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Magic: the Gathering |OT12| Hour of Devastation - Hour of Jace getting dunked on

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S

SigmasonicX

Member
The Technomancer said:
Cohesive creative

Hmmmmm
Click to expand...

That's referring to the guild parodies coming into conflict, I imagine. Crossbreed Labs seems unusual in GW.

Even in silver border, it's hard to imagine what contraptions actually do. I'm looking forward to how they handle it.

Interesting that we are actually getting black border cards.

EDIT: MTG Salvation says Reddit says Steamflogger Boss is the only black border card. It's on the land sheet.

Unstable is set on a Mad Scientist World.
 
S

Santiako

Member
All of that art could easily be Hearthstone cards lol

EDIT: Stuff from a guy that's attending the panel:

He could not show any lands or silver bordered cards from the set so he showed this. He confirmed that there will be contraptions in the set and that all creatures that make them are rares. It is set on a mad scientist world with 5 factions. I'll post more photos as soon as I can upload them with the 5 factions.

Full art lands, possibly borderless. Foil tokens
White blue faction: They are like esper with no self control. They go why need a toaster if I can make my hand a toaster.
Blue black faction: Spy's that make spy inventions but are really bad spies. They will be spy themes like ninjas and secret agents.
Black red faction: they are the super villains that want to make doomsday machines.
Red green faction: they are goblins that like to tinker. They make lots of things and breed fast enough to not wipe out their race.
Green white faction: they like to experiment with combining animals and themselves.
There will also be a squirrel lord that is not a legendary.
Lands and steamflogger boss will be the only black border cards.
 
J

jph139

Member
Cohesive creative in an Un-set sounds like a not-so-great idea to me. And I'm sure people will be pissed about Contraptions being stuck in silver border but I always assumed they would never actually come out so, yeah.
 
B

blindrocket

Member
Santiako said:
It spiked because dumb people thought that contraptions would be on Kaladesh.
Click to expand...

Gotcha. I thought maybe MaRo said he'd do contraptions in his next Un-set (if it happened).

I don't mind cracking packs of Conspiracy, which is basically a draft-only set BUT you could crack cards that are worth money and playable in Vintage/Legacy/Modern/Commander.

Besides Full art Lands and now I suppose Foil Tokens, these un-sets are junkola.
 
G

Giant Panda

Member
hermit7 said:
Checks, pain lands, temples, and the vivids are probably what you're looking for. Temples have the biggest upside for coming into play tapped, Pains and checks are good and usually enter untapped. Vivids have a limited number of times you can get any mana but by that time you're usually able to get all your colors reliably. Those and a bunch of basics. Maybe a terrmorphic and evolving wilds for actual fixing.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I forgot about the painlands. That's interesting that you think Temples are good. I agree, but I had been doubting myself because some people I was playing with a bit back said that Temples were terrible even in Commander.
 
Wulfric

Wulfric

Member
Santiako said:
All of that art could easily be Hearthstone cards lol

He could not show any lands or silver bordered cards from the set so he showed this. He confirmed that there will be contraptions in the set and that all creatures that make them are rares. It is set on a mad scientist world with 5 factions. I'll post more photos as soon as I can upload them with the 5 factions.
Click to expand...

That's not too surprising considering how many artists freelance for both WotC and Blizz. It's so cool to see the old loose MTG style updated for the modern day. I was afraid the art would look dated. Some of the Unhinged stuff looks plain cheesy.

Super looking forward to the foil tokens. And presumably the John Avon lands he mentioned on Facebook ages ago that we still haven't seen.
 
S

shrapnelmagnet

Member
Giant Panda said:
Let's talk about lands in Commander.

What are the best budget options that you guys use for your commander decks? Obviously Command Tower, Ravnica Bouncelands, Checklands, Trilands and panoramas (for 3 color decks), and enemy color man-lands are good, but what's next best after those?

At that point the options seem to be Evolving Wilds, Temples, Refuges, Tangos, and Ash Barrens. At some point though just having more basics would be better than including more.

Do you guys even bother with Karoos in single color decks? I just hate how much worse they than the Ravnica ones.
Click to expand...

I don't have the breadth of format experience as many others do, but I love the Temples. I feel like in any casual deck they are wonderful. The Scry is so good, especially in long multiplayer games, they just add value. Again, just me, but I like Temples :)
 
S

sgjackson

Member
i wasn't really expecting unstable to be so clearly inspired by hearthstone's brand of steampunk goofy and i'm honestly way more scared about the implications of that than a set full of stupid puns and bad jokes. i have kind of a hate/hate relationship with hs even though it's probably my second most played game ever after wow. seeing it leak into magic (which i always have fun with and wish i had more money to play more of) so overtly is really disconcerting.
 
