I wonder if Mantis could read Ocelots mind so thoroughly that he would know it wasn't really Liquid?
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Metal Gear Solid V SPOILER THREAD| [EXTR3ME] Such a lust for conclusion, T-WHHOOOO
- Thread starter MMarston
- Start date
I wonder if Mantis could read Ocelots mind so thoroughly that he would know it wasn't really Liquid?
GodzillaDB
Member
According the final timeline crawl, Big Boss managed to build the Outer Heaven fortress while discreetly operating as the FOXHOUND commander back in the States. On the other hand, it wouldn't be too surprising if the embers of Zanzibar Land were already in place as a contingency plan. He presumably allowed Venom Snake/Diamond Dogs to resume combat operations in his absence in a futile effort to draw heat away from its existence. Indeed, I don't quite understand how the true identity of the Outer Heaven CO isn't a well known fact when Venom Snake is the splitting image of a renowned soldier. I'm guessing it's possible Big Boss ousted his phantom as an imposter to preserve his role as a double agent within the American military, but whether Solid Snake was aware of the doppelganger has been another element that I wish was clarified. Ultimately, I think the decoy twist convoluted the subsequent canon more so than it complemented.
Miller was likely infected with an alternate form of the parasites, much like those utilized in the Cobra Unit experiments, and I'm certain he was contaminated without his immediate knowledge. However, the resulting symptom of his strain must've ultimately backfired in the overall arc of the narrative canon. As lackluster as it might sound, Miller's infection could've been designed to simply render him visually impaired, but his heightened survival skills allowed to excel beyond the handicap. Personally, I'm beginning to believe the "Eyes on Kazuhira" scene might've just been an acknowledgement that the ending epilogue between Ocelot and Miller had already taken place instead of casting probability of him being infected. Code Talker's forewarning could be a passing nod to Miller acting differently in light of discovering the true intentions of Big Boss. Additionally, the biologist mutters that Ocelot's "aim [was] off today" which could signify that his self-hypnosis had previously worn off which, subsequently, allowed him to reveal the truth of Venom Snake to the Mother Base XO.
It's an optional subplot, you can start it by going through the one open (blue) door on the medical platform.
Benzychenz
Member
That's weird, each mission in chapter 2 unlocked for me after 1 or 2 side ops.
GodzillaDB
Member
Her appearance has been relegated to an optional side-quest pertaining to the ten wandering MSF soldier side-ops. You can trigger a series of cutscenes connected with Paz by accessing the blue-lit doorway on the second floor of the medical platform. A new cinematic unlocks for each mission that you complete, but you'll have to wait twenty-fours in-game before you can access the next one. Utilize the forward progression of the phantom cigar for best results on the chance you'd like to see them sequentially. I'll toss in a special tip by stating the final memento required to bookend her side-story is posted along the hallway leading to her room.
Was it day time in the flashback? I think Ground Zeroes explicitly makes it night time when you go back to Mother Base, right?
So I listened to the Truth tapes last night. They were fucking great. Loved hearing Zero again (Even though it's a different but alike voice actor of MGS3). So much exposition! Just like the time lines at the end. Listening to them makes me bummed out even more we didn't get a lot of overarching Metal Gear story (The Patriots, Les Enfants Terribles, Zero). Would have liked it much more.
Is it bad I kind of want a remade MGS4 without all the nanomachine nonsense? Too bad we can't get rid of the hypnosis because fucking Ocelot just had to go and be a magician in this game.
GodzillaDB
Member
Cyborg
Member
Guys,
I have finished the game, got the true ending and so on.
I have two questions
1. I see a lot hidden trophies, is there a list somewehere how to obtain them? I realy dont see what I have missed (one of them was Hero)
2. Showed alle pictures to Pazz (except 1) where can I find this?
I have finished the game, got the true ending and so on.
I have two questions
1. I see a lot hidden trophies, is there a list somewehere how to obtain them? I realy dont see what I have missed (one of them was Hero)
2. Showed alle pictures to Pazz (except 1) where can I find this?
Cyborg
Member
Thanx.
Since the launch I have been playing offline. If I want to create a Nuke I need to play online (FOB)?
Benzychenz
Member
Kojima spent two years playing around with Quiet on his computer and got fired for it.
Cyborg
Member
They spoiled the whole game in the trailers
I'm pretty sure you can develop it offline. It's an option in your resources menu from the iDroid.
Cyborg
Member
What? Realy? Where? I dont see it? I also didnt send out my Metal Gear cause I cant find the option. So I assumed both are for Online
Benzychenz
Member
The mini metal gear thing is just for the dispatch missions sadly.
Nukes should be the very last tab in your resources menu. If it's not there maybe you do need to connect online, I couldn't tell you because I've been online from the very start
Haunted
Member
The Battle Gear has nothing to do with online, you need it to complete certain yellow-dotted S-rank combat deployments.
Well, not yet. It'd be a shame to let all the work they did on it go to waste; when it could be a perfect piece of paid MGO equipment. For balance reasons, it shouldn't be able to be bought outright, so maybe something like renting it for $0.99 per match could work?
