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hariseldon
Unconfirmed Member
I do hope that all this leads to an understanding that China is the bigger threat and perhaps some 'unofficial' military action taking place, if you catch my drift.
Mask Efficacy |OT| Wuhan!! Got You All In Check
- Thread starter keraj37
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I do hope that all this leads to an understanding that China is the bigger threat and perhaps some 'unofficial' military action taking place, if you catch my drift.
Joe T.
Member
Corbella: Kenney's criticism of Dr. Tam is well deserved
Alberta Premier Jason Kenney’s recent criticism of Canada’s top physician, Dr. Theresa Tam, was a much-needed dose of reality during this COVID-19 pandemic.calgaryherald.com
For any canadians good points about Dr. Tam who always comes off as a boot licker to me
I'm no fan of Patty Hajdu either: "There is no indication that the data that came out of China in terms of their infection rate, and their death rate, was falsified in any way," earlier this month.
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rykomatsu
Member
I'm guessing your temp sensor might have gone bad and the condenser is frosted over.
Try defrosting the entire unit for a few hours (condenser unit will defrost, you'll get a puddle underneath). When you start up the fridge, the fridge portion will also work.
In the interim, when you start feeling your fridge cooling slow down or become weak, repeat until you can get someone in.
You should be able to search for your fridge's model number and find instructions on how to defrost.
It's a temp solution but it should give you refridgeration for 3-4 days at a time before the condenser Frost's over again.
Should just need to move the frozen food into the fridge compartment while you're defrosting - keep all the frozen foods close together when defrosting so they don't melt as quickly.
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cryptoadam
Banned
Trudeaubux are here.
Only took 2 days.
how much blackface paint you going to buy with your Trudea Buxx?
Rock And Roll
Member
I'm no fan of Patty Hajdu either: "There is no indication that the data that came out of China in terms of their infection rate, and their death rate, was falsified in any way," earlier this month.
The fact our government is still defending China and giving money to them is absolutely pathetic. How deep are we in with the CCP?
You saying that you're much more worried about your family than yourself really speaks to me.
Yesterday at the care home where I work more staff members tested positive. I was okay during work, but then I had to go home to my mother - was I or was I not taking the virus home to mom? Each day, since the outbreak began, I've had to live with this fear. It's just... crippling.
On top of it all my mom fell down the steps yesterday and broke her hip (sorry for repeating myself here). Today she's in bed, and I have to nurse her, but I also have to go to work. Unfortunately, she's much worse today. She now says her knees and her ribs are hurting. All they gave me yesterday were morphine tablets. 4 of them.
The anxiety I'm experiencing right now is through the roof. All I can say, NinjaMouse, is that you being worried about your family, and not so much about yourself, truly warms my heart. I can draw strength from that. I'm actually glad you are anxious because it tells me how much you care.
Unfortunately, we're all just going to have to live with this for quite a while... and just hope and hope and hope that somehow we get through this and make it to the other side and see the sun again.
Take care of your family, NinjaMouse. I believe you'll make it.
JordanN
Banned
Mostly going to save it.
I actually had plans to go visit another province in search of a new job, but I'm not sure if that's even possible anymore. So I'm basically grounded in Ontario.
cryptoadam
Banned
Mostly going to save it.
I actually had plans to go visit another province in search of a new job, but I'm not sure if that's even possible anymore. So I'm basically grounded in Ontario.
If your willing to go work in an old age home or on a farm I am sure Legault would be happy to hire you in Quebec LOL.
Come to the Corona Chan capital of Canada, beautiful french Quebec.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Gotta say, I want to believe he's right, and I certainly don't doubt his credentials, but I didn't find that very convincing. He didn't really say much other than that he thinks, in the end, it won't really matter much which approach any country took.
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llien
Banned
I was wondering what was the BS "called out by Iran".
And you told me that Iran considers CFR at least 1% worse than German to be unrealistic.
Thanks for response in any case, but don't you think that if China's 3.5% CFR is BS, German 2.5% even more so?
At the end of the day, I want to hear what are the reasons to believe authoritarian regime that can lock down its citizens in flats, like in cells, cannot handle the virus spread via droplets. The only real reason I see is Western arrogance.
JordanN
Banned
Old age home is what got me quarantined in the first place...
Farming would be fun though (I'm subscribed to a youtuber who tends livestock for a living and he's happier than most people) . I'll put it down as a backup option.
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All Hail C-Webb
Hailing from the Chill-Web
A vaccine can still protect people if they don't build natural immunity.
I don't think we need to quarantine until a vaccine, I think we need to quarantine until we know more.
