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[Slo]

Studies have been completely inconclusive in terms of the real benefits to having a professional sports team. Generally the massive outlay, infrastructure improvements and maintenance, city personnel requirements (cops, traffic, busses, etc,) and the foregone property taxes as a result of TIF's offset the generated revenues.

That being said, his is corporate welfare, flat out. I'm against states going out and trying to incentivize businesses moving state to state (something my man Mitch and Scott Walker have huge boners for) and this is really nothing more than that. It's a misappropriation of tax payer dollars and should infuriate anyone even mildly interested in understanding where that stolen portion of their paycheck ends up. Zygi's coffers, that's where.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/sports/08stadium.html?_r=2&src=twt&twt=nytimes

Story from a couple years ago that goes into some of the underlying issues and expenses.

Eh, I've grown kind of numb to the "socialism is the devil stuff." People don't want to pay for the schools their kids don't attend, the roads that they don't drive on, the parks that they don't visit, or the local fire department until their house is on fire. In general most people want all the things that their tax dollars pay for, but they don't want to pay taxes. Personally, I'm willing to pay for the Vikes stadium with my tax dollars.

I am kind of confused by your stance on socialism/capitalism though. You use the word "welfare" like it's a curse, but then you also act like Zygi's an asshole for being a successful business owner and trying to extract fat cash from his customers and maximize his profits. Isn't that what he's supposed to do?

 

[Slo]

Slo, this might be more up your alley. It's a comic!

http://reason.com/archives/2007/05/23/lets-all-give-money-to-the-ric

Thanks! I understand pictures better than sentences!

 

[Goro Majima]

I was hoping for Vikings fans until I saw Goodell's bullying comment. Now I'm not so sure.

Let's get to the real talk: How do they realign the divisions once they move to LA? Who replaces them in the NFC North? St. Louis Rams? Because I think they eventually are the 2nd LA team.

The Rams are really the only choice. They're stupidly far east for an NFC West team and the Vikings are stupidly far west to be an NFC North team.

 

[Futurevoid]

Shocking..

Adam Schefter ‏ @AdamSchefter

No great surprise, it's what most expected, but Colts have told Andrew Luck they will take him with the No. 1 overall pick, per NFL source.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

The Rams are really the only choice. They're stupidly far east for an NFC West team and the Vikings are stupidly far west to be an NFC North team.

There's almost literally no other team that's more north than the Vikings. (Seattle's the only one)

 

[Slo]

There's almost literally no other team that's more north than the Vikings. (Seattle's the only one)

Think he was talking about the LA Vikings.

 

[Fox318]

Shocking..

I can't wait till they draft Bryan Anger with the first pick.

 

[jakncoke]

lol goodell god complex in full effect

 

[SonnyBoy]

No great surprise, it's what most expected, but Colts have told Andrew Luck they will take him with the No. 1 overall pick, per NFL source.

Good. Good.

It'd be SUPPPPER cruddy if the Skins are axing Gaffney so that RGIII can retain his #10. LOL

 

[Hitokage]

I hadn't realized George Shinn became owner of the Vikings.

 

[AngmarsKing701]

So now you can stop pretending it was just the pads he wore, or the camera angle, or the people around him being smaller than they look making him look bigger, or optical illusions, or accidentally falling into a vat of lard and not having time to shower....

Under Armor making some sweeeeet girdles now. Gotta get one of those!

 

[TheLegendary]

Got damn I can't wait for the draft.

 

[jakncoke]

Yeah draft is going to be fucking awesome, I can't wait to sit down and watch while posting in IRC and this thread.. oh wait I HAVE TO FUCKING WORK, FUCK OFF NFL FOR MAKING ROUNDS 1-3 ON THURSDAY/FRIDAY.

 

[Vesmir]

There's almost literally no other team that's more north than the Vikings. (Seattle's the only one)

The Toronto Bills will be second-most north if the Vikings go to LA!

 

[eznark]

Eh, I've grown kind of numb to the "socialism is the devil stuff." People don't want to pay for the schools their kids don't attend, the roads that they don't drive on, the parks that they don't visit, or the local fire department until their house is on fire. In general most people want all the things that their tax dollars pay for, but they don't want to pay taxes. Personally, I'm willing to pay for the Vikes stadium with my tax dollars.