Late reply, but I more mean as an actual on screen character in PW and V. Have the peeps on NeverBeGameOver climbed off the ledge yet? They frighten me.
Cyborg
Member
Can someone help me out?
1. Did I understand it correctly that the real Big Boss left a message for Venom?
2. Zero knew there were two Snakes, the real one and Venom? Why go through all the trouble to hide BB from Cipher when he knew the whole time?
3. How did Cipher survive while SkullFace did something to him?
4. What is up with Millers eyes? Liquid killed him and not the parasites. How is this possible
1. Did I understand it correctly that the real Big Boss left a message for Venom?
2. Zero knew there were two Snakes, the real one and Venom? Why go through all the trouble to hide BB from Cipher when he knew the whole time?
3. How did Cipher survive while SkullFace did something to him?
4. What is up with Millers eyes? Liquid killed him and not the parasites. How is this possible
1-Yep, the final tape
2-Yep, he helped on orchestrating the whole doppleganger thing.
3-If for Cipher you mean Zero, he was basically KO until MGS4 when BB pulled the plug on him.
4- Probably plot hole. The game hints he could be blind, but still he looks for eye contact in basically every cutscene of the game.
1. Yes he did
2. Zero developed the Venom project to protect BB.
3. Expert medical team on staff, also known as this is a prequel and he is alive during MGS4.
4. Nothing is wrong with his eyes, probably. The parasites are basically inert because of the injection he received/don't think about how this game fits in with the rest of the series too much.
I think a $1.99 per match sounds more fair don't you?
He obviously has parasites if you take a moment to compare his eyes to CT and Skulls, his eyes are fine when you first get to him.
That wasn't the most serious response. I agree with you that Huey was definitely one of the characters who really didn't need to be expanded on - his cameo in 3 was already a little too much (though the ambiguity at the time as to whether they were referring to Huey or his father who had already been established as a Manhattan Project scientist in MGS1 helped things a little); but his Peace Walker appearance was completely unnecessary. I liked his portrayal here a little bit more, but his whole plot with Strangelove was just as contrived. Overall, the character is a perfect example of the prequel games' tendency towards world-shrinking, along with Null.
Also, Never Be Game Over jumped off that ledge a long time ago. I think they're just festering now, as opposed to sinking any lower.
I guess it'd only be fair to make it $1.99, in the interest of keeping the game properly balanced for the entire userbase. Players might feel like such an insignificant price would devalue the thing they've spent so much time and effort building in the singleplayer game - though the first two or three uses should still be at $0.99, just to get people used to relying on it. There'd have to be bundle prices for 5, 15, 25, 50 and 99 matches, as well - I can imagine the garish, iridescent BEST VALUE text already.
I know, I also pointed this preaviously, but he shouldn't be blind at all, since he looks for eye contact.
It's a thing left unsolved at best.
I guess the consensus is that he meant the v jay jay bomb
Because the kid soldiers weren't really a topic at all
Probably regarding releasing unfinished games and spending 7 years to develop 150 side missions.
Haunted
Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyz_2DEah4o
Put on as soon as the helicopter speakers were installed, the tape never left the chopper.
fixed
Thanks for the info! I'll check this out.
Still pretty bummed about Quiet. Didn't even have a chance to equip the Sniper Wolf outfit because I kept forgetting.
Honestly, I feel the point was never whether it was "really liquid or not" and the point was that it was just "Liquid in spirit" in an ambiguous sense, and that the literal details didn't matter, because it "was Liquid". It's all about inheriting his will and all of that, I feel. It's not really ocelot until the final moments, and that's supposed to be what's important in the end. (Interesting: You can also see the Sorrow in a hidden R1 bit during the mantis "defeat" scene)
I'm on a second runthrough. Does just having the butterfly emblem on the front slot keep quiet from going byebye?
Oldest Snake
Member
Child soldiers, probably.
The first images of MGSV had the player character as a little kid in Africa (though I'm willing to concede that may have had nothing to do with MGS), the 'Sins of the Father' trailer has 2 cutscenes of the child soldiers that were cut from the game and final product has BB/Kaz go out of their way to say they're rescuing & rehabilitating them, NOT recruiting them to Diamond Dogs.
Considering that part of the legacy of Big Boss involves his use of child soldiers it's a no brainer to assume that this element of MGSV was completely removed.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Kinda cross posting here...
I thought it was Child Soldiers.
Then I thought it was because he sort of touched on the 'AIDS is man made' conspiracy theory, but I don't that is all that taboo.
Now I think it is the fact that he is talking about the English Language as a parasite, as analogous with globalization and American imperialism, and as a destroyer of civilisations and cultures. Like, Code Talker and Skull Face go all out in slamming it. That's a pretty bold statement for a video game to make, I think, and I can understand why someone from Japan might think that a taboo subject.
He is unambiguously saying that the English language's dominance is a cultural dead end. He equates thinking and our understanding of the world with language (a la Sapir-Whorf) and, in those terms, he is basically attacking the foundations of Western Thought and equating it with a parasite.
