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[PantherLotus]

IT ALL STARTS UP FRONT, FELLAS.

There was never a great quarterback that became great behind a horrendous line. There have been good qb's that became great after the line improved, but never the other way around.

You put Manning or Brady on the Chiefs and we're good for maybe one more win this season. (which would put us at 11 wins ). When you see their line disintegrate in front of them, then we can talk about how stoic they are. No doubt they're HoFers, no doubt they're the best. But they ain't shit without those offensive lines.

Remember that, fans of those teams. Your time will come and you will be stuck wondering if you can make the playoffs someday and it will be some other team with the best o-line in football and some young buck proving that HE is the best QB ever.

 

[I3rand0]

a rational 9ers fan? no way

I think I stopped being irrational when I learned that under-amour will not protect Vernon Davis from getting hurt every other week (lulz).

 

[Milabrega]

Marvin Harrison is on the trading block in my fantasy league, and I want to take a shot at him. The owner said he wants an RB, possibly a QB. My other receivers are:

Tory Holt, Bernard Berrian, Andre Johnson, Kevin Curtis, and Brandon Marshall.

QB and RBs:

Eli, Favre, A-Pete, Bush, Gore, Brandon Jacobs.

I told him A-Pete is off limits, but I'd be willing to part with Favre, Jacobs, Gore, or Bush. The guy never responded. I am willing to trade a combination of a Favre or an RB with a WR (Berrian or Marshall) for Harrison, but I did not tell him this.

Any advice? Jason Campbell is available on the wire which is why I am interested in moving Favre. (VY and Huard are also out there) Eli's bye week is week 8, and he doesn't play any good D's for the rest of the year, so I am looking really for insurance at that position.

It sounds like your willing to give too much for Harrison right now. Favre for Harrison straight up is a decent trade. Although I would dump a back and a receiver for a proven stack receiver in your position, Harrison is coming off an injury so yeah, he's Colts #1 he will most likely prove to be a stacked receiver again, however right now coming off an injury he isn't proven which reduces his value enough for you to do a 1:1 trade.

 

[topsyturvy]

IT ALL STARTS UP FRONT, FELLAS.

There was never a great quarterback that became great behind a horrendous line. There have been good qb's that became great after the line improved, but never the other way around.

You put Manning or Brady on the Chiefs and we're good for maybe one more win this season. (which would put us at 11 wins ). When you see their line disintegrate in front of them, then we can talk about how stoic they are. No doubt they're HoFers, no doubt they're the best. But they ain't shit without those offensive lines.

Remember that, fans of those teams. Your time will come and you will be stuck wondering if you can make the playoffs someday and it will be some other team with the best o-line in football and some young buck proving that HE is the best QB ever.

dan marino? terry bradshaw?somewhat johnny unitas? they never had the marvin harrisons or randy moss's. if they did, I feel sorry for them because their not in the record books, aka google search engine.

but its nice to be proven wrong tho.

ps

the chiefs better win the fucking west or i'll be down 50 bucks in the office.

 

[Karakand]

...maybe kiffin is just playing his games again! Maybe we get AWalt futures, then McCown resurgence, then JRUSS REAL FUTURES FOR REALS THIS TIME!

Excellent...

Well that was quick...

Not excellent...

 

[Crazymoogle]

I see finally that Fantasy Football really does change how you view the NFL. I've gone from only caring to what the Steelers do to hoping they win or lose strictly based on my fantasy matchup of the week. :lol

Serious question though: would you trust Fred Taylor or Deshaun Foster more for the rest of the season? Either would be my flex play most weeks; I have the latter and have been offered the former.

Foster has more points overall (a 25pt week 3 being all of his major scores), but seems at constant risk of losing his job. Taylor has scored twice as much for the last 3 weeks, and can't really lose his spot, but he's not the star either. Would you guys tend to follow the trend or just follow the stats in this case?

 

[Karakand]

You know what the source of all these fires is? Irate Southern Californians, from Malibu to Tijuana's Hat, rioting in anger over having to watch another deity-damned Giants game again on Sunday. And can you really blame them? They'd better not try showing us the Giants game against the 0-7 Dolphins, or the entire state will go up in flames. And I’m still waiting for an explanation why a game being played in the London –- the closest thing Europe has to New York –- counts as a home game for Miami.

Seriously, what’s the more impressive streak this year –- New England snot-kicking every team by at least 17 points every week, or a mediocre team from the East Coast getting all its games televised on the networks more than 3,000 miles away? (And do they show Chargers games in New York? No. You know why? Nobody moves from San Diego to New York. Even when the entire county is an inferno.)

