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[Bisnic]

If he isnt loyal to you, he will.

Yeah but who beats ME2 with the intention of keeping people alive without doing their loyalty mission?

 

[HK-47]

They kinda tried, but failed. Many elements of both the intro and final moments mirror the events of the first game. They obviously tried to play some kind of homage to how the trilogy began.

But then, you know, floating platform and space child.

Floating platforms are the enemy. I remember that section on the Collector Ship. I'll never be able to forget ;_;

 

[HK-47]

Yeah but who beats ME2 with the intention of keeping people alive without doing their loyalty mission?

I dunno, but they bothered to do it. Props I guess?

 

[Bisnic]

I dunno, but they bothered to do it. Props I guess?

Yet they didnt bother to do decent endings.

Priorities! Where are they!?

 

[gokieks]

If he isnt loyal to you, he will.

I like Grunt (he's like an lovable pet who angrily barks at the world), but I honestly thought that scene where he miraculously survives and comes back to reach the shuttle in the nick of time was teetering on the edge of complete implausibility.

Looking back, that's just yet another indication of what the ending was portended to be, and how the actual ending is nothing like it.

 

[HK-47]

I like Grunt (he's like an lovable pet who angrily barks at the world), but I honestly thought that scene where he miraculously survives and comes back to reach the shuttle in the nick of time was teetering on the edge of complete implausibility.

Looking back, that's just yet another indication of what the ending was portended to be, and how the actual ending is nothing like it.

I would have still chosen the Queen. I want them to have a second chance. Stop trying to make me kill her.

 

[B_Rik_Schitthaus]

I like Grunt (he's like an lovable pet who angrily barks at the world), but I honestly thought that scene where he miraculously survives and comes back to reach the shuttle in the nick of time was teetering on the edge of complete implausibility.

Looking back, that's just yet another indication of what the ending was portended to be, and how the actual ending is nothing like it.

That's how I feel about the moments in games when someone has to 'hold off' a group of baddies, Grunt stops for what? 10 enemies I just killed thousands, no need for a bullshit 'sacrifice'.

 

[HK-47]

That's how I feel about the moments in games when someone has to 'hold off' a group of baddies, Grunt stops for what? 10 enemies I just killed thousands, no need for a bullshit 'sacrifice'.

He must have beast shields to take on that many ravagers.

 

[kirblar]

I thought Grunt living was an enormous cop-out on the part of the ME3 team. Once I *thought* he was going to die, all of a sudden the weight of my decision there hit home and caused me to re-evaluate what I had decided to do. For about 20 seconds until I got the "Grunt lives!" cut scene. It was the closest they had gotten to the Ashley/Kaiden decision from the first game.

 

[Divvy]

Man, Grunt didn't even show up in my game. I got some no named Krogan that got killed.

 

[HK-47]

I thought Grunt living was an enormous cop-out on the part of the ME3 team. Once I *thought* he was going to die, all of a sudden the weight of my decision there hit home and caused me to re-evaluate what I had decided to do. For about 20 seconds until I got the "Grunt lives!" cut scene. It was the closest they had gotten to the Ashley/Kaiden decision from the first game.

but you lose space points for your bar!. But than again the Queen gives you a bunch. And you didnt meet her five minutes ago.

Unless the reapers somehow magicked up a new queen...oh wait!

 

[RoylAsult]

is it neccesasry to play the first 2 games before playing this one? this game looks interesting but i dont feel like playing through 2 other games or playing this one and being lost.

if it is, how long is the main story for the other 2 games? and what about the 3rd?

 

[Doodis]

http://doycetesterman.com/index.php/2012/03/mass-effect-tolkein-and-your-bullshit-artistic-process/

Wow, this sums it all up eloquently. Nicely done.

 

[RedRedSuit]

I thought it was the weakest Mass Effect game by a wide margin, even without taking story in to account.

There were several sidequests that were just multiplayer maps where you play horde mode and press buttons while a disembodied voice talks to you or Cortez explains that the LZ is too hot.

Having not played MP I can't say, but since SP is the main thing, I don't really care if MP uses the same map. That's more of a criticism of MP than SP. Perhaps the MP is lazy in that way, but the SP should be judged on its own terms.

As for the quality of those side quests (basically the N7 ones, I assume), they are OK. They are equally as OK as the ME2 side quests that you get by randomly landing on planets -- except that now there is at least a certain story justification for engaging in them at all. Shallow justification, maybe, but it's there and helps the "random fighting" side quests in this game be better than in the previous 2 games.