I am kind of confused by your stance on socialism/capitalism though. You use the word "welfare" like it's a curse, but then you also act like Zygi's an asshole for being a successful business owner and trying to extract fat cash from his customers and maximize his profits. Isn't that what he's supposed to do?

It has nothing to do with socialism/capitalism. I think most people would object if their municipality not only offered tax incentives to bring a Wal Mart into town, but also paid for the construction and created a sales tax district to do so. Sports franchise owners exploit the fans love of the game to extract unnecessary assistance from cities and states with threats of relocation. It's garbage. (Side note, local school districts do the same. Watch any school referendum and the first thing administrators say they will cut if the property tax hike doesn't pass is the sports teams).

Zygi isn't trying to extract cash from his customers, he is attempting to use them to extract cash from the State. Were he a better businessman, he could gouge his customers by selling them worthless pieces of paper for $250 a pop!

 

[TheLegendary]

Interesting conversation with the schedule makers on SiriusXM.

Talking about what they're going to do about the unveiling of draft picks based on cell phone calls "announcing" draft picks rather than the announcement at the podium. Didn't give a firm answer on what they're going to this year though.

 

[eznark]

Oh fuck yes! Let me know if they archive those anywhere. I find those interviews with the schedule people absolutely fascinating.

That reminds me, I have to do a month sub to Sirius so I can listen to their draft day stuff. They have that awesome old guy on there who is just a brilliant ass hole.

 

[Bowser]

lol scouts trying to tar RGIII like they did Cam:

Two scouts expressed to the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel that they have concerns with Baylor QB Robert Griffin III's attitude.

"He's got a little bit of a selfish streak," said one scout. "Everybody was laying on Cam, but for some reason this guy has become gloves-off. He doesn't treat anybody good." Another scout "questioned the way Griffin deals with people," perhaps referencing RG3's refusal to conduct pre-draft private workouts. We wouldn't read into these opinions. We just found them interesting.

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/7406/robert-griffin-iii

Bets on eznark being the "two scouts"?

 

[MechDX]

Oh fuck yes! Let me know if they archive those anywhere. I find those interviews with the schedule people absolutely fascinating.

That reminds me, I have to do a month sub to Sirius so I can listen to their draft day stuff. They have that awesome old guy on there who is just a brilliant ass hole.

Is it the guy who does the "Final Drive" show in the late evening?

 

[eznark]

I'm high on Griffin, dude.

Is it the guy who does the "Final Drive" show in the late evening?

Not sure, I only listened one year when I was driving across the country during the draft and he was awesome. I think NFLN might have had him on a bit last year, actually.

Gil Brandt. Dude is fantastic.

 

[DeaconKnowledge]

Yeah draft is going to be fucking awesome, I can't wait to sit down and watch while posting in IRC and this thread.. oh wait I HAVE TO FUCKING WORK, FUCK OFF NFL FOR MAKING ROUNDS 1-3 ON THURSDAY/FRIDAY.

Get a good job and work normal hours.

 

[Bowser]

I'm high on Griffin, dude.

I was just playing into the whole "racist dude from Milwaukee" stereotype

 

[MechDX]

I'm high on Griffin, dude.



Not sure, I only listened one year when I was driving across the country during the draft and he was awesome. I think NFLN might have had him on a bit last year, actually.

Gil Brandt. Dude is fantastic.

The show is Late Hits and it IS Gil Brandt. Guy has some serious memory issues and a nasally voice.

 

[eznark]

Get a good job and work normal hours.

Serious. I'm so glad I don't have to waste a nice April Saturday sitting inside all day long watching "guru's"

 

[SonnyBoy]

I was just playing into the whole "racist dude from Milwaukee" stereotype

"He's got a little bit of a selfish streak," said one scout. "Everybody was laying on Cam, but for some reason this guy has become gloves-off. He doesn't treat anybody good." Another scout "questioned the way Griffin deals with people," perhaps referencing RG3's refusal to conduct pre-draft private workouts. We wouldn't read into these opinions. We just found them interesting.

RG III stated that he did that to force the spotlight on his teammates. He knew that by forcing scouts to come to "his" pro-day, that would in turn allow his teammates to share the spotlight and improve their stock in the draft.

So basically, dude used his "star-power" to help his teammates. That IMO is unselfish.

 

[TheLegendary]

Oh fuck yes! Let me know if they archive those anywhere. I find those interviews with the schedule people absolutely fascinating.

