretation went) him uncorking the Island (which he remembers from flashing into his afterlife and being awakened there) was that no matter what they'd all end up in this nice safe place where none of the island stuff ever happened. He just didn't realize that it was after they all die. That's why he was surprised when he uncorked the island, but was still around, he was expecting everyone to flash into this world where, for all he knew, the island didn't exist.

Thanks for correcting me on how to spell Widmore, btw. :lol
 
VALIS said:
Does Supernatural focus more on its mysteries, or, like Lost, is it more, um, *cough* "character driven?" 'Cuz I'm feeling some TV show mythology blue balls after Lost's finale.

It's more character driven because it's not a constant ongoing plot from episode to episode. It's structured like Buffy, with many one and done episodes -- which can end up being some of the best.

But as far as the show's mythology goes, it's far more satisfying than Lost's once the mythology really starts to kick in.

Plumbob said:
Exactly what I'm thinking. Like, the point of that episode was to show that Jack loved him etc. :lol whoops, guess you were a mistake, kiddo

The point was that that was how Jack came to terms with Christian, by being the father that he wished he had been.
 
Can't believe I just read through this entire thread. I only intended to read through initial reactions, but I couldn't stop. Absolutely fucking fantastic ending. Seriously beautiful. I literally couldn't believe how many people online seem to have massively misinterpreted the final scenes though. It's a shame that it has already left a bitter taste in so many peoples mouths simply because they're stupid enough to think that they died in the pilot.

I also don't understand the people who do understand what happened, but say shit like "Such a cop-out. It ruined what was otherwise an amazing show". How did the ending at all define or effect everything that came before it? If you're that uncomfortable with the idea of some kind of afterlife, then just pretend that Jack dreamed the sideways world up during his last moments of life or some shit like that. If you dislike the idea so much, it still shouldn't really effect the entire story of their lives for the past 6 seasons and how that concluded prior to their deaths. It all happened. It is all just as good and just as real. Everything that happened happened, and the last scene just gives that extra bit of closure as well as fantastically acknowledging the importance of the characters and the relationships they've formed throughout the show. The perfect way to say goodbye to the characters, in my opinion.

Seeing the credits wreckage footage made me think about how the losties are just another group of people who've had a massive adventure on the island and have left their mark. Like the statue and Dharmaville, I like to think that in the future some people will view 815 as a big mystery and maybe at the end of their adventure they'll learn the tale of Hurley, the protector of the island and everything that comes with it.
 
Huh. It appears that Klosterman actually thinks that was really them at the bottom of the ocean in Confirmed Dead. I might be misreading what he's saying, though.
 
woxel1 said:
For fuck's sake... Samuel & Jacob -- those are the names of my brother and me. :lol

Good finale too, btw.
They should have just given the name in Across the Sea. The name makes perfect sense in regards to the fact that the Mother favored him.

Also, seems obvious based on the finale that the Egyptians were on the Island pre-Jacob. The fact we never saw any of the egyptian structures in ATS almost made it seem like the opposite.
 
gdt5016 said:
Yeah, Kate was incredible this episode. I TOTALLY FUCKING BOUGHT (and loved) EVERYTHING BETWEEN HER AND JACK.

Golfham.


"Tell me I'm gonna see you again!"


and

"I missed you so much."

Dear god.
this that was the best scene they done together...
 
I think we should process the Lost ending, not as an audience, but as the losties themselves. Let me explain.

For me at least, watching Lost was about watching the characters. They were so well written, they we as the audience felt like we knew them personally, that they existed, and we were connected. When something horrible happened to them, we felt that. I'm not talking about the supporting cast (miles, lapadius, widmore, ect) but the losties themselves (Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sawyer).

So we are one and the same with the Losties. Sayid doesn't know how he was resurrected and neither do we. Jack has no idea who created that cork or what exactly smokie was and neither do we. We are on the same playing field as the characters themselves, and the connection over the 6 years has grown stronger because of that. It would have been completely out of character for the show to just bombard us with answers during this final season, when even the losties had no idea how exactly things were happening, just so that we would know.

The most important part of this, and why the finale really worked for me, is that at the end, I felt the same relief that the main characters felt after they remembered. They had found peace. They completed their destiny. And now they could move on. Do we know why the island existed? No...but neither does Jack, Desmond, Hurley, Kate, Sawyer, Jin, Sun, Claire, Locke, Ben, or Charlie.

thoughts anyone?
 
Did anyone else get the feeling that the original idea for The Hatch was what the cave ended up being? When the show directly stated the parallels between the cave and The Hatch, I started thinking that they might have originally planned on The Hatch being something similar to the cave, but they had introduced it too early and decided it was more of an end-game type of thing. This may be complete bullshit, but the more I think of it, the more the cave seems to be a very primitive version of The Hatch.
 
Man I just realized that combined with the breakup of me and my girlfriend of 5 and a half years last week and now the absence of LOST (which has been around in my life for just as long and something I shared with her) has made for a pretty empty feeling couple of days. Fuck feelings, man!
 
There is so much gloom to the end of lost which I still cant shake. I've watched every episode since day one and I admit being mostly lost since day one but the show ending and the way it ended as that air of gloom/butterflies in the stomach like when one of your favorite actors or singers die unexpectedly.
 
Afrodium said:
Did anyone else get the feeling that the original idea for The Hatch was what the cave ended up being? When the show directly stated the parallels between the cave and The Hatch, I started thinking that they might have originally planned on The Hatch being something similar to the cave, but they had introduced it too early and decided it was more of an end-game type of thing. This may be complete bullshit, but the more I think of it, the more the cave seems to be a very primitive version of The Hatch.
Yeah thats exactly what I've been thinking today. Theres way too many parallels, they both are operated by Desmond, they both could result in the destruction of the world if not maintained properly, and they both had Jack and Locke arguing about whether it mattered or not.

The one big difference is Desmond was releasing the electromagnetic energy every 108 minutes in the Hatch. He released 2000+ years of electromagnetic energy by unplugging the cork.
 
Masaki_ said:
not sure if this was posted before (this is a long thread), but this is interesting, if it's true

http://lostmediamentions.blogspot.com/2010/05/someone-from-bad-robots-take-on-finale.html

apparently, they never changed the ending.

For those that wonder -- the original ending started the moment Jack walked into the church and touches the casket to Jack closing his eyes as the other plane flies away. That was always JJ's ending. And they kept it.

Uh how can that be? Wasn't Jack supposed to die in the pilot?
 
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