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[OccamsLightsaber]

The only way is if there are two actors, one for each game, who act in their best interests. So have someone who's best interest is to make a gif of DC in its best possible light, and have another actor who's best interest is to make a gif of FM6 in the best possible light.

That's why we're here.

So Turn 10 couldn't have crammed in an extra 16.6ms of resources just for photomode even if they wanted to.

They couldn't have reduced the frame rate in photomode? It isn't really essential for gameplay.

 

[etta]

They couldn't have reduced the frame rate in photomode? It isn't really essential for gameplay.

They have reduced it to 30fps, but there's "performance left on the table".
Find Synth's explanation of it.

 

[Fess]

The only way is if there are two actors, one for each game, who act in their best interests. So have someone who's best interest is to make a gif of DC in its best possible light, and have another actor who's best interest is to make a gif of FM6 in the best possible light.

As for the replay point, it doesn't matter what each version adds. The only thing that matters is that each game was built with different resources in mind. DC with 33.3ms of available resources, and FM6 with 16.6ms. So Turn 10 couldn't have crammed in an extra 16.6ms of resources just for photomode even if they wanted to.

gifs only tell half the truth though, 60fps usually look like crap in gifs since the slick and nonblurry look of high framerates don't get shown. Videos are better, if they run at the right framerate. But I agree with the rest.

 

[shandy706]

Forza replay only improves the car model slightly and adds some post-processing effects, and a higher quality AA, not to mention that the game was developed with 60fps in mind, so obviously it won't have assets that could have been used with the extra 16.6ms. Synth already said this some pages back, see if you can find his explanation.

I'm sure others have noticed this, but you can get the "gameplay" model of cars in screenshot mode.

How? Change the focus (literal focus of the camera) to a car that you're not initially taking the picture of.

This is a shot of a gameplay model (see edit below)****and not the higher-polycount "Forzavista" level model.

This is also a "gameplay" model. The camera isn't this close during gameplay, so you wouldn't notice things you do this close.

It's a neat trick to basically taking "gameplay" level shots with a free camera. Edit**** See post after mine....it could be an LOD one step down from the players gameplay model.


If I were to hit "X" (focus) on this car before taking a picture...it would completely reload and re-render the model..lighting and all.

Ooof, I thought it was slighter than that. Are you sure non-primary aren't downgraded further in gameplay? Because I don't see those low polygons when I'm in the chase camera. Chase camera looks very close to Photomode models for the primary car.

You may be right...it could be ONE LOD lower. How close is the lower chase cam? I'm not where I could test it on the non-focused photomode cars.

It's possible the car you are actively driving is an LOD between Photomode and the AI cars. This is a graphics thread, this would be a neat thing to figure out.

I agree, when swinging the camera around your car in gameplay, you don't see polys at the wheel-wells.

 

[etta]

I'm sure others have noticed this, but you can get the "gameplay" model of cars in screenshot mode.

How? Change the focus (literal focus of the camera) to a car that you're not initially taking the picture of.

This is a shot of a gameplay model and not the higher-polycount "Forzavista" level model.



This is also a "gameplay" model..

Ooof, I thought it was slighter than that. Are you sure non-primary aren't downgraded further in gameplay? Because I don't see those low polygons when I'm in the chase camera. Chase camera looks very close to Photomode models for the primary car.

 

[GoldenCrow]

M0dus already mentioned that the comparison there is misrepresentative and cherry-picked, and people kept using it. I mean it took a mod to come in and say it.
Maybe someone can make one of those fancy gifs where the camera pans around and swings in a dramatic manner for FM6, because I suck at those and have no capture card.

The chase cam at speed in the rain isn't a misrepresentation, that is how it looks. You have spray that doesn't go past the height of the bumper I'm assuming so it doesn't interfere with the view but this spray blocks out the shadow as well as making the lighting look off on the car and making it look like it is floating. As soon as you drop the speed or angle it starts to look normal again. Hardly misrepresentation but people are picking up on it because it looks so strange, I wouldn't be surprised if it gets patched.

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

Dat ass. Here's more ass:

She looks like she's floating over the road.

 

[AgentP]

M0dus already mentioned that the comparison there is misrepresentative and cherry-picked, and people kept using it. I mean it took a mod to come in and say it.

Unrepresentative? Is it from FM6 or not? Was it altered somehow other than the gif process? A fallacy like argument from authority is not going to change the truth.

 

[leeh]

She looks like she's floating over the road.

Are we joking now here?

 

[cakely]

Are we joking now here?

The woman, not the car. And yeah, she's levitating.