That reminds me, I have to do a month sub to Sirius so I can listen to their draft day stuff. They have that awesome old guy on there who is just a brilliant ass hole.

Yeah, they're always awesome. Love the science that goes into it.

They're having the main Schedule guy Howard Katz on in just a little bit. Don't know if they'll have it archived elsewhere, but if you have an online sub now you can cull through previous shows or pick up at the start of a show if you catch it halfway through. Some cool new features.

I think the old guy you're talking about is Gil Brandt. And Adam Schein is another marvelous asshole. There's a lot of those on the NFL station.

 

[jakncoke]

Get a good job and work normal hours.

I wont be able to get a good job till im out of school next summer. So next year im going to miss the draft to.. actually fuck that im calling those days off! I would this year but i just started last month, its a factory and I already requested July 4th week off.

 

[eznark]

That sweet ride I just bought has Sirius/XM built into it. Might have to sub. Is it like $3 a month or something?

 

[MechDX]

That sweet ride I just bought has Sirius/XM built into it. Might have to sub. Is it like $3 a month or something?

I got a year free from Dodge on my new car I bought a couple months ago.

 

[TheLegendary]

I get it for free. I do know they just raised the prices.

 

[eznark]

Back when I had it, the NFL stuff wasn't accessible online or on the iphone app. Has that changed?

 

[Slo]

That sweet ride I just bought has Sirius/XM built into it. Might have to sub. Is it like $3 a month or something?

If I were you I'd spring for the premium subscription, so you can listen on the mobile app and stream online from your PC. I was sharing my buddy's subscription by streaming from my PC

Spoiler

sirius/xm-welfare?

until they went to a tiered model and I got cut off.

 

[TheLegendary]

Back when I had it, the NFL stuff wasn't accessible online or on the iphone app. Has that changed?

Yep, all live sports are available online now as far as I know. I know the NFL games are, and the SiriusXM NFL Radio station is definitely online since that's where Im listening to it right now. They just added the MLB live games to that I think. Pretty much everything is available online now, they're starting to finally catch up with that stuff.

Live NFL games online are amazing because they have the home and away local radio broadcasts for every game. When the very sexy and sultry Joseph Francis Buck isn't doing a Packers game (and when does he not? <3), I'll throw on the GB feed for the dagger.

 

[brentech]

http://www.siriusxm.com/ourmostpopularpackages-sirius

My car came with 3 free months, but I sure don't listen to radio enough to go 14.49/mo for the cheapest. I'll just wave goodbye when it expires.

 

[Hitokage]

It has nothing to do with socialism/capitalism. I think most people would object if their municipality not only offered tax incentives to bring a Wal Mart into town, but also paid for the construction and created a sales tax district to do so. Sports franchise owners exploit the fans love of the game to extract unnecessary assistance from cities and states with threats of relocation. It's garbage.

As somebody further to the left on the political spectrum as you, I agree, and it's especially true if the owner just wants to pad his wallet a little more or has grown just a little tired of the existing stadium. This isn't serving a social good, it's serving some fat cat with no real ties to the community.

 

[TheLegendary]

http://www.siriusxm.com/ourmostpopularpackages-sirius

My car came with 3 free months, but I sure don't listen to radio enough to go 14.49/mo for the cheapest. I'll just wave goodbye when it expires.

Just complain. Just like DirecTV, if you complain that you're going to leave they'll give you a better deal Im sure.

 

[eznark]

bahahahahaha, they are at $15/month now? Insanity. I'm almost positive that when I had XM it was like $3-5 a month. Why would anyone ever pay for that? Get Spotify/rdio and listen to whatever you want.

As somebody further to the left on the political spectrum as you, I agree, and it's especially true if the owner just wants to pad his wallet a little more or has grown just a little tired of the existing stadium. This isn't serving a social good, it's serving some fat cat with no real ties to the community.

To me it isn't really politics, it's economics. Yes I would oppose this spending even if it made infinite monies, but in this case stadiums are generally a municipal black hole, so everyone should be opposed regardless of ideology.

 

[Slo]

As somebody further to the left on the political spectrum as you, I agree, and it's especially true if the owner just wants to pad his wallet a little more or has grown just a little tired of the existing stadium. This isn't serving a social good, it's serving some fat cat with no real ties to the community.

I think you should have to go door to door and announce yourself as a pony-lover! For the greater social good!