If you assume 12-14 or so games a week (taking bye weeks into account), and that only five games are shown here every week (and that two of those have to be the Chargers and Raiders), statistically speaking there’s less than a 0.04 percent chance that the Giants should have been on every week. Maybe less. But you've been warned FOX and CBS, these fires in Southern California are on you.

http://thehaternation.blogspot.com/2007/10/lil-hater-burning-down-house.html

 

[Gigglepoo]

IT ALL STARTS UP FRONT, FELLAS.

Couldn't agree more. One of the reasons I was so optimistic about the Niners season was their offensive line. On paper, they are quite good. Jennings and Larry Allen on the left is quite solid. Kwame Harris was finally going to lose his job at RT for their much hyped rookie, Joe Staley. And Baas and Heitman are both good. Reports from training camp said their offensive line was one of their strengths. With that secured, it would pave the way for another great Frank Gore season and would help immeasurably in Alex Smith's progression. It didn't matter that their WRs were suspect because their offensive line was supposed to be good enough to by them time to get open.

In reality, they are below average. Very frustrating. Their left side is awful at this point. Larry Allen needs to retire. Heitman has no strength and Baas seems to hold on every play. Only the rookie, Staley, is any good. The Niners won't be able to consistently compete until they can fix their line woes. They proved that paying mega bucks to a big name free agent isn't the answer, Jennings is clearly not worth the money. Hopefully, they build their offensive and defensive lines through the next few drafts. It's clearly the Niners biggest weakness.

 

[Tamanon]

dan marino? terry bradshaw?somewhat johnny unitas? they never had the marvin harrisons or randy moss's. if they did, I feel sorry for them because their not in the record books, aka google search engine.

but its nice to be proven wrong tho.

ps

the chiefs better win the fucking west or i'll be down 50 bucks in the office.

Honestly, I was unaware that Moss and Harrison played offensive line

 

[Rorschach]

We HAVE seen what Manning plays like with pressure. Shit, we just saw it this fucking week. Turns out he still plays well. If Peyton Manning had been with the any of the struggling AFC West teams since day 1 of this season, that team would be playoff bound no doubt.

 

[topsyturvy]

Honestly, I was unaware that Moss and Harrison played offensive line

oh snap, what i get for scheming... we'll shit. i guess agree then...

the chiefs still better win the west or i'm taking names after the ass kicking. I want meh monies. 50 dollars each division baby.

afc i have:
the chiefs winning the west
the jets winning the east. (what the fuck lead me to believe that shit)
the steelers winning the north.
colts winning the south

nfc i have:
the bears winning the north (fucking lions and packers)
the bucs winning the south
the hawks winning the west
the giants winning the east (this could possible happen fellas )

note that all of the picks was taking well before training camp at my office/internship for 50 dollars each, and so far, i'm clearly down 100 dollars with the nfc north and afc east.

 

[woodchuck]

oh snap, what i get for scheming... we'll shit. i guess agree then...

the chiefs still better win the west or i'm taking names after the ass kicking. I want meh monies. 50 dollars each division baby.

afc i have:
the chiefs winning the west
the jets winning the east. (what the fuck lead me to believe that shit)
the steelers winning the north.
colts winning the south

nfc i have:
the bears winning the north (fucking lions and packers)
the bucs winning the south
the hawks winning the west
the giants winning the east (this could possible happen fellas )

note that all of the picks was taking well before training camp at my office/internship for 50 dollars each, and so far, i'm clearly down 100 dollars with the nfc north and afc east.

:lol :lol :lol

 

[topsyturvy]

:lol :lol :lol

yea i know :lol :lol :lol , this was waaaaaaaaaaaaay before training camp when i called it. my gowd. :lol i might have never been off that bad.

"light bulb"

does this mean that griese and jason cambell won't be teh awesome since im rooting for them? :0

 

[Eminem]

If anyone cares(so no one), this is an NFL podcast from SAS. I thought it was pretty fucking funny:

http://sascast.sportsargumentwiki.c...Can_Look_Out_My_Window_And_See_Rap_Music.html

 

[Karakand]

If anyone cares(so no one), this is an NFL podcast from SAS. I thought it was pretty fucking funny:

http://sascast.sportsargumentwiki.c...Can_Look_Out_My_Window_And_See_Rap_Music.html

"Vinny Testaverde looks like you took Long Island and turned it into a person." :lol

"Are you based in Atlanta right now?"
"Yes, I can look out my window and see rap music." :lol

 

[Eminem]

"Listen...It's a statement for how bad it is in the NFL right now that when we bring up QB controversies, we don't include Cleo Lemon. Like, we accept him as an established starter."

