Jake Tower
Banned
Are you pumped the fuck up to go buy DLC right now?
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Mass Effect 3 Spoiler Thread |OT2| Taste the Rainbow
- Thread starter Patryn
- Start date
KingItachi
Member
Had no favorite moment in ME3.
SpacePirate Ridley
Member
I got a fade to black with Tali.
Damn you Bioware. Damn you all.
Yep, only because they are to lazy to create a fucking 3d model without clothes.
At least her romance journey was awesome.
As I said I love how the romance stories were given a full long story intead of a scene, adding other npc interactions and emotive scenes in some of the missions.
I always wanted that from a game so I give huge props for Bioware for finally doing it.
I would love that this type of romance intertactions happen the same way in other games that have them already, like the persona series.
The hypothetical of completely re-writing and re-building the ending requires:
- Conceptualisation.
- Drafting.
- Finalisation of design.
- Scripting and storyboarding.
- Newly recorded dialogue from the two leads and likely others (this alone requires booking, recording, and editing).
- New models, textures, and animations. For both gameplay and cinema scenes.
- All of the above programmed.
- QA.
- Release.
The scope of the best-case-scenario is so large that if it did happen EA would charge for it. Way too much time and money involved.
I know this to be true, and I know how much work it takes to do crap like this (web developer, smaller scale but still get it). For some reason I've always thought this was their intention though and they already have stuff in the works. This IS my hope but its not what lead me to feel this way.
Their intention was pretty much to kill the IP, at least in terms of future games. Hudson literally didn't see 'Mass Effect 4', or any Mass Effect game, taking place after the ending of Mass Effect 3. This is why it hurls the game universe into an abnormal state and why they deliberately left it as vague and open as possible. As far as they were concerned, this was the Mass Effect singularity: the point at which nobody could predict or understand what would come after.
I mean, even Hudson and co wanting this doesn't convince me it would actually stick, especially if fans kept demanding post-game stuff. But yeah, it ends so definitively because that was the intention.
Which is, in turn, completely baffling, and absurdly destructive to your own IP.
Really? I didn't know that. I thought they wanted to continue with ME games, just without Shephard. Or is that is what you are saying, but they just wanted to end it in such a way that they could go anywhere with it? Either way, I think its extremely shitty and they still could have done that while having a decent conclusion. They always just could have done Star Wars and jumped ahead or back on their timeline and made up anything in between.
The scope of the best-case-scenario is so large that if it did happen EA would charge for it. Way too much time and money involved.
Or, just edit like one of the videos on youtube and scrap everything dealing with vent-kid, and finish with the scene of Shepard and Anderson overlooking the battle as the Crucible fires. Yeah... I know they wont do this... for starters it would require Bioware admitting they made a mistake.
As for buying future Mass Effect games, I'm not discarding that for me, but I'll be a lot more cautious. It took a lot (Dragon Age 2 and this ending), but Bioware games are no longer in my "auto-buy" list.
HarryHengst
Member
What a strange thing to say.Had no favorite moment in ME3.
Liara's time capsule is in my top five moments of the game. It's very humbling and I think cleverly played on the player's obvious expectation to beat the Reapers, by humouring the possibility they won't.
It's just too bad they did nothing with it.
Once that part happened, I was certain the Reapers would win no matter what. But of course everything needs a "happy" ending and Space Jesus saves organics with the help of Space Child.
For once I wish a story that had a villain say "your death is inevitable" was actually true.
DarkChronic
Member
I'm a bit baffled by statements like this BUT...good for you. I'm genuinely glad for you. You don't feel like you wasted your money or your time.
I feel the opposite and it sucks.
This is the way I felt about it.
All three choices are "bad", but the DESTROY choice seems to be the only choice with "hope."
Shepard had to make the ultimate sacrifice by destroying all AI/Geth. He's basically restarting everything. But his cycle proved that it was possible to live in peace with AI/synthetics.
So now they are starting from scratch, but the cycles are over. This cycle is different, and judging from the grandpa scene at the end, they did it. That could be thousands of years in the future, but AI/synthetics did not take over.
The original creators of the Reapers were wrong. It is possible to coexist. Shepard's cycle proved it.
