There already is a cleopatra card
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Magic: the Gathering |OT11| Amonkhet - Have you ever had decks with a Pharaoh?
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
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We already have a cleopatra card, Hezoret the Pervert seems like the best god to me, and Nissa will see play in standard. The Pervert is the easiest one to turn on besides the green god and it's a great top deck. Seems great to me.
Infinite Stars
Member
The Jeskai on Tarkir knew of the 5 colors through their 5 fires, so it's not unheard of. I'd also venture to guess that if the idea of color isn't fundamentally known there's still an idea of opposites fundamentally.
charlequin
Banned
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I mean, Nissa, ELEMENT MASTER isn't a playable card in Standard as it stands now. It encourages decks that are very creature heavy as opposed to answer heavy, aka decks that lose to Cat or Vehicles.
Joe Molotov
Member
Lot of other cheeky references on cards, too:
Red hair, green clothes, white skin.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
It only occurred to me now, that it's kinda offensive they managed to fill the jungle with a bunch of white people. They Tarzan'd the shit out of Naya.
Copycat got a lot worse since they printed Manglehorn. Manglehorn by himself: kills Heart of kiran and shuts off the cat combo since the cats are artifacts in addition to their creature types. He is a 2G bear that is found with the new Nissa and seems like a great mainboard hate card in some numbers heading into the new meta. There is also Shefet Monitor that finds Sun scourched desert when you cycle it which kills Saheeli when they try to go off with it. They are printing answers. We shall see if they are good enough.
I really like the Nissa art.
That said, we really needed a Yami Yugi PW like (just joking around and obviously fake of course):
Yami Yugi 3WB
Planeswalker - Yugi
+2: You may destroy target creature with power less than the amount of loyalty counters on Yami Yugi. If you do, its controller loses life equal to the amount of loyalty counters on Yami Yugi minus its power.
0: Create a tapped 3/3 green Imp creature token with: "0: Tap or untap ~. Use this ability only as a sorcery and only once during your own turn.".
-2: Search your library for a card, then shuffle your library and put that card on of it.
-9: Exile all permanents target player controls. Exile all cards in that player's library, hand and graveyard. Banish that player's spirit to the shadow realm.
3
That said, we really needed a Yami Yugi PW like (just joking around and obviously fake of course):
Yami Yugi 3WB
Planeswalker - Yugi
+2: You may destroy target creature with power less than the amount of loyalty counters on Yami Yugi. If you do, its controller loses life equal to the amount of loyalty counters on Yami Yugi minus its power.
0: Create a tapped 3/3 green Imp creature token with: "0: Tap or untap ~. Use this ability only as a sorcery and only once during your own turn.".
-2: Search your library for a card, then shuffle your library and put that card on of it.
-9: Exile all permanents target player controls. Exile all cards in that player's library, hand and graveyard. Banish that player's spirit to the shadow realm.
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Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I don't think we actually will.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
People were already running authority of the consuls and such to shut off the combo and that is much harder to get rid off than a 2/2. Manglehorn results maybe in some crossfire hate but that hardly makes copycat a lot worse. Post board it often transformed into a value build anyways. Not to mention that copycat was able to establish itself in a meta where walking ballistas were everywhere.
Control decks will hardly want to tap out on turn 3 to get rid of a heart in fear of a gideon resolving.
I want to see cycle into desert happening to stop the combo because that's hilarious.
Next set is based on Mesoamerica, right? I can only hope the humans will be more diverse there than they were in Naya.
I actually kinda hope the next set has no humans, to be honest.
"God's Beard!"
Member
English version.
Guess it's a good thing the new gideon turns into a 4/4
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
T2: Heart of Kiran
T3: Rhonas the Indomitable
T4: Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
T5: Gideon now has Trample
T3: Rhonas the Indomitable
T4: Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
T5: Gideon now has Trample
I called Suspend in Atlazan block earlier but I'll go one further and say it's in Conquest of Power specifically just so they can include Ancestral Vision and Lotus Bloom as allusions to the P9. Vision gets new art that plays into the Mesoamerican theme as well as fitting with the old art. There's a reason why we haven't gotten Vision reprinted since it came off the ban list and this is it. It also explains their use of Rift Bolt reprint equity as a 3-of in a supplementary product since it'll get printed into the ground with another Standard printing.
