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[bionic77]

The jump from PS1 to PS2 is probably the smallest jump we have ever had. It is rally hard to include PC, and I wasnt, because what gen do PC games even belong to. Mario 64 was definitely another holy shit moment in gaming, I will agree with you there.

I actually thought the jump from PS1 to PS2 was pretty substantial. PS1 and N64 could barely put out playable 3D games. From the DC onwards every system was able to push 3D games easily.

If we are talking graphics then I think the jump from PS2 to PS3 is a smaller jump. We are playing the same exact games with an HD coat (and even that is arguable). The jump this gen was in how popular online multiplayer got with 360 (Sega must be rolling in their graves) and the changes in controls.

I am very curious to see what the graphics are going to look like next gen.

 

[jakncoke]

I hope they expand on physics and have things not so linear and make shit more interactive with the environment. But i guess the last thing uses up a lot power needlessly

 

[yankeehater]

I actually thought the jump from PS1 to PS2 was pretty substantial. PS1 and N64 could barely put out playable 3D games. From the DC onwards every system was able to push 3D games easily.

If we are talking graphics then I think the jump from PS2 to PS3 is a smaller jump. We are playing the same exact games with an HD coat (and even that is arguable). The jump this gen was in how popular online multiplayer got with 360 (Sega must be rolling in their graves) and the changes in controls.

I am very curious to see what the graphics are going to look like next gen.

Maybe it was because I was primarily a Saturn gamer that gen but the Saturn did some awesome 3D stuff, it really felt like the PS2 just cleaned up things rather then doing something mind blowing, the XBOX did introduce online mp and having a download store and those were both huge things. If you really want to see what next gen graphics will look like find a PC that can run The Witcher 2 or BF3 on very high settings. MS and Sony are not going to make consoles with crazy specs anymore. Sony cant afford to and MS doesnt have to anymore.

 

[bionic77]

I hope they expand on physics and have things not so linear and make shit more interactive with the environment. But i guess the last thing uses up a lot power needlessly

They need to do something.

I was so disappointed in sports games this generation. They failed to impress on every level, from graphics to gameplay. If Sony and MS don't impress me with their next gen offerings I am seriously considering building an HTPC for my sports needs and joining the master race. The only downside will be getting my friends to join me so we can all play together.

 

[yankeehater]

There was so much talk about improving physics this gen and I dont think it really amounted to anything. The problem is physics and AI are not as flashy as graphics, or as easy to sell. Next get the big thing will be 1080p and 60fps.

 

[bionic77]

There was so much talk about improving physics this gen and I dont think it really amounted to anything. The problem is physics and AI are not as flashy as graphics, or as easy to sell. Next get the big thing will be 1080p and 60fps.

:lol

Yeah right. Only a small fraction of gamers care about that. Most other people are too stupid and don't know what they are missing.

 

[Futurevoid]

Next get the big thing will be 1080p and 60fps.

1080p native resolution should be a goal but developers aren't going to push 60fps. They'll maintain their target framerate at 30fps and try to cram as many effects as they can into their games.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

Ha! That's what I mean. Some people just assume that Nintendo/Sony/Japan rule the industry. I started with an Atari way back when, graduated to a Sega Genesis in the early 90s and then went toward PC gaming. Diablo, Unreal Tournament, Command & Conquer. Obviously much more action heavy, bloody and less story-driven. No spiky hair. No androgynous weirdos with really long swords.

So the PS2 really didn't do it for me. I didn't like Ico. I didn't like Final Fantasy VII.

I loved Halo though. And Fable. I have over 100 X360 games still in my collection, and that doesn't include all the ones I finished and traded in.

I don't label the Nintendo games as being kiddy, but I really don't find them appealing. I'd rather play Darksiders than Zelda.

My comment was tongue in cheek. That said, I like all the games you mentioned (well, aside from Fable, Fable is garbage) as well as enjoying Japanese games.

I don’t know when it happened, but it seems that a lot of people drew a hard line in the sand on games they just won’t play. Outside of extreme fanboyism (which I was more than guilty of myself when I was younger) I just don’t see why.

The PS2 had a massive range of games from all genres, as did the Super NES before it. Sorry, but I can’t help but roll my eyes when I hear people say “it had zero games I like”.

