Liquidsnake
Banned
As a player who has poured more hours into FM than any other series, this bothers me the most. Its like do you guys know this looks like lego racing?
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Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)
- Thread starter Gestault
- Start date
As a player who has poured more hours into FM than any other series, this bothers me the most. Its like do you guys know this looks like lego racing?
Because that is what they targeted and optimized for?
Not that it's a particularly fair comparison (60fps vs 30fps and all), but here's a pretty good comparison of Forza 6, Driveclub and PCars in a range of conditions, views etc. Some of you may recognise who one of the top comments is from lol. No guesses needed as to it's contents
Forza 6 vs. DriveClub vs. Project CARS | Graphics, Rain & Weather Gameplay Comparison (PS4 & Xbox)
The comparison of the Z06 in the rain was just filthy. Something about the car models in Forza games is just off to me, not sure how to explain it. Maybe it's the color palette or the lighting. Everything is just oddly smoothed out.
That's because the engine handles its load well. When you force it to do otherwise (ie. photomode forces high LOD car models) it can and will drop frames with multiple cars on screen. The same goes for Forza Horizon 2. Both games are very well optimized in gameplay because they know the hardware limits and can scale back model quality to maintain the desired framerate.
TheAdmiester
Member
I was thinking similar, it should be a standard, not a praised exception lol.
Seeing Forza so heavily praised for being 60FPS is actually kind of saddening, because that means locked 60 is something so rare that it's a big deal.
Stillmatic
Member
Don't know if it's the case, but it seems like they're bound by engine, as creating a new one would likely increase dev time. Something they likely can't do with their 2 year dev cycle. They've probably been chipping away at something new.
Haha, I'd agree. It is a shame that so many devs get away with claiming 60 (or even 30) fps and that is not the norm for their game.
I think Forza Motorsport's biggest weakness in visuals is the reflection quality (which I think is one of Driveclub's biggest strengths). Reflections go a long way in making a believable scene, especially with cars, and Forza Motorsport has baked reflections that don't accurately portray the environment off of the car. Cars with less reflective paint colors (grays, whites, etc) actually look pretty realistic.
I'm in the same boat. For some reason the demo for Forza 6 looked worse to me than Horizon 2. I think it's not just the way the cars look in DC, but the environments as well. I don't think even GT7 is going to be able to win out against DC for that exact reason.
It should, one is 30fps, the other is 60 fps. How hard is this for people to get?
The occasional pop-in you can see in some reflections in Forza 6 can definitely take away from a moment. I noticed the same thing about "brushed" metal paint jobs in Forza 5 looking particularly nice (compared to a normal gloss-coat).
Can't go back to playing DC. Great eye candy, but that's all that it's got going for it. 60 FPS, for me, really changes things.
Just from my own awareness of judder, this sounds like the worst thing I can imagine for game design. It should really be 30 or 60.
Horizon 2 is open world though. I played Forza 5 and thought it looked amazing. I left the Forza 6 demo slightly underwhelmed. It lacked that overall cleanses that Horizon 2 (and I'm pretty sure Forza 5 wasn't as jaggy) had. I have the Ultimate edition on preorder, so let's hope it's just an old build, and that they've cleaned it up a bit more for launch.
Aceofspades
Banned
To be honest, after seeing F6 visuals, I knew why it didn't drop a single frame...
Dictator93
Member
60 fps, does not drop a frame on an xb1 which is in a performance deficit to the Ps4.
You can do a whole lot more with graphics if you 2x the amount of time to render a frame, not including the performance advantage PS4 has.
Being disappointed how a 60fps game on a weaker system visually looks vs one of a 30fps game on a more powerful system is like complaining that the PS4 version of MGSV doesn't have the ultra quality settings of the of a 30 fps Ryse running @ 4k on a titan x.
For being a graphics thread, this sure has some weird posts that completely lack perspective.
Liquidsnake
Banned
DC's dynamic volumetric clouds adds quite a bit to the visual experience. I hope future sim racers can adopt something similar during this generation span.
This makes me want to cry its so beautiful.
This makes me want to cry its so beautiful.
I must say the actual rain drops and snow flakes in DC look great.
uncledonnie
Banned
It actually looks a lot less jaggy than Forza 5, although the overall AA is still not great.
Also, damn near every other game this generation lacks the overall cleanness of Horizon 2.
Still can't even say that because it's not as dynamic as driveclub.
all those forza 6 reviews probably should have said it was the best performing racer out there on consoles rather then saying it was the better looking, because it clearly isn't the better looking racer. Even its arcade sister horizon looks better and that's open world ( and 30fps)
I would still say no. Not to "protect" forza or something, but most of the stuff added in photo mode is for image quality, like aa, anisotropic filtering, improved blur, etc. It is not like the lighting model or some other basic engine system changes.
It's open world though. You can't even drive backwards in Driveclub.
So you think not having a day cycle helps alleviate the performance in NFS? That's why DC will still take the cake?
This may just be the silliest post in this entire thread.
Foutrologue
Banned
Not really because the only added effect is DoF and more cars on display depending on the camera angle. Everything is the same as when it's running at 60FPS which is precisely why many people still wonder why Turn10 insists on locking everything to 30FPS outside of races just to add DoF.