:lol :lol

 

[Karakand]

:lol So many great one-liners in there. You've got yourself a convert, Em! Now everyone else that was listening to Bill Simmons' 'cast stop and listen to this.

 

[levious]

dan marino? terry bradshaw?somewhat johnny unitas? they never had the marvin harrisons or randy moss's. if they did, I feel sorry for them because their not in the record books, aka google search engine.

you really on google for you football arguments? Terry Bradshaw had a couple of hall of famers on offense with him.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

"Listen...It's a statement for how bad it is in the NFL right now that when we bring up QB controversies, we don't include Cleo Lemon. Like, we accept him as an established starter."

:lol :lol

i honestly have no idea who Cleo Lemon is. Like i don't even know if he's black or white. And he's a starting QB in the NFL.

 

[Jon_Danger]

nfc i have:
the bears winning the north (fucking lions and packers)
the bucs winning the south
the hawks winning the west
the giants winning the east (this could possible happen fellas )

note that all of the picks was taking well before training camp at my office/internship for 50 dollars each, and so far, i'm clearly down 100 dollars with the nfc north and afc east.

Who'da thunk the superbowl team would play so shitty? And that the packers would get their shit together for once.

 

[Tamanon]

Channing Crowder, doing America proud.

"I couldn't find London on a map if they didn't have the names of the countries," Crowder said. "I swear to God. I don't know what nothing is. I know Italy looks like a boot. I learned that.

"I know (Washington Redskins linebacker) London Fletcher. We did a football camp together. So I know him. That's the closest thing I know to London. He's black, so I'm sure he's not from London. I'm sure that's a coincidental name."

 

[Karakand]

The SEC sure turns out Rhodes scholar athletes...

 

[twinturbo2]

I'm not going to watch the London game. My poor heart can't take this anymore. :-(

 

[topsyturvy]

you really on google for you football arguments? Terry Bradshaw had a couple of hall of famers on offense with him.

what he said was o-line, and my brain told me wide recievers and some shit. brain fart at 3:00AM i guess.

i wasn't born around the terry bradshaw and unitas years obviously, so it doesn't hurt to look in the record books, but just watching terry bradshaw from my pops vcr tapes is something to behold. I'll cherish that shit for life, pops got like 60 tapes of games and superbowls since the 70s and i would always go back and watch it once and a great while, like when someone would talk about certain games or something. I didn't get into football until the very early 90s when i was like 5.

I hope i'm not the youngest one in this thread? lol

 

[whytemyke]

dan marino? terry bradshaw?somewhat johnny unitas? they never had the marvin harrisons or randy moss's. if they did, I feel sorry for them because their not in the record books, aka google search engine.

but its nice to be proven wrong tho.

ps

the chiefs better win the fucking west or i'll be down 50 bucks in the office.

Lynn Swann? FRANCO HARRIS?!?!?! :lol I mean in the pantheon of great Steelers WRs there's Kordell Stewart, Lynn Swann, Franco Harris, Plaxico Burress and then Hines Ward. Kordell Stewart is also in the Pantheon of great Steelers QBs, RBs, and OGs. Don't know how that last one happened but it's there. I blame Russ Grimm....


it's okay topsy-- if you learn this stuff while you're young then by the time you're 30 you'll have your own radio show and know more about football than anyone in your respective city :lol

 

[topsyturvy]

Lynn Swann? FRANCO HARRIS?!?!?! :lol


it's okay topsy-- if you learn this stuff while you're young then by the time you're 30 you'll have your own radio show and know more about football than anyone in your respective city :lol

bu bu bu, it was 3 AM, i thought he said offense, and and i scheme through it...

Spoiler

looking back at the post, thats waaaay off from what he was talking about anyhow, and i can honestly say i have vcr tapes to fall back on.

:lol

you bastards are just to old for me, I guess i'll never mention the 70s again then knowing that i have no right to speak of it :lol

terry bradshaw is still awesome tho.

 

[Nameless]

Tam(and anyone else in the National FF conference) Randy Moss is on the block(I have other needs) and talks business.

 

[snacknuts]

Who'da thunk the superbowl team would play so shitty? And that the packers would get their shit together for once.

How many years in a row now has the team that lost the Superbowl failed to make the playoffs the following season?

 

[twinturbo2]

I mean, you can throw Testaverde up there on that list going by that logic.

"zomg, he was here for less than week. Didn't even know the guys names on the field. Had no idea how to run the offense for the entire game. Shitty O-Line. Pansies for running backs. BUT HE WON A GAME AT 62 YEARS OLD ZOMG MAKE A MOVIE"

Panthers fans are sensible.