 

[brentech]

There was so much talk about improving physics this gen and I dont think it really amounted to anything. The problem is physics and AI are not as flashy as graphics, or as easy to sell. Next get the big thing will be 1080p and 60fps.

Next gen should not be highlighting 1080p and 60fps....those should be locked in as standards for systems. I'd actually be fine with 30fps and 1080 being the hard line rules.

Then developers can't act like that's a feature of their game, but the game itself has to stand on it's own merits.

edit: and yeah, I realize it's highly unlikely that such a thing happens. =(

 

[Kave_Man]

Did you miss Super Mario Brothers, Mario 64, Doom, maybe MGS2, etc?

I am sure there are other games that I am missing but seeing Super Mario for the first time in 1985 was one of the biggest holy shit moments ever. Such a simple game now but at the time it is hard to explain how much of a game changer it was.

As a kid I didn't think much of Mario. I was more blown away with Duck Hunt. I could shoot things on the screen? AWESOME!

Actually I have a question:

For any of you that did play Duck Hunt...was I the only one who had to put the gun right up against the screen to shoot the ducks/frisbees? I remember trying to shoot from a distance but it never really worked.

/amateurshooter

 

[jakncoke]

Ryan Tannehill finacee has sharp knees but otherwise attractive

As a kid I didn't think much of Mario. I was more blown away with Duck Hunt. I could shoot things on the screen? AWESOME!

Actually I have a question:

For any of you that did play Duck Hunt...was I the only one who had to put the gun right up against the screen to shoot the ducks/frisbees? I remember trying to shoot from a distance but it never really worked.

/amateurshooter

Probably had more to do with the tech then you.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

We need better AI and physics for our heavily scripted Modern Warfare game with canned animations!

AI and physics are buzzwords for geeks to jerk each other off to.

 

[Talon]

As a kid I didn't think much of Mario. I was more blown away with Duck Hunt. I could shoot things on the screen? AWESOME!

Actually I have a question:

For any of you that did play Duck Hunt...was I the only one who had to put the gun right up against the screen to shoot the ducks/frisbees? I remember trying to shoot from a distance but it never really worked.

/amateurshooter

Your gun must have been busted.

Accounting for momentum in Super Mario Bros. must have been a massive pain in the butt. Also, it's mindblowing how small the file sizes were for all those games.

 

[Wellington]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

 

[Goro Majima]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

So.....new Niner stadium to collapse "spontaneously" next time they play the Cowboys?

 

[jakncoke]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

fuck dude. so you make the yankees stadium and now going to work on Milano Stadium? nice.

 

[Milchjon]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

As in you're going to work on it? If so, that's pretty cool!

 

[Spectral Glider]

I actually thought the jump from PS1 to PS2 was pretty substantial. PS1 and N64 could barely put out playable 3D games. From the DC onwards every system was able to push 3D games easily.

If we are talking graphics then I think the jump from PS2 to PS3 is a smaller jump. We are playing the same exact games with an HD coat (and even that is arguable). The jump this gen was in how popular online multiplayer got with 360 (Sega must be rolling in their graves) and the changes in controls.

I am very curious to see what the graphics are going to look like next gen.

Yeah, I thought the PS1 to PS2 was a pretty good jump...and that's even after I got into PC gaming around 98 or 99 which had surpassed PS1 stuff pretty easily by then. I remember being amazed by the shit SSX was pushing around or the rampant destruction on Twisted Metal Black and just thinking games like that on my PC at the time would be a slide show if they even ran at all.

I also agree that this gen wasn't as big a leap over the last, which is partly why I never got on board with until about 3 or 4 years into the generation, which was a first for me. I was normally an early adopter, but the higher prices and the sameness of the games kept me away for a bit.

 

[Futurevoid]

We need better AI and physics for our heavily scripted Modern Warfare game with canned animations!

I always find the hate for heavily scripted experiences to be a bit silly. Sometimes, I crave them specifically of the straight forward nature of the experience in general. I enjoy a good open world game like anyone else or games that offer me choice but after I've spent 150 hours in Skyrim or 50+ hours with The Witcher 2 - it's nice to relax with a tightly scripted game that I can finish off in 6-7 hours without putting much thought into it. If it's something with a decent narrative, even better.