H

hermit7

Member
Giant Panda said:
Thanks. I forgot about the painlands. That's interesting that you think Temples are good. I agree, but I had been doubting myself because some people I was playing with a bit back said that Temples were terrible even in Commander.
Click to expand...

Temples are probably the worst of the playable duals. I would rate them below both the new cycle and battle lands (cause those can be fetched), but they are playable. I would probably tend to run them only in 2 color decks where I am running all the other duals that I can run. The tempo loss after turn 1 is typically poor if you want to play on curve, but turn 1 it is pretty good and then after probably like turn 5 or so the tempo loss is a little more manageable.

If I were rankling them (no budget)
ABU
Shocks
Pain lands
Filter (Loren)
Checks// Fast lands -- Kaladesh enter untapped if you control 3 or less
Battle // cycle
Temples
Come into play tapped duals
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
sgjackson said:
i wasn't really expecting unstable to be so clearly inspired by hearthstone's brand of steampunk goofy and i'm honestly way more scared about the implications of that than a set full of stupid puns and bad jokes. i have kind of a hate/hate relationship with hs even though it's probably my second most played game ever after wow. seeing it leak into magic (which i always have fun with and wish i had more money to play more of) so overtly is really disconcerting.
Click to expand...

I am worried that this will be more "overall goofy" and less "card by card dumbfuckery"
 
C

charlequin

Banned
The set will have full-art basic lands with art done by John Avon. We did something with them that we almost did in Unhinged by Chickened out. They look amazing.
Click to expand...

This definitely sounds like out-to-the-edges lands to me. These are gonna be hot as hell.
 
D

DashReindeer

Lead Community Manager, Outpost Games
hermit7 said:
Temples are probably the worst of the playable duals. I would rate them below both the new cycle and battle lands (cause those can be fetched), but they are playable. I would probably tend to run them only in 2 color decks where I am running all the other duals that I can run. The tempo loss after turn 1 is typically poor if you want to play on curve, but turn 1 it is pretty good and then after probably like turn 5 or so the tempo loss is a little more manageable.

If I were rankling them (no budget)

Fetches
ABU
Shocks
Pain lands
Filter (Loren)
Checks// Fast lands -- Kaladesh enter untapped if you control 3 or less
Battle // cycle
Temples
Come into play tapped duals
Click to expand...

I'd argue that Fetches are actually better than ABUR duals. Fetches fix better and have other utility. I know that when building an EDH deck, I make sure to secure Fetches first before all other lands and it's not just due to price.
 
D

Daedardus

Member
To be honest, I'm like one of the three people on GAF that wanted a new Un-set and it's looking to be interesting based on this information. Maybe I'll buy a box and draft some with friends that want to.

R1fdEt3.gif
 
B

blindrocket

Member
I'm excited about this card in the upcoming Commander deck.

content_commander-2017-ramos-dragon-engine.jpg
o

I'm eager to see what else the deck contains. I wonder if it will have the mana rocks that fit this creatures flavor: Eye of Ramos, Heart of Ramos, Horn of Ramos, Skull of Ramos, and Tooth of Ramos.
 
S

SigmasonicX

Member
Blogatog Unstable dump.
You may interpret that wording however you wish.

Panel info
I promised to post the new info I gave out at the panel. Note that it's all about Unstable. Here it is:

Unstable will have a small Squirrel theme, enough to build a deck around. There is a Squirrel lord but because its effects stack, it isn't legendary so people can get multiples on the battlefield at the same time.

The set will have full-art basic lands with art done by John Avon. We did something with them that we almost did in Unhinged by chickened out. They look amazing.

The set will have Contraptions. I figured out a flavorful and fun way to do them but it was a bit much for black border. I consider it a home run execution. Steamflogger Boss is on the set. It appears once on the land sheet (It was the only way to get a black-bordered card in the set). Only the basic lands and Steamflogger Boss are Eternal playable. All the creatures in this set that assemble Contraptions are Riggers.

The set has a cohesive creative theme. We brought in artists and did real world building. The world is a mad scientist steam punkish world with five factions:

Order of the Widget (White/Blue) - This is the cyborg faction. They are like Esper but without any self control. They use their inventions to constantly improve themselves. You don't need a toaster if you replace your hand with a toaster. They take self improvement to an absurd degree.

