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[StrategyFan]

look on the bright side

if they keep printing no strong cards for 4 more sets, it'll be the most fair standard of all time after kaladesh leaves

 

[Supast4r]

Because it lets you filter before you draw.

Like, I played a LOT of preordain in Standard! There's a reason it's god-tier and Serum Visions is not.

And that's because it scrys 2 and not one. That's a huge difference... Opt isn't as good as you think it is.

 

[shrapnelmagnet]

Maybe it's obvious to people with much better card eval / actually testing or has already been mentioned, but I get the feeling that there is a U/x aggro or aggressive tempo deck in Standard with Ixalan / Jace. I haven't really gone through the cards, though.

EDIT: I should've read to the end of the thread. Is mentioned a couple posts above lol

 

[Supast4r]

Let's look at the Modern Metagame:

Deck with Blue:

Baral Storm: Will keep playing 4x Sleight of Hand. I think they'll keep playing Serum Visions as well, because Visions gets you all the way to the fourth card if you need it. Might play more than 8 cantrips though.

Death's Shadow: Will keep playing 4x Thought Scour. If Wraith gets banned, they might go to 12 cantrips and play Opt and Serum Visions. Otherwise, I could see them probably replacing Serum Visions with Opt.

UW/Jeskai: Obviously replaces Serum Visions with Opt.

Merfolk: Can't see them taking time off to cantrip, to be honest.

What am I missing?

Shadow will morph into shadow delver lists and play both opt and serum visions. Calling it now.

 

[Supast4r]

Out of pure curiosity (and the fact I might want to play with Jace), why are you down on his two main abilities? They seem pretty good for a 3 mana walker. There's no shortage of cheap, hard to block creatures in blue so it shouldn't be too hard to get value out of his +1 every time you use it, and being able to make a 2/2 repeatedly sounds really good for a walker as cheap as he is.

Just imagining him as 3 mana for "Loot + occasional bear". Looks like a winner to me.

I guess it depends on if Ux aggro/tempo takes off, but if it does Jace looks like a good fit for it.

The important thing about Jace is that the illusion doesn't die to abilities. So you are always spending a card to kill it. That's why I think Jace will be good. The loot is just to find more Jace to get more 2/2s. The loot also has nice synergy with the blue enchantment

 

[A Serious Man]

If there are codes on these cards, standing offer of $5 for anyone who gets me one, because I can't make the event

I think the ad cards are just marketing but yeah, if they do have beta codes on them I'll gladly pay for one.

 

[divisionbyzorro]

Shadow will morph into shadow delver lists and play both opt and serum visions. Calling it now.

Thought Scour is so important to casting Tasigur and Angler though? You think they'll move away from those?

 

[Santiako]

Thought Scour is so important to casting Tasigur and Angler though? You think they'll move away from those?

No, they'll go to 12 cantrips and lower land count.

 

[kirblar]

And that's because it scrys 2 and not one. That's a huge difference... Opt isn't as good as you think it is.

Difference between Preordain and Opt

-1 scry
+Instant Speed

That's a really, really good trade-off.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Difference between Preordain and Opt

-1 scry
+Instant Speed

That's a really, really good trade-off.

Why is it though?

If you cast opt to get your next land it's terrible.

 

[Supast4r]

Difference between Preordain and Opt

-1 scry
+Instant Speed

That's a really, really good trade-off.

You are also trading off turn 1 serum visions which is a very nice play and males many hands keepable. Like I said before, I like the idea of trying 4 and 4.

 

[Lucario]

From playing with all of them in Cube and EDH I'd say it's:

brainstorm >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ponder > preordain > opt > serum visions > sleight of hand > thought scour

 

[DrArchon]

The important thing about Jace is that the illusion doesn't die to abilities. So you are always spending a card to kill it. That's why I think Jace will be good. The loot is just to find more Jace to get more 2/2s. The loot also has nice synergy with the blue enchantment

That's why I called them bears. If they died to abilities like old illusions it'd be another story. And honestly, what spell could an opponent throw out against a 2/2 that wouldn't kill it (and that's ignoring the fact that they're spending a card to kill a 2/2 token, so they must be really fucking desperate)?

I actually really like the looting though. Keep that gas going no matter what. That plus Chart a Course = almost never not having the cards you need.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

From playing with all of them in Cube and EDH I'd say it's:

brainstorm >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ponder > preordain > opt > serum visions > sleight of hand > thought scour

Not saying it's better but I like ponder more than brainstorm in EDH and thoughtscour tends to be amazing in the right deck. The blue flip land only made thought scour better.

 

[Yeef]

Perhaps Frank Karsten will do an article breaking down the math of all the popular blue cantrips. Everyone loves math!

