Ascend
Member
What do you mean 'now'? They advertised that from the beginning.So now the narrative is super-fast load times
- Status
SportsFan581
Member
There's really no need for the number games, let's just see what the games look and load like. MS's storage optimizations are geared more towards lowering the amount of data that needs to be delivered (via texture paging, direct AI image upscaling, etc.) rather than increasing overall IO, which is fitting since they have less raw data speed.
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Shmunter
Member
Yes that's right, the faster your streaming the less buffering allocation in ram needed, resulting in more ram you have for what's to be rendered in front of you.
silent head
Member
MasterCornholio
Member
D
Deleted member 775630
Unconfirmed Member
You might want to look back, because the PS4 OS was also barebones, Microsoft was just much faster in adding new features and way more transparent where they gave the community the possibility to vote for features they wanted.
Gamernyc78
Banned
So something did happen today.
Not exactly what we want but I'll take it.
Shit its what I want to see lol cant wait.
Radical_3d
Member
Worst Sony Tuesday ever : (So something did happen today.
Not exactly what we want but I'll take it.
Vaztu
Member
Its little nuances. While one can argue its the same thing, but their wording is not. Sony has stuck with elimination of load times.
Power Your Dreams with Xbox Series X, Available Holiday 2020 - Xbox Wire
Xbox Game Studios unveils Senua’s Saga: Hellblade II, a new chapter in the award-winning Hellblade story from Ninja Theory For eighteen years and three console generations, the Xbox community has shown us the power both games and fun can have on all of us. As we enter a new generation of gaming...
news.xbox.com
" our next-generation SSD will virtually eliminate load times "
Xbox Series X: A Closer Look at the Technology Powering the Next Generation - Xbox Wire
A few months ago, we revealed Xbox Series X, our fastest, most powerful console ever, designed for a console generation that has you, the player, at its center. When it is released this holiday season, Xbox Series X will set a new bar for performance, speed and compatibility, all while allowing...
news.xbox.com
" Developers will also be able to effectively eliminate loading times "
Defining the Next Generation: An Xbox Series X|S Technology Glossary - Xbox Wire
[Editor’s Note: Updated on 10/21 at 11AM to ensure it is now reflective of the capabilities across both of our next-gen Xbox consoles following the unveil of Xbox Series S.] As we enter a new generation of console gaming with Xbox Series X and Xbox Series S, we’ve made a number of technology...
news.xbox.com
" They will showcase unparalleled load-times "
" effectively eliminates loading times "
" Game worlds are larger, more dynamic and load in a flash "
"But they didn't want the I/O system to be just about your games loading faster"
"The most noticeable of these is loading times, which will be greatly decreased thanks to the processing power of Xbox Series X "
I don't know about you, but there is a difference between 'eliminate load times' and these words, at least for me.
saintjules
Member
Refreshing. Feels like I just got out of an Inn in a JRPG.
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Gediminas
Banned
they copy - paste whatever sony is doing. what they are going to do if they don't have any identity...So now the narrative is super-fast load times
THE:MILKMAN
Member
4,8GB/s + 50% Bpack = 7,2GB/s
This is playing silly games with the numbers. Actually thinking about the numbers..... On PS5 it seems Kraken takes 5.5GB/s and compresses by ~60% overall? = 8.8GB/s hence the 8-9GB/s figure. No way then does 2.4GB/s get 100% compressed to 4.8GB/s with Zlib (10% worse than Kraken?) so must already include what BCPack brings for textures? Even if this brought 50% you can't just add both together consecutively right!? These numbers games are a mess!
Someone please explain it so I understand.....
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Seems like a cheap rip-off/mimic of the legendary PS1 startup
Still the best startup ever, hence my avatar.
SportsFan581
Member
2.4GB/s to 4.8GB/s represents 50% compression. Let's say you have 4.8GB of data and you compress that 50%, you'd have 2.4GBs of data.