Absolutely. If you haven't look up how much overhead a dynamic lighting system uses. To add on to it DC has a dynamic weather system which I believe NFS does not. Also, with the Frostbite Engine, the game may not even run 1080p. I don't trust the DEVS.
The engine can handle it. I'm sure you saw the gif where the camera was completely free...
That last bit makes you sound like a crazy person, especially because most 30fps games that use frostbite run at 1080p on ps4 (I do not know any off hand that do not).
The only one I've seen is the one where it goes straight up into the clouds. Which is a pretty awesome gif.
Foutrologue
Banned
So your work at Evolution? Ah no? Ok...
Foutrologue
Banned
BF3 runs at 900P on PS4
DirtyLarry
Member
Driveclub is the best looking next-current gen game. Easily. Anyone that says otherwise is either blind or biased. Really no other way to put it. It also features some truly incredible weather cycles that also surpasses all other games. Driveclub is as everyone knows also 30 FPS.
Forza Horizon 2 is probably next on the visuals, although truth be told the environments are not wow by any means. It is however also pseudo Open World, so that is very impressive. It is also 30 FPS.
Forza 6 is next visually. It looks pretty damn good. It is however as everyone knows 60 FPS. It is sacrificing some visual fidelity for performance, and many people consider it to be the best from a gameplay perspective because of this, but there is no doubt whatsoever it does not look as good as DC.
Finally the new Need For Speed looks like it is going to be some serious competition for DC, but the verdict is still out on that as all we have been shown are promotional videos and do not have the actual game yet to make a final decision. It is also apparently all at night, which one would have to think gives the developer a little less to worry about and lets them focus on getting the most out of the engine.
Forza Horizon 2 is probably next on the visuals, although truth be told the environments are not wow by any means. It is however also pseudo Open World, so that is very impressive. It is also 30 FPS.
Forza 6 is next visually. It looks pretty damn good. It is however as everyone knows 60 FPS. It is sacrificing some visual fidelity for performance, and many people consider it to be the best from a gameplay perspective because of this, but there is no doubt whatsoever it does not look as good as DC.
Finally the new Need For Speed looks like it is going to be some serious competition for DC, but the verdict is still out on that as all we have been shown are promotional videos and do not have the actual game yet to make a final decision. It is also apparently all at night, which one would have to think gives the developer a little less to worry about and lets them focus on getting the most out of the engine.
TheAdmiester
Member
That's a ~60FPS game. The person you quoted means the 30FPS Frostbite games, like NFS Rivals.
Huh?
You know I mean the fact that you can't drive backwards is a design choice and not a limitation.
Get out of here with your reason and sensibility. There is no place for you here.
There's documentation on the engine. I don't need to work for EVO.
He has a point. In a sense, it's styled to only be at night so you get a lot of baked effects which is a lot less intensive than the dynamic nature of DC. Plus most things pushed out from the FB engine don't resemble the quality of the promotion shots/videos.
Design choice, not limitation. The engine can handle it.
GoldenCrow
Member
I think it strange how some people dismiss the visuals of a game because it doesn't do everything and also throw in a kitchen sink. So what if it isn't as varied as other games visually if what they do is visually brilliant then that is the most important part. With replicating cars then realism is the goal and from the footage shown so far aesthetically looks more realistic than what Driveclub is doing, sure Driveclub does a lot more but that doesn't detract from what NFS is doing. When RE:Make came out originally I remember similar discussions about it not being as good as other games graphically because it used 2D backgrounds but it is still a brilliant looking game and no other games of that generation looked better (realistically speaking). If a game has a distinct focus such as night racing then it makes sense to focus all graphic effort into that one area.
Whatever. At a cost of visuals. DC is able to maintain it's graphic prowess at any time of day. Besides, FB is not the most capable engine out anyway. We shall see once the game is out what it is capable of. My bet is disappointment.
Raven77
Member
But this is a graphics face off, 60fps has nothing to do with judging the quality of the graphics, that is about performance.
If you say 60 fps matters then why couldn't you drag in the quality of the AI, etc. A game with better AI will use more resources and would take away from the assets you could devote to pretty visuals just like framerate does.
Doing less with more is a totally valid design approach. It's why Driveclub manages a look all it's own in a genre where games are otherwise looking more and more similar. I have my opinions on it, but that's different from the visuals. The IQ is the only area I think they really had to dial back for, and that shows, but otherwise you have a slick look that's a total visual success.
Race in the snow, honestly. It just looks rad.
Race in the snow, honestly. It just looks rad.
I don't think he is arguing what you think he is arguing. He is just saying that being disappointed with a game that is 60 fps on a weaker console when comparing it to a game that is 30 fps on a more powerful console is dumb. You can still argue that the latter looks better than the former, but if you are disappointed in the former because of this fact then you just had baseless, idiotic expectations to begin with.
aaronwt
Member
It definitely looks current gen. I recently played some true last gen forza on the 360. The FM6 demo looks nothing like it. Of course Drive Club does look better. But it's only at 30fps so I expect more detail from a 30fps game than a 60fps game.
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