 

[dracula_x]

Except when there are no weather or lighting effects, then it looks a bit shite. I have made this claim before, so stopped into my local Game on Saturday to have another go, and yep, no weather and low angle lighting and it looks a bit pants compared to the gifs and vids thrown around.

Those road and terrain textures are horrible. I guess they look better when they're obscured by the rain or darkness (i.e. you can't see them).

Actually, this is a screen grab from video (notice Gamersyde logo at bottom):

Here's a PNG screenshots for comparison:

 

[c0de]

Can we talk about replays? Both use 30fps replays so are there extra graphics tweaks applied to FM6?

Forza is designed for 60 fps. For taking advantage of 30 fps everything would've to be remade but then people would wonder which game is shown as it would be different to a good amount.

 

[leeh]

The woman, not the car. And yeah, she's levitating.

She's wearing high heels. Looks perfectly on the ground to me. What even is this?

Actually, this is a screen grab from video (notice Gamersyde logo at bottom):

Here's a PNG screenshots for comparison:

That doesn't look hot. You can tell most of their rendering budget is on the weather.

 

[Gestault]

She's wearing high heels. Looks perfectly on the ground to me. What even is this?


That doesn't look hot. You can tell most of their rendering budget is on the weather.

To be fair, she's not casting a shadow. Which is odd, because other intro-sequence people normally cast shadows. At first, I thought the previous poster was making a Mary Poppins reference.

 

[shandy706]

Here's a PNG screenshots for comparison:

It's moments like these shots that would make one think DC is a rough looking game.

For example a mid-day gameplay shot of the highway looking into the distance in an open world racer like Horizon 2 looks far better than any of those shots. From AA to textures...those are just rough as can be.

 

[Spladam]

So have we reached a decision? Did Mario Kart 8 win?

Seriously though, the flame war on Youtube over this is out of hand. Do we agree that Driveclub takes the graphic trophy?

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

Are we joking now here?

I was talking about Mary Poppins there, not the car.

To be fair, she's not casting a shadow. Which is odd, because other intro-sequence people normally cast shadows. At first, I thought the previous poster was making a Mary Poppins reference.

Thank you. I knew the risk of humour, but I went ahead anyway

 

[dracula_x]

It's moments like these shots that would make one think DC is a rough looking game.

For example a mid-day gameplay shot of the highway looking into the distance in an open world racer like Horizon 2 looks far better than any of those shots. From AA to textures...those are just rough as can be.

I don't think so – http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=153052523&postcount=85

And this is with a blur filter, btw. You know, Driveclub in motion looks much better – http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=179547778&postcount=6314

 

[MilkyJoe]

So have we reached a decision? Did Mario Kart 8 win?

Seriously though, the flame war on Youtube over this is out of hand. Do we agree that Driveclub takes the graphic trophy?

There is no doubt.

 

[shandy706]

I don't think so – http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=153052523&postcount=85



And this is with a blur filter, btw. You know, Driveclub in motion looks much better – http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=179547778&postcount=6314

Not a single shot in your or that post is a noon time shot, sitting still, looking 5 miles across a landscape or more.


I was comparing like for like. Some people have the hardest time separating things.

Yes, in motion. DC is absolutely the graphics king. Especially lighting wise...oh and trees most of the time.

There are parts of it that do not win the graphics debate though. Textures can look like clay...not realistic at all. The PNGs you posted are a good example of those moments.

 

[dracula_x]

Not a single shot in your or that post is a noon time shot, sitting still, looking 5 miles across a landscape or more.


I was comparing like for like. Some people have the hardest time separating things.

Yes, in motion. DC is absolutely the graphics king. Especially lighting wise...oh and trees most of the time.

There are parts of it that do not win the graphics debate though. Textures can look like clay...not realistic at all. The PNGs you posted are a good example of those moments.

Are you sure?

 

[funkystudent]

If anything this thread is useful for finding the ugliest possible screenshots of all these normally great looking games.



Also Driveclub's water droplets on the camera are ridiculously over the top. The game would look so much better if they toned them down. But maybe their goal with rain included not being able to see shit.

 

[shandy706]

Are you sure?

Yes...you compared middle of the day shots (the PNGs you posted), to two rainy/dreary shots.

I'm sorry if I didn't clarify WITH THE SAME WEATHER CONDITIONS (derp).

You know exactly what I meant. No need for silly comparisons.

If I had a middle of the day shot, in clear weather, with the close follow cam, swung towards a road and mountain side...I'd post one.

 

[23qwerty]

pretty sure that overhead shots have proven that the textures themselves are actually very good, no reason for them not to be, but the AF, or lack thereof, is just very underwhelming. Hopefully that's part of the graphic improvement rushy was talking about.