Agents of S.N.E.A.K. (Blue/Black) - This faction is the spies. They use their inventions for elaborate spy devices. The problem is, they are, for the most part, awful spies, using spy gadgets whenever and wherever they can often when not remotely called for.

Legion of Dastardly Doom (Black/Red) - This faction is the super villains. They use their inventions for death rays, weather control devices and apocalypse machines. They want to rule the world, but are constantly fighting as to who gets to destroy the world first.

Goblin Explosioneers (Red/Green) - This faction is the Goblins, it includes the Steamfloggers. These Goblins love making contraptions and are slightly obsessed with hammers. Their style is slapping thing together to see if cool things can happen. And when things don't explode, sometimes they do.

Crossbreed Labs (Green/White) - This faction is obsessed with using their inventions to alter biology. They are all made up of hybrids of different animals. Part monkey/part spider/part leopard - sounds good. This faction mixes and matches all sorts of different animals in its quest for self improvement.

The set uses modern design and development techniques. It was designed to be drafted by itself and the release events for the product will be booster drafts. We worked hard to make the set have a lot of playability so you can draft it a bunch of times.

The set will have foil tokens, both for tokens produced by cards in the set and for popular tribes we felt the players would like in foil.

There are tons of other cool things I can't talk about yet. The set does have a second named mechanic, along with Contraptions. It is something we've been trying to solve for years and with the flexibility of silver border, finally found a way to do it.

The set started design in January of 2011 and has its release date slip on several occasions. I am very proud of the work everyone did and think it's the best Un-set we've ever made. I believe fans of Un-sets are going to love it.
Click to expand...

Contraptions being solved predates Blogatog
15-20% of the set is parody, with the rest being Mad Scientist World stuff
Steamflogger Boss is the equivalent of mythic rare
Ideal Unset frequency is every four years
Contraptions were added early on
Unstable factions have watermarks
Unstable will have at least one Magic Story, written by MaRo
There's just one basic art land cycle
Agreed that Crossbreed Labs is Simic-ish
But there is some orderliness to them
Tokens are all foil
No card ripping
On the art direction
MaRo still has plenty left on his Magic bucket list
On contraptions being in a joke set
There will be rules in place for handling lands, tokens, and Steamflogger Boss in drafting
Unsets are harder to design than normal sets

thejohnnytimmyspike asked: Out of curiosity, for how long have you known Contraptions were solved and couldn't say anything (or that Unstable was coning out)?

It's another secret that predates Blogatog.

==

p3nanc3 asked: Hi Mark, will Unstable be set on its own plane within the multiverse or Co tongue to be a parody of existing characters and locations?

80 to 85% of it will be its own plane with the rest being things like parody.

==

ancient-chaos asked: What is, roughly, the equivalent rarity of "once on the land sheet"?

Mythic rares appear once on their sheet.

==

bassimelwakil asked: Another hypothetical: if Un3 sold so well like the first Commander decks did, would you think an annual Unset would be a good idea? I would think the design constraints of an unset wouldn't be conducive to a yearly set. How often do you think an Unset could be made?

While every thirteen years feels too long, every year is too short. In my perfect world, I'd do one like every four years.

==

aamcmanus1 asked: How far into unstable's design were you when you added contraptions?

It was pretty early. Contraptions did go through numerous iterations though.

==

goldgaridelve asked: Will the five factions from Unstable have logos/watermarks?

Yes. The Unstable version of Steamflogger Boss I showed off had a watermark of the Goblin Explosioneers.

==

saintmiscellaneous asked: Whats the name of the plane Unset 3 takes place on? Will get Magic Story about it?

We haven't revealed the name yet. There is plans to have a least a story or two set on that world, one of which I'm tagged to write.

==

lostdeerinspace asked: For Unstable, will there be more than one art per colour for the lands?

No, just one cycle.

==

csick3108 asked: Some of the descriptions of the factions in Unstable sound like they should be enemy colors. The Goblin Explosioneers sound Blue-Red and the Crossbreed Labs sound Green-Blue.

The Goblin Explosioneers are a lot more primitive than the Izzet. I agree Crossbreed Labs is Simic-ish.

==

luckystampede asked: What makes Crossbreed Labs GW instead of UG?

The factions are cycled in allied colors and it was the best fit of our choices. When we get more into the creative, you'll see there is an orderliness to them.

