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Milo Yiannopoulos's UC Berkeley speech cancelled due to protests, campus on lockdown

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Condom

Member
Milo: I'm obviously not the racist or sexist guy that they claim that I am

L M A O

I mean which one of the dudes getting attacked by a mob she's yelling at isn't really my issue and it certainly looks like the guy on the ground is out cold and hit a few times before that other guy stops them.

Yeah my bad he did get hit twice or so.
 

Plumbob

Member
How many people are worth hurting to stop hate speech? Can someone help me establish an exchange rate? Is it 3 people to 10 bad ideas?
 

Magus1234

Member
Well then let's all be sure we take the right side, then - the people protesting and protecting their communities and schools against the violent ideology of fascism and not the police and university who give the fash platform and permission to propagate - because this sort of thing is not going to stop and you're going to see more and more of it. It's time to start looking at our reactions to violence and our notions about non-violence, because it's clear that structural (and literal) violence exists whether or not we participate in it and the people have a right to defend themselves from it. This is some shit we on the left really need to think about right now.

The University, by the way, and in particular the Univ. of California and its dedicated police force, are already well-equipped to punish activists, and has a long history of doing so. I should know, I've been detained and harassed by them, been put on a list, and I never smashed a damn thing!

Very proud of the people over there tonight.

¡No Pasarán!
The right side can make the wrong moves, the actual institution this protest was held is a defense to the spread of that ideology. If education is failing or people can not afford education, politicians are not making statements and peaceful protests have no effect, laws are not accommodating and you have done and exhausted every alternative to fight what continues to spread, then yes it seems a revolution in some sense is needed. But if people are just taking the law into their own hands and attacking people outside of the law, that is going to backfire and from the person shot earlier at a Milo event it seems like it already has.

In some cases non-violence requires more militancy than violence. Cesar Chavez
 

Doc Holliday

SPOILER: Columbus finds America
what does very anti pc consist of and if you're so annoyed at the barrage of constant outrage on social media why continue to use it or why not simply refuse to engage with that content. i don't really understand the feeling of being constantly bombarded by these political correctness / outrage forces.

You're not the one who had to remodel characters because people on social media didn't like the proportions of female characters :)
 

Madame M

Banned
It's ironic for right wingers like Milo who preach about individual responsibility as the answer to every problem forget about the idea of individual responsibility when it comes to a few bad actors in a protest of ~1000 people to paint the entire group as bad and destructive. Why yes, the entirety of the protest and by extension the entire left-wing of the body politic is crazy because one guy set a light on fire....
 

watershed

Banned
I don't like violence, I don't approve of violence. But I also don't live a privileged enough life to believe for a second that violence is 100% unacceptable even in the defense of what's right. Hate speech isn't inconsequential. Not challenging hate speech leads to its growth and acceptable. It leads to Trump. It has very real consequences.

I'm not able to pretend that violence has never helped the cause of justice or that violence should only be the weapon of the powerful.
 

Alucrid

Banned
You're not the one who had to remodel characters because people on social media didn't like the proportions of female characters :)

wouldn't mind seeing the before / after because frankly i think a lot of designs for female characters are bad and wouldn't mind them being reworked. not out of some sense of outrage or political correctness, but as a matter of taste.
 

Cipherr

Member
But if people are just taking the law into their own hands and attacking people outside of the law, that is going to backfire and from the person shot earlier at a Milo event it seems like it already has.

Last I checked on that matter both the shooter and the person shot were alt right folk.

I like your tolerant attitude toward freedom of speech.
Cheers.

And I like laughing at grown ass men who don't actually know what freedom of speech means. Pro tip: It doesn't mean I have to listen to a fucking thing you or Milo have to say. Use the same device you typed that reply on to look up "Freedom of Speech" so that you don't misuse it again in the future.

Cheers.
 

Bl@de

Member
Those Antifa people are criminals and nothing else. Dressing up in black with masks and attacking people with poles and pepperspray. Oh, and destroying property of others and public institutions.

Demonstrate all you want. Make your own events were you speak up against Milo and others. But anyone who is supporting actions like that is not better than those criminals.
 

Magus1234

Member
From the lawyer of the guy shot,

“My client isn’t interested in using the apparatus of the state to punish the individual,” Lippek said. “He’d like to engage in dialogue and a restorative justice process.”

Pretty admirable if you ask me. I know a lot of people will consider it a lost cause and part of me does too, but I admire the fact that he wants a dialogue to take place.
 

Madame M

Banned
Make your own events were you speak up against Milo and others.

They did make their own event tonight, opportunistic anarchists just took advantage when they heard there was a protest going on and showed up to these things like they always do.

It's a shame the anarchist agitators never showed up to those tea party events, you would think anarchists would be all about that too.
 

Bl@de

Member
They did make their own event tonight, opportunistic anarchists just took advantage when they heard there was a protest going on and showed up to these things like they always do.

It's a shame the anarchist agitators never showed up to those tea party events, you would think anarchists would be all about that too.

And that's why everyone has to speak up against those anarchists. Doesn't matter if you voted Trump, Hillary, Stein or Johnson. They don't help anyone and just want chaos. But the sad truth is, that I see a lot of acceptance from Anti-Trump people for things like that.
 
How many people are worth hurting to stop hate speech? Can someone help me establish an exchange rate? Is it 3 people to 10 bad ideas?

Since we're offering such rhetorical questions, I offer a counter-question, based partially on another available thread: How many have to die before a civil unjustice is deemed a problem?