 

[Supast4r]

That's why I called them bears. If they died to abilities like old illusions it'd be another story. And honestly, what spell could an opponent throw out against a 2/2 that wouldn't kill it (and that's ignoring the fact that they're spending a card to kill a 2/2 token, so they must be really fucking desperate)?

I actually really like the looting though. Keep that gas going no matter what. That plus Chart a Course = almost never not having the cards you need.

I low key think that chart a course is the best card in the set for modern.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Out of pure curiosity (and the fact I might want to play with Jace), why are you down on his two main abilities? They seem pretty good for a 3 mana walker. There's no shortage of cheap, hard to block creatures in blue so it shouldn't be too hard to get value out of his +1 every time you use it, and being able to make a 2/2 repeatedly sounds really good for a walker as cheap as he is.

Just imagining him as 3 mana for "Loot + occasional bear". Looks like a winner to me.

I guess it depends on if Ux aggro/tempo takes off, but if it does Jace looks like a good fit for it.

It costs 2/3 of his starting loyalty to make a 2/2 and you only conditionally get a loot if for some reason you want to let your opponent murder Jace.

 

[Daedardus]

From playing with all of them in Cube and EDH I'd say it's:

brainstorm >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ponder > preordain > opt > serum visions > sleight of hand > thought scour

And they are all nothing compared to Ancestral Recall. But of course their price reflects that too.

 

[Angry Grimace]

And they are all nothing compared to Ancestral Recall. But of course their price reflects that too.

Ancestral Recall isn't legal in anything

 

[DrArchon]

It costs 2/3 of his starting loyalty to make a 2/2 and you only conditionally get a loot if for some reason you want to let your opponent murder Jace.

I'll agree with those points. He's very squishy. Still I can see getting a 2/2 and a loot off of him before an opponent kills him, which isn't terrible for 3 mana.

I'm certainly not expecting him to be the next baby Jace or anything, I just think that if there's a good aggro or tempo Ux deck, Jace could be useful in it.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I want one for my Narset deck is the biggest compliment I can give a UWR walker.


I was occupied when this was spoiled but the flavour is fucking weird

what's the legendary enchantment exactly here?

 

[Repgnar]

Didn't the community go through the same perceived low value with HOU too? I remember reading a MTGOGoldfish article saying it was going to be one of the lowest and that set turned out better than expected even having an impact on a full standard format.

 

[HK-47]

I want one for my Narset deck is the biggest compliment I can give a UWR walker.


I was occupied when this was spoiled but the flavour is fucking weird

what's the legendary enchantment exactly here?

Lol should be an artifact flavorwise

 

[Justin]

Didn't the community go through the same perceived low value with HOU too? I remember reading a MTGOGoldfish article saying it was going to be one of the lowest and that set turned out better than expected even having an impact on a full standard format.

Yes, even the Alpha Investments guy did a video saying he was wrong to shit on the set so much and that it ended up having a nearly perfect value curve.

 

[Daedardus]

Ancestral Recall isn't legal in anything

I know, but he was talking about cubes and power level and I was just reminded how that card is ridiculous compared to all other cantrips, half of them who are banned and restricted in many formats too.

I want one for my Narset deck is the biggest compliment I can give a UWR walker.


I was occupied when this was spoiled but the flavour is fucking weird

what's the legendary enchantment exactly here?

Those are some very special and famous cannon blast spells, are you trying to mock Captain Vance herself?

 

[Violet_0]

Here it is:

Pretty good in control mirrors or slow matchups.

that might be my favorite card of the set, honestly. Flip card, great concept, cool art, legendary enchantment, pretty strong EDH effect. Red control is getting some love lately (the 6 mana phoenix enchantment is pretty neat as well). Might even see play in standard

 

[Ashodin]

It's the Captain's signature cannons on his ship. There's nothing like it on Ixalan.

fuck I love hte land frame on the back

 

[ultron87]

From playing with all of them in Cube and EDH I'd say it's:

brainstorm >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ponder > preordain > opt > serum visions > sleight of hand > thought scour

I put Brainstorm below Ponder and Preordain in Cube unless I have more than a couple shuffle effects.

 

[ThLunarian]

It's the Captain's signature cannons on his ship. There's nothing like it on Ixalan.

fuck I love hte land frame on the back

Still should have made it a red legendary artifact for maximum flavor

 

[DrArchon]

that might be my favorite card of the set, honestly. Flip card, great concept, cool art, legendary enchantment, pretty strong EDH effect. Red control is getting some love lately (the 6 mana phoneix enchantment is pretty neat as well). Might even see play in standard

I love the idea of this card so much, but I'm not sure if it'll see much standard play just because of Chandra. She does basically the same thing but better, and can kill creatures without needing 3 spells in a turn beforehand.