Bladed Thesis
Member
"How do modern companies work in 2020"Microsoft Long Term Debt 2010-2024 | MSFT
Microsoft long term debt from 2010 to 2024. Long term debt can be defined as the sum of all long term debt fields. <ul style='margin-top:10px;'> <li>Microsoft long term debt for the quarter ending December 31, 2024 was <strong>$39.722B</strong>, a <strong>11.59% decline</strong>...www.macrotrends.net
$70B in debt
Sony Long Term Debt 2006-2020 | SNE
Sony long term debt from 2006 to 2020. Long term debt can be defined as the sum of all long term debt fields. <ul style='margin-top:10px;'> <li>Sony long term debt for the quarter ending December 31, 2020 was <strong>$7.078B</strong>, a <strong>21.78% increase</strong>...www.macrotrends.net
$5.8B in debt
Gediminas
Banned
don't try to make sense of these numbers. those delusional fanboys just glued what ever numbers they could find.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
Okay that makes sense but then why does PS5's 5.5GB's only become 8-9GB/s when it uses Kraken which is said to be 10% better? Numbers are being fudged somewhere!
DrKeo
Member
Your table is not aligned right. It should be:
2.4GB/s raw VS 5.5GB/s raw
4.8GB/s typical vs 8GB/s - 9GB/s typical
??? max vs 22GB/s max
It's actually not that clear what the 6GB/s figure is but if I had to guess, it's the BCPack typical. The final typical is 4.8 because Zlib lowers the average.
It's not an odd number, it's in GiB which means there are 9 digits after that 1.
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Gamernyc78
Banned
They've been following Sony's blueprint to gain good graces since after the beginning of this gen. Good examples "Gears will be more open" like God of war/Uncharted, "We are giving devs freedom to create their games" Sony pushing tht narrative for years, "Fast Loading" Sony brought tht forth in initial reveal and Microsoft's reveal was a carbon copy just in video few weeks, later. "We are investing and expanding first party studios" Sony mantra since PS3.
There's more but you get the hint.
SgtCaffran
Member
The 6 GB/s is the theoretical maximum throughput of the hardware decompression block. So it's a hard limit. The 4.8 is typical. Similar to how the 22GB/s is the maximum for the PS5 block.
Shio
Member
Is that going to be the XBOX boot screen? I think Sony should resuse their old one from
silent head
Member
DrKeo
Member
It can't be, it doesn't make sense to the compression ratio of Kraken, Zlib and BC if the typical is 4.8GB/s.
SportsFan581
Member
BCPack is rumored to be more performant at image compression by 10 or 15%. Kraken is generally around 35 -40% on images, those are the typical numbers that Sony went with. On ascii to binary compression, Kraken can be a stellar performer, zlib not so good there. Sony covers the spread in raw performance, they are champs in this area, any noise to the contrary is just that.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
Seems pretty clear from the DF article:
Interesting. Given this, and until we get more details, I'm going to assume the 4.8GB/s figure includes BCPack and Zlib.
SportsFan581
Member
Looks like a representation of their overall average compression target, agreed. It would have been foolish to go with a more capable decompression block in combination with the SSD they chose. Not much good if you can't feed it.
Kusarigama
Member
I'm hoping for <5second cold boot up time. Is it asking too much?
Rusco Da Vino
Member
Its little nuances. While one can argue its the same thing, but their wording is not. Sony has stuck with elimination of load times.
Power Your Dreams with Xbox Series X, Available Holiday 2020 - Xbox Wire
Xbox Game Studios unveils Senua’s Saga: Hellblade II, a new chapter in the award-winning Hellblade story from Ninja Theory For eighteen years and three console generations, the Xbox community has shown us the power both games and fun can have on all of us. As we enter a new generation of gaming...
" our next-generation SSD will virtually eliminate load times "
Xbox Series X: A Closer Look at the Technology Powering the Next Generation - Xbox Wire
A few months ago, we revealed Xbox Series X, our fastest, most powerful console ever, designed for a console generation that has you, the player, at its center. When it is released this holiday season, Xbox Series X will set a new bar for performance, speed and compatibility, all while allowing...
" Developers will also be able to effectively eliminate loading times "
Defining the Next Generation: An Xbox Series X|S Technology Glossary - Xbox Wire
[Editor’s Note: Updated on 10/21 at 11AM to ensure it is now reflective of the capabilities across both of our next-gen Xbox consoles following the unveil of Xbox Series S.] As we enter a new generation of console gaming with Xbox Series X and Xbox Series S, we’ve made a number of technology...