We have some reports were a huge percentage of a group was asymptomatic, but we also have other reports that aren't nearly as rosy. Multiple people dying in families, the percentage dying in some old age homes. Even if you look at a group like the NYPD, if we assume all of them have had it, at least 10% have shown symptoms.
We need to know how many people have had it. We need to know more about antibodies and immunity.
Over a month ago I posted that we'd heard about a few people who had been asymptomatic, who a month later started developing symptoms like shortness of breath. What if you can be reinfected withing a couple of months, and have a more difficult fight the 2nd time?
We've at least shown that we can stem the tide with quarantines, so slowly reopening certain places is not going to be the end of the world. But the people who get sent out there first are essentially test subjects and guinea pigs, and most don't even know it.
cryptoadam
Banned
I don't think you can deny mitigation works. Probably masks too (thanks WHO and officials that followed the WHO's BS). Lock downs that can go either way.
China had a draconian lock down and they didn't stop it and its coming back again in Hubei and spreading to other parts of China. Sweden's CFR is not much different than other European places like Italy, Spain, UK etc... Italy still has thousands of cases and 100's of deaths and they lock down started almost 6 weeks ago. The people infected and dying now were infected after they lock down.
The virus has slowed down, mitigation has helped but could we have achieved the same results by focusing on old people and old age homes (look at the scandals popping up about senior residences), requiring mask wearing, social distancing and taking more half measures instead of complete shut downs?
I guess we can never prove that since we can't go back in time. And don't mistake this for saying we need to be completly open. I think mitigation 100% helps, but I am not 100% convinced that the lock downs are why the virus follows the same patterns across the globe basically. EU peaks and declines pretty much the same time. USA + Canada following the same peaks and declines. Even West Coast vs East coast is very similar.
China had a draconian lock down and they didn't stop it and its coming back again in Hubei and spreading to other parts of China. Sweden's CFR is not much different than other European places like Italy, Spain, UK etc... Italy still has thousands of cases and 100's of deaths and they lock down started almost 6 weeks ago. The people infected and dying now were infected after they lock down.
The virus has slowed down, mitigation has helped but could we have achieved the same results by focusing on old people and old age homes (look at the scandals popping up about senior residences), requiring mask wearing, social distancing and taking more half measures instead of complete shut downs?
I guess we can never prove that since we can't go back in time. And don't mistake this for saying we need to be completly open. I think mitigation 100% helps, but I am not 100% convinced that the lock downs are why the virus follows the same patterns across the globe basically. EU peaks and declines pretty much the same time. USA + Canada following the same peaks and declines. Even West Coast vs East coast is very similar.
Jtibh
Banned
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I admit I'm not an expert in this field, but how does this work? The body recovers through its immune system recognizing foreign proteins and destroying them. The immune system remembers these proteins and destroys as they are introduced to the body in the future, building "immunity." Unless I'm mistaken, a vaccine just allows for this process to happen without actually introducing a big enough viral load to cause disease, but still relies on the immune system to work and be able to recognize, destroy, and remember the foreign proteins. If we're not doing it naturally, can a vaccine be effective?
cryptoadam
Banned
No I don't believe China's numbers at all, they are and have lied. And pretty much no one around the world believes them not just "western" people.
And I don't believe Iran's copy and pasta 140 deaths a day for the last 6 weeks either, but it says alot when the 2nd biggest BS'er of Corona Chan is calling out CCP. When even the biggest liar can't handle CCP lies anymore the jig is up. Russia is next, they are already kicking out chinese nationals and sending them back across the border. Once Moscow is on fire Putin and Xi gonna have a big falling out. And wait till Hajj is canceled and your gonna see real Muslim fury.
All Hail C-Webb
Hailing from the Chill-Web
I'm not an expert on that either, and I actually wasn't clear. I was referring to short term natural immunity, not no natural immunity at all (which thankfully doesn't seem to be the case).
I'll try to find the source, but basically if there's short term immunity, then vaccines would need to be administered more often/boosters. It doesn't sound like much fun, but even if we end up in that awful scenario, we wouldn't be completely fucked.