It's a shame, because the card looks super fun to use.

 

[Justin]

I love the idea of this card so much, but I'm not sure if it'll see much standard play just because of Chandra. She does basically the same thing but better, and can kill creatures without needing 3 spells in a turn beforehand.

It's a shame, because the card looks super fun to use.

It will be a good alternative for people who can't drop 120 on a playset of Chandra's though.

 

[Violet_0]

I love the idea of this card so much, but I'm not sure if it'll see much standard play just because of Chandra. She does basically the same thing but better, and can kill creatures without needing 3 spells in a turn beforehand.

It's a shame, because the card looks super fun to use.

fair point. It might have made the cut at 3 mana, which still seems fair when compared to phyrexian arena

on an unrelated note, Chandra is the only decently valuable card I own since I came back for KLD

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Yes, even the Alpha Investments guy did a video saying he was wrong to shit on the set so much and that it ended up having a nearly perfect value curve.

I was curious if anyone redid the math because there really weren't many chase cards till now in the set and the value was so atrocious even improving would just make it bad.

Lol should be an artifact flavorwise

Enchantments are real difficult to pinpoint flavourwise but that's real eggregious especially being legendary.

To elaborate from what I gathered enchantments are concepts and/or powerful moments of sorts captured on permaments.
Even just looking at the rest of the cycle of flip all have their powerful emotions conveyed of exploration, making ground, sacrifice and the collective effort.

 

[Justin]

I was curious if anyone redid the math because there really weren't many chase cards till now in the set and the value was so atrocious even improving would just make it bad.

Here's the video
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=brX_L51ruxI

 

[Infinite Stars]

Thematically, a Cannon is not an enchantment. However, given that it's a specific kind of Cannon, I can buy a stretch for Cycle's Sake

 

[Daedardus]

It's the Captain's signature cannons on his ship. There's nothing like it on Ixalan.

fuck I love hte land frame on the back

Captains are female on Ixalan, I mean, it even says so on the card itself.

 

[Yeef]

Random commons. I hope you like blocking.

 

[Santiako]

That's both the biggest vanilla creature ever and the biggest common ever. Neat!

 

[Violet_0]

random lore question, are all the conquistadors vampires or is it a mixed vampire/human force?

 

[Ashodin]

Captains are female on Ixalan, I mean, it even says so on the card itself.

Sry, I assumed we hit upon a male captain.

I guess Angrath is the only male captain

Violet, they're mixed. Humans do the labor and Vampires do the conquerin'

 

[kirblar]

There are male captains referenced in the story and flavor text. Not sure if any are pirate captains though.

 

[Justin]

I look forward to making that Brontodon Walk the Plank

 

[Ashodin]

I look forward to making that Brontodon Walk the Plank

its head will still come out of the ocean and be like "wtf man"

 

[Crocodile]

Ceratops needed Reach and Brontodon needed Trample

Altisaur is going to be a PAIN with that GW Uncommon Dinosaur >_<

 

[Justin]

its head will still come out of the ocean and be like "wtf man"

"We're going to need a bigger plank"

 

[Bandini]

I wasn't very hyped about Opt until I realized it's an instant. I play UW Control and Jeskai Geist in modern so it's an easy replacement for Serum Visions for me.

For constructed, there's not much in Ixalan that calls out to me other than some EDH cards. Carnage Tyrant makes me not want to play standard, so that's fine anyway. Does look like a fun set for limited at least, been a while for that for me.

 

[OnPoint]

Should've mentioned that I'm in Canada, so add 40% to the price of any card.

Comes to $18.20 per copy when adjusted for 40%, putting it under the $20+ you said.

I'm just saying, buy in while it's this low

 

[Pundere]

It's such a bummer that they're pushing Dinosaurs and Pirates so hard for standard, but Vampires and Merfolk got shafted to just being (not great looking) limited archetypes. I was really looking forward to playing BW vamps

 

[Violet_0]

vamps and merfolk seemingly aren't meant to be viable tribal deck (not talking about the individual strenght of the cards, just tribal synergy). It's a bit of an odd design choice that I don't really like either. We're looking at a potential dinosaur and pirate deck for standard, and then a bunch of decks that might use the odd vampire or merfolk here and there like any other creature

 

[SigmasonicX]

Didn't expect a common bigger than an eldrazi common, but I suppose this is also a pure vanilla.

random lore question, are all the conquistadors vampires or is it a mixed vampire/human force?

I expect they must have non-vampires working for them, but I doubt we'll see cards; with only two colors, vampires have less space for non-tribal creatures. I know the art description for Shadowed Caravel mentioned they have shades protecting their ships.