" They will showcase unparalleled load-times "
" effectively eliminates loading times "
" Game worlds are larger, more dynamic and load in a flash "
"But they didn't want the I/O system to be just about your games loading faster"
"The most noticeable of these is loading times, which will be greatly decreased thanks to the processing power of Xbox Series X "
I don't know about you, but there is a difference between 'eliminate load times' and these words, at least for me.
And then you see that in their official loading time tech demo they dont include a stopwatch because they dont want you to notice that it takes around 11s (pop ups include) to load a low resolution game.
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It's mostly pr. May have to wait for launch to see how it all shakes out.Its little nuances. While one can argue its the same thing, but their wording is not. Sony has stuck with elimination of load times.
Power Your Dreams with Xbox Series X, Available Holiday 2020 - Xbox Wire
Xbox Game Studios unveils Senua’s Saga: Hellblade II, a new chapter in the award-winning Hellblade story from Ninja Theory For eighteen years and three console generations, the Xbox community has shown us the power both games and fun can have on all of us. As we enter a new generation of gaming...
" our next-generation SSD will virtually eliminate load times "
Xbox Series X: A Closer Look at the Technology Powering the Next Generation - Xbox Wire
A few months ago, we revealed Xbox Series X, our fastest, most powerful console ever, designed for a console generation that has you, the player, at its center. When it is released this holiday season, Xbox Series X will set a new bar for performance, speed and compatibility, all while allowing...
" Developers will also be able to effectively eliminate loading times "
Defining the Next Generation: An Xbox Series X|S Technology Glossary - Xbox Wire
[Editor’s Note: Updated on 10/21 at 11AM to ensure it is now reflective of the capabilities across both of our next-gen Xbox consoles following the unveil of Xbox Series S.] As we enter a new generation of console gaming with Xbox Series X and Xbox Series S, we’ve made a number of technology...
" They will showcase unparalleled load-times "
" effectively eliminates loading times "
" Game worlds are larger, more dynamic and load in a flash "
"But they didn't want the I/O system to be just about your games loading faster"
"The most noticeable of these is loading times, which will be greatly decreased thanks to the processing power of Xbox Series X "
I don't know about you, but there is a difference between 'eliminate load times' and these words, at least for me.
DrKeo
Member
If your typical decompression rate is 4.8GB/s (which means the BCPack average decompression rate is much higher than 4.8Gb/s), your max is way over 6Gb/s. Your average max might be 6-7 GB/s, but not the BCPack decompression max. Even Zlib can hit x3 compression ratio here and there (7.2GB/s).
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xacto
Member
So now the narrative is super-fast load times
Yup, they want to be trendy themselves and play with the big boys
Then why is it smaller then the binary 1 TB number. Should be larger not smaller.
HeisenbergFX4
Member
Demon2blades
Member
I'm pretty sure the PS4 had more features from release than the Xbox I'm not saying it has now but at the start it did .
I probably already saw it on reddit.
lepermessiah
Member
11.4 seconds is lightning.
MasterCornholio
Member
And then you see that in their official loading time tech demo they dont include a stopwatch because they dont want you notice that it takes around 11s (pop ups include) to load a low resolution game.
It's basically just loading the Xbox One X version of the game correct?
If the games visuals were upgraded to Series X levels wouldn't the loading times be longer?
I'm just assuming an increase in asset size when we move into Next Gen.
Kenpachii
Member
Its little nuances. While one can argue its the same thing, but their wording is not. Sony has stuck with elimination of load times.
Power Your Dreams with Xbox Series X, Available Holiday 2020 - Xbox Wire
Xbox Game Studios unveils Senua’s Saga: Hellblade II, a new chapter in the award-winning Hellblade story from Ninja Theory For eighteen years and three console generations, the Xbox community has shown us the power both games and fun can have on all of us. As we enter a new generation of gaming...
" our next-generation SSD will virtually eliminate load times "
Xbox Series X: A Closer Look at the Technology Powering the Next Generation - Xbox Wire
A few months ago, we revealed Xbox Series X, our fastest, most powerful console ever, designed for a console generation that has you, the player, at its center. When it is released this holiday season, Xbox Series X will set a new bar for performance, speed and compatibility, all while allowing...
" Developers will also be able to effectively eliminate loading times "
Defining the Next Generation: An Xbox Series X|S Technology Glossary - Xbox Wire
[Editor’s Note: Updated on 10/21 at 11AM to ensure it is now reflective of the capabilities across both of our next-gen Xbox consoles following the unveil of Xbox Series S.] As we enter a new generation of console gaming with Xbox Series X and Xbox Series S, we’ve made a number of technology...