Also Driveclub's water droplets on the camera are ridiculously over the top. The game would look so much better if they toned them down. But maybe their goal with rain included not being able to see shit.

Yeah I definitely prefer F6's implementation

 

[c0de]

So have we reached a decision? Did Mario Kart 8 win?

Seriously though, the flame war on Youtube over this is out of hand. Do we agree that Driveclub takes the graphic trophy?

Many pages ago. But this is not what the discussion is about anymore.

 

[nib95]

It's moments like these shots that would make one think DC is a rough looking game.

For example a mid-day gameplay shot of the highway looking into the distance in an open world racer like Horizon 2 looks far better than any of those shots. From AA to textures...those are just rough as can be.

Perhaps in terms of cleanliness of overall image, not sure I'd agree with textures, and especially not so in terms of overall lighting, shaders and geometry. I do agree Driveclub could do with better anti-aliasing, luckily it seems to clean up a good deal during actual movement. Still cleaner than Forza 6, and especially Forza 5, but Horizon 2 and Project Cars (PS4) are definitely the cleanest racers out right now.

Here's a bunch of Driveclub (jpeg) gameplay screens in motion, notice the difference in overall aliasing issues.

Driveclub realistic gameplay screens

 

[dracula_x]

Yes...you compared middle of the day shots (the PNGs you posted), to two rainy/dreary shots.

Well, you're wrong here. It was 12pm in settings.

Edit: Or are you referring to Forza Horizon shots? Maybe you want to see Driveclub with rain at evening?

 

[Spladam]

If anything this thread is useful for finding the ugliest possible screenshots of all these normally great looking games.



Also Driveclub's water droplets on the camera are ridiculously over the top. The game would look so much better if they toned them down. But maybe their goal with rain included not being able to see shit.

I have not played Driveclub, only Forza and Project Cars (PC) but while browsing all the screens on here and watching the youtube videos I kept thinking the same thing, the water effect on screen was overpowering. They were definitely going for the dramatic.

 

[transformer]

Unrepresentative? Is it from FM6 or not? Was it altered somehow other than the gif process? A fallacy like argument from authority is not going to change the truth.

So if someone were to say take a clip from Driveclub (or any other game) and create a low resolution gif at 8-10fps, post it and criticize how poor it looks in fidelity and smoothness this would be representative? I mean, it would be from the game, correct? And not altered other than the gif process?

 

[shandy706]

Well, you're wrong here. It was 12pm in settings.

Edit: Or are you referring to Forza Horizon shots? Maybe you want to see Driveclub with rain at evening?

At least Nibs isn't cutting parts of my post out to fit the narrative...never mind, lol.

 

[cakely]

She's wearing high heels. Looks perfectly on the ground to me. What even is this?

Come on, really? This is light-hearted, and it's such a minor point, but that woman is half a foot off the ground, seriously, can't unsee.

 

[Melfice7]

How cool would it be if Driveclub introduced bikes? dat sense of speed

 

[VanWinkle]

Well, you're wrong here. It was 12pm in settings.

Edit: Or are you referring to Forza Horizon shots? Maybe you want to see Driveclub with rain at evening?

I thought it was pretty obvious he was talking about the FH shots. He was saying that a clear daytime shot with the distant environment in the background on a game like FH2 looks far better the same conditions on DC.

I don't agree with him, but that's what he was saying. So your comparison didn't really show anything. Your shots were in cockpit, without a long stretch of road, with varying weather conditions and times.

 

[NullPointer]

Come on, really? This is light-hearted, and it's such a minor point, but that woman is half a foot off the ground, seriously, can't unsee.

Don't see that at all. You're fucking with us right?

How cool would it be if Driveclub introduced bikes? dat sense of speed

I like the way you think.

 

[Conduit]

M0dus already mentioned that the comparison there is misrepresentative and cherry-picked, and people kept using it. I mean it took a mod to come in and say it.
.

He mentioned.... Everybody mentioned something. Sorry, dude! But it's Forza 6 gif and it's a DC gif. It clearly show a difference between these 2 games in graphics department. You have also youtube videos. If you whining about how gif is poor representation of Forza 6, KEEP IN MIND this ALSO applies to DC.

As i said a few pages back - NOBODY said anything about PCARS vs. DC gif comparison. And suddenly Forza 6 is the problem, it's cherry picked and other shit. Damn.

Btw. etta, this quote perfectly describes you :

Gifs make DC look better, you should use video.

Then someone upload a video comparison where DC destroys everything in PC and F6: video doesn't show F6 in full glory 60fps!