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Nymphae
Banned
Swedish expert: why lockdowns are the wrong policy
That was one of the more extraordinary interviews we have done here at UnHerd. Professor Johan Giesecke, one of the world’s most senior epidemiologists, advisor to the Swedish Government (he hired Anders Tegnell who is currently directing Swedish strategy), the first Chief Scientist of the...
unherd.com
Professor Johan Giesecke, one of the world's most senior epidemiologists, advisor to the Swedish Government (he hired Anders Tegnell who is currently directing Swedish strategy), the first Chief Scientist of the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control, and an advisor to the director general of the WHO, lays out with typically Swedish bluntness why he thinks:
- UK policy on lockdown and other European countries are not evidence-based
- The correct policy is to protect the old and the frail only
- This will eventually lead to herd immunity as a "by-product"
- The initial UK response, before the "180 degree U-turn", was better
- The Imperial College paper was "not very good" and he has never seen an unpublished paper have so much policy impact
- The paper was very much too pessimistic
- Any such models are a dubious basis for public policy anyway
- The flattening of the curve is due to the most vulnerable dying first as much as the lockdown
- The results will eventually be similar for all countries
- Covid-19 is a "mild disease" and similar to the flu, and it was the novelty of the disease that scared people.
- The actual fatality rate of Covid-19 is the region of 0.1%
- At least 50% of the population of both the UK and Sweden will be shown to have already had the disease when mass antibody testing becomes available
I really hope Newsom starts trying to arrest people for doing this. After emptying the jails and prisons of felons, his recall would be guaranteed.
JordanN
Banned
Saw this on reddit. Another person describes what Covid-19 testing is like. 
The last time I spoke with my mom, she said she didn't display any of the obvious symptoms despite being positive. It was just her voice that sounded very very deep. I wont risk it right now but if I do see her today I'll ask her how she feels now.
The last time I spoke with my mom, she said she didn't display any of the obvious symptoms despite being positive. It was just her voice that sounded very very deep. I wont risk it right now but if I do see her today I'll ask her how she feels now.
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D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Swedish expert: why lockdowns are the wrong policy
That was one of the more extraordinary interviews we have done here at UnHerd. Professor Johan Giesecke, one of the world’s most senior epidemiologists, advisor to the Swedish Government (he hired Anders Tegnell who is currently directing Swedish strategy), the first Chief Scientist of the...
Professor Johan Giesecke, one of the world's most senior epidemiologists, advisor to the Swedish Government (he hired Anders Tegnell who is currently directing Swedish strategy), the first Chief Scientist of the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control, and an advisor to the director general of the WHO, lays out with typically Swedish bluntness why he thinks:
- UK policy on lockdown and other European countries are not evidence-based
- The correct policy is to protect the old and the frail only
- This will eventually lead to herd immunity as a "by-product"
- The initial UK response, before the "180 degree U-turn", was better
- The Imperial College paper was "not very good" and he has never seen an unpublished paper have so much policy impact
- The paper was very much too pessimistic
- Any such models are a dubious basis for public policy anyway
- The flattening of the curve is due to the most vulnerable dying first as much as the lockdown
- The results will eventually be similar for all countries
- Covid-19 is a "mild disease" and similar to the flu, and it was the novelty of the disease that scared people.
- The actual fatality rate of Covid-19 is the region of 0.1%
- At least 50% of the population of both the UK and Sweden will be shown to have already had the disease when mass antibody testing becomes available
Thanks for the summary bullet points. I watched the whole thing when the video was posted earlier, but I wish he elaborated on any of those points as to why he thinks that way. Obviously he's a highly qualified expert and authority on things like these, but I just didn't find what he was saying to be very convincing in the end. Was basically saying we won't know for sure until a year or so from now. Shit, I could have told you that.
Chittagong
Gold Member
Another lead for the theory that corona is not that much more damaging, but a hundred time more infectious:
www.dailymail.co.uk
so it could be that we are seeing an illusion of sorts, the hospitals are not full of people because the virus is so much worse than influenza, but because it's a hundred times more infectious. Basically it's speed running a multi year influenza span in a matter of weeks. We see all the hospitalisations at once and using influenza mathematics we assume that it hasn't yet infected most people, so a big wave is coming.
One third of people in study test positive for COVID-19 antibodies
Physicians in Chelsea, Massachusetts, tested 200 residents' blood for COVID-19 antibodies and discovered nearly one third of participants previously had the illness
so it could be that we are seeing an illusion of sorts, the hospitals are not full of people because the virus is so much worse than influenza, but because it's a hundred times more infectious. Basically it's speed running a multi year influenza span in a matter of weeks. We see all the hospitalisations at once and using influenza mathematics we assume that it hasn't yet infected most people, so a big wave is coming.
Nicktendo_
Banned
Please take care, Siri.
You are doing an amazing job, both with your mother and going into the care home every day.
Stay strong, you're doing what many could not. You're going to get through this brother.