Spoiler

Testaverde > All Bears, Vikings, Ravens, and Dolphins QBs x 2

My dad, a lifetime Jets fan, will toast to that.

 

[Spectral Glider]

you really on google for you football arguments? Terry Bradshaw had a couple of hall of famers on offense with him.

Yeah, but he had four: Mike Webster, Franco, and Swann and Stallworth. With Bradshaw, that was 5 guys. What's interesting is that the team usually noted for the Steel Curtain defenses in the 70s had 5 offensive guys elected to the hall, and just 4 defensive: Lambert, Ham, Greene and Blount. The fact that LC Greenwood is not in the hall is practically a crime.

 

[woodchuck]

Clinton Portis:

The wide receivers have yet to score a touchdown, while Portis and Cooley are the only Redskins to cross the goal line more than once. The Redskins rank 25th in average yards per rush, and 26th in passing yards per game. The offense has scored just 12 touchdowns in six games, and Washington has amassed three offensive touchdowns in a game just 15 times in 56 games (including the playoffs) since Gibbs returned in 2004. This was to be the year when the confluence of personnel, coaching acumen and scheme resulted in a diverse offense, but instead the Redskins are grappling for an identity on that side of the ball with a game at New England ahead Sunday.

"Talent-wise, I think we [are] the most talented team in the NFL. It's discipline. It's coming together and playing as a team," Portis said. "When it comes to talent, I think we've got more talent than anybody, including the Patriots. You look at the receiving corps they put together, I think our receiving corps is just as talented."

At least Channing Crowder was probably joking. I think Portis actually means what he said.

 

[Gigglepoo]

I guess i'll never mention the 70s again then knowing that i have no right to speak of it

What about the 90s? :lol

 

[Wellington]

Clinton Portis:



At least Channing Crowder was probably joking. I think Portis actually means what he said.

Wow, they're only the third most talented team in the NFC E, and that's only because the Eagles hate McNabb.

 

[DY_nasty]

Any good safeties going to the free agency market this year? I want to take this time to write some letters begging them to come to Carolina. Kerry Rhodes should be nearing the end of his contract right?

 

[bluemax]

We HAVE seen what Manning plays like with pressure. Shit, we just saw it this fucking week. Turns out he still plays well. If Peyton Manning had been with the any of the struggling AFC West teams since day 1 of this season, that team would be playoff bound no doubt.

Manning on the Chargers! That team would be unstoppable! He'd make Vincent Jackson and Eric Parker look like Pro Bowlers!

 

[Gigglepoo]

Manning on the Chargers! That team would be unstoppable! He'd make Vincent Jackson and Eric Parker look like Pro Bowlers!

Someone is coming to my way to thinking. Is there any NFC team that wouldn't be a Super Bowl favorite with Manning at the helm? Is there an AFC team that wouldn't at least make the playoffs? Aside from the AFC East, a Manning lead team would easily win their division. Unless Texans Manning has to still play Colts Manning or some weird parallel universe shit.

 

[SonnyBoy]

Wow, they're only the third most talented team in the NFC E, and that's only because the Eagles hate McNabb.

3rd? Oh come on now. :lol Portis definitely embellished a lot but to say we would be at the bottom just because McNabb is having issues. The ONLY reason the Giants beat the Skins is because Joe Gibbs retarded ass tries to protect a 3 point lead in the 2nd quarter and gets way too conservative. If he had the balls to keep on scoring and to keep the defense off of the field, that 17+ point lead we had would have grown even more. If you compare a healthy Giants team against a healthy Redskins team, all biases aside, you guys have the better offense and we have the better defense by far. The NFC East is very close in talent, only Dallas is more distanced.

 

[levious]

why shouldn't Portis say or think that? He's not a prognosticator, he doesn't analyze games, he's supposed to go out there every week thinking nothing can stop him. Every team should think they're good enough to win.

 

[Gigglepoo]

If you compare a healthy Giants team against a healthy Redskins team, all biases aside, you guys have the better offense and we have the better defense by far. The NFC East is very close in talent, only Dallas is more distanced.

I don't know about that. The Giants front seven, particularly their defensive line, is one of the best in the league right now. The Redskins have a better secondary, but I don't think it's fair to say the Redskins have a far better defense.

 

[woodchuck]

why shouldn't Portis say or think that? He's not a prognosticator, he doesn't analyze games, he's supposed to go out there every week thinking nothing can stop him. Every team should think they're good enough to win.