Another upload a 60fps comparison of DC and F6: its cheery picked! F6 looks much better


Some people will never accept that DC is the better looking game and not by a small margin (generational difference really)

 

[Wax Free Vanilla]

How cool would it be if Driveclub introduced bikes? dat sense of speed

Rushy pls!

The Tourist Trophy guy must have dabbled with Bikes in Driveclub?

 

[Janski89]

-

 

[pixelbox]

Now if you can compare both games with the camera directly over the road and not use a compressed, single image of an mp4.

 

[pixelbox]

How cool would it be if Driveclub introduced bikes? dat sense of speed

Sthap

 

[etta]

He mentioned.... Everybody mentioned something. Sorry, dude! But it's Forza 6 gif and it's a DC gif. It clearly show a difference between these 2 games in graphics department. You have also youtube videos. If you whining about how gif is poor representation of Forza 6, KEEP IN MIND this ALSO applies to DC.

As i said a few pages back - NOBODY said anything about PCARS vs. DC gif comparison. And suddenly Forza 6 is the problem, it's cherry picked and other shit. Damn.

Btw. etta, this quote perfectly describes you :

Lol, I am not complaining that the gif ruins the comparison, I am saying the same thing m0dus said, that FM6 is misrepresented in the gif, especially since the water spray hides the car's reflection in that particular instance.
Look at Noobcraft's earlier examples of it being possible to make DC look bad as well, or any game in general. That's what's happening in that gif except that it's done to FM6.

But if using that gif because it solidifies this concept that FM6 looks like a Wii game helps you sleep at night, go right ahead.

 

[T.O.P]

Yo Conduit, do you have like a daily quote to reach or something?

So have we reached a decision? Did Mario Kart 8 win?

Seriously though, the flame war on Youtube over this is out of hand. Do we agree that Driveclub takes the graphic trophy?

Yeah it has been estabilished for a while, people need just a daily reminder as soon as something good is said about another racing game ofc

 

[etta]

Yo Conduit, do you have like a daily quote to reach or something?
Yeah it has been estabilished for a while, people need just a daily reminder as soon as something good is said about another racing game ofc

Pretty much. You can say anything good about Forza/PC just as long as you add a nice little comment about DC at the end, just put in something like "DC is still the king", otherwise people roll up their sleeves and things get scrappy.

 

[Fess]

Ignoring the framerate and rain effects for a while, it's all about the shadows and lighting, DC goes for realism and therefore looks a bit bland at times when the sun and clouds are at certain positions. This shot is probably about as bad as DC gets. Compared to the regular look of FM6 at the bottom.

Driveclub

Forza 6

 

[Lion Heart]

Man you can't say anything bad about Forza, unless you throw DC under the bus to make it "even". Amirite folks.

 

[commedieu]

If dc targeted 60fps.. on the ps4, the results would likely still out pace forza. Because of the hardware. Will have to wait for gt7 to see how much you can squeeze from hardware at 60fps, but im not expecting f6 to be the end of visuals for console racers. Seems people are into that train of thought.

its not like 60fps means turn10 maxes the visuals. It means they used the specs of the xb1.

People say 60fps like that means u must use baked lighting. And thats as good as it can get. Thats not really the case here. The future is bright. Looking forward to any devs taking on the 60fps challenge. + porn..

Also this thread is severely lacking pcars porn. Guess ill have to do it.

Bums.

 

[AgentP]

So if someone were to say take a clip from Driveclub (or any other game) and create a low resolution gif at 8-10fps, post it and criticize how poor it looks in fidelity and smoothness this would be representative? I mean, it would be from the game, correct? And not altered other than the gif process?

The clip was not illustrating fidelity or smoothness, gifs never do. It was illustrating the poor look of the hover car in the rain.

 

[T.O.P]

I barely touched Pcars at launch because at the time i still had a AMD card and the game ran awfully (it also felt pretty much unplayable on a pad tbh)

Couple of gameplay shot i took

Also i'm really curious about NFS, but i wanted to play it on pc, so i'm fucked 'till 2016

 

[M52B28]

Ignoring the framerate and rain effects for a while, it's all about the shadows and lighting, DC goes for realism and therefore looks a bit bland at times when the sun and clouds are at certain positions.

So, this is an excuse? Real life, from what we all have seen, does not look bland at all.

 

[NullPointer]

So, this is an excuse? Real life, from what we all have seen, does not look bland at all.

Compared to saturated video games it does.

I'll let HipHopGamer explain in detail (bonus: mentions of Forza and Horizon). The whole video is great time though. HHG was entirely blown away by DC

 

[nbnt]

Here's a PNG screenshots for comparison:

Dragon Age II called, it wants its shit mountains back.

Spoiler

Ba dum tssss.. sss.. No? Sorry, carry on.