The problem with those types of games is price. The day that we decouple multiplayer from single player and offer each of those individual experiences at reduced pricing - the better. Paying $19.99 for a quick 6-7 hours of Modern Warfare single player is far more palpable than $60 for a multiplayer suite I have absolutely zero interest in. Which is exactly why I haven't bothered to buy a Modern Warfare game until they are heavily discounted for a long time. It doesn't mean there isn't a place for that style of game but the industry and more specifically gamers need to readjust what they pay for these things.

 

[Wellington]

Nah I won't get to work on it, I'm staying in NY. It's just cool that my company's got so much stadium work under it's belt.

 

[Nightz]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

Have someone bury a Trey Junkin jersey under the stadium.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

I always find the hate for heavily scripted experiences to be a bit silly. Sometimes, I crave them specifically of the straight forward nature of the experience in general. I enjoy a good open world game like anyone else or games that offer me choice but after I've spent 150 hours in Skyrim or 50+ hours with The Witcher 2 - it's nice to relax with a tightly scripted game that I can finish off in 6-7 hours without putting much thought into it. If it's something with a decent narrative, even better.

The problem with those types of games is price. The day that we decouple multiplayer from single player and offer each of those individual experiences at reduced pricing - the better. Paying $19.99 for a quick 6-7 hours of Modern Warfare single player is far more palpable than $60 for a multiplayer suite I have absolutely zero interest in. Which is exactly why I haven't bothered to buy a Modern Warfare game until they are heavily discounted for a long time. It doesn't mean there isn't a place for that style of game but the industry and more specifically gamers need to readjust what they pay for these things.

You misunderstand me. I actually prefer the structure of scripted games over the loose hapdash of open world fare.

My argument is that for all the people crying for “physics!” and “AI!” how many games actually pushed them forward?


The most popular games of this gen are deeply rooted in concepts we’ve been playing since the N64, just refined over the years. How has AI brought Madden forward? DOTA? Modern Warfare? GTA?

What of the games that actually leveraged next gen technology? Still playing Spore? How did Backbreaker sell? Mirror’s Edge? Only geeks care about Physics and AI. It’s the new “blast processing” or “mode 7” – words that stress the haves and the have nots. Whooptie shit.

 

[SonnyBoy]

Goodness, don't get me started on how damn disappointing Madden has been this generation.

 

[storybook77]

Goodness, don't get me started on how damn disappointing Madden has been this generation.

Its sad that the B team (NCAA) did a much better job than the A team (Madden) did this gen.

 

[yankeehater]

Goodness, don't get me started on how damn disappointing Madden has been this generation.

I was at the draft were they unveiled what next-gen Madden was going to look like. The games have been good but they have not been anywhere near that target trailer.

 

[bionic77]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

When are handing in your resignation letter?

Also the NES lightgun from what I can remember worked ok when we played from 6-8 feet, at least on DuckHunt.

There was an awesome platformer I had called GumShoe which used the light gun and I had to be right next to the screen to play that game. That game was relatively easy for that time and yet I bet it is harder than 95% of games released today.

 

[chuckddd]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

 

[jbug617]

Pats resign Dan Koppen to a 2 yr deal. I honestly think the Pats are going to draft the C from Wisconsin.

 

[TheDrizzlerJ11]

The jump this gen was in how popular online multiplayer got with 360 (Sega must be rolling in their graves) and the changes in controls.

Multiplayer blew up with Halo 2 actually. You could finally easily play with friends and jump around to different games no problem. Their lobby system became the template for every game after it. It was just so much more efficient than any other game out there and the one's that tried to do their own thing (Gears) were complete shit in comparison (talking about just the matchmaking and lobby systems).

 

[FrenchMovieTheme]

Looks like my company got awarded the construction of the new 49ers stadium. :-0

God bless your company!

 

[SonnyBoy]

I was at the draft were they unveiled what next-gen Madden was going to look like. The games have been good but they have not been anywhere near that target trailer.

The games have been mediocre, at best. At best...

- DB's still don't play the ball.
- FB's still ignore potential tacklers
- LB's still can jump 8 feet into the air for one handed interceptions
- "gang tackling" appeared for a year and was taken back
- no physics
- the 3-4 isn't truly represented in the game
- they still don't know how to make superior teams better than lesser teams without resorting to making the lesser team do stupid shit. I get that the Ravens defense is stout. But don't make my offensive players do simple minded things to create an illusion of the opponent being better.
- I personally don't like that they have one guy who does all the ratings. There are too many teams and nuances for one person to discern on a week-to-week basis with any level of depth.