==

ghallberg asked: Is every token in Unstable packs foil, or is it random?

I believe all the tokens are foil.

==

frosty-mage-stuff asked: Can you confirm that there are no cards in unstable that require destroying themselves or otherwise rendering themselves unusable?

There is no card ripping if that's what you're asking. Unglued market research made it clear that card ripping was not popular.

==

sarpadianempiresvol-viii asked: The art direction for Unstable seems quite not-Magic-like. Why the departure?

It's almost as if it takes things a little less seriously. : )

The art, as you will see, is top notch. Dawn Murin was Unstable's art director and she did an amazing job. I can't wait for you to see what she and the artists did.

Obviously each set has a slightly different tone, and Un-sets push more towards a lighter feel.

==

mrpopogod asked: Unhinged AND Contraptions? Are you sure you're not planning on retiring soon; what else is there left for you to do?

My Magic Bucket List is plenty full.

==

sliver-bloglord asked: Contraptions in Unstable sounds like possibly the worst thing you could have done to players: More than anything, it's one of the mechanics we've been asking to have for years, and for you to put it in a joke set tells us that you don't take player interest seriously at all. What's next? A Legendary Bear (Magic Online Only)?

While it is a joke set in the sense that there are a lot of jokes in it, it is not a joke set in that they're not real cards people can't have fun playing with. Sanctioned format play (other than sanctioned Un-play, which is a thing) is a tiny portion of played Magic meaning most Magic play can use silver bordered cards (if players agree to allow it).

Unstable is not designed as a set to read once, chuckle at and never play again. It's us exploring play spaces on the edge of what's currently allowed. And yes, it's on the fun side of the fun/serious spectrum, but for a lot of people playing and having fun is what Magic's about.

==

centurosplaneswalker asked: Will it be expected to remove lands and tokens from Unstable packs before drafting, as usual? If so, how does that work if Steamflogger Boss replaces your land?

We'll have rules in place by the set's release.

==

juananddone asked: I think part of the negative reaction to Contraptions is that it feels like cheating. You set yourself a very difficult challenge, and I was so excited to see how you would pull it off in black border. But in silver border? That's design easy mode.

Un-designs are harder than black border designs. It was the hardest challenge in the first ”Great Designer Search" and I often design a large chunk of cards because designing something black border can't do is quite difficult.
Click to expand...

It seems like contraptions are close enough to black border that it's possible they could appear in black border in the future.
One
Two
movezig5 asked: I heard contraptions are going to be in Unstable! Does this mean we'll never see them in black border?!

Let's see how they go in silver border.

==

swmystery27 asked: Having zero interest in silver-border, I just want to say I'm disappointed Contraptions are finally going to be a thing and I won't be able to use them in any Magic format I actually enjoy. I'm not trying to begrudge anyone else their fun, just saying I would have much preferred them to appear in black-border (and hope they do so soon).

Today's silver bordered mechanic is tomorrow's black bordered mechanic.
Click to expand...

EDIT:
Another explanation for Crossbreed Labs
It is not the intent to get people who don't like Unsets to buy Unstable, which is why they aren't worried about tokens and lands being unexciting
bassimelwakil asked: For those wondering why crossbreed labs has no blue; same reason Innistrad doesn't have black werewolves. "Mad scientist" world wants *everything* to be blue. Something has to give.

Basically. When everyone is an inventor, you have to find non-blue inventors.

==

secondmoonrise asked: Don't you feel that with the new FNM promo changes it significantly reduces the excitement of foil tokens in Unstable? Couple that with having full art lands being done in multiple sets still in standard, aren't you concerned that you've turned off the players on the fence about the set?

It's not my intent to sell Unstable to people who aren't interested in it. Different supplemental products are for different audiences. If Unstable doesn't seem like your thing, that's okay. It doesn't have to be for you.

Just as with Conspiracy, I think if people sample it, they might find they like it, but basic lands and tokens are in Unstable for the same reason I put them in Unglued. It's a set that plays around with boundaries and likes to do things that we don't do or don't often do in ”normal" sets.

I created Unstable to embrace what it is for players that love that aspect of the game.
Click to expand...
 
T

Tunoku

Member
Drafted Hour at the store yesterday and today and this format is pretty rad. I'm loving the UR deck. It's quite aggressive and it's really satisfying to have access to a bunch of reach with the 6 mana deal 6 and the Ramunap Ruins, while you're tempoing your opponent out hard. Gods are extremely dumb though.
 