The subquest log is crazy broken, uninformative, and the process of getting "missions" by just overhearing characters was poorly thought-out at best.

No argument there. The journal is the worst, laziest decision. However I don't find it to be a major issue... it's easy to get over, like the slow-ass menus in DA: O on the consoles. It sucks, but it isn't major to me.

Encounter design felt worse than ME2. ME2 was at least clear about the fact that you are traveling down a hallway and shooting guys. You used your biotics to stop enemies from flanking you, positioned your teammates, etc. In ME3, you needed the Assault Rifle with Incendiary Ammo and you were mostly fine. To counter-balance this, they gave Cannibals inexplicably large amounts of grenades, they gave Banshees (who teleport and have tons of health) one-hit kill melee moves, and gave Cerberus enemies smokescreens that don't really do anyone any good. These things didn't make the battles any harder, it just made the battles take longer.

I don't really agree with any of this. The battles (playing as solider, at least) were much more fun than in ME2 (and definitely ME1, duh). The hallway factor was way, way reduced. There was actually some openness and verticality to the battle level design, which is pretty much a new thing to the series. I did notice that positioning squad members was a bit less of a factor in this one, but the battles were overall just much more fun.

The reaper minigame on the galaxy map was so poorly thought out and tacked on that I would be legitimately shocked if you told me they added it more than a month before the game went gold. It is especially surprising since Christina Normal pretty explicitly said that scanning in Mass Effect 2 was awful and they regretted that mechanic, but then replaced it with something actually worse.

There is no fucking way that anything on the galaxy map in ME3 is as bad as the ME2 scanning. No fucking way. Whatsoever. Just the sheer amount of time spent scanning planets in ME2 -- alone -- automatically proves this.

Now, on its own terms, the Reaper mini-game is just a little dumb. It's a throw-away. It's inoffensive and easy to ignore. Doesn't mean it's good but just not a major factor (unlike the Mako, or the scanning).

There's more that's not strictly a gameplay problem. The pacing (EARTH IS UNDER ATTACK hold on I have to get involved in this shopkeeper dispute with this customer trying to return something WHY WON'T YOU HELP RIGHT NOW TURIAN COMMANDER MY PEOPLE ARE DYINGGGGGGG), the pretty lame character roster in comparison to previous games, sidequests having event expiration without any indication that they would is always bad game design, War Assets meaning essentially nothing

Some of this is valid; some isn't.

- The pacing is more than adequate. Given the setup it would be hard to make all this totally convincing, but saying something about a shop dispute while running by in the Citadel is fine. It's not like you actually spend time on it. It takes 2 seconds, and you're there anyway -- for real, plot-related reasons. And besides, petty things like that (while incredibly common in ME1 and ME2) were really kept to a minimum. 95% of random stuff in this game was at least nominally connected to the war effort.

- The timed quests are dumb, I agree. But then so are some of the random landings in ME2. It's just filler.

- The character roster is (relatively) lame. That is a serious and valid complaint. However the interaction with this roster is actually quite good. They don't just stay in their rooms on the Normandy and say the same stuff for 3 missions straight. They move around the Normandy and the Citadel, have conversations with each other, etc. It's not as colorful a cast, but interaction with them is handled well.

- War Assets mean something. They affect the ending. If you have low WA, the ending is bleaker. Your squad mates visibly die, Earth gets utterly devastated. Now, do WA affect the ending enough? Probably not. However that is a problem (among many) with the ending -- not with the concept of War Assets or its execution throughout the game. Actual the War Assets concept is one of logically stronger things in this game, and I was surprised at how (relatively) plausible it was given the rather intractable setup of the intro.

 

[Zeliard]

I thought Grunt living was an enormous cop-out on the part of the ME3 team. Once I *thought* he was going to die, all of a sudden the weight of my decision there hit home and caused me to re-evaluate what I had decided to do. For about 20 seconds until I got the "Grunt lives!" cut scene. It was the closest they had gotten to the Ashley/Kaiden decision from the first game.

I totally agree with this. Grunt's a fun guy but when he popped back up, I didn't really have a sense of relief. I had expected that he had died - and in a very appropriate way - and thought it was one of the best scenes in the game. So when he came back up, my reaction wasn't "Yay Grunt!" It was more like "oh come on Bioware."

I did think Grunt overall was more enjoyable in ME3 than in 2, even in his limited screen time. He was just fun to be around. I think he got the short end of the stick in ME2 in terms of strong character development, relative to most of the other new squad members.