Of course, this all goes out the window if you didn't play pure paragon. But anyway, my two cents.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Many times the game, my Margie, Liara, the crew, the ME universe in general will pop up in my head randomly. I could be posting in a completely different thread in the middle of typing up a paragra-...MASS EFFECT. This series and setting won't be topped. The odds of us getting another futuristic sci-fi trilogy of this scope and magnitude, with characters and decisions that carry over from game to game, are tiny. I wonder how many people realize that. We might get some shitty fantasy setting series but a space opera epic like this?
why did it have to be a trilogy...just continue it with me4 for next-gen, what's the big deal about being a trilogy...just fucking make another game and continue the story
why did it have to be a trilogy...just continue it with me4 for next-gen, what's the big deal about being a trilogy...just fucking make another game and continue the story
EmCeeGramr
Member
This is the way I felt about it.
All three choices are "bad", but the DESTROY choice seems to be the only choice with "hope."
Shepard had to make the ultimate sacrifice by destroying all AI/Geth. He's basically restarting everything. But his cycle proved that it was possible to live in peace with AI/synthetics.
So now they are starting from scratch, but the cycles are over. This cycle is different, and judging from the grandpa scene at the end, they did it. That could be thousands of years in the future, but AI/synthetics did not take over.
The original creators of the Reapers were wrong. It is possible to coexist. Shepard's cycle proved it.
Of course, this all goes out the window if you didn't play pure paragon. But anyway, my two cents.
If you played pure Paragon, then it's an even worse slap in the face.
"All synthetics will always try to destroy all organics."
You have no option to refute him if you played a pure Paragon path and point out that you've proven he's wrong, nor the obvious logic in using synthetics to stop organics from making synthetics because synthetics will always try to wipe out all organics. If the Catalyst is wrong, then he and the Reapers have no reason to exist or do what they're doing. There doesn't NEED to be "a new solution" because there is no problem.
Instead you're forced to commit genocide, become a mind-controlling god, or force all life to submit to your will and become partially cybernetic through space magic.
There is no Paragon path.
D
Deleted member 81567
Unconfirmed Member
Many times the game, my Margie, Liara, the crew, the ME universe in general will pop up in my head randomly. I could be posting in a completely different thread in the middle of typing up a paragra-...MASS EFFECT. This series and setting won't be topped. The odds of us getting another futuristic sci-fi trilogy of this scope and magnitude, with characters and decisions that carry over from game to game, are tiny. I wonder how many people realize that. We might get some shitty fantasy setting series but a space opera epic like this?
why did it have to be a trilogy...just continue it with me4 for next-gen, what's the big deal about being a trilogy...just fucking make another game and continue the story
There is no story left.
5. People turning invisible, happened a lot in my game, mainly during convos.
Haha, can't believe I forgot about that.
There's some C-Sec side mission and when you walk in, he's like "Damn, I've been made" or something like that. He was invisible so my Shepard was just talking to a wall the whole time. I couldn't help but burst out laughing.
...just fucking make another game and continue the story
I assume you never beat the game? They can't continue it. There is no story. The Reapers are dealt with and all relays are destroyed. It would take thousands, if not millions of years for them to be re-created. Also, if I'm not mistaken, organics never even fully understood the relays.
The universe is done with. Life isn't fair. Mass Effect isn't going to stay around because we need an epic sci-fi universe. BioWare killed it. It's time to just move on.
KingItachi
Member
What a strange thing to say.
Is it really that strange the game was good but had now wow moments for me.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
I fucking wish they took some cues as to how LotR ended. The journey doesn't stop when the Ring gets destroyed. The journey ends when we've had some time to reflect on what we accomplished.
I mean, it's only the most revered trilogy every, right?
I mean, it's only the most revered trilogy every, right?
Liara's time capsule is in my top five moments of the game. It's very humbling and I think cleverly played on the player's obvious expectation to beat the Reapers, by humouring the possibility they won't.
Absolutely. From that moment on I was expecting at least a worst case scenario ending with a post credits epilogue with some other new civilization finding the capsule. It hurts that there were 4 or 5 absolutely great moments in there when you think: "Bioware really gets it, they really understood what made their universe special," but they threw it all out a window.
If you played pure Paragon, then it's an even worse slap in the face.
"All synthetics will always try to destroy all organics."
You have no option to refute him if you played a pure Paragon path and point out that you've proven he's wrong, nor the obvious logic in using synthetics to stop organics from making synthetics because synthetics will always try to wipe out all organics. If the Catalyst is wrong, then he and the Reapers have no reason to exist or do what they're doing. There doesn't NEED to be "a new solution" because there is no problem.
Instead you're forced to commit genocide, become a mind-controlling god, or force all life to submit to your will and become partially cybernetic through space magic.
There is no Paragon path.