All Hail C-Webb
Hailing from the Chill-Web
Another lead for the theory that corona is not that much more damaging, but a hundred time more infectious:
One third of people in study test positive for COVID-19 antibodies
Physicians in Chelsea, Massachusetts, tested 200 residents' blood for COVID-19 antibodies and discovered nearly one third of participants previously had the illness
so it could be that we are seeing an illusion of sorts, the hospitals are not full of people because the virus is so much worse than influenza, but because it's a hundred times more infectious. Basically it's speed running a multi year influenza span in a matter of weeks. We see all the hospitalisations at once and using influenza mathematics we assume that it hasn't yet infected most people, so a big wave is coming.
They advertised the study, and 50% said they had at least 1 symptom in the last month, but only a third showed antibodies.
If it's highly infections, has low mortality and people build immunity, it's the absolute dream outcome. It's awesome that we're seeing some indications pointing at least partially that way, but that study didn't do much for me.
Nymphae
Banned
My girlfriend calls me last night to tell me her workplace has implemented even heavier lockdown policies, at this point it doesn't even sound legal to me.
She is from Korea and does not have PR status yet, so she needs her job and has to follow the rules. She lives in with disabled people and they are now telling her she isn't even allowed to go outside to meet people. They had implemented strict policies a few weeks ago and she was no longer allowed to go for groceries, only one person from the house could. Basically said don't leave unless you have to, fine, we still met once a week and walked together.
Now they told her she can't even do that, she pleaded with them and gave them rational arguments, like what about the staff who aren't full-live in and only come in half of the time, they are out being exposed, how can you control them? Shoulders shrugged. But they are scaring her into not even having contact with anyone, and she has to wear a face mask at all times in the house, despite not being allowed to go anywhere.
It's taking a toll on her and it's really starting to piss me off watching people do irrational shit out of fear. I don't understand how it can be legal for them to tell her she is not allowed to go out and see anyone. If it's not a government mandate, go fuck yourself, do we not have rights?
She is from Korea and does not have PR status yet, so she needs her job and has to follow the rules. She lives in with disabled people and they are now telling her she isn't even allowed to go outside to meet people. They had implemented strict policies a few weeks ago and she was no longer allowed to go for groceries, only one person from the house could. Basically said don't leave unless you have to, fine, we still met once a week and walked together.
Now they told her she can't even do that, she pleaded with them and gave them rational arguments, like what about the staff who aren't full-live in and only come in half of the time, they are out being exposed, how can you control them? Shoulders shrugged. But they are scaring her into not even having contact with anyone, and she has to wear a face mask at all times in the house, despite not being allowed to go anywhere.
It's taking a toll on her and it's really starting to piss me off watching people do irrational shit out of fear. I don't understand how it can be legal for them to tell her she is not allowed to go out and see anyone. If it's not a government mandate, go fuck yourself, do we not have rights?
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llien
Banned
"Evidence based", chuckle as if UK haven't started with that and then reversed on 16th of March.
"Evidence based", right? So how many vunlerable live in Germany, as number of actively infected is dropping for more than a week now and total deaths is at 4.4k? It doesn't add up, Germany is 4 times bigger than NL, but the latter nearly matched in on number of deaths with no "flattening" in sight.
Also this:
One needs to admit Netherlands are doing better than Belgium that uses harsher lockdowns. On the other hands, perhaps said lockdowns were the reaction to infection spikes.
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Jtibh
Banned
I see a lot of posts here how this virus is not any worse than the flu.
How 50bpercent dont show any symptoms therefor most of us will be fine.
Here is my theory as an average person.
Lets say you get the virus but your immune system takes care of it.
The virus most likely stays dormant in your body it just sleeps.
If your immune system gets weak later on the virus will reactivate itself.
And if so it will do a lot more damage to you than before.
Also you would start infecting others again.
This is what i can think off is happening in south korea singapore japan etc. with the reinfection reports.
So lets say most of us didnt feel anything, with the second wave will have it a lot worse and we will see a dramatic increase in cases hospitalizations and deaths and not just for the old folks.
I dont think heard immunity is an option with this virus
But only time will tell.
Right now i feel people are a bit delusional about the worst being over or how everything is overblown but they only say that cuz we took serious measures locked the whole world up and thats why we see cases dropping and less and less deaths when i reality the situation would be sooooo much worse we couldnt even imagine would we have not taken any action.
So right now people never experienced the true magnitude of this virus outside of china and they feel they lost their jobs and had to stay home for nothing.
And this attitude will only result in going back to our normal life way too early and this will lead to a big major comeback of the virus with its secind wave and several mutations.
I dont know i might be full of shit but this is how i see it.
How 50bpercent dont show any symptoms therefor most of us will be fine.
Here is my theory as an average person.
Lets say you get the virus but your immune system takes care of it.
The virus most likely stays dormant in your body it just sleeps.