There is some irony then that this was the game meant to appeal to more Western, English-Speaking audiences.
Inferno313
Banned
Yeah, I think that and the whole idea of an "Ethnic Cleansing" of English-Speakers are what he was talking about. As someone who has worked on my own short films before, it's easy as the creator to over-worry about taboo topics and offending people than your work actually will.
Berserker976
Member
You might need to go back to some of the Code Talker tapes. Code Talker says that he started out thinking the same thing, but then acknowledges the benefits of a lingua franca, he's far more measured in his opinions than you claim.
The other character you list is Skull Face, who is presented as a clear villain. It's not really a taboo for villains to espouse things like that. I mean 80% of rpgs involve a scene where the villain talks about how humanity is a plague.
And regardless of all that, I really don't think it's an idea that any reasonable person would consider "taboo." I think it's far more likely the taboo stuff was either the stuff in GZ, which I think he absolutely flubbed, or it was cut entirely from the game.
Screaming Meat, I love ya fella, but I think this is a far too intelligent interpretation of MGSV and that particular quote. This would be a brilliant idea to explore, but Kojima isn't capable of this level of depth.
The social taboo Kojima was referring to was probably Quiet.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
Haha! I'm pretty sure he does explore/discuss that though!
Love you too, babe.
Also: MGS2?
I'm pretty sure Code Talker shows a lot of resentment toward the English Language, his later face-heel turn on the subject aside.
I don't think "humanity is a plague" is equivalent, really. You're comparing Kojima's rather unique and detailed polemic to a trite, overused crutch trope that is hardly (if at all) justified or expanded on in any detail. "Humanity is a plague" is often shorthand for "I want to kill everyone", not quite as nuanced, I don't think.
It doesn't matter who says it. You and I are both aware that Kojima uses his games and their characters to express and/or criticise political and philosophical opinions and positions. He's not even subtle about it!
All I'm saying is, I'd think twice about writing a story aimed at a Japanese market that suggests that their language (and by extension the entire foundations of their thinking and understanding of the world) is a destructive virus and cultural dead end.
I could be wrong, of course, but yeah, that was broadly speaking my reading of it.
Roni
Gold Member
Awful arrogant of you to say someone who has spearheaded the game industry for years is incapable of saying something that is already in the game and is being yelled at your face for most of the second half of chapter 1.
Inferno313
Banned
I dunno. I think that theme is pretty blatantly explored. If that Skullface Jeep Ride was in a film, a lot of critics would tear into it for being too on the nose if anything. It's literally a 5 minute monologue about this idea.
Lionheart1827
Member
Kind of related, I was secretly hoping and expecting that when the Sins of the Father song was playing, when it got to the final "whoaa OHHHHHHHHHH" section that pequod and other Diamond Dogs helicopters would launch missiles at the vehicles in front of you and cause chaos. but nope, just more driving and staring. I was pretty let down by that. The whole game I was hoping for the song to be used in a poignant cut scene or something awesome like a final battle but it got relegated to a jeep ride stare down. At least we have the first trailer
Berserker976
Member
But, this is pretty much my point. He isn't breaking any new ground with this theme. In MGS2, The Patriots were the literal embodiment of modern American ideals and cultural sentiment. He does this sort of thing in all of his games, why would it suddenly be considered breaking some huge taboo?
Inferno313
Banned
Kind of related, I was secretly hoping and expecting that when the Sins of the Father song was playing, when it got to the final "whoaa OHHHHHHHHHH" section that pequod and other Diamond Dogs helicopters would launch missiles at the vehicles in front of you and cause chaos. but nope, just more driving and staring. I was pretty let down by that. The whole game I was hoping for the song to be used in a poignant cut scene or something awesome like a final battle but it got relegated to a jeep ride stare down. At least we have the first trailer
I agree. I think that song played there could've been poignant, that scene just needed a bit more direction and time in the cooker. Feels like Kojima wanted to push for Last of Us style
cutscenes that don't break significantly from the gameplay, but even some simple directorial flourishes could've made that sequence work.
Something as simple as pulling the camera up and back during the final "WhoaaOOOHHH" to give us a huge wide shot of the tiny little jeep pulling into the base with Sally towering over all would've given the song and scene a lot more impact.
Screaming Meat
Unconfirmed Member
I was talking about the medium there, not the message; what he is saying, not the method he used to say it. The "messages" of the two games aren't the same, so I'm not sure how what you quoted proves your point.
BTW, I'd say that last question would be more accurate if you rephrased it to: why would he consider it some huge taboo?
Berserker976
Member
I was talking about both. He uses characters to deliver these types of messages, and the message in MGS2 is similarly, or perhaps even more provocative than the one in MGSV.
I don't see why presenting English as villainous in MGSV is any more controversial than presenting the American government as manipulative asshole villains in MGS3.
Roni
Gold Member
Not sure the question applies, I doubt he was talking about this theme when he said the game contained something controversial.