Yeah, it was a hard decision for my Paragon Shep to make, but the only one which was kind of throwing a middle finger to the space kid. If I'm going to condemn everyone I might as well destroy the fucking reapers in the process. You know, the thing I came here to do. Like I said before, I don't think anyone's Shepard would've taken any of the spacekid's bullshit, and that is the worst part of the ending, it renders your character absolutely useless and irrelevant after defying I don't know how many odds.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
There is no story left.
*10 years later*
- Margie's retired and has a family with whoever your love interest was (Liara of course)
- She gets a call and it's Anderson.
- Immediately she knows something is up because she hasn't communicated with him in years outside of exchanging yearly holiday greetings cards.
- Anderson: "Shepard, we need you..."
- Shepard: "Is it the reapers, Anderson? Are they back?"
- Anderson: "No Margie, it's something even worse, if that's even possible."
- Shepard: "Dear god. Anderson, get my crew ready. Shepard out."
- *cue epic music*
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
Throughout the game, Shepard keeps reiterating that whether winning or losing against the Reapers doesn't matter, what matters is that they made a stand.
And then they proceed to UNDERMINE ALL OF THAT.
And then they proceed to UNDERMINE ALL OF THAT.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Haha, can't believe I forgot about that.
There's some C-Sec side mission and when you walk in, he's like "Damn, I've been made" or something like that. He was invisible so my Shepard was just talking to a wall the whole time. I couldn't help but burst out laughing.
I assume you never beat the game? They can't continue it. There is no story. The Reapers are dealt with and all relays are destroyed. It would take thousands, if not millions of years for them to be re-created. Also, if I'm not mistaken, organics never even fully understood the relays.
The universe is done with. Life isn't fair. Mass Effect isn't going to stay around because we need an epic sci-fi universe. BioWare killed it. It's time to just move on.
Use the indoc theory (or some other explanation) and say the relays weren't destroyed, problem solved.
*10 years later*
- Margie's retired and has a family with whoever your love interest was (Liara of course)
- She gets a call and it's Anderson.
- Immediately she knows something is up because she hasn't communicated with him in years outside of exchanging yearly holiday greetings cards.
- Anderson: "Shepard, we need you..."
- Shepard: "Is it the reapers, Anderson? Are they back?"
- Anderson: "No Margie, it's something even worse, if that's even possible."
- Shepard: "Dear god. Anderson, get my crew ready. Shepard out."
- *cue epic music*
..that's worse than the ending
Anderson is dead...or did you miss that part?
"All synthetics will always try to destroy all organics."
You're not understanding things correctly. He does not say "All synthetics will always try to destroy organics" at all. He says synthetics will. There is a huge difference in those statements.
You have no option to refute him if you played a pure Paragon path and point out that you've proven he's wrong, nor the obvious logic in using synthetics to stop organics from making synthetics because synthetics will always try to wipe out all organics.
The reapers aren't "stopping organics from making synthetics" they are preserving organics forever within them.
I fucking wish they took some cues as to how LotR ended. The journey doesn't stop when the Ring gets destroyed. The journey ends when we've had some time to reflect on what we accomplished.
I mean, it's only the most revered trilogy every, right?
You were expecting something as contemplative and subtle as the LotR ending? I wish.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
..that's worse than the ending
Anderson is dead...or did you miss that part?
indoc theory genius
could have dreamed/illusioned anderson dying
And of course the brilliant writers could flesh out my intro to ME4
You're not understanding things correctly. He does not say "All synthetics will always try to destroy organics" at all. He says synthetics will. There is a huge difference in those statements.
The reapers aren't "stopping organics from making synthetics" they are preserving organics forever within them.
By turning them into paste to make a horrific genocide machine.
WrenchNinja
Member
You see, its all very noble.
Use the indoc theory (or some other explanation) and say the relays weren't destroyed, problem solved.
I guess this would actually work.
We blew up a relay and destroyed a whole system in ME2. Yet when we do it in ME3, nothing happens. They pretty much did this with the Reapers as well.
ME1: "We have no creator" .."We have no beginning, we have no end. We simply, are."
ME3: LOLJK space kid created us because he was bored
Obviously BioWare doesn't care about their own story elements so why the hell not..
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
You were expecting something as contemplative and subtle as the LotR ending? I wish.
That's why the time capsule was so great. It makes you think about both story elements and moment to moment game play.
Yeah, Shepard saved the Citadel, we remember that, but we also remember that she, Wrex, and Garrus cut through hundreds of Geth to do it.
It's that experience that only games can create.
I hope Bioware chooses to subtract/delete the current ending: Not only is it intrinsically abhorrent, but it also destroys any future sequels, because the whole IP has been altered beyond any recognition.