 

[HK-47]

I dont remember the mako being a major factor. In main story missions, its always on flat land. Everything else is sidequest.

 

[RedRedSuit]

I totally agree with this. Grunt's a fun guy but when he popped back up, I didn't really have a sense of relief. I had expected that he had died - and in a very appropriate way - and thought it was one of the best scenes in the game. So when he came back up, my reaction wasn't "Yay Grunt!" It was more like "oh come on Bioware."

*shrug* Made me feel good when he survived.

I may be more attached to him due to his hilarious incidental dialog line in Mass Effect 2, in Ilium as some baddies are about to emerge from the elevator.

"Everybody get behind... stuff."

 

[EatChildren]

Grunt has to survive. Shepard is his battlemaster, and he is pure Krogan.

 

[RedRedSuit]

I dont remember the mako being a major factor. In main story missions, its always on flat land. Everything else is sidequest.

Yes, I agree, but some people do see the side quests as a major part of Mass Effect. I mean, the Mako is a major aspect of the game when talking about the Galaxy Map and things that happen from it is what I meant.

 

[Divvy]

I really enjoyed the Mako in ME1, crappy controls and all. It really gave me a sense of exploration that none of the games have been able to match.

I also found the conversation between James and Cortez in the shuttlebay arguing about whether the Mako or the Hammerhead was better, was pretty funny.

 

[RedRedSuit]

I really enjoyed the Mako in ME1, crappy controls and all. It really gave me a sense of exploration that none of the games have been able to match.

It just had crappy mechanics, that's all, and combined with the utter pointlessness of 99% of the random planet landings in ME1 (find a probe, maybe fight random guys, etc.), people's memories of the Mako are just not good.

Exploration concepts in Mass Effect 1 could have worked, but there was so little context or interesting gameplay involved, that it was a waste. Look, no one is perfect... that part of the game was just not baked... but the game had other strengths.

There were some very stunning views on those pointless planets in ME1 though. Like I recall some planet with a giant red star... stunning.

I also found the conversation between James and Cortez in the shuttlebay arguing about whether the Mako or the Hammerhead was better, was pretty funny.

Yep.

 

[Zomba13]

I really enjoyed the Mako in ME1, crappy controls and all. It really gave me a sense of exploration that none of the games have been able to match.

I also found the conversation between James and Cortez in the shuttlebay arguing about whether the Mako or the Hammerhead was better, was pretty funny.

I loved that and that they managed to get a bunch of Makos in the final mission.

 

[rozay]

When I played the Rachni mission, I had remembered reading in the script leak that either Grunt or the Rachni would survive depending on who you chose, and fuck that was a hard decision in game. I was geniunely surprised when Grunt started walking towards the shuttle.

 

[HK-47]

I loved that and that they managed to get a bunch of Makos in the final mission.

Fucking hammerhead.

 

[Derrick01]

I was hoping Grunt was dead since he was just another annoying Krogan, and Krogan are just dudebros in alien form.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

I accept that character deaths sometimes have to be made for the greater good. If you're a paragon Shep, it does (perhaps unintentionally) reflect how much Shepard has grown from Virmire in ME1 that he is willing but sad that he has to lose friends to save the galaxy.

The line between Renegade and Paragon was becoming blurred but still resided on different sides of the same path.

But to compensate for this, Bioware turned Renegade Shepard in to a straight-up psychotic who would happily kill friends. It was unnecessary.

 

[.GqueB.]

I dont remember the mako being a major factor. In main story missions, its always on flat land. Everything else is sidequest.

I remember it being an annoyance if you actually wanted to get everything. There was a lot of awkward mountain climbing involved. But in general, I didn't have that big of a problem with it.

 

[RedRedSuit]

Ha.

 

[chickdigger802]

hmmm I played ME1 on pc... but the Mako wasn't that hard to control if you are 'gentle' with it.

 

[HK-47]

I remember it being an annoyance if you actually wanted to get everything. There was a lot of awkward mountain climbing involved. But in general, I didn't have that big of a problem with it.

Well yes but the same can be said of planet scanning and system scanning. Though the tediousness of system scanning is mostly defeated by looking at the wikia

 

[Divvy]

It just had crappy mechanics, that's all, and combined with the utter pointlessness of 99% of the random planet landings in ME1 (find a probe, maybe fight random guys, etc.), people's memories of the Mako are just not good.