 

[brentech]

bahahahahaha, they are at $15/month now? Insanity. I'm almost positive that when I had XM it was like $3-5 a month. Why would anyone ever pay for that? Get Spotify/rdio and listen to whatever you want.

Seriously, if I want a specific event or something, I can just find a internet radio broadcast on my iPhone and plug it in or even stream BlueTooth audio. I could see people agreeing with $3-5 for radio with all sports events, but $10 over that is just a laugh.


Luckily I made sure I don't even have to cancel it. It just goes way after 3 months.

 

[Hitokage]

I think you should have to go door to door and announce yourself as a pony-lover! For the greater social good!

But why go door to door to prod people's irrational fears when I can do so with a few clicks of the mouse at home?

Efficiency.

 

[Slo]

But why go door to door to prod people's irrational fears when I can do so with a few clicks of the mouse at home?

This neighborhood is really going down hill.

 

[FrenchMovieTheme]

Normally I'm opposed to new stadiums but for us, candlestick needed to go. It was a fucking dump and a nightmare to get in and out of. But the owners are all greedy assholes and I'm sure the Santa Clara stadium will line little jeddys pockets nicely

 

[TheLegendary]

bahahahahaha, they are at $15/month now? Insanity. I'm almost positive that when I had XM it was like $3-5 a month. Why would anyone ever pay for that? Get Spotify/rdio and listen to whatever you want.

That sounds exactly like something a filthy poor would say

 

[Slo]

That sounds exactly like something a filthy poor would say

The high subscription rate keeps the riff raff away.

 

[brentech]

Normally I'm opposed to new stadiums but for us, candlestick needed to go. It was a fucking dump and a nightmare to get in and out of. But the owners are all greedy assholes and I'm sure the Santa Clara stadium will line little jeddys pockets nicely

Yeah, stadiums have to be upgraded/replaced from time to time. I still don't think it should ever be put onto tax payers though.

It's a private business, making billions of dollars. They can move teams where-ever they like, and leave locations high and dry. They should be paying for their stadiums. Would force them to make sure they develop a stadium in a proper location with enough people around to fill it.

There just isn't great incentive to ever expect a government to chip in.

 

[eznark]

Anything that the team itself can't do, the NFL should jump in and cover through debt instruments. It's absurd how little the NFL generally kicks in.

I get it for free. I do know they just raised the prices.

That sounds exactly like something a filthy poor would say

Did you delete the part about you working for Sirius before or after you went into sales pitch mode?

 

[TheLegendary]

The high subscription rate keeps the riff raff away.

Yes, Sirius only wants the highest breed of cross country truckers and hillbillies.

Did you delete the part about you working for Sirius before or after you went into sales pitch mode?

I deleted it before. I do work for Sirius... figured after some better judgment I'd prefer to keep my personal info out of an open forum. For the record I wouldnt pay that price, I was just using your common retort as a joke. I've been here for years; I've never pitched the company before and I certainly didn't do that here.

 

[brentech]

lol, caught. We all saw that shit.

 

[Wes]

GM Heckert said he'd like to stay at No. 4, rather than trade. Does think they probably would be able to trade out.

GM Tom Heckert said he knows who they will take at 4 if they stay there and the status quo happens in front of them.

GM Heckert called Bama RB Richardson very good player, but said fact that he drafted Hardesty 2 years ago plays a role.

GM Tom Heckert said having the compensatory picks late frees up the middle picks to move up and grab guys they like

GM Tom Heckert: "You can't stray away from a player because of a perceived need" Player over need wins.

GM Tom Heckert said they have about 18 guys with 1st round grades but is confident one of those guys will be there at 22

GM Tom Heckert said if those 18 guys w/ 1st-rd. grades are gone at No. 22, he'd try to trade down.

GM Tom Heckert on Claiborne: You need 3 CBs to survive in this league & that's why they're big deal. He's a really, really good one.

GM Tom Heckert said the height of a WR doesn't matter, its about can he play.

GM Tom Heckert said there is not ties at the top of their draft board. They have guys graded 1,2,3 and 4.

GM Tom Heckert said he's made bad decisions in past b/c he tried to fill needs instead of drafting best player. Said long time ago.

Some tweets from Heckert's press conference today.

 

[Futurevoid]

smh...

Jason La Canfora &#8207; @JasonLaCanfora

Ohio State T Mike Adams, 1st rnd prospect, tested positive for marijuana at combine. Has already completed counseling

Let the tumble begin...