They are not going to reprint Vision and Bloom with As Foretold in standard. C'mon.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
SigmasonicX
Member
At best, I think we'll see suspend 1 as a renamed mechanic with no time counters. That is, "Cost: Exile CARDNAME from your hand. At the beginning of your next upkeep, cast it without paying its mana cost."
This is wrong on every level, you know what else shut off the combo, and was easily killed everytime it was played ? Thalia for 3 mana, and it also made their tap lands come into play tapped, and never once was Thalia a problem for Copycat decks.
The problem is you are combing a combo deck that wins on turn 4 with a control deck that doesn't have to do anything, and can sit there and draw cards if you do nothing. Though recently its turned more into a just a 4 color value fest.
Right now I did the math, and according to mtggoldfish Mardu Vehicles and Copy Cat decks are 75% of the metagame ..... almost 50% alone is copycat decks, and you think its still ok for that deck to exist ? We've seen 2 cards that deal with it from this new set, one is a 4 mana cycler that you have to go get a DESERT for, just to deal 1 damage, and the other is Mangle horn, a 3 mana 2/2;
Meanwhile here are the things that the copycat deck can now play, Essence Scatter, Pull from Tomorrow,Reduce// Rubble, Failure//Comply, Cast out, Censor, Dusk // Dawn
Theres literally no point in playing standard if some part of copycat doesn't get banned; because it will take over the meta in one form or another. Remember when you were all saying "oh man its not as bad as you think" and "their are answers to it"..... well yes there are answers to it, and they all exist in 1 deck, Mardu Vehicles.
Copy cat has pushed all of the fair decks out of the format. The numbers dont lie, the METAGAME is 75% between 2 decks, and 50% of them are copycat decks. They would need to print almost 2 - 3 answers per color to come even close to hating that deck out.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
You would need cards that are good on their own that incidentally hosed the combo for it to be really hated out.
The hyperbole here is funny considering that it's universally agreed by the pros that Copycat is worse than mardu vehicles. We don't even know all the cards in the format yet "everything is unplayable but two decks." Also Temur tower is a fair deck last I checked that didn't get pushed out. Then again I'm more optimistic about standard than most in this thread.
It's weird to me when popular/interesting mechanics are held back from standard due to complexity level for new players. Isn't that a zero sum game, where the complexity of the game can only go down as they create new (simple) mechanics to replace old (complex) mechanics?
Storm, I getit's complicated to keep track of your Storm count. Dredge, I getit's caused problems every time it's appeared.
Suspend, on the other hand, is easy to keep track of with a single die, and has a lot of interesting design space. Couldn't Suspend appear at Uncommon and Rare. Isn't this exactly why NWO exists?
I'm not being facetious, I'm genuinely puzzled by it.
charlequin
Banned
suspend isn't popular tho
so pretty close to rebound, basically
Apparently people forget to remove counters every turn, and then the suspend count gets messed up.
I think it could appear as a mainly uncommon mechanic for complexity purposes tho.
I agree that marduk vehicles is a better deck than copycat; the problem with copycat isnt just that it's one of two viable choice, though. It's that it's specific play pattern is not particularly fun to play against and it represses too many cards/decks. Temur tower is viable in the sense that any t2 deck is- sure, you can win games, but it's clearly not putting up the results the other two decks do.
On the manglehorn topic- because I also think it's one of the best cards in the set- will this displace reclamation sage in older formats?
On the manglehorn topic- because I also think it's one of the best cards in the set- will this displace reclamation sage in older formats?
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I don't get what the point of debating with you is when you just say "the (unnamed, unsourced) pros agree with me" or otherwise dismiss opinions as not conforming to someone else's supposed expertise every time anyone brings up a point. It really isn't an Old Boys' Club here, but you're not giving yourself much to work with.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Is rec sage played much in older formats and if so isn't wrecking enchantments also relevant?
In Legacy Elves - it's there to kill Counterbalance/Sneak Attack/Chalice.
(It never actually deals with counterbalance, but it sure tries.)