Exploration concepts in Mass Effect 1 could have worked, but there was so little context or interesting gameplay involved, that it was a waste. Look, no one is perfect... that part of the game was just not baked... but the game had other strengths.

There were some very stunning views on those pointless planets in ME1 though. Like I recall some planet with a giant red star... stunning.

Yeah it was deeply flawed, but I still enjoyed it a lot. I actually enjoyed scaling the mountains and tumbling around. The Hammerhead sections in ME2 were pretty good too. It's also that the things they created to replace the Mako sucked so hard.

 

[.GqueB.]

Well yes but the same can be said of planet scanning and system scanning. Though the tediousness of system scanning is mostly defeated by looking at the wikia

I don't think system scanning was in the same world as planet scanning and the mako traversals when it came to annoyance. With the percentages to help you out and the general ease of evading the reapers, it was much much easier to get everything you needed.

 

[- J - D -]

If the Firewalker stuff had been in ME2 from the get-go, I think that would have been a suitable replacement for the Mako missions.

 

[firehawk12]

http://i.imgur.com/hvqlJ.png

Is that the new ending?!

 

[Papercuts]

I accept that character deaths sometimes have to be made for the greater good. If you're a paragon Shep, it does (perhaps unintentionally) reflect how much Shepard has grown from Virmire in ME1 that he is willing but sad that he has to lose friends to save the galaxy.

The line between Renegade and Paragon was becoming blurred but still resided on different sides of the same path.

But to compensate for this, Bioware turned Renegade Shepard in to a straight-up psychotic who would happily kill friends. It was unnecessary.

He doesn't happily do it, you can tell it's eating at him. Joker mentions it's a shame that Mordin died but atleast he cured the genophage. When I shot him and caused it to remain sabotaged, Shep walked away and looked torn up when he agreed. It makes sense storywise to get Salarian, Krogan, and Turian aid at the same time, and it's only something he can get by stopping mordin by any means necessary.

Ashley, who spends the entire game very clearly not trusting you because of Cerberus, is now pointing a gun at you and the only thing in your way from Udina. Shoot her and Udina is an option, because nothing will stop him from getting Udina for the shit he pulled. Legion attacks you if you tell him to not upload the data. Wrex goes after you on the citadel and attacks first. Self defense on these two.

It's much more brutal than the stuff he did before, but the actions seem justified. He's hardly killing people willy nilly. I also am not sure how the Wrex part happens, because after killing Mordin he hasn't shown up on the citadel for me yet.

 

[firehawk12]

He doesn't happily do it, you can tell it's eating at him. Joker mentions it's a shame that Mordin died but atleast he cured the genophage. When I shot him and caused it to remain sabotaged, Shep walked away and looked torn up when he agreed. It makes sense storywise to get Salarian, Krogan, and Turian aid at the same time, and it's only something he can get by stopping mordin by any means necessary.

Ashley, who spends the entire game very clearly not trusting you because of Cerberus, is now pointing a gun at you and the only thing in your way from Udina. Shoot her and Udina is an option, because nothing will stop him from getting Udina for the shit he pulled. Legion attacks you if you tell him to not upload the data. Wrex goes after you on the citadel and attacks first. Self defense on these two.

It's much more brutal than the stuff he did before, but the actions seem justified. He's hardly killing people willy nilly. I also am not sure how the Wrex part happens, because after killing Mordin he hasn't shown up on the citadel for me yet.

What about killing Samara's daughter?

 

[WrenchNinja]

What about killing Samara's daughter?

Potential Banshee.

 

[firehawk12]

Potential Banshee.

Well, maybe that explains why Shepard is shipping 'nac on the Citadel, hanging out with ambassadors and dealing with store returns while Earth burns. Stopping the Reapers is more important than saving Earth!

 

[Papercuts]

What about killing Samara's daughter?

The ardak-yashi thing? He says it's too much of a threat for the reapers to get ahold of her like the other Asari, and make her a banshee. This one is harder to justify though.

 

[Felix Lighter]

I hated what they did with galaxy map in ME 2 and they made it even worse in ME 3. The map in the first game made sense. In the original game, it was a reasonable visual representation of the galaxy and solar systems used to select your destinations.

When you started actually flying a representation of the Normandy on the map, I thought it was goofy but at least you could imagine that it was still just a goofy interface. In the third game, the fact that you are actually avoiding Reapers by dodging and weaving on the galaxy map is absurd. The Normandy can only fly on a flat plane when navigating a system apparently and the scale! I really disliked the gameyness of that and, on top of that, none of the game elements they added to the galaxy map were any fun.