" They will showcase unparalleled load-times "
" effectively eliminates loading times "
" Game worlds are larger, more dynamic and load in a flash "
"But they didn't want the I/O system to be just about your games loading faster"
"The most noticeable of these is loading times, which will be greatly decreased thanks to the processing power of Xbox Series X "
I don't know about you, but there is a difference between 'eliminate load times' and these words, at least for me.
U read way to much into this lol.
Both consoles can have zero load times perfectly fine if they choose for it. The only advantage that sony SSD has is faster load times in games that do require load times because of how they are designed.
People keep forgetting that seamingless worlds without load times have already been a thing since forever even on HDD's.
SSD is getting bottlenecked hard because the game doesn't take the SSD into account for shit.
What u see there is not the full speed of the SSD, its much like what PC's do. create 2-5x faster load times, because of faster access to data which is more directly. Which gives them that load speed. as its 11 vs 54 seconds. The SSD in the xbox series X is probably 50-100 times faster depending if you use compressed io throughput. Which will mean if the game was designed around that SSD u would see practical no load times. However the game probably can't handle that because it was never designed for it. The same as ac odyssey is capped at 40mbps load times on PC no matter the SSD.
They clearly just dropped a xbox one game on series x and demonstrated the gains without optimisations for it.
So not really, load times will get shorter actually on both boxes.
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DrKeo
Member
The smaller is the binary. Storage volume is advertised in GB but in the OS itself you see all the numbers in GiB. That's why every 1TB drive on the market is actually 931GiB. That's why XSX 1TB drive is actually 931GiB and PS5's 825GB is actually 768GiB.
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Couple of things:
1. If streaming is faster it means less RAM usage. Not more.
2. Rendering a high quality assets is pretty much the same as rendering a low quality one. You can check the perf of any fan-made texture packs and the differences are negligible. Even if the texture size was increased 2x across the board (google the recent Witcher 3 re-tex).
THE:MILKMAN
Member
Honestly don't know but I can't argue with what Andrew said and what he specifically talks about here. I'm pretty sure if 7.2GB/s was correct it would be the number we see in the specs instead of 4.8GB/s.
SportsFan581
Member
You should also assume a package that better utilizes the speeds offered by SSD.
sonomamashine
Member
Lol now we counting Current Gen loading time on Next Gen
MasterCornholio
Member
Especially when compared to Sonys numbers but I'm guessing they did that to avoid being accused of false marketing.
Just my guess.
BattleScar
Member
This is wrong for two reasons.4,8GB/s + 50% Bpack = 7,2GB/s
For one, 4.8GB/s is the compressed bandwidth, so it already accounts for compression. The RAW bandwidth is 2.5GB/s.
So he's applying the compression ratio to a compressed bandwidth.
Secondly, he's comparing it to the PS5's RAW bandwidth of 5.5GB/s which in reality is still faster than the Series X's SSD bandwidth with compression.
Vaztu
Member
I agree this is mostly PR. There is a thin line between PR and lying. PR has to adhere to laws / legal department.
My post was to show the difference between PR of two companies. MS circles around the word "eliminate load times" while Sony directly says "eliminate load times".
xacto
Member
Lol now we counting Current Gen loading time on Next Gen
Well, it was Microsoft starting with number counting, so there it is.
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travisktl
Member
They do have load times though. They're just hidden behind long walking sections, crawl spaces, elevators,etc. The PS5's SSD will be able to eliminate all of these kinds of things, and allow developers to do more with their games. Lots of developers have expressed how excited they are for this, and how this opens up much more possibilities in game design. That being said, as far as I know, we haven't seen anyone praising the XSX SSD yet. We'll have to wait and see how first party games differ this gen, and if the Xbox will be able to keep up in those aspects.
Rusco Da Vino
Member
That is exactly my point. Some users say that the game was not optimized for that tech demo without providing any evidence about that claim, but they "forget" to mention that the game has low resolution assets and still it takes 11 sec to be fully loaded.
Now imagine loading a very complex and full 4K game
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MasterCornholio
Member
Honestly I just go with the demos that they showed us.
I'm sure that they will not miss the opportunity to show us better numbers.
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