And I don't want some prequel Mass Effect. It's like with pre-ending DLC: If I know what my actions amount to in the end, I won't give a fuck.
And I don't want some prequel Mass Effect. It's like with pre-ending DLC: If I know what my actions amount to in the end, I won't give a fuck.
Jake Tower
Banned
And I'm preserving cows inside me by grinding them into hamburger and eating them.The reapers aren't "stopping organics from making synthetics" they are preserving organics forever within them.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
by the way,
do we know how well ODST and Reach did compared to Halo 3?
do we know how well ODST and Reach did compared to Halo 3?
Barack Lesnar
Banned
A prequel would be a slap in the face and something I wouldn't be looking forward to at all given what we know happens in ME3. No motivation to play it. I have a feeling they'll go the prequel route for next-gen... very confident about it actually.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
That stupid space kid.
What really bothers me is that they don't let my Shepard argue his point with the space kid.
Ah but we already know that BioWare wanted to remove the defining game play mechanic from the ending.
by the way,
do we know how well ODST and Reach did compared to Halo 3?
Both are less than Halo 3
Ah but we already know that BioWare wanted to remove the defining game play mechanic from the ending.
Gotta keep it high-level after all.
EmCeeGramr
Member
"The created will always rebel against their creators."You're not understanding things correctly. He does not say "All synthetics will always try to destroy organics" at all. He says synthetics will. There is a huge difference in those statements.
That is an all-inclusive statement. It includes all synthetics.
The reapers aren't "stopping organics from making synthetics" they are preserving organics forever within them.
Yes. To stop them from making synthetics.
I should have kept going with Liara, Traynor apparantely wasn't very interested in my Femshep. Maybe I yelled at her at some point, I never got the option during "game night".yeah that was the stand out scene for me too, the part where she looks at you and then the window and then back to you was so lifelike it was amazing
this part: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=kaxMZLt9S-o#t=57s
I hope Bioware chooses to subtract/delete the current ending: Not only is it intrinsically abhorrent, but it also destroys any future sequels, because the whole IP has been altered beyond any recognition.
And I don't want some prequel Mass Effect. It's like with pre-ending DLC: If I know what my actions amount to in the end, I won't give a fuck.
I find this kind of funny. Don't most gamers have a problem with endless sequels and going at the same IP over and over again? But now the problem is that they haven't opened it up to more sequels?
And I'm preserving cows inside me by grinding them into hamburger and eating them.
Right, because that's totally the same thing. Derp.
"The created will always try to destroy their creator."
That is an all-inclusive statement. It includes all synthetics.
It doesn't include every single synthetic ever in existence on a micro scale. The phrase is on a macro scale. It's a big picture sort of thing.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Prequel just seems like something they'd do. There's been similar situations in other forms of media like movies and television. The Hobbit is a good example. I'm sure it'll be good but it'll never live up to the LotR movies. Most people don't really want prequels in general. I don't have any stats to back that up but it feels that way.I hope Bioware chooses to subtract/delete the current ending: Not only is it intrinsically abhorrent, but it also destroys any future sequels, because the whole IP has been altered beyond any recognition.
And I don't want some prequel Mass Effect. It's like with pre-ending DLC: If I know what my actions amount to in the end, I won't give a fuck.
When you're talking about shit like Call of Duty, yeah. This is different.I find this kind of funny. Don't most gamers have a problem with endless sequels and going at the same IP over and over again? But now the problem is that they haven't opened it up to more sequels?
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
Both are less than Halo 3
So, the take away is that a.) no Multi-player multiplier for the ME series b.) Halo 3 didn't revile its fans so much that they're petitioning to get it changed.
Good luck with that BioWare.
I find this kind of funny. Don't most gamers have a problem with endless sequels and going at the same IP over and over again? But now the problem is that they haven't opened it up to more sequels?
Right, because that's totally the same thing. Derp.
I hate Shepard. I like the universe.
EmCeeGramr
Member
It doesn't include every single synthetic ever in existence on a micro scale. The phrase is on a macro scale. It's a big picture sort of thing.
It's still wrong though. (and I think you're giving them WAAAAAY too much of a benefit of the doubt here)
It's still wrong though. (and I think you're giving them WAAAAAY too much of a benefit of the doubt here)
Look at the technology behind the reapers. It is at least millions upon millions of years more advanced than anything in the galaxy. You're not going to give the benefit of the doubt on the way things work on a galactic scale to those who've been around a lot longer than you could ever possibly fathom? And they further get benefit because they are synthetics making an assertion about synthetics. You are an organic being trying to put your reason and likely naive hope to the actions of a synthetic.