I play one in my modern deck, but its primary function is to kill blood moons, so it won't be replacing it there.
Since you intend on using ad hominem for your arguments I'll post articles that back my points:
(http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=13782)
(http://www.mtgmintcard.com/articles/writers/lee-shi-tian/options-in-mardu-vehicles)
There is also the fact that the Pro Tour itself backs my points due to the mardu vehicles domination. Gideon Ally needs a ban more than something from Copycat does imho. In a perfect world Cat/gideon are both banned but I highly doubt it since wizards hates to do standard bans.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Telling someone that their arguments are flawed or are counter-productive isn't an "ad hominem." Nobody actually asked whether Mardu Vehicles was better than Saheeli Combo, nor does it actually matter w/r/t the underlying point that those 2-decks are highly dominant and very little in this set spoiler appears to be anything that would cause those decks to stop being the best decks. Temur Tower isn't breaking through even if WOTC likes to put articles up every week subtly referring to it as a format pillar.
It's not impossible for someone, e.g. Kirblar, to have a valid analytical opinion about a card or a format even if he's not winning Pro Tours.
I mean, I can't lie when I say that Mardu Vehicles being the top dog means I run basically near their list (not on purpose either! I came about to the same setup identically when the decks were forming) but it's RW and Equipment focused (especially now, I got Slayer's Plate back in there)
This is what it ended up turning into with the latest revision (that made me go 3-0 on Standard League)
I don't know what I'm going to do to the deck after Amonkhet releases. I want to run Dusk to Dawn to try to take out BG Delirium but I could just sideboard that.
I'm also leaning toward using Oketra. Getting a Slayer's Plate on her seems pretty damn hard to deal with, considering she would be a 7/8 double strike.
Then there's the exert stuff I want to play around with... My deck is going to look much different I feel.
This is what it ended up turning into with the latest revision (that made me go 3-0 on Standard League)
I don't know what I'm going to do to the deck after Amonkhet releases. I want to run Dusk to Dawn to try to take out BG Delirium but I could just sideboard that.
I'm also leaning toward using Oketra. Getting a Slayer's Plate on her seems pretty damn hard to deal with, considering she would be a 7/8 double strike.
Then there's the exert stuff I want to play around with... My deck is going to look much different I feel.
Infinite Stars
Member
I too love 4 Mana Answers to a turn 4 Combo. It's like running Stonehorn Dignitary to counter twin: 100% worth your time and effort.
Do y'all just not have a sense of humor anymore?
Ban the cat. And ban Gideon too.
Fuck.
I don't get it. Cats can't survive deserts?
You redirect the land damage to Sahelli in response to the blink
It's an actual answer. Just not a good one
It's an actual answer. Just not a good one
SigmasonicX
Member
Wait, just realized.
We've already seen that they've shifted back to "<creature type> you control" rather than "<creature type> creatures you control", but Lord of the Accursed also grants menace to all zombies. Even if it being an activated ability and an ability that only matter while declaring blockers means it's rarely relevant that it affects your opponents' zombies too, it's still looser with restrictions than we usually see.
We've already seen that they've shifted back to "<creature type> you control" rather than "<creature type> creatures you control", but Lord of the Accursed also grants menace to all zombies. Even if it being an activated ability and an ability that only matter while declaring blockers means it's rarely relevant that it affects your opponents' zombies too, it's still looser with restrictions than we usually see.
Infinite Stars
Member
Sorry, I was replying mostly in jest. I know it's not going to work and was comparing a 4drop to answer a T4 kill with another.
It's hard to do sarcasm sometimes without /s
Shock is the best answer right now for Cat, but you need at least two if they're holding counter magic. Secondly, Thalia + Shock is a bitch and I have won a game over Cat combo when my opponent didn't realize that I had both answers.
I mean we could see burn? But I think the only bone we got thrown was Magma Spray for Scrapheap Scrounger.
Also SigmasonicX, I don't doubt that Relentless Dead spiked after the Senor dropped.
I mean we could see burn? But I think the only bone we got thrown was Magma Spray for Scrapheap Scrounger.
Also SigmasonicX, I don't doubt that Relentless Dead spiked after the Senor dropped.
I was just joking but this would literally be the worst.
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