If people are dying because of the results of discussion and ideology, where does the line fall?

If violent action is never okay - and again, I've already said I believe it was a problem in this case - then how do you square that with instances where violent action lead to great, positive societal change?
 
No one cares what the fuckwit has to say.

If that were true he wouldn't be making a living off being a real world internet troll. I may be wrong, but if people had allowed him to show up to these campuses and speak to his room full of 10 MRA fanboys, he wouldn't be 1/100th of what he is now. Tonight just made him richer by who knows how much.
 
If that were true he wouldn't be making a living off being a real world internet troll. I may be wrong, but if people had allowed him to show up to these campuses and speak to his room full of 10 MRA fanboys, he wouldn't be 1/100th of what he is now. Tonight just made him richer by who knows how much.

Nonsense...

How can you get mad at me for saying no one gives a fuck and then claim if we just let him talk only 10 people would show up.

And no one here gives a fuck is my context, as in don't post his bullshit videos.


Taking him off Twitter also made him richer but fuck him it was the right thing to do.

When he speaks he encourages harassment of real life people, so fuck him it is the right thing to do.

In short fuck him.
 

Madame M

Banned
And that's why everyone has to speak up against those anarchists. Doesn't matter if you voted Trump, Hillary, Stein or Johnson. They don't help anyone and just want chaos. But the sad truth is, that I see a lot of acceptance from Anti-Trump people for things like that.

I voted for the Legal Marijuana Now Party candidate, those four people suck balls (and not the good kind of ball sucking). I'm not sure how speaking up against anarchist agitators is going to do much to convince the agitators to not commit random acts of violence and destruction with black masks on in relative anonymity, if anything it will encourage them. Kind of reminds me of the belief that all we need to do is educate folks on why Islamic extremism is bad when actual Muslim extremists laugh and use it as propaganda about the west hating Islam in general. It doesn't work. Luckily most people generally understand that violence and breaking shit is a no-no.
 
How many people are worth hurting to stop hate speech? Can someone help me establish an exchange rate? Is it 3 people to 10 bad ideas?
Hate speech has real consequences for people who have done nothing. If punching a Nazi means the people shot up in the Canadian mosque are still alive right now, is it so bad to punch the Nazi?

If that were true he wouldn't be making a living off being a real world internet troll. I may be wrong, but if people had allowed him to show up to these campuses and speak to his room full of 10 MRA fanboys, he wouldn't be 1/100th of what he is now. Tonight just made him richer by who knows how much.
Where is the proof of this? These people were powerful long before now. He encourages and spreads dangerous ideas, and by leaving them unchallenged we've let them fester into a serious problem. How long have we said "don't read the comments section because it's a festering pile of filth" while ignoring the fact that the people posting on those were real people who retreated to white nationalist communities where they get radicalized?
 

SmZA

Member
And that's why everyone has to speak up against those anarchists. Doesn't matter if you voted Trump, Hillary, Stein or Johnson. They don't help anyone and just want chaos. But the sad truth is, that I see a lot of acceptance from Anti-Trump people for things like that.

I think this is secretly why the Women's Marches were successful where something like "Resist Trump" would not have been. Black Bloc types are almost universally young and male and while not necessarily misogynist in themselves, tend to stay away from events that don't tacitly stroke their egos.
 
Just gonna leave this truth bomb here

O5DuR3t.jpg
Austin Walker is the man.
 

rjinaz

Member
White man gets shut down by protestors, people scream freedom of speech and cry intolerance.

Black man get choked to death by a cop for selling loose cigs and those same people are no where to be found.

I posted the Eric Garner story on my facebook and it was completely ignored by my family. Those same people are up in a rage about this man being silenced.

This is what America is now. It's as Black and White as it always has been, just people are better at hiding it.
 

The_Kid

Member
Someone on my timeline compared this to a book burning. Like, what?

People know he spent the one in Wisconsin harassing a trans student, right?
 
White man gets shut down by protestors, people scream freedom of speech and cry intolerance.

Black man get choked to death by a cop for selling loose cigs and those same people are no where to be found.

I posted the Eric Garner story on my facebook and it was completely ignored by my family. Those same people are up in a rage about this man being silenced.

This is what America is now. It's as Black and White as it always has been, just people are better at hiding it.

Truth
 

zoku88

Member
What about the American Civil Liberties Union on this issue? https://www.aclu.org/other/hate-speech-campus

Should we start disagreeing with this?
Nothing in that link has anything to do with people protesting hate speech though? Seems unlikely that the ACLU would be against the protests.

It also says nothing about forcing people to listen. So I'm not sure why you thought that link was an appropriate response to the person you quoted.
 

Anjelus_

Junior Member
Nothing in that link has anything to do with people protesting hate speech though? Seems unlikely that the ACLU would be against the protests.

It also says nothing about forcing people to listen. So I'm not sure why you thought that link was an appropriate response to the person you quoted.



Well... he said the 1st doesn't mean "we must tolerate hateful rhetoric." The ACLU page addresses that in questions:

"Q: I just can't understand why the ACLU defends free speech for racists, sexists, homophobes and other bigots. Why tolerate the promotion of intolerance? "

and the answer to:

"Q: But don't speech codes send a strong message to campus bigots, telling them their views are unacceptable? "

It seemed relevant, but neither the person I responded to nor I said anything about "forcing people to listen."



the university did not ban him from speaking


Ought only the university admin adhere to the principle in question?

The philosophy behind it strikes me as being applicable to this situation.
 
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