S

shrapnelmagnet

Member
Reading about Un-sets reminds me why I don't like them. I know it's not a good argument to say, "This takes away from real sets.", but I can't help but feel that way. Like, it sucks (for me) that there is a set of Magic, which I fucking love, that I just can't muster the energy to care about. Lands, cool: Got it. All the other cards, especially now that they are semi-playable? Not even doubling down on the jokes, just making it more plausible? No thanks.

Alas. It's happening. I just want to see the full Commander spoiler to see new cards and confirmed creature types :)

In the meantime, this is a card I just stumbled on lol:

111.jpg


Does not pass 2017 muster. In many ways.
 
S

shrapnelmagnet

Member
GregLombardi said:
Why is Urza's Bauble spiking?

https://www.mtgstocks.com/prints/15054
Click to expand...

Random.

Also, not related spikes, but also Mindmoil?

https://www.mtggoldfish.com/price/Ravnica+City+of+Guilds/Mindmoil#paper

I actually like that card, I wasn't aware it existed, even. Pretty fun. If it's a temporary spike, I would def be interested in building around that.

Bauble is strange - not RL... That said, I feel any cards that say, "draw a card at the beginning of the next ___ step / turn", are things they don't want to reprint. I've never had the pleasure of playing with cards that say that, but it seems easy to forget. Non intuitive.
 
B

blindrocket

Member
That Ramunap Excavator + Ghost Quarter lock was pretty damn sweet to see in Todd Stevens G/W Company deck vs. Daniel Jessup on Grixis Shadow.
 
C

charlequin

Banned
shrapnelmagnet said:
Bauble is strange - not RL... That said, I feel any cards that say, "draw a card at the beginning of the next ___ step / turn", are things they don't want to reprint.
Click to expand...

Someplace like Anniversary Masters seems like a good slot for it, though, since the gimmick is specifically about including old stuff that isn't like what they do these days.

red13th said:
Yey Unstable seems as shitty as it sounded when they announced.
Click to expand...

You would've said this about literally any set of details they announced. :p
 
R

red13th

Member
I love tokens and absolutely hate foils so it's like they asked what I could want and then "fuck you".
John Avon lands sound amazing though but that was a given. zzzz
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
As nervous as I am about this being less "off the wall" and more "just silly" I suppose its probable that this was the only way this set was going to get made
 
Wulfric

Wulfric

Member
Remembrance said:
Are we sure this set didn't get made under the condition that it would be the test run for all art direction going full Hearthstone?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if you're being serious, but here goes.

I would highly doubt that. Art direction is one of the key differences between both games. Hour of Devastation wouldn't have that same serious gravity it has if it looked like Hearthstone. HS also is based off the look of the Warcraft universe. There's no precedence for adopting that style in Magic. But since this new world lies on the comical side, it makes sense to make the plane more colorful and experiment with new artists. I know the woman who makes the SCG parody playmats was commissioned for Unstable, for example.

That being said, Dawn Murin is directing this set, and she comes from the D&D side of the house at WotC. The article I linked is pretty old, but I was surprised to learn that D&D has a smaller art budget than Magic. That must be a big reason why Donato Giancola and Rebecca Guay rarely do work for them anymore.
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Wulfric said:
That being said, Dawn Murin is directing this set, and she comes from the D&D side of the house at WotC. The article I linked is pretty old, but I was surprised to learn that D&D has a smaller art budget than Magic. That must be a big reason why Donato Giancola and Rebecca Guay rarely do work for them anymore.
Click to expand...

I guess I wouldn't find that surprising? D&D probably needs like one Magic set's worth of new art for an entire year, doesn't it? The volume is just different
 
Wulfric

Wulfric

Member
The Technomancer said:
I guess I wouldn't find that surprising? D&D probably needs like one Magic set's worth of new art for an entire year, doesn't it? The volume is just different
Click to expand...

Ah, for some reason I thought she was saying there was less money per person. But that wouldn't really make sense because both brands are both pretty even in terms of visual quality.
 
S

SigmasonicX

Member
This pops out to me from MaRo's write-up about Unstable.
The set does have a second named mechanic, along with Contraptions. It is something we’ve been trying to solve for years and with the flexibility of silver border, finally found a way to do it.
Click to expand...

What do you think this might be? What could they have been trying to solve in black border for years and they decided to do in silver border due to flexibility?

Also, we now know contraptions were solved before Blogatog even started. Has anyone noticed any clues from his previous statements about contraptions?
 
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