 

[ActStriker]

Pats resign Dan Koppen to a 2 yr deal. I honestly think the Pats are going to draft the C from Wisconsin.

Looks like he's getting paid starter's money

Albert Breer ‏ @AlbertBreer
Koppen's 2-year deal is worth about $6 million, so it looks like NE expects him to start. May have to adjust that Konz pick in my mock.

 

[TheLegendary]

God bless your company!

I think you should be more concerned with the electrician that comes in.

 

[Futurevoid]

My argument is that for all the people crying for “physics!” and “AI!” how many games actually pushed them forward?

Would Portal or Portal 2 be the games that they are without its physics based puzzles? I agree that developers have not done a good job of innovating in that regard (at least in the supposed "AAA" games department. There are plenty of smaller titles out there that are doing more for gaming with experiences of smaller scope), but you seem to be arguing that because the market is stuck in this first person shooter driven cycle, that improved AI and physics should not be part of the equation in next generation games? If so, I think that's remarkably short sighted.

How has AI brought Madden forward?

Using a title with a yearly development cycle (seriously, yearly development cycle titles need to end!) and that has pushed forward very little in the way of innovation isn't exactly telling me that AI and physics won't improve the experience. Do you think Madden would NOT benefit from physics based tackling or improved AI to better simulate the sport? Again, it seems to be your saying that these things should be ignored because the general game populace doesn't care and Madden still sells in the millions. Or that Mirror's Edge shouldn't have been made because it didn't sell by the truckload? To hell with that man. That's the problem with the industry today. You either sell 5 million copies or you failed and that needs to change.

Also, pointing to Backbreaker's lack of sales is disingenuous as hell. We both know that game failed because it didn't have the NFL license. It was doomed to failure on that basis alone before it ever hit the market. Not because people don't care about physics in their football games.

- DB's still don't play the ball.
- FB's still ignore potential tacklers
- LB's still can jump 8 feet into the air for one handed interceptions
- "gang tackling" appeared for a year and was taken back
- no physics

My point made.

(this may be something we should take to PM so we don't clutter up the thread by the way)

 

[Spectral Glider]

Also the NES lightgun from what I can remember worked ok when we played from 6-8 feet, at least on DuckHunt.

There was an awesome platformer I had called GumShoe which used the light gun and I had to be right next to the screen to play that game. That game was relatively easy for that time and yet I bet it is harder than 95% of games released today.

I remember Gumshoe, think it was the only zapper game I had actually. I also remember just pointing the gun about 3 inches from the screen to play it. I also had an NES Max controller, which was junk. And an Advantage, which was awesome.

 

[Goro Majima]

Madden is disappointing for me because there isn't a lot of incentive for people like me who only play it single player and offline.

I think the random packs of cards from way back when offered more incentive to play than anything offered now.

I vaguely remember being able to set ticket prices, hot dog prices, etc.....did that happen?

Sadly, I really liked the cribs from NFL 2k5.

 

[Talon]

Do RBs still run straight out of bounds on swing routes that go to the near side?

Always my favorite feature.

 

[darkside31337]

Madden is disappointing for me because there isn't a lot of incentive for people like me who only play it single player and offline.

I think the random packs of cards from way back when offered more incentive to play than anything offered now.

I vaguely remember being able to set ticket prices, hot dog prices, etc.....did that happen?

Sadly, I really liked the cribs from NFL 2k5.

Yes. They've been stripping more and more out of Franchise Mode over the years. It's pretty pathetic really.

 

[Dutch Gronk]

Looks like he's getting paid starter's money

They can still draft a C and develop him behind Koppen for 1/2 years. Just like the Light/Solder situation from last year. I just hope that Light and Waters stay for one more years to get the young guys ready.

Yes. They've been stripping more and more out of Franchise Mode over the years. It's pretty pathetic really.

It really sucks, the big thing they 'added' last year was expanded rosters. Well whoopdedoo, I simulate pre-season games anyways + it really bothered me that they forced you to use the clock run-off when you played Franchise mode, AI constantly letting the quarter run out because of it and it just messed with my flow.