If your immune system gets weak later on the virus will reactivate itself.
And if so it will do a lot more damage to you than before.
Also you would start infecting others again.
This is what i can think off is happening in south korea singapore japan etc. with the reinfection reports.
So lets say most of us didnt feel anything, with the second wave will have it a lot worse and we will see a dramatic increase in cases hospitalizations and deaths and not just for the old folks.
I dont think heard immunity is an option with this virus
But only time will tell.
Right now i feel people are a bit delusional about the worst being over or how everything is overblown but they only say that cuz we took serious measures locked the whole world up and thats why we see cases dropping and less and less deaths when i reality the situation would be sooooo much worse we couldnt even imagine would we have not taken any action.
So right now people never experienced the true magnitude of this virus outside of china and they feel they lost their jobs and had to stay home for nothing.
And this attitude will only result in going back to our normal life way too early and this will lead to a big major comeback of the virus with its secind wave and several mutations.
I dont know i might be full of shit but this is how i see it.
cryptoadam
Banned
Germany’s largest paper to China's president: You're endangering the world
"You [Jinping], your government and your scientists had to know long ago that coronavirus is highly infectious, but you left the world in the dark about it."
m.jpost.com
Rbk_3
Member
I grew up on a farm in South Western Ontario. I miss it but at the same time, I don't. I still go back sometimes to help my dad, but it is usually the shit work he's getting to old to do.
All Hail C-Webb
Hailing from the Chill-Web
I hate this argument.
As if we wouldn't have economic impact and job loss without putting measures in place.
As if people wouldn't be even more depressed losing loved ones, and even knowing that they were responsible for it.
Imagine the loss in a place like NY if we hadn't locked down when we did. Another few weeks of spread, and the top medical system in the world would have collapsed.
Ornlu
Banned
It is also fair to acknowledge the unintentional results of long-term economic damage. It's useful data to have when determining a good point to re-open things.
synchronicity
Member
People need to realize that there are only two nations. The nation of wealth and power and the nation of servitude to wealth and power. That is all.
Phunkydiabetic
Banned
So the bottom strap is meant to just flap and dangle in the wind instead of going around your head?
Phunkydiabetic
Banned
Trudeaubux are here.
Only took 2 days.
Canada is killing it throughout this whole situation. The amount of support for canadians during this all is amazing. As much as Trudeau and his government cronies irritate me I cant help but praise their handling of this. When worse came to worse they have stepped up and done a great job.
Articles and attitudes like this is why these protests will get violent soon.Try telling this someone who owns their own business that the can't work, can't pay their mortgage (because their state won't give them unemployment due to being self employed), and they're going to go hungry because the food banks are running out of food. All because their Dem governor wants to play tyrant and affect an election in November.
bitbydeath
Member
As I was mentioning the other day about chances on never getting a vaccine/cure.
www.news.com.au
There may never be a vaccine for COVID-19
One of Australia’s most eminent vaccine developers says there may never be a vaccine against COVID-19 for some very good reasons.
www.news.com.au
Sybrix
Member
There may never be a vaccine for COVID-19
One of Australia’s most eminent vaccine developers says there may never be a vaccine against COVID-19 for some very good reasons.
I just cant my head around the possibility of no vaccine, our whole way of life would have to change forever.
Taxexemption
Member
There is no vaccine for the cold, and the one for the flu is basically guesswork that often isn't effective. Stop being scared, this isn't a big deal. I'm contemplating making a youtube channel where I show myself getting asian women to spit in my mouth and or do whatever would spread germs the most with me just to show how not afraid I am.
What's the most effective way to spread germs between two people? Cause I'm now interested in doing that just to show how little I care about this.
timeflais
Banned
Deep.
They are desperate for any other president other than Trump as we approach election day.
Infiltrate > invade. How many democrats and republicans do you think sold out?
I think a very large percentage of congress are in China's pocket.
HarryKS
Member
I have a profound dislike for the dude and some of the measures such as CEBA are still perfectible, but yes, you are correct. Even Ford, the Ontario Premier stepped up big time. We're still behind in terms of testing though. But by large, the numbers have been very good.
Wage subsidies is a godsend. There'll be other catastrophic problems down the line, but those were always gonna show up.
eot
Banned
My biggest objection to that video is that (when asked) he estimates the fatality rate at 0.1% (actually he says it's "of that order" which can mean quite a big range), but gives no justification for it. NYC is already at like 0.15% if literally everyone is infected. He needed to give some kind of argument for that, not just say "I think it's mild". The rate at which this thing kills people is probably the most important factor in deciding for/against these lock downs.
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