He can say things like that to fire up his team. It's good that he has that attitude. That doesn't make it any less hilarious.

 

[captive]

He can say things like that to fire up his team. It's good that he has that attitude. That doesn't make it any less hilarious.

"Getcha popcorn ready

Spoiler

for my dropped passes"

 

[levious]

He can say things like that to fire up his team. It's good that he has that attitude. That doesn't make it any less hilarious.

well I don't mind waiting to laugh.

 

[SonnyBoy]

I don't know about that. The Giants front seven, particularly their defensive line, is one of the best in the league right now. The Redskins have a better secondary, but I don't think it's fair to say the Redskins have a far better defense.

The Giants have an unbelievable front four. The Redskins pass rush is at best...passable/decent. I think that overall the Redskins have the better defense and it has shown in their top 5 ranking thus far in the season after playing some very strong offensive opponents.

I understand that a ridiculous pass rush like the Giants have can make up for shittay 2ndary which they have. But I think that the Redskins lack of a consistent pass rush speaks volumes of how good our secondary has played and makes me wonder what they'd be capable of with a consistent pass rush. To be honest, they'd be ranked higher if the fucking offense wasn't keeping them on the field all game.

Offensively, I think when healthy the teams are pretty close. Both teams have good offensive lines, good RB's, Eli is ahead of Jason due to experience and I'd say that NY has better WR's. I think Cooley and Shockey are equally good when used properly.

 

[woodchuck]

well I don't mind waiting to laugh.

that's because you're dead inside

come on, you wouldn't laugh if Notre Dame said they were just as talented as Florida? It's a more extreme example, but follows the same idea.

 

[storybook77]

*sigh* Hall blasted Petrino yet again. If he doesn't change his attitude, they can trade his ass as far as I'm concerned. If Crumpler wants to go too, then so be it.

I'm glad Petrino is taking any crap off these guys instead of coddling them the way that Mora did and Blank as well. It seems Blank learned his lesson though as he doesn't make many public appearances anymore, but content on being the owner not a father figure.

 

[Gigglepoo]

Offensively, I think when healthy the teams are pretty close.

The reason the Giants are a lot better than the Redskins right now is because of experience. This is Campbell's first full season as a starter. Eli takes his team to the playoffs every year. Because of that, the Giants are a scary team right now. In a huge game, I would trust the Giants offense to come through in a way that is just not possible for Jason and the Skins at this point. A few years from now, though, this should be a great rivalry.

If one NFC East team was placed in each NFC division, you would have at least three division winners from that division (does that make sense?). And if the Eagles could beat up on the Seahawks, Cards and Rams, they might end up winning that division. Pretty ridiculous.

storybook77, why the heck did the Falcons cut Grady Jackson anyway? Fatty gots to eat!

 

[snacknuts]

Interesting factoid I heard today:

No QB has ever beaten all of the 32 teams in the league (not really applicable to older QBs since those teams weren't around, but whatever). Tom Brady and Peyton Manning have both beaten 30 of their 31 possible opponents. Brady has never beaten the Redskins, and Manning has never beaten the Panthers. Those are the two teams the Colts and Pats are facing this week before their potential undefeated matchup on the 4th.

 

[levious]

what are the kick off times? Who will do it first?! ESPN will have a field day with that one.

that's because you're dead inside

come on, you wouldn't laugh if Notre Dame said they were just as talented as Florida? It's a more extreme example, but follows the same idea.

uh, Florida is in the SEC, and Notre Dame is independent, I think... that really taxed my college sports knowledge. Last amateur game I watched was the Boise State bowl game and prior to that was the Miami/Ohio State championship game (where I first saw the horrid overtime format in college) and I assure you both were a side effect of spending time with relatives.

 

[storybook77]

storybook77, why the heck did the Falcons cut Grady Jackson anyway? Fatty gots to eat!

Rumor has it that he wasn't playing the scheme properly and trying to make plays on his own. He made some plays but the contention is that he hurt them more than he helped them by doing that since it allowed offensive lineman to go free and get to the linebackers.

 

[Gigglepoo]

Rumor has it that he wasn't playing the scheme properly and trying to make plays on his own. He made some plays but the contention is that he hurt them more than he helped them by doing that since it allowed offensive lineman to go free and get to the linebackers.

So it's a Lavar Arrington situation. It seems to me that Grady Jackson is a rare athlete. Sure, he can only play 25 plays a game, but he was a presence on the D Line. Unless he was a locker room cancer, I'm not sure why Petrino didn't try to, you know, coach him a little. It's not going to be easy to find a replacement for a 400 pound man.