 

[Riposte]

He doesn't happily do it, you can tell it's eating at him. Joker mentions it's a shame that Mordin died but atleast he cured the genophage. When I shot him and caused it to remain sabotaged, Shep walked away and looked torn up when he agreed. It makes sense storywise to get Salarian, Krogan, and Turian aid at the same time, and it's only something he can get by stopping mordin by any means necessary.

At least you now know his murder/sacrifice was worth it. Would have gotten a bad ending if you didn't have Salarian aid!

 

[Infinite Justice]

He doesn't happily do it, you can tell it's eating at him. Joker mentions it's a shame that Mordin died but atleast he cured the genophage. When I shot him and caused it to remain sabotaged, Shep walked away and looked torn up when he agreed. It makes sense storywise to get Salarian, Krogan, and Turian aid at the same time, and it's only something he can get by stopping mordin by any means necessary.

Ashley, who spends the entire game very clearly not trusting you because of Cerberus, is now pointing a gun at you and the only thing in your way from Udina. Shoot her and Udina is an option, because nothing will stop him from getting Udina for the shit he pulled. Legion attacks you if you tell him to not upload the data. Wrex goes after you on the citadel and attacks first. Self defense on these two.

It's much more brutal than the stuff he did before, but the actions seem justified. He's hardly killing people willy nilly. I also am not sure how the Wrex part happens, because after killing Mordin he hasn't shown up on the citadel for me yet.

You have to complete the Rannoch mission then go to the citadel. When on the Citadel, attempt to board the Normandy

 

[EmCeeGramr]

I accept that character deaths sometimes have to be made for the greater good. If you're a paragon Shep, it does (perhaps unintentionally) reflect how much Shepard has grown from Virmire in ME1 that he is willing but sad that he has to lose friends to save the galaxy.

The line between Renegade and Paragon was becoming blurred but still resided on different sides of the same path.

But to compensate for this, Bioware turned Renegade Shepard in to a straight-up psychotic who would happily kill friends. It was unnecessary.

Seeing Renegade videos of ME3 is hilarious, because it confirms what I always felt about Renegades: an eternal parade of a wannabe tough dude shrilly screaming "THIS IS THE HARD DECISION THERE IS NO OTHER OPTION I AM SO TOUGH" and killing people like scrubs, while I'm over here being Space Jesus and Kobayashi-Maruing the fuck out of impossible situations.

 

[Dysun]

I was pretty giddy when I saw Grunt come out of that tunnel alive, it was one of the highlights of the game for me.

I never even used him in ME2, but it was awesome anyway

 

[heliosRAzi]

Seeing Renegade videos of ME3 is hilarious, because it confirms what I always felt about Renegades: an eternal parade of a wannabe tough dude shrilly screaming "THIS IS THE HARD DECISION THERE IS NO OTHER OPTION I AM SO TOUGH" and killing people like scrubs, while I'm over here being Space Jesus and Kobayashi-Maruing the fuck out of impossible situations.

*eats an apple*

 

[Papercuts]

At least you now know his murder/sacrifice was worth it. Would have gotten a bad ending if you didn't have Salarian aid!

yeah, EMS meaning nothing is an undeniably huge flaw. But atleast before you realize the game ends with space magic and RGB renegade shepard's decision atleast all make sense.

You have to complete the Rannoch mission then go to the citadel. When on the Citadel, attempt to board the Normandy

I see, thanks. I'm in the middle of those missions right now.

 

[Bazza]

I was pretty giddy when I saw Grunt come out of that tunnel alive, it was one of the highlights of the game for me.

I never even used him in ME2, but it was awesome anyway

have to agree i was well chuffed to see him make it out, i was gutted when i thought he died as he was my favourite companion in ME2.

 

[Divvy]

I am about to replay the whole saga again and I was wondering if there was any way to make the games save to the cloud so I can play the campaign on any computer? Maybe some sort of the Dropbox shenanigans?

EDIT: crap was going to post this in the other thread.

 

[Giard]

Anybody else thought the ending was kinda Tower of Babel-ish? Everyone comes together to become the strongest they've been, but then are forcefully split apart (Mass Relays exploding). Would go well with the Space Jesus jokes.

 

[Anticitizen One]

Bioware's dumb. The ending should have been shepard crawling from the citadel wreckage on earth, shaking off the dirt and walking off into the sunset while this plays:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcrDWAuyqtc

and then the words "Jack Shepard will return in Mass Effect 4" show on screen