My favourite moment? When Kalros took the destroyer reaper down during one of the main missions on Tuchanka.
Hell yes. Probably my favorite moment in the series.
Still, people in general want fresh, new IPs. This is really one of the first instances where a large complaint has been levied that it doesn't have room for sequels. Which is especially weird, too, because wasn't this supposed to be a trilogy? Meaning there really never was necessarily supposed to be room for another one.When you're talking about shit like Call of Duty, yeah. This is different.
I mean I know EA's not dumb and will likely give us something in the ME universe, but still. That complaint is rather odd.
Freeza Under The Shower
Member
A prequel would be a slap in the face and something I wouldn't be looking forward to at all given what we know happens in ME3. No motivation to play it. I have a feeling they'll go the prequel route for next-gen... very confident about it actually.
I fear that the guy who suggested the MMO is right on the money.
Weekes mentioned that he and the other staff have no idea where the cutscenes they talked about -and possible even made to some extent- had gone, the leads took control of the ending out of nowhere, co-founder comes along with 'artistic integrity' (how high do you have to be fall for that?), endings are all the same, clearly setting up a 'in between' stage, one of the endings is an almost direct reference to the Matrix Online where Neo turned out to have survived the ending of Revolutions.
Actually, just look at the ending and compare it with the Matrix Online and you'll see quite clear why an MMO seems to have been the intent (which at this point would also be like admitting to have ruined the ending on purpose, so they might silently cancel that one).
Also note that Bioware was also working on a FPS prototype in the ME universe, which only further suggests that the ending is made to facilitate future games and not cut them off.
How Bioware actually had time for all this shit is what bothers me a bit, to be honest. I know the label is expanded like crazy, but I wonder how much of this went on to impede progress on the game, instead of helping it forward.
And I'm preserving cows inside me by grinding them into hamburger and eating them.
that's the other thing that bothers me about the ending: this series has been all about SCALE. Yet spending millions of years doing NOTHING is suddenly retroactively forced in there by the ending. It completely bypasses one of the main themes of the series. And for what? For no apparent reason. That's not "high concept", that's just rubbish. Just because something looks pretty doesn't mean it can't be rotten to the core.
EmCeeGramr
Member
Look at the technology behind the reapers. It is at least millions upon millions of years more advanced than anything in the galaxy. You're not going to give the benefit of the doubt on the way things work on a galactic scale to those who've been around a lot longer than you could ever possibly fathom? And they further get benefit because they are synthetics making an assertion about synthetics. You are an organic being trying to put your reason and likely naive hope to the actions of a synthetic.
So, if they're synthetics who have been around for billions of years and have hundreds of thousands of members, why haven't they succumbed to this macro-scale law of the universe yet?
(also I was referring to the BioWare writing staff that you were giving too much credit to, lol)
ElectricBlue187
Member
I cannot see how Bioware could rewrite the ending. Its sticking your arm into a viper's nest and its more trouble than its worth. They will clarify some things probably in DLC form and move on
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Wow, never thought of that. How could Bioware have the time and resources to juggle 2 massive MMOs like that... what a huge gamble that would be.I fear that the guy who suggested the MMO is right on the money.
Weekes mentioned that he and the other staff have no idea where the cutscenes they talked about -and possible even made to some extent- had gone, the leads took control of the ending out of nowhere, co-founder comes along with 'artistic integrity' (how high do you have to be fall for that?), endings are all the same, clearly setting up a 'in between' stage, one of the endings is an almost direct reference to the Matrix Online where Neo turned out to have survived the ending of Revolutions.
Actually, just look at the ending and compare it with the Matrix Online and you'll see quite clear why an MMO seems to have been the intent (which at this point would also be like admitting to have ruined the ending on purpose, so they might silently cancel that one).
Also note that Bioware was also working on a FPS prototype in the ME universe, which only further suggests that the ending is made to facilitate future games and not cut them off.
How Bioware actually had time for all this shit is what bothers me a bit, to be honest. I know the label is expanded like crazy, but I wonder how much of this went on to impede progress on the game, instead of helping it forward.
Jake Tower
Banned
It would have been better if Maud'dib, er, Shepard was riding on its back.My favourite moment? When Kalros took the destroyer reaper down during one of the main missions on Tuchanka.
Wow, never thought of that. How could Bioware have the time and resources to juggle 2 massive MMOs like that... what a huge gamble that would be.
Bioware is now a huge label with lots of dev teams under its wing. Also I kinda doubt the MMO since it clashes with SWTOR in theme and demographic too much.
WrenchNinja
Member
Are there any third person shooter mmos?