 

[yankeehater]

If EA would just have 3 different teams doing Madden it could be so much better. Their problem is they dont even have time to see if something worked or not before they are already into the cycle for the next game. Give each team 2 years to really go over what worked and tweak and test things and the games would be so much better. Sadly this work drive up costs for Ea so they wont ever do it.

 

[bionic77]

:lol

We all agree Madden hasn't improved much since last gen and yet we all continue to buy it like bitches.

It really sucks that there is no competition for NFL games anymore.

 

[storybook77]

One of the guys from the MLB: The Show crew is now the creative director of Madden and most of the old team that made Madden is gone so hopefully it'll get turned around back in the right direction.

 

[Futurevoid]

Sadly this work drive up costs for Ea so they wont ever do it.

...and people still buy the game in droves so we as gamers give them no incentive to ever bother. /shrug

We all agree Madden hasn't improved much since last gen and yet we all continue to buy it like bitches.

.

I bought 10 via a buddy that works at EA for $20. That was the first time I bought Madden since the PSX days (NFL Gameday!). It's the last one I bothered with. I rented 11 and that was it. Until they get off their asses and add physics based tackling, I won't bother.

 

[Talon]

Madden peaked with Madden 2005.

 

[Dutch Gronk]

Bruce Springsteen is the greatest artist ever

That is all.

 

[darkside31337]

We all agree Madden hasn't improved much since last gen and yet we all continue to buy it like bitches.

Nah I know some people who still play old Madden games. Especially fans of teams that suck. Pretty sure Hitokage is still reliving the glory days through Madden 2007.

 

[Fox318]

:lol

We all agree Madden hasn't improved much since last gen and yet we all continue to buy it like bitches.

It really sucks that there is no competition for NFL games anymore.

I only bought 2011.

 

[BigAT]

If it weren't for the GAF Madden league, I probably wouldn't be touching the new game each year. It's really the only reason I pick it up, I don't think I have a single game played against a random person for Madden 12.

 

[Striker]

Madden peaked with Madden 2005.

Loved that game. Owner mode ftw!

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

Would Portal or Portal 2 be the games that they are without its physics based puzzles? I agree that developers have not done a good job of innovating in that regard (at least in the supposed "AAA" games department. There are plenty of smaller titles out there that are doing more for gaming with experiences of smaller scope), but you seem to be arguing that because the market is stuck in this first person shooter driven cycle, that improved AI and physics should not be part of the equation in next generation games? If so, I think that's remarkably short sighted.


Using a title with a yearly development cycle (seriously, yearly development cycle titles need to end!) and that has pushed forward very little in the way of innovation isn't exactly telling me that AI and physics won't improve the experience. Do you think Madden would NOT benefit from physics based tackling or improved AI to better simulate the sport? Again, it seems to be your saying that these things should be ignored because the general game populace doesn't care and Madden still sells in the millions. Or that Mirror's Edge shouldn't have been made because it didn't sell by the truckload? To hell with that man. That's the problem with the industry today. You either sell 5 million copies or you failed and that needs to change.

Also, pointing to Backbreaker's lack of sales is disingenuous as hell. We both know that game failed because it didn't have the NFL license. It was doomed to failure on that basis alone before it ever hit the market. Not because people don't care about physics in their football games.


My point made.

(this may be something we should take to PM so we don't clutter up the thread by the way)

I’m gonna post this here Future ‘cause I’m not done on my soapbox and there’s barely any football news right now anyway.

I’m not saying these things should be ignored. I’m saying that they ARE being ignored.

There’s a misconception around GAF and amongst the gaming populace in general that it is technology that drives the industry, when in reality that couldn’t be further from the truth. The games that are developed for these consoles are beholden to their budget and break even first and foremost. There is no reason to update Madden with updated physics routines and features – EA successfully destroyed the competition and gamers have proven they will buy incremental upgrades. The system ain’t broke, so they’re not fixing it. Almost all 3rd parties are like this. They will only push technology enough to make the game stand out.

Would I like for these companies to use more advanced AI routines and physics? Absolutely, however I know that as long as they can continue selling me the same games that hasn’t happened, isn’t happening, and likely won’t happen next gen, no